User talk:Coal town guy

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Editor of the Week[edit]

Red barnstar.png Editor of the Week
Your ongoing efforts to improve the encyclopedia have not gone unnoticed: You have been selected as Editor of the Week, for work creating articles on towns. Thank you for the great contributions! (courtesy of the Wikipedia Editor Retention Project)

User:Gtwfan52 submitted the following nomination for Editor of the Week:

I would like to nominate Coal town guy (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · edit filter log · block user · block log). Since starting a few months ago, he has created over 2000 articles on small, and ghost, towns all across the country; from Slickpoo, Idaho to Spaghetti Junction, Kentucky. These help fill out the gazetteer function of the encyclopedia and give people a place to start if they want to expand on them. Gtwfan52 (talk) 09:06, 10 January 2013 (UTC)

You can copy the following text to your user page to display a user box proclaiming your selection as Editor of the Week:

{{subst:Wikipedia:WikiProject Editor Retention/Editor of the Week/Recipient user box}}

Thanks again for your efforts! --Go Phightins! 21:01, 27 January 2013 (UTC)

Good job! Thanks for all you do! Gtwfan52 (talk) 07:25, 28 January 2013 (UTC)
You are welcome. I need to ask for a favor. Could you please watchlist Fairview Alpha, Louisiana? There is a guy there, an IP beginning 12, that keeps adding nonsense. He is either not a native English speaker or 6 years old. Many thanks. And you deserved it! Gtwfan52 (talk) 14:33, 28 January 2013 (UTC)
This is done and will be watchedCoal town guy (talk) 14:37, 28 January 2013 (UTC)

Congrats, dude. Well deserved, imo. Acdixon (talk · contribs) 14:54, 28 January 2013 (UTC)

Bravo! Hip-Hip! and all that Jazz...```Buster Seven Talk 01:09, 29 January 2013 (UTC)
Editor of Red barnstar.png the Week
Flag of West Virginia.svg
Coal town guy is interested in West Virginia.

Coal town guy
Editor Retention Editor of the Week
For the week beginning January 27, 2013

This editor registered on March 28, 2012 and till the date of the award, he had 6200 edits, out of which over 3750 were to create new articles. Throughout his stay on Wikipedia, Coal town guy has been a silent contributor. His articles on towns and ghost towns have allowed Wikipedia to serve its purpose as a Gazetteer, and have allowed other editors to expand on them.

Next nominations
Edit this section
Known for Creating new articles on towns
Notable work(s) All pages made by him
Congratulations!-RFD (talk) 12:04, 29 January 2013 (UTC)
Much appreciated, you helped me get here as wellCoal town guy (talk) 14:08, 29 January 2013 (UTC)

A barnstar for you![edit]

Globe-barnstar2.png The Geography Barnstar
A barnstar for your work to significantly improve the List of counties in West Virginia article. Thanks for your work to improve Wikipedia's coverage of West Virginia topics. Northamerica1000(talk) 06:01, 18 February 2013 (UTC)

Talk page cleanup[edit]

As a frequent visitor to your talk page, I notice it's getting kind of long. This is just a suggestion, but have you considered archiving some of those old conversations to make the page more manageable? I know you can set up some bots to do it, or you can do it manually like I do (see the right side of my talk page). If you want to do this, I'll be glad to help you get started. Also, it's certainly not mandatory, but lots of folks (myself included) like to collect up their cookies, kittens, and barnstars in a single place, especially before archiving them. See my gallery. Like I said, it's not required, and maybe it's a little vain, but it sure can help out when you're having one of those days! Just a suggestion; take it for what it's worth. Acdixon (talk · contribs) 14:19, 18 February 2013 (UTC)

EGAD, I did need to tidy it upCoal town guy (talk) 16:08, 18 February 2013 (UTC)

A barnstar for you![edit]

Original Barnstar Hires.png The Original Barnstar
Congratulations! RFD (talk) 21:57, 19 February 2013 (UTC)

Congratulations on the featured list[edit]

Congratulations on the promotion of the counties list! Having worked on some featured list nominations myself about an eon ago (List of municipalities in Tennessee was my first), I like to see other editors work to create featured lists for topics like geography, history, and science (pretty much anything that's not one of the over-represented popular culture topics). Every featured list should encourage other Wikipedians to inject similar good qualities into their own lists. Proud that I was able to help you out a bit. --Orlady (talk) 22:09, 19 February 2013 (UTC)

I'm piling on here rather than creating a new section. Great work on the West Virginia counties page, and congrats on the FL. I was happy to help you get there. Jonesey95 (talk) 06:02, 26 February 2013 (UTC)

A barnstar for you![edit]

Tireless Contributor Barnstar Hires.gif The Tireless Contributor Barnstar
For your tireless contributions to the List of counties in West Virginia page and getting it to FL status, I hereby award you this barnstar. Great work! :) NeutralhomerTalk • 22:14, 19 February 2013 (UTC)

Belated reply[edit]

Hi Coal town guy, congrats on the FL promotion. Apologies for the belated reply; I was busy elsewhere, meant to get there yesterday and got caught up with RL stuff. Just wanted to tell you that you did a impressive job in the period between the PR and the FL. Truthkeeper (talk) 22:20, 19 February 2013 (UTC)

A barnstar for you![edit]

Tireless Contributor Barnstar Hires.gif The Tireless Contributor Barnstar
SUPERCALIFRAGALISTICEXPIALIDOCIOUS! Congrats on your first Feature!!! Bravo, Bravo!! Keep up the good work! Gtwfan52 (talk) 02:30, 20 February 2013 (UTC)
Annoying talk page stalker I think it's spelled: Supercallafragilisticexpialidocious! Go Phightins! 02:35, 20 February 2013 (UTC)

Congratulations and thanks[edit]

Congratulations on your first featured list, and thanks so much for the barnstar. Keep up the good work! Yours, Ruhrfisch ><>°° 03:44, 20 February 2013 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for February 20[edit]

Hi. Thank you for your recent edits. Wikipedia appreciates your help. We noticed though that when you edited List of counties in Kentucky, you added a link pointing to the disambiguation page Charles Scott (check to confirm | fix with Dab solver). Such links are almost always unintended, since a disambiguation page is merely a list of "Did you mean..." article titles. Read the FAQ • Join us at the DPL WikiProject.

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oops indeed[edit]

I'm guessing you were trying for this? Yunshui  15:00, 20 February 2013 (UTC)

You are correct, my error, and thanks for the catchCoal town guy (talk) 15:05, 20 February 2013 (UTC)
Not a problem. I see you have a few more to add, above; let me add my congratulations as well. Yunshui  15:16, 20 February 2013 (UTC)
Many thanksCoal town guy (talk) 15:24, 20 February 2013 (UTC)

The Signpost: 18 February 2013[edit]

West Virginia Counties FL[edit]

Congratulations on the FL, great work! Let me know if there's anything more you need in the future, I'd be glad to help. Jujutacular (talk) 04:29, 21 February 2013 (UTC)

Re: Ohio counties list[edit]

It would be nice to get that one back at FLC. Luckily, it doesn't need all that much work, just a retooling of the lead and figuring how how to best explain the strangeness with Wayne County. Wizardman 17:10, 22 February 2013 (UTC)

Laning's the second listed ref of the two book sources currently; i'll split them out and make the refs clearer soon enough. I believe NCA/NCT are the same thing; I'd be surprised if they weren't but I could be wrong. Wizardman 04:52, 24 February 2013 (UTC)

Barnstar Thanks![edit]

Wow Coal town guy,

Thank you so incredibly much for this tremendous honor! After writing and editing countless West Virginia-related articles and categories since 2005, I'd never received a barnstar award, so it means a great deal to me and is greatly appreciated for your acknowledgment! Thank you again for all your contributions to Wikipedia and for making West Virginia and its heritage, culture, and communities accessible to the world! Congratulations again on your featured list, sir! --Caponer (talk) 01:15, 23 February 2013 (UTC)


Coal town guy, thank you for sharing the interesting topic of coal scrip with me, especially since I've never heard of it before! My absences from Wikipedia will be increasing slightly in the weeks to come as I take on more projects and prepare for a move in the real world, but I will continue to have as much presence here as possible and hope to coordinate on this article when the pace slows down. I'll do some digging in the meantime. Take care, sir! --Caponer (talk) 01:20, 23 February 2013 (UTC)

Re Guyan River[edit]

I'm using Openstreetmap; Google maps; DeLorme atlas; and I'm clicking the coordinates link in the upper right of the page so as to get a pin on a Google map in cases where it's not clear. (I'm looking at a map and aerial photo of, say, Itmann, which you say isn't on the river; it sure looks like it is! Are you meaning that the coordinates assigned to the place by the GNIS are incorrect?) -- Malepheasant (talk) 02:21, 23 February 2013 (UTC)

When you say on the river, what do you mean? IF you mean, I get up, open a window and see it, no, not so. If you mean on a map it looks close. Sure. By that logic, McLean VA is on the Potomac, and well, its not. I could drive 4 + miles to Great Falls and see it sure. BUT I am not on itCoal town guy (talk) 02:41, 23 February 2013 (UTC)

Kentucky coal camps[edit]

I just created Kettle Island, Kentucky and noticed that you wrote Kettle Island Coal Camp, Kentucky a while back. The two places have separate GNIS entries, but their coordinates are in the same area, and Kettle Island is also a coal town. The GNIS entry for Kettle Island Coal Camp cites Robert Rennick's research and says the coal camp no longer exists, but Rennick's book of Kentucky place names only seems to mention Kettle Island, which he says is an existing coal town. So do you think these are duplicate entries for the same place, or is this another case of a settlement moving (albeit not that far)? A similar situation seems to exist for Arjay and Arjay Coal Camp, and I want to figure out what's going on here before I write the Arjay article. TheCatalyst31 ReactionCreation 01:53, 24 February 2013 (UTC)

From what I can gather, they are seperate. The "coal camp" coal town was the inhabited area closest to the mine, then you had a town area of the same name, further away which lead to the camp. Additionally, it is a time consideration. Almost without exception, they will list the coal camp as being defunct. This is in some instances fact, but it is also political. Lets face it, if you were a municipality, having a coal town in your area was roughly equivalent to having a leper nudist beach. I chose the coal town because I want to populate the category as much as I can before I start to break it down by state and county. I very much appreciate you asking by the way. Let me know how you want to proceedCoal town guy (talk) 02:15, 24 February 2013 (UTC)
Seems like a reasonable explanation to me. I figured if they were separate, it would be for some reason like that. That would explain why only the coal camp would be listed as defunct, too. If they weren't separate for political reasons, my guess would be that the mine closed after the coal ran out, so the coal camp either died out or got absorbed into the rest of the town (though of course it's speculation either way). I could probably be convinced either way about merging the articles or leaving them separate; for now they can probably be left as separate articles, but if there turns out not to be anything more to add about the coal camp merging them might be appropriate. I'll go ahead and start the article for Arjay. TheCatalyst31 ReactionCreation 04:38, 24 February 2013 (UTC)

County lists work[edit]

Hey there! I just wanted to mention that I'm pretty busy IRL. I already feel like I'm not putting enough work into these lists! Haha. I can't promise I will have a ton of time, but whatever time I do have for Wikipedia, I will try to concentrate on these lists. Jujutacular (talk) 05:30, 27 February 2013 (UTC)

The Signpost: 25 February 2013[edit]

Kanawha County, West Virginia[edit]

Counties roughly follow the order of sections in this guideline Wikipedia USCITY because there isn't a county guideline. You shouldn't include phones numbers, because "wikipedia isn't the yellow pages". I think you broke some fields in the infobox. • SbmeirowTalk • 10:08, 1 March 2013 (UTC)

I placed no phone numbers and never ever have. We have a new user KanawahCo who is having a field day telling the world about the new Walmart, swell people, family fun etc etc. Are you telling me you want a county article to have the phrases fun places and swell people with their phone numbers??? I could have a ball with alot of counties if thats the case.Coal town guy (talk) 14:02, 1 March 2013 (UTC)
Looks like an energetic newbie, perhaps having something to do with the Chamber of Commerce, who could use a little guidance. Perhaps also a pointer to Wikivoyage, which within reason, might be a better place for some of this material. Acroterion (talk) 15:20, 1 March 2013 (UTC)
Hmmmm, last night the "diff" looked like you did it. Now that I check it through the history doesn't it. Maybe the newer diff has some quirks? • SbmeirowTalk
I did a roll back, and then, you guessed it, rolled that back as well. There is some good data, and I tried to manually edit out the other data. However, it is difficult to go therough all of the changes this user has done. It is sadly common to WV county pages. I do however believe that this was a newby, and I hope their user name does not mean a county rep did the work.....Coal town guy (talk)
Double checked the residents. A majority are indeed from Kanawha County. I have wiki linked them and they are back on the page. We need to be as careful as possible with the newby and their inputCoal town guy (talk) 20:02, 1 March 2013 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for March 4[edit]

Hi. Thank you for your recent edits. Wikipedia appreciates your help. We noticed though that when you edited List of counties in Wisconsin, you added a link pointing to the disambiguation page Native American (check to confirm | fix with Dab solver). Such links are almost always unintended, since a disambiguation page is merely a list of "Did you mean..." article titles. Read the FAQ • Join us at the DPL WikiProject.

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Red link[edit]

Just ran across a red link for Tyrone, Kentucky in the new article Young's High Bridge. It's not my article, but I thought you might want to turn it blue anyway. Always nice to know you'll have an incoming link when you create an article. Acdixon (talk · contribs) 15:44, 4 March 2013 (UTC)

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A barnstar for you![edit]

Kindness Barnstar Hires.png The Random Acts of Kindness Barnstar
Thank you for what you have done helping out at WikiProject Wisconsin. I enjoy working with you on the List of Wisconsin Counties. I hope you will know that I appreciate you helping out at WP Wisconsin. RFD (talk) 01:31, 6 March 2013 (UTC)
Many thanks, it is very appreciatedCoal town guy (talk) 01:43, 6 March 2013 (UTC)

Teahouse talkback: you've got messages![edit]

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Minor edits[edit]

I guess that you may not have read WP:MINOR? When you are adding content, as in some of your recent edits, then it's not a minor edit. - David Biddulph (talk) 16:18, 6 March 2013 (UTC)

My error and thank youCoal town guy (talk) 16:19, 6 March 2013 (UTC)

Your question at Teahouse regarding map references[edit]

i would suggest contacting Wikipedia talk:WikiProject U.S. Roads. They have more experience with using maps as references than just about anyone. You might try to reach someone on their IRC channel, which I don't have, but you can find it at their project page. That way, they can talk to you about their practices, and not be too hung up on policy. Gtwfan52 (talk) 18:49, 6 March 2013 (UTC)

GROOVYCoal town guy (talk) 18:51, 6 March 2013 (UTC)

The Signpost: 04 March 2013[edit]

Citing a primary constitutional source[edit]

Its a complicated issue but, you may make clearly descriptive prose or text that anyone, without expertise can understand to be straightforward. For example, in the article United States Constitution#Original text under "National government/ Legislature" you will see that there is some prose about individual lines from the document such as:

Article One describes the Congress, the legislative branch of the federal government. Section 1, reads, "All legislative powers herein granted shall be vested in a Congress of the United States, which shall consist of a Senate and House of Representatives."

The article establishes the manner of election and the qualifications of members of each body. Representatives must be at least 25 years old, be a citizen of the United States for seven years, and live in the state they represent. Senators must be at least 30 years old, be a citizen for nine years, and live in the state they represent.
Article I, Section 8 enumerates the legislative powers, which include:

To make all laws which shall be necessary and proper for carrying into execution the foregoing powers, and all other powers vested by this Constitution in the government of the United States, or in any department or officer thereof.

Article I, Section 9 lists eight specific limits on congressional power.
The United States Supreme Court has interpreted the Commerce Clause and the Necessary and Proper Clause in Article One to allow Congress to enact legislation that is neither expressly listed in the enumerated power nor expressly denied in the limitations on Congress. In McCulloch v. Maryland (1819), the Supreme Court read the Necessary and Proper Clause to permit the federal government to take action that would "enable [it] to perform the high duties assigned to it [by the Constitution] in the manner most beneficial to the people,"[1] even if that action is not itself within the enumerated powers. Chief Justice Marshall clarified: "Let the end be legitimate, let it be within the scope of the Constitution, and all means which are appropriate, which are plainly adapted to that end, which are not prohibited, but consist with the letter and spirit of the Constitution, are Constitutional."[1]

So, basicly you just begin with a starightforward description of the text in a particular section and then add the anaysis/interpretation from your RS source, summerized directly below it. i hope this helps.--Amadscientist (talk) 02:15, 8 March 2013 (UTC)

This article used to have a Feature status but has been dropped to a B status. Best to seek a higher rated article of a similar nature to double check how such highly reviewed article handle this, but I think the above is what is generally done. Sorry for the "Happy edit" confusion. They want us to end with that to be as nice as possible or begin with a "Welcome to the Teahouse". I agree, it can sometimes make editors feel like they are being kissed off, but I assure you it is just something that we do at the Teahouse. But...we also attempt to follow through so if this still does not help you may always seek further input at my talkpage.--Amadscientist (talk) 02:25, 8 March 2013 (UTC)


Hi-I like the photo on your user page-thank you for posting it-RFD (talk) 18:50, 8 March 2013 (UTC)

Thats Jenkinjones WV......that place is rather cool. I plan on doing a gallery for the place here, HOWEVER, I need to of course be schooled in what is appropriate for a gallery.

The Signpost: 11 March 2013[edit]

Article Feedback deployment[edit]

Hey Coal town guy; I'm dropping you this note because you've used the article feedback tool in the last month or so. On Thursday and Friday the tool will be down for a major deployment; it should be up by Saturday, failing anything going wrong, and by Monday if something does :). Thanks, Okeyes (WMF) (talk) 21:32, 13 March 2013 (UTC)

GROOOVYCoal town guy (talk) 01:18, 14 March 2013 (UTC)

"U.S. state of"[edit]

HI. I guess we are in the middle of a WP:BRD action. Can you point me to any place where it is required to use such a phrase as "the U.S. state of California" or the "U.S. state of West Virginia"? Thank you. GeorgeLouis (talk) 00:45, 15 March 2013 (UTC)

(talk page stalker) I don't know if we have a policy mandating it, but I know a lot of non-U.S. readers appreciate it, either because they genuinely don't know all 50 U.S. states or because they appreciate us not assuming that they do. Per comments on some of my FACs, I usually begin all my political biographies with some variant of "John Doe was a lawyer and politician from the U.S. state of Kentucky." Acdixon (talk · contribs) 13:22, 15 March 2013 (UTC)
I concur, BUT there is a wicked bad logic thing here. The code. not what you read, but rather what we edit reads,
Gilmer County''' is a [[County (US)|county]] located in the [[U.S. state]] of [[West Virginia]]

I get why we have the US county ref because the othert county article is a wreck. BUT look at that phrase. Its a US county in the US state of etc etc etc. BUT, WP:LOC only nails the title, not the lead. We do indeed need to let folks know its inthe US, it is I agree, presumptive to think, the other near 7 billion people on the planet would know that, BUT, WOW, that is some ugly code....I have a new porposed county template (has humor) here...ANY comments would be welcomed, and I do mean ANYCoal town guy (talk) 13:29, 15 March 2013 (UTC)

Hooray! You created your Teahouse profile![edit]

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Some cookies![edit]

Christmas Cookies Plateful.JPG Here's a plate full of cookies to share!
Hi Coal town guy, here are some delicious cookies to help brighten your day! However, there are too many cookies here for one person to eat all at once, so please share these cookies with at least two other editors by copying {{subst:Sharethecookies}} to their talk pages. Enjoy! Go Phightins! 19:23, 21 March 2013 (UTC)

The Signpost: 18 March 2013[edit]

Nomination of Hazel Kirk, Pennsylvania for deletion[edit]

A discussion is taking place as to whether the article Hazel Kirk, Pennsylvania is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.

The article will be discussed at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Hazel Kirk, Pennsylvania until a consensus is reached, and anyone is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on high-quality evidence and our policies and guidelines.

Users may edit the article during the discussion, including to improve the article to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the article-for-deletion notice from the top of the article.Niteshift36 (talk) 13:25, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

Nomination of Good Intent, Pennsylvania for deletion[edit]

A discussion is taking place as to whether the article Good Intent, Pennsylvania is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.

The article will be discussed at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Good Intent, Pennsylvania until a consensus is reached, and anyone is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on high-quality evidence and our policies and guidelines.

Users may edit the article during the discussion, including to improve the article to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the article-for-deletion notice from the top of the article.Niteshift36 (talk) 13:25, 25 March 2013 (UTC)

The Signpost: 25 March 2013[edit]

Weyanoke, W.Va[edit]

As you are the resident expert on obscure Appalachian coal towns, I was going through an old trade magazine and found reference to "Weyanoke, West Virginia" and the Weyanoke Coal and Coke Co. I can't seem to find quick online information on the town (mostly out of curiosity), but it may be a missing article, or the very least a redirect to the county/nearest town, etc. Know of it? Morgan Riley (talk) 15:39, 29 March 2013 (UTC)

(stalker edit) It's in Mercer County; I started Weyanoke, West Virginia. TheCatalyst31 ReactionCreation 09:03, 30 March 2013 (UTC)
Hi guys, back from the beach, no coal there. Weyanoke Coal and Coke was HUGE at its zenith. Check out Arista, West Virginia and Hiawatha, West Virginia as well. Both of those were in Mercer County as well. While yes, there was a Weyanoke WV, its greater presence was probably in Hiawatha. Hope this helps and thanks Catalyst my manCoal town guy (talk) 20:32, 31 March 2013 (UTC)
Apparently you didn't go to New Zealand :-) Thanks for the notes on Alaska; I've never done much with our articles up there. Nyttend (talk) 21:42, 10 April 2013 (UTC)
Anytime, my brother lived in New Zealand for a bit, great people wonderful culture..I have always been fascinated by remote placesCoal town guy (talk) 01:29, 11 April 2013 (UTC)

Teahouse talkback: you've got messages![edit]

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The Signpost: 01 April 2013[edit]

The Signpost: 08 April 2013[edit]

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Merge Penile, Jefferson County, Kentucky and Penile, Louisville?[edit]

Do these refer to the same place?

Penile, Jefferson County, Kentucky and Penile, Louisville.

Regards, Gilliam (talk) 18:00, 15 April 2013 (UTC)

Yes, they are now that I am looking. Their hometoen locator is incorrect. Please use the GNIS entry article. Good catch. The one in Jefferson County was also called PenialCoal town guy (talk) 18:05, 15 April 2013 (UTC)


Just a reminder — before you remove a blue link that goes directly to an article, please check to make sure that the article has (and is linked by) the appropriate county template. I've not checked (and am not planning to check) the pages you removed, so please don't think that I'm objecting to what you're doing; this is simply a reminder to do what you may already be doing consistently. Of course, it's going to be different if the link is a redirect to an established article (e.g. Akers, Louisiana, an alternate name for an established place) or a link to a disambiguation page. Nyttend (talk) 19:36, 15 April 2013 (UTC)

Thanks a lot! The county templates used to be my biggest single activity (I created most of them nationwide), but it's been a long time now since I paid much attention to them. You may find it gets boring as you get into far western Kentucky — having been there last week, I can testify that the small communities of Fulton County and other parts of the Purchase are culturally as far away as you can get from Appalachia while still remaining rural. On the other hand, you may find them interesting for the same reason as these coal towns: they're withering away because of the surrounding geography, at least partly because they're so susceptible to flooding. It's somewhat eerie driving through places like Sassafras Ridge (36°33′12″N 89°19′43″W / 36.55333°N 89.32861°W / 36.55333; -89.32861), perhaps even more than it would be if they were in the hills: a few abandoned businesses, a few abandoned houses and trailers, and a few still-inhabited houses and trailers, all surrounded by miles of wide-open fields with the only elevation change being the Mississippi River levees that you can dimly see a few miles away, and you know that they burst in 1993 and might again. As you gaze across the massive floodplain fields, you realise that they were once home to lots of small farmers, and now they're abandoned because modern machinery enables farmers to cultivate wide areas while living up on the bluffs away from the floodwaters. It's even emptier and lonelier than it would be if it were in the hills: if you're in a remote hilly area for the first time, you can always imagine that there's a house just over the ridgeline, but out there you know that there are no other humans within several miles. Nyttend (talk) 23:53, 15 April 2013 (UTC)
Good observations. I am going on another great trek in the end of May in McDowell County WV. I get my hiking clothes, and start driving. I usually stop at any static yellowed grass paths proceeding in a perfect line. Thats creasote, killing grass buried underneath bad reclamation and thats where I find places. They are at times, just stair cases in the woods. Other times, I get lucky and there is an actual passable road. ALWAYS have my cameras. No Big Foot sightings, BUT, good people and placesCoal town guy (talk) 01:31, 16 April 2013 (UTC)
I normally don't talk with the locals — not because I have something against them, but because I have lots of places to go, and people always wonder how my Ohio license plate ended up in a little town so far from Ohio, and it takes a bit of explaining to satisfy their curiosity about the out-of-town guy who's taking pictures of the neighbor's house. I do enjoy talking with people when I have the time (on Friday I met a lovely old lady in Blytheville, Arkansas, who was delighted to learn that I found her city interesting), but when you have hundreds of miles to drive and you want to get lots of photos, talking can become distracting. Of course, I often find myself starting conversations with "Help, I'm from out of town; can you tell me how to get to ____?" Eastern Kentucky is a place I really don't know; except for places on the Ohio River, I've almost never been east of I-75 in the state, so most of what I've learned is from a former roommate who worked for an archaeology firm in Harlan and nearby counties. Even that is more than my knowledge of West Virginia; other than the Ohio River counties, I've not been to any part of WV except for a couple of interstate trips as a child and a single US 50 trip (when a teen) from Capon Bridge to I-79 at Clarksburg — nothing of southern areas like McDowell County. Nyttend (talk) 01:52, 16 April 2013 (UTC)
Hmm, reading the McDowell County article, I see that floods aren't outlandish in that area either — I'm somewhat familiar with flood slike this, and definitely familiar with floods like this, but flash floods aren't something I think of very much. Nyttend (talk) 02:02, 16 April 2013 (UTC)
Totally understood. I have the luck, I guess, of being more local myself, but I am now 30 years and 300+ miles removed, its tough, but what I can recall, helps alot with local people because most of the places I go are rather, shall we say, remote. Most coal towns are anyway. What I did discover is that when interviewing people, they can tell you ALOT about an area, and together you learn so much that the photos become easier. I MUST get to Algoma and Caretta and Jenkinjones and if you ever , and I do mean ever make it CR8, at Jenkinjones, there is no way on earth a person accidentally gets there. WOW, its far out. Flooding there is an issue because of the soil. Its been overmined for decades. Hence a flashflood there wipes out silt almost instantly. It can be quick and fast, and leave alot of a town, goneCoal town guy (talk) 02:08, 16 April 2013 (UTC)


I'll let you know of any disambiguation issues as I go.

I live in Northern KY so I'm glad to help on issues relating to the bluegrass state.

Some of the towns remind me of Jason Aldean's song Fly Over States, "Miles and miles of back roads and highways, Connecting little towns with funny names."

-Gilliam (talk) 21:16, 15 April 2013 (UTC)

Many many thanks! I know the siong well.Coal town guy (talk) 23:28, 15 April 2013 (UTC)

Prosperity, West Virginia[edit]

Both of these communities of the same name appear to be in Raleigh County, WV. Might they refer to the same place?

WOW, I made an erro there for sure. The CDP entry is correct.Coal town guy (talk) 02:04, 17 April 2013 (UTC)


These articles appear to refer to the same place and should be merged:

If Brown became Nuttallburg, you could mention this in Nuttalburg's history (?) section. Gilliam (talk) 08:52, 17 April 2013 (UTC)

I left a detailed reply on your talk page. Each town had its own PO. Hence why I uploaded a postmark of each town to each article. They are disctinct coal towns and yes, I have been to both. When Brown went under, SOME not all of their mines were used by Nuttallburg which was a town proper at that time as well. While GNIS did not do the job right, and I cant blame them, I can provide links to mine maps showing the diffs which will help, I think. BUT, let me know. AND again, many thanks for the keen eye.Please DO NOT merge these. It would NOT be correct to do so Coal town guy (talk) 12:26, 17 April 2013 (UTC)

County Templates[edit]

Could you tell me what you want me to explain, and to whom I should explain it? You've fixed the problem well. Nyttend (talk) 12:45, 17 April 2013 (UTC)

Oh, explain it to you — I thought you meant I was supposed to instruct Gilliam or someone else. I'm not sure that a navbox for coal towns would be helpful: first off, the 900+ means that one navbox for all of them would be ridiculously big, and secondly the criteria for inclusion would be unclear. County templates are easy, since we include every municipality and every unincorporated locality that's counted as a populated place as long as they're within the specific legal boundaries of the county. Simply being a coal town isn't really enough of a defining characteristic; I'm afraid that a navbox for coal towns would go against the advice given in the "Do we really need this template at all?" section of the WP:ATC essay. Meanwhile, I really don't know how they're made; when I went around creating these templates, I started with one created by someone else and simply changed county name, county seat, and community names. I think you might do better to create something like {{National Register of Historic Places}} — rather than creating navboxes, I think it would help to put together a short list of some common topics (e.g. coal town, coal scrip, company town, coal mining), link all of them in a small box, and place the template on many articles as a footer. Nyttend (talk) 14:16, 17 April 2013 (UTC)

The Signpost: 15 April 2013[edit]

Fireco postage stamp[edit]

Thanks for writing. You're so right about the stamp. I thought a picture would be better, but both images are best. Cheers! Richard Apple (talk) 23:21, 17 April 2013 (UTC)

County government in the United States[edit]

Hi. To defuse the edit war that has started at Category:County government in the United States, I'm hoping for some additional input on the topic of whether U.S. counties are (1) a level of local government or (2) an arm of state government. I think this is a topic that you might be able to comment productively on. Discussion thus far is on my User talk page at User_talk:Orlady#County_government, but we could move it to a content-oriented talk page if desired. --Orlady (talk) 00:36, 18 April 2013 (UTC)

Greetings, Orlady has posted this question to about a dozen places already, and at this point, I think we need to look into the whole canvassing policy. Perhaps we should take this question to WP:United States, and WP:Politics and leave it at that. I am perfectly willing to enter into a discussion or two about the matter, BUT NOT 50! My claim is that although county officials may be elected or appointed locally (i.e. not statewide), the actual county government itself is an arm of the state government. This is consistent with the powers they exercise (elections, law enforcement, etc.). If we could have some academically informed input, I would appreciate it, because the general impression and intuition that people have is that county government is "local government," but to those who actually study political science formally, the difference is known. The compromise that I propose is the persons should be categorized under "local politicians" while the offices should be categorized under "state government." Greg Bard (talk) 8:39 pm, Today (UTC−4)
Howdy, I stopped 2 years into my Phd program for Appalachian studies with a grad degree in Econ and law as it pertained t commerce and states rights. I am rather familiar with thi concept and would STRONGLY suggest we do indeed get a singkle discussion and STRONGLY suggest we place the politics aside ESPECIALLY if you choose Connecticut as an example. Thats slippery slope, and its all a hacked political POV. Not neutral and NOT hereCoal town guy (talk) 01:01, 18 April 2013 (UTC)

The Signpost: 22 April 2013[edit]

CDPs and census data[edit]

I probably haven't taken the time to get back with you on your recent replies. My laptop was stolen about three weeks ago, which means I'm back to either working from my phone or wherever I can find a real computer out on the road.

The 1980 data may take a little time to fully transcribe. I had to photocopy it from a book. The remaining censuses are available online (you have to go to Gazetteer, not FactFinder, to find it). There are missing files. However, it should be easier going, between the data being online and mainly looking for differences rather than starting a list from scratch.

Like with the list of legislator articles, this is to establish notable subjects which need articles. It may be prudent in the future to move the information to a requested articles page, if the articles aren't all created first. Speaking of which, the 2010 Census CDP articles are found on es-wiki (here's just a few examples). I just haven't had the time yet to translate the articles, because it requires a little more attention to detail than automagically relying upon Google Translate. RadioKAOS  – Talk to me, Billy 19:15, 26 April 2013 (UTC)


I hate wikidrama!!! The category warring and the Gibraltar WikiProject!!! I wanted to get that out of my system. Thank you for what you for Wikipedia-RFD (talk) 23:20, 26 April 2013 (UTC)

Netherlands municipalities list[edit]

I am swamped in real life and have a few peer reviews I said I would do and am way overdue on here already - I can probably take a look at the list in May. Sorry, Ruhrfisch ><>°° 03:20, 27 April 2013 (UTC)

State Line, Kentucky[edit]

A pity I didn't know about this place a few weeks ago; I drove through there on the trip I mentioned to you, but I didn't take any photos between Hickman and Woodland Mills. Nyttend (talk) 05:12, 27 April 2013 (UTC)

I often take old topo maps and a compass when I decide to do some photos in an area that is not so well populated anymore. It is amazing what you can find if you look closely.Coal town guy (talk) 17:50, 29 April 2013 (UTC)

The Center Line: Spring 2013[edit]

The Center Line header.svg
Volume 6, Issue 2 • Spring 2013 • About the Newsletter
State and national updates
ArchivesNewsroomFull IssueShortcut: WP:USRD/NEWS
EdwardsBot (talk) 22:26, 27 April 2013 (UTC)


Thanks for the encouragement.. I am taking a break for a few hours but remain committed to finishing the KY Place Names guide on Google books.- Gilliam (talk) 13:32, 30 April 2013 (UTC)

As of recently, I have added quite a few red links to disambiguation pages for Kentucky towns in my book but not in Wikipedia, as maps and infoboxes is not really my thing. Thanks again for adding your touch to those articles.= Gilliam (talk) 13:56, 30 April 2013 (UTC)

New article.[edit]

Here's something new that needs worked on: Grace, Kentucky. It needs an infoboox, map, the works.

Grace is an unincorporated community located in Clay County, Kentucky, United States.

A post office was established in the community in 1898. Grace is said to be named for the favorite housekeeper of a local congressman.[2]

Many thanks, got it doneCoal town guy (talk) 03:29, 1 May 2013 (UTC)


  1. ^ a b 17. U.S. at 421
  2. ^ Rennick, Robert M. (1987). "Kentucky Place Names". University Press of Kentucky. p. 120. Retrieved 2013-04-28. 

Regards, - Gilliam (talk) 03:16, 1 May 2013 (UTC)

Thank you[edit]

Thank you for the Barnstar. I hope someone can make use of the information that I gathered. Or just take the list whole (but eliminate the first column).    → Michael J    03:52, 1 May 2013 (UTC)

Gulston and Pansy[edit]

Please don't do this — the list really shouldn't be changed except by removing blue links. This kind of situation is better addressed by creating the old name as a redirect to the new name, and then deleting the old name because it's a good blue link. Nyttend (talk) 17:48, 1 May 2013 (UTC)

My apologies, I will make sure to follow that to the letter. At least the list is getting shorter.Coal town guy (talk) 17:54, 1 May 2013 (UTC)
Hey, I wasn't complaining and wasn't expecting an apology; I'm sorry that I made you think that. Feel free to append comments to entries; I meant that the links themselves shouldn't be changed. Post offices generally mean some sort of community, so these situations probably mean that GNIS is missing the place — like Wikipedia, they're nowhere near complete. However, the lack of information means that I'd suggest you not create any articles for these places unless you get additional information. Look for online published county histories, or try to find applicable historical markers, or check your Kentucky Atlas and Gazetteer if you have it. I have the atlas, so if you don't have it, let me know which communities need to be looked up in it. Perhaps you could add a marker (e.g. ‡) next to the names of the communities that aren't in GNIS? Meanwhile, since you're doing all of this writing of local history, I strongly suggest that you obtain a copy of A Bibliography of American County Histories (library catalogue link) if you don't already have one. Nyttend (talk) 18:43, 1 May 2013 (UTC)
Believe it or not, its on my Birthday list....The County History book, that is........Coal town guy (talk) 18:45, 1 May 2013 (UTC)
Found (by accident) a good example of a no-GNIS situation. Sassafras Ridge, which I mentioned up above, is absent from GNIS, but it's in the Atlas and Gazetteer, and GNIS has the ridge itself (ID #502999) and a nearby church (ID #503000), and it definitely exists, so we'll presumably be able to find sourcing somewhere. Nyttend (talk) 19:21, 1 May 2013 (UTC)
A VERY cool thing, (KY Atlas and Gazetteer which I found online) many thanks. I have a Gazetteer question for you which I will post on your pageCoal town guy (talk) 20:28, 1 May 2013 (UTC)
The coordinates for #502999 point to the community, which is on a road and isn't part of a noticeable ridge, so I think the GNIS misclassified Sassafras Ridge as a ridge instead of a populated place. In my experience, the GNIS does that a lot when it comes to places that have a geographic term like "Ridge" or "Valley" or "Bay" in the name; usually if you tell them about it they'll correct it. TheCatalyst31 ReactionCreation 20:44, 1 May 2013 (UTC)
Good point; that reminds me of Mount Jefferson (Ohio) and its AFD, which was the result of someone relying purely on the GNIS. What do you mean about it being online and giving you an ID number? I'm talking about this, which is much more portable and much more useful without Internet access than any online service :-) I'm suggesting that you use it to give the article a little geographic context. See what I did at Branchville, Indiana, where I used the Indiana atlas to specify (1) the road on which it's located, and (2) where it lies compared to a larger community, in this case the county seat. Nyttend (talk) 21:02, 1 May 2013 (UTC)
AHA, I misunderstood you Nyttend, Yes, I have KY and TN and WV and OH and WY and VA road altas and Gazetteer. There is of course an online KY Gazetteer which gives the GNIS numbers you provided. I thought you had gotten those from an Atlas or Gazetteer. I mixed that up with a ref number in the Atlas. Yeah I know. I said I was a very very literal personCoal town guy (talk) 21:18, 1 May 2013 (UTC)

──────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────── The GNIS is quicker than usual today; they've already responded to my question about Sassafras Ridge. It's now classified as a populated place, and it's also marked as historical now since the person handling the request noticed that the community's abandoned. TheCatalyst31 ReactionCreation 21:31, 1 May 2013 (UTC)

The Signpost: 29 April 2013[edit]

Thank you[edit]

Thank you-RFD (talk) 09:48, 2 May 2013 (UTC)

The Signpost: 06 May 2013[edit]

The Signpost: 13 May 2013[edit]

Rayburn, Alabama[edit]

Hi-Could you do an information box for Rayburn, Alabama please? Also Baden, West Virginia needs an article. Thank you for your help.RFD (talk) 12:51, 17 May 2013 (UTC)

Got them both. Thanks for the data for letting me know about BAden!Coal town guy (talk) 13:00, 17 May 2013 (UTC)


I was just wondering if someone could add a detailed history section and mabee add to the attractions section I made. If you can't I will just have to ask a few people around town this summer. SmerkInYourEyes (talk) 19:11, 17 May 2013 (UTC)

Hmm, there are a few sources, county govet offices, and talking to folks is great, BUT, be certain to get references. Not, because the guy who lives there said so. Good luck!!Coal town guy (talk) 22:05, 17 May 2013 (UTC)

Lucerne, West Virginia[edit]

Hi-Lucerne, West Virginia in Gilmer County-GNIS-1549802-thank you-RFD (talk) 20:37, 21 May 2013 (UTC)

Got it! Many thanks!!Coal town guy (talk) 21:02, 21 May 2013 (UTC)

The Signpost: 20 May 2013[edit]

Disambiguation link notification for May 23[edit]

Hi. Thank you for your recent edits. Wikipedia appreciates your help. We noticed though that when you edited Ai, Georgia, you added a link pointing to the disambiguation page Georgia (check to confirm | fix with Dab solver). Such links are almost always unintended, since a disambiguation page is merely a list of "Did you mean..." article titles. Read the FAQ • Join us at the DPL WikiProject.

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Thank you for your constructive criticism in the list article and for the barnstar you gave me. CRwikiCA talk 13:29, 23 May 2013 (UTC)

No problem, it was deserved. Besides, it was my Dutch room mate who improved my German, how can I forget. My dialect at that time was what a person would call NOT high German...Coal town guy (talk) 13:48, 23 May 2013 (UTC)
I have always found it odd that it is called high German haha. CRwikiCA talk 16:05, 23 May 2013 (UTC)
Ditto, especially when we heard Platt alotCoal town guy (talk) 17:22, 23 May 2013 (UTC)

The Signpost: 27 May 2013[edit]

State Line KY[edit]

Do you still have access to the envelope that you scanned to produce File:State Line KY postmark.jpg? The image doesn't look like a normal scan; to me, it looks as if you photographed the envelope at an angle instead of photographing or scanning it from directly above. Meanwhile, it really should be retagged as {{PD-USGov}}, since the image is an unoriginal reproduction of stamps and a postmark created by a US Government agency. Nyttend (talk) 17:57, 2 June 2013 (UTC)

Nyttend, I sure do. I took a pic from a borrowed camera, BUT I can make certain to get a good scan within the week. Would that suffice?Coal town guy (talk) 19:08, 2 June 2013 (UTC)
Sure; thanks. A different camera angle will work fine; just be careful to be directly above (or very close to directly above) when you get the picture. When doing this kind of thing, I typically turn off all the lights except a desk lamp; sunlight can cause funny shadows and overhead lighting will often put your head's shadow and the camera's shadow on top of the subject, but a desk lamp is low enough that you should have an easy time making all shadows end up well to the side. Nyttend (talk) 02:43, 3 June 2013 (UTC)
I just did just over 1000 miles of driving in WV and came back home and promptly collapsed. This is my first full week back. I was FINALLY able to update a few of the National Historic pics on lists for more remote places, McDowell County, Fayette, and of course Raleigh (not remote BUT fun)Coal town guy (talk) 13:33, 3 June 2013 (UTC)
Nice! I'm just starting to collapse, too; I just got back a few minutes ago from an all-day photo trip to the farther-out Indiana suburbs of Chicago. The direct Bloomington-Michigan City-Crown Point-Bloomington trip is 400+ miles, and getting photos of remote historic sites means that I took a decent number of detours. I've already gotten all of the remote Indiana historic sites; pretty much all of the ones I don't have are in the state's northern cities, which are far enough away that I simply can't visit them under normal conditions. Nyttend (talk) 03:28, 4 June 2013 (UTC)

The Signpost: 05 June 2013[edit]

The Signpost: 12 June 2013[edit]

The Signpost: 19 June 2013[edit]

Wheat, West Virginia[edit]

Hi-I came across Wheat, West Virginia and wanted to help out. Thanks-RFD (talk) 21:22, 21 June 2013 (UTC)

Got it. The real world is still hip deep, but I did manage to update it, many thanks for the catchCoal town guy (talk) 14:34, 24 June 2013 (UTC)

Maybe of interest to you[edit]

Ran across this article on the Lexington Herald-Leader web site today and thought you might be interested. If you are, I recommend you try to get a copy (electronic or otherwise) ASAP, because LHL articles tend to disappear behind the paywall. Acdixon (talk · contribs) 20:32, 25 June 2013 (UTC)

GROOVY....ALMOST ready to start editing more again, crazy real world time constarints. However, MUCH appreciated.


Thank you for the barnstar. It is nice to see that the list article finally made it to FL! CRwikiCA talk 18:41, 27 June 2013 (UTC)

The Signpost: 26 June 2013[edit]

TemplateData is here[edit]

Hey Coal town guy

I'm sending you this because you've made quite a few edits to the template namespace in the past couple of months. If I've got this wrong, or if I haven't but you're not interested in my request, don't worry; this is the only notice I'm sending out on the subject :).

So, as you know (or should know - we sent out a centralnotice and several watchlist notices) we're planning to deploy the VisualEditor on Monday, 1 July, as the default editor. For those of us who prefer markup editing, fear not; we'll still be able to use the markup editor, which isn't going anywhere.

What's important here, though, is that the VisualEditor features an interactive template inspector; you click an icon on a template and it shows you the parameters, the contents of those fields, and human-readable parameter names, along with descriptions of what each parameter does. Personally, I find this pretty awesome, and from Monday it's going to be heavily used, since, as said, the VisualEditor will become the default.

The thing that generates the human-readable names and descriptions is a small JSON data structure, loaded through an extension called TemplateData. I'm reaching out to you in the hopes that you'd be willing and able to put some time into adding TemplateData to high-profile templates. It's pretty easy to understand (heck, if I can write it, anyone can) and you can find a guide here, along with a list of prominent templates, although I suspect we can all hazard a guess as to high-profile templates that would benefit from this. Hopefully you're willing to give it a try; the more TemplateData sections get added, the better the interface can be. If you run into any problems, drop a note on the Feedback page.

Thanks, Okeyes (WMF) (talk) 22:08, 28 June 2013 (UTC)

Hahn, Texas[edit]

Hi, CTG! Hey, since you write more about towns that are pretty much gone than anyone I know, would you mind taking a look at the above article? I find the roadmap approach the editor is taking to be a bit silly. Gtwfan52 (talk) 04:19, 29 June 2013 (UTC)

Its a tad extreme, and in some instances, misleading. I can make some edits, BUT it wil be nice to have your feedback as well, JUST IN CASE there is a less then pleasant reaction.Coal town guy (talk) 18:15, 30 June 2013 (UTC)
Please do. I will start a discussion on the TP and if you could make any edits you see as appropriate, that would be great. I'll get at it around 10pm MDT today. Gtwfan52 (talk) 20:53, 30 June 2013 (UTC)
I left a comment/defense at the Hahn talk page. When WP called for photos of places my response was to travel to many small towns within driving distance. I upload my photos to existing articles and write new articles about other places that don't yet have any. I'm having fun. Anyone is welcome to improve the articles as per the common understanding. But removal of all geography data except GNIS coordinates seems like too much, especially since I can find many examples in WP of non-GNIS data being included. I think this disagreement boils down to a difference of opinion about what is considered "useful information" and who gets to decide. If there is a WP standard for articles about small and ghost towns, please let me know and I will try to follow it. My WP writing is always evolving. Thanks. Djmaschek (talk) 00:12, 1 July 2013 (UTC)
Djmaschek, whoah whoah. I am on your side and have fun as well. The only contention I would have is the levelk of detail. I am painfully aware of amller places and remote loications on the map and I am 100% with you. The only specific questions I would have are do you think its needed to include data about which quad this place is located in? AND do you think its needed to tell folks which road and if its a right or left. I think, its fantastic to have the level of detail especially for smaloler places. We all evolve and I certainly hope to do so as well. The reason I would even ask this is given the level of detail, do you think it would help or hinder? For example, the quad data could go in a geography section, and stating the geo coordibates in the article itself, is over kill, you have an info box and a title abopve the map image, how many more do you need? Again, this is a great article, love the cemetery data, however, on a lark as it were , is the cemetery populated by a famous family or persons? How many are a few oil wells? How about a section on what the oil industry meant to that place? Just some thoughts and by no means were my words meant as a challenge and most of all, to deter fun, it is funCoal town guy (talk) 13:15, 1 July 2013 (UTC)
I left a response at the Hahn, Texas talk page. To change the subject: Do you think Hahn qualifies as a ghost town? I've been wrestling with this. It might be insulting to the few remaining residents. There are some objective criteria (no identifying road sign, source refers to it in the past tense, few or no homes) for labeling a ghost town but no hard and fast rules. Of course if a source states explicitly that it is a ghost town, it makes it easy. In Hahn's case this was not stated. Djmaschek (talk) 03:52, 2 July 2013 (UTC)
Believe it or not, it is totally possible to be classified a ghost town and have a population. I had a bit of a time with that as well. The main thing to keep in mind, and this is my experience, your mileage may vary, IF and I will again state IF you find yourself considering the emotions of the people there, try to look at the place as if it were in an encyclopedia from the view of a person saying, oh look, here is a town named Hahn in Texas, I wonder what it was etc etc I am VERY guilty of being emotive on certain topics and there are times when hell yes, its hard to watch what others write about certain places. I have, no exaggeration, walked away from major editing efforts because, I would not remain non emotive OR, it would be a confrontational feel, and thats just not an option for me. Its NOT easy at times but again, consider what an encyclopedia is, and go from thereCoal town guy (talk) 04:17, 2 July 2013 (UTC)
CTG gives great advice. I edit a lot of high school articles and the attachment the kids have to their school's article is not really conducive to effective editing. A prom is a prom; every school has one so they are not really worth discussing in a high school article. But try to tell a schoolkid that about his or her school's prom, and look out! My very first edit on Wikipedia was to an article about a friend from high school, the next was to my high school's article. I pretty much have left it and my hometown alone since except to revert vandalism, just simply because it is hard to separate what I know, what I feel, what I can prove and what others might care about. I went round and around with a guy about the importance of a commercial campground in his hometown. Generally, Wiki articles about places don't discuss specific businesses unless they have notability on their own. (The best indicator of that is an article existing on them.) He felt since the campground was the only thing in the town he should talk about it in specifics in the article. It took me quite a while to convince him that just because the campground was important to the town, that didn't make it important to the world.
The article looks much better now. I found a website that actually mentioned that no census data exists for Hahn, so there goes that idea. There are simply some places that all you can say about them is they exist or existed. I too hope you continue to edit Wikipedia and am more than willing to help you in any way I can. Feel free to drop me a note anytime. Just an aside; the last time I was in Texas, about 40 years ago (I have family in Taylor), Hutto was just a crossroad, quite like Hahn is today. Now, Hutto is a thriving small city. Things change.Gtwfan52 (talk) 05:05, 2 July 2013 (UTC)
There is a census data set that would mention Hahn, BUT you would need to know what district of the county it was in. You will see names, but no population totals.Coal town guy (talk) 14:02, 2 July 2013 (UTC)

VisualEditor newsletter[edit]

Hey Coal town guy. We've just rolled out a new version of the VisualEditor :). Changes and patches include:

  • Newly added templates now list their available parameters if TemplateData is available;
  • The load for the VisualEditor on apages is now 4 KiB, down from 119 KiB;
  • Feedback dialog is no longer chased off the screen by typing (bug 50538)
  • Fixed the Monobook issues around z-indexes (bug 50241)
  • Undoing an image resize doesn't make everything look bad
  • In the image dialog, "Caption content" is now just "Caption"
  • Tweaked tooltip references to VisualEditor to instead talk about "source mode"

Those are the big ones; more coming at the end of this week or early next week :). It's a short list, but the load issue took up a lot of time, as did TemplateData, and are both pretty big changes. If you've got any questions, drop them on my talkpage. Thanks, Okeyes (WMF) (talk) 01:20, 4 July 2013 (UTC)

The Signpost: 03 July 2013[edit]

Fairview, West Virginia[edit]

I came across the disambiguation page for Fairview, West Virginia. Articles for Fairview, Mingo County, West Virginia and Fairview, Wetzel County, West Virginia are redlinked and need articles-thanks-RFD (talk) 23:22, 5 July 2013 (UTC)

GROOVY!, Many thanksCoal town guy (talk) 02:00, 6 July 2013 (UTC)

VisualEditor newsletter[edit]

Hey Coal town guy! We've just deployed some fixes to the VisualEditor. These include:

  • "Edit" will load the latest version, not the version you're looking at (bug 49943)
  • "Edit" will load the latest version, not the version you edited last time if this is your second edit (bug 50441)
  • VE edit section links will load the latest, not original, version in diff view preview (bug 50925)
  • <big><big>Foo</big></big> and similar repeated tags will not get corrupted any more (bug 49755)

In the meantime, testing is proceeding well, and hopefully we can get some more fixes out over the next couple of days. If you're interested in helping out, we have a set of open tasks we'd really appreciate your assistance with :). Thanks, Okeyes (WMF) (talk) 07:57, 9 July 2013 (UTC)

VE newsletter[edit]

Hey Coal town guy

We just deployed another VisualEditor release; bugs fixed include:

  • Firefox 13/14 has been temporarily blacklisted, to avoid the insertion of broken links [[./that look like this]] (50720)
  • Changing a reference in a template should no longer produce the bright red "you don't have a references block!" error (bugzilla:50423)
  • Notices are now shown if you're editing a protected or semi-protected page (bugzilla:50415)
  • The template inspector will no longer invite you to insert parameters that are already being used (50715)
  • Same as above, but with aliases (50717)
  • Parameter names in the template dialogue now word-wrap (50800)
  • The link inspector will not show in the top left if you hit the return key while opening it (49941)
  • Hitting return twice in the link editor will no longer introduce a new line that overwrites the link (51075)
  • Oddly-named categories no longer cause corruption (50702)
  • The toolbar no longer occasionally covers the cursor (48787)
  • Changing the formatting of text no longer occasionally scrolls you upwards (50792)

Not specific bugs, but other things; cacheing is now improved, so people should stop seeing temporary breaking when the VisualEditor updates, and RTL support has received some patches. I hope this newsletter is helpful to people; I'll send out another one with the next deployment :). Thanks, Okeyes (WMF) (talk) 10:07, 11 July 2013 (UTC)

The Signpost: 10 July 2013[edit]

VE newsletter[edit]

Hey Coal town guy! Another set of patches :). Today we have:

  • Required template parameters are now automatically added to new templates (50747)
  • Templates with piped links now display correctly when you alter them (50801)
  • If your edit token expires, you're now informed of it (50424).
    You still won't be able to save - that's due to be fixed on Monday :).

More on Monday, I suspect. Hope you have a good weekend :). I should also have some news about the IP launch pretty soon. Thanks, Okeyes (WMF) (talk) 13:15, 12 July 2013 (UTC)

(if you're seeing this and aren't the newsletter recipient - please do sign up here)

VE newsletter[edit]

Hey Coal town guy; hope you had a decent weekend :). We've got a pile of patches, some of which went out on Monday, some yesterday:

  • If you insert wikitext such as links or section headers, you get a notice in the top right corner (over the save button). It doesn't go away until click, though once dismissed you don't get another one that edit. (49820)
  • If your edit token expires, VE fetches a new one for you so you can save. (50424)
  • If the page is empty of content but does have something non-content (like a category or an HTML comment), VE no longer crashes on load - (50289)
  • sub tags are no longer removed ((49873)
  • If you type at the end of links, they now extend
  • Templates now only take a single click to insert
  • Clear annotations clears links (50461)
  • The link inspector stays open when you click to another item (50895)
  • Typing after multi-byte characters no longer creats pawn icons (51140)
  • Resizing thumbnails that have a default size set now works (50645)
  • References made by tag:ref now display properly (bugzilla:50978)
  • The VE is integrated with the spam blacklist (50826)
  • Feedbacl link goes to the right language (bugzilla:47730)

There are a lot more improvements coming, but that's it for Monday and Tuesday. Thanks, Okeyes (WMF) (talk) 08:17, 17 July 2013 (UTC)

The Signpost: 17 July 2013[edit]

Cornelison Pottery[edit]

I was waiting for you to create an article over it(or list it at RFD) before blanking it, but seems you made a nice article at a quick pace, cheers. --AshFR (talk) 00:56, 19 July 2013 (UTC)

See my response at WT:NRHP; there were a couple of minor formatting notes that I mentioned there. Please don't include substantial quotes from the nomination forms; they're copyrighted, so we can't use text itself from them except for minimal significant quotes, and it's just about always easy to rewrite the same thing in our own words. I've performed all the changes that I suggested; just check back to see what I was talking about. Nyttend (talk) 02:01, 19 July 2013 (UTC)
Many thanks, learning alot hereCoal town guy (talk) 02:03, 19 July 2013 (UTC)
Page number. We should always include the page number when citing a multi-page document. Sometimes that's easy — for example, if one page from the nomination has all the information you want. In such a case, include the page number in the citation:

<ref>Wilson, Frederick T. ''[ National Register of Historic Places Inventory/Nomination: Cornelison Pottery]''. [[National Park Service]], 1976-12, 2.</ref>

This is a good way to cite page 2 from the nomination. If you want to cite different pages in different citations, you have two choices: either provide a completely new citation for each different page (thus making the reflist look rather redundant, since you're giving the complete citation multiple times), or use the ref name= feature and don't include the page number inside the ref tags at all, instead using {{rp}}. This way, the citation only appears once, but by including the page number with the {{rp}} template, you're still making the page number accessible. You're free to give separate full citations to the same document if you feel like it, but I don't because I don't feel like it. Look at the reference lists for Ellerbusch Site and Sair Tjerita Siti Akbari, for example. The latter article contains tons of separate entries with citations to different pages from the different sources, while the former includes just a few entries despite tons of citations to the same source. If I'd followed the STSA article's style with Thomas Green's dissertation in the Ellerbusch article, I would have had fifty entries with citations to the same work, rather than just one. Nyttend (talk) 02:15, 19 July 2013 (UTC)
Also, if you want to write about sites in that part of Kentucky, you could get places with photos by writing about sites in Jessamine and Mercer Counties — I attended church conferences at Wilmore in 2009 and 2010, and several afternoons I spent getting pictures. Nyttend (talk) 02:37, 19 July 2013 (UTC)
GROOVYCoal town guy (talk) 03:00, 19 July 2013 (UTC)


In response to your struck-through question, Thurmond, West Virginia (which I largely wrote) is pretty much the same as the historic district. Where the town and the HD are substantially the same, the practice has been to include the HD as a section in the town's article, and Thurmond is a good example of this. It's not very ling, and I don 't think it serves the reader to make them go to a stub on the town and then to an article on the HD to read about what is essentially the same place. Acroterion (talk) 12:40, 20 July 2013 (UTC)

Have to agree, hence the strike through. Its a cool place, if you can, try to get there. I will of course be putting up more pics of HDs in the area.Coal town guy (talk) 21:50, 20 July 2013 (UTC)

VE newsletter[edit]

Hey Coal town guy. The newest updates:

  • Links now don't extend over space/punctuation/workbreaks when you type (bugzilla:51463)
  • Users with the "minoredit" preference set get working functionality (bugzilla:51515)
  • You can tab to buttons in dialogs, including the save dialog (bugzilla:50047)
  • We now show the <newarticletext> (or <newarticletextanon>) message as an edit notice (bugzilla:51459)
  • You can scroll dialog panels like in transclusions' templates' parameter listings (bugzilla:51739)
  • Templates that only create meta-data and no display content at all (like Template:Use dmy dates) now can't be deleted accidentally or deliberately, but still don't show up (bugzilla:51322)
  • FlaggedRevisions integration (bugzilla:49699)
  • Edit summary will get the section title pre-added if you launched from a section edit link (bugzilla:50872)

Along with some miscellaneous language support fixes. That's all for today; as always, let us know if you spot more bugs. Thanks, Okeyes (WMF) (talk) 21:52, 24 July 2013 (UTC)

The Signpost: 24 July 2013[edit]

Gilberton controversy[edit]

Sorry, I don't think that the section about videos made by Gilberton, Pennsylvania's police chief should be blanked. The videos made national news and the section is sourced by numerous third party sources. If you have suggestions, please make them on the talk page rather than blanking the section. Respectfully, Athene cunicularia (talk) 18:31, 26 July 2013 (UTC)

I replied on the article talk page, I am uninvolved in that processCoal town guy (talk) 18:34, 26 July 2013 (UTC)

The Signpost: 31 July 2013[edit]

Welcome to The Wikipedia Adventure![edit]

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Hi! We're so happy you wanted to play to learn, as a friendly and fun way to get into our community and mission. I think these links might be helpful to you as you get started.
-- 19:54, 2 August 2013 (UTC)
Get Help
About The Wikipedia Adventure | Hang out in the Interstellar Lounge

Welcome to The Wikipedia Adventure![edit]

TWA guide left bottom.png
Hi! We're so happy you wanted to play to learn, as a friendly and fun way to get into our community and mission. I think these links might be helpful to you as you get started.
-- 19:54, 2 August 2013 (UTC)
Get Help
About The Wikipedia Adventure | Hang out in the Interstellar Lounge

Names of unincorporated communities[edit]

Hi-I just saw your article about Possum Kingdom, Kentucky. It would interesting to know what the history of the community and why it got the name. Pole Cat Crossing, Wisconsin is another one. Polecat is an animal but it is also a slang term for skunk. Another one: Ubet, Wisconsin. Many thanks for the articles-RFD (talk) 18:56, 2 August 2013 (UTC)

There's also a Possum Kingdom Lake in Texas, though its origin story appears to have nothing to do with Kentucky. For my own amusement, I'm going to assume the community was founded by a bunch of Toadies fans. TheCatalyst31 ReactionCreation 22:54, 2 August 2013 (UTC)
That is probably more pleasant, BUT, I think there is a piublished source that describes this as a vast food source and many formerly hungry people. Recall also that when you have been in that wilderness, and trying to create a place of habitation, the level of hunger drives a person to dine on literally ANYTHING. I recall reading a letter from that time period where the explorer was considering eating the ass off of dead mules without cooking. Hardwork, and hunger drive peopleCoal town guy (talk) 14:30, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

VisualEditor newsletter for 06 August 2013[edit]

It's been almost two weeks since the last newsletter, and a lot of improvements have been made during that time. The main things that people have noticed are significant improvements to speed for typing into long pages (bug 52012, scrolling (bug 52014 and deleting (bug 52013 on large pages. There have also been improvements to references, with the latest being support for list-defined references, which are <ref>s defined inside a <references> block (bug 51741 Users of Opera 12 and higher have had their web browser removed from the browser black-list, mostly as a result of work by a volunteer developer (bug 36000 Opera has not been fully white-listed yet, so these users will get an additional warning and request to report problems.

Significant changes were made to the user interface to de-emphasize VisualEditor. This has cut the use of VisualEditor by approximately one-third. You can read about these at Wikipedia:VisualEditor/Updates/August 1, 2013, but they include:

  • Re-ordering links to the editors to put "Edit source" first and VisualEditor second
  • Renaming the link for VisualEditor to "Editbeta"
  • Disabling the animation for section editing.
  • Changing all labels for the classic wikitext editor to say "Edit source", regardless of namespace.

There have also been many smaller fixes, including these:

Most of the Wikimedia Foundation staff is traveling this week and next, so no updates are expected until at least August 15th. If you're going to be in Hong Kong for Wikimania 2013, say hello to James Forrester, Philippe Beaudette, and the other members of the VisualEditor team.

As always, if you have questions or suggestions, or if you encounter problems, please let everyone know by posting problem reports at Wikipedia:VisualEditor/Feedback and ideas at Wikipedia talk:VisualEditor. Thank you! Whatamidoing (WMF) 23:24, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Allegheny County template[edit]

The problem was that it had too many fields. The basic navbox for US counties is able to display only seven fields, and the addition of a former city and of Pittsburgh neighborhoods broke the template. Fixing it is easy, since city neighborhoods (including the former city of Allegheny) don't belong on county navboxes. Nyttend (talk) 18:33, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

The Signpost: 07 August 2013[edit]

The Center Line: Summer 2013[edit]

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Volume 6, Issue 3 • Summer 2013 • About the Newsletter
State and national updates
ArchivesNewsroomFull IssueShortcut: WP:USRD/NEWS
EdwardsBot (talk) 22:21, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for August 11[edit]

Hi. Thank you for your recent edits. Wikipedia appreciates your help. We noticed though that when you edited Spotted Horse, Wyoming, you added a link pointing to the disambiguation page Native American (check to confirm | fix with Dab solver). Such links are almost always unintended, since a disambiguation page is merely a list of "Did you mean..." article titles. Read the FAQ • Join us at the DPL WikiProject.

It's OK to remove this message. Also, to stop receiving these messages, follow these opt-out instructions. Thanks, DPL bot (talk) 12:33, 11 August 2013 (UTC)


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Hello, Coal town guy. You have new messages at Ww2censor's talk page.
Message added 13:59, 13 August 2013 (UTC). You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.

ww2censor (talk) 13:59, 13 August 2013 (UTC)

Again ww2censor (talk) 14:17, 13 August 2013 (UTC)

The Signpost: 14 August 2013[edit]


Infoboxes really shouldn't contain anything except (1) things already in the article, or (2) minor/trivial things that still probably ought to appear, like ZIP codes or telephone area codes. Location is a critical component of any article's text, and the coordinates are at least as important as a written description of the location: both written descriptions and coordinates enable readers to understand where the place is located, but the coordinates' obvious link makes it easier to get access to the location on a map. Yes, readers can go to the infobox or the top right corner of the article to get coordinates, but presumably not everyone notices that those coordinates are there. Even for people who do realise that they're in the corner and the infobox, providing the coordinates in the text helps because they won't need to jump back and forth between text and infobox. Elevation is less of a critical thing, of course, but it's still enough of a locative thing that it does well in the text; it's not so trivial that I think it belongs only in the infobox. We normally don't provide elevations for larger communities, but that's purely a matter of applicability; saying a city of twenty thousand people is at a certain elevation is unrealistic unless it sits in very flat terrain, but tiny communities like Milburn can reasonably be said to sit at a certain elevation. Nyttend (talk) 13:39, 20 August 2013 (UTC)

Understood.Coal town guy (talk) 14:00, 20 August 2013 (UTC)
Your response sounds like what I say what my boss tells me what to do. Don't treat me like a boss :-) What do you think of my comments? Note that the east-west mixup with Bardwell was my fault; I'd just added the text some minutes before. Nyttend (talk) 17:34, 20 August 2013 (UTC)
I agree yuou are not the boss, BUT you have alot more experince and I will tend to follow that lead. I have learned quite a bit from you and others here so for me, it was more as respect or defference (sp?). However, no worries. there are a few articles where I am most certainly having to be bold. See see this I think the edits you performed with Milburn specifically make sense as there is alot of very specific locational chat etc etc. Many of the places I do document, I try to properly indicate where they are by using the info box. That being said, I am a tad leary given the NRHP rating scenario and restating data from an info box in the body of an article. I am starting NOTE, starting to get the method to the madness of wikipedia, there are however some articles where ANY ref seems to propel people to believe a FA is just one more ref away and that aint so.Coal town guy (talk) 17:51, 20 August 2013 (UTC)
Thanks, but no deference is needed :-) The thing with the WP:NRHP ratings is basically that Doncram's been trying to game the system for quite a while; simply trying to expand an article with useful information is helpful. Some of the issues whence the controversy has arisen are basically attempts to bloat articles with large amounts of text on trivial things (e.g. devoting lots more text to the fact of a site being NR-listed than to anything about the site itself), and other problems have arisen from extensive quotation that goes far beyond the limits of fair use. Nyttend (talk) 21:53, 20 August 2013 (UTC)

VisualEditor newsletter for 21 August 2013[edit]

Both VisualEditor and MediaWiki were upgraded recently. For VisualEditor, this is the long-awaited post-Wikimania update with many bug fixes and enhancements. Work also continues on speed at opening and during use, as well as on the bugs reported here and at other Wikipedias. The full report is at Mediawiki.

References are displaying properly, even when nested (bug 50749 or in image captions (bug 52427) Reference lists are now always fully populated with references (bug 50094). Firefox users can insert an existing reference in the first paragraph (bug 52159 Opera users no longer see corruption of categories when a reference was added (bug 50385).

Stray spaces are being stripped from the start of paragraphs to end one of the common <nowiki> problems (bug 51462 We also fixed a round-tripping bug that caused desirable whitespace in templates (used to make templates more legible, e.g., by putting each parameter in an infobox on a separate line) to get corrupted (bug 51150).

Wikilink handling was improved. Users are not allowed to create internal links to invalid titles (titles that are actually impossible due to limits on acceptable character combinations in titles, not redlinks) (bug 33094 You can extend wikilinks, but it won't do so over a wordbreak (like a space) (bugs 49931 and 51463).

A handful of fixes to the user interface were made. The toolbar doesn't float over personal tools after opening a dialog or the inspector (bug 52441 Toolbars were also re-written to be collapsible/expandable, with room for more icons. Buttons in dialogs can now be activated using the Tab and Shift+Tab key commands (bug 50047). This saves time for editors, because you don't need to take your hands off the keyboard to click a button. We fixed a handful of bugs that affected only certain articles or certain browsers, including toolbar buttons in Firefox (bug 51986) and dialog panels that didn't always scroll correctly (bug 51739). Bugs with undo/redo getting confused have been fixed (bug 52113

Images, in addition to getting references displaying correctly, also saw improvements with a set-empty |link= parameter no longer corrupted (51963). We corrected thumbnail images' display so that they look don't wrong in some contexts (bug 51995). Inserted images no longer explicitly set their alignment, but instead inherit the default position in compliance with the Manual of Style (bug 51851).

More edit notices, warnings, and metadata like information about Pending Changes on an article now appear as appropriate (bug 49699). When new articles are created, users are now shown the <newarticletext> message (bug 51459). VisualEditor now handles templates that set "meta" items (like a category) and nothing else better (bug 51322). If the database is locked when a user tries to save with VisualEditor, they now get a message telling them as such and an opportunity to try again, rather than a silent failure (bug 51636).

When you save the page, having the default preference set to "mark all my edits as minor by default" no longer overrides the setting in the save dialog (bug 51515). If you open VisualEditor from a section edit link, the section's title will be pre-filled in in the edit summary box when you go to save it (bug 50872). The size of the save dialog box in the Monobook skin has been fixed (bug 50058). Also, wikipage content handlers like sortable tables are re-run automatically after saving (bug 51565

A very early version of the mathematics equation editor is now available for testing on mw:Mediawiki. If you would like to help improve the user interface for math editor, please test out the extension at mw:Mediawiki:Sandbox and leave your comments directly at the discussion page for the Math Node User Interface at Mediawiki. You should be able to use your regular username and password should to login to Mediawiki.

For other questions or suggestions, or if you encounter problems, please let everyone know by posting problem reports at Wikipedia:VisualEditor/Feedback and other ideas at Wikipedia talk:VisualEditor. Thank you! Whatamidoing (WMF) 17:41, 21 August 2013 (UTC)

The Signpost: 21 August 2013[edit]

Dab headers[edit]

It's simple Wikipedia policy that we need to dab places with the same name clearly; it's most common to do that as tersely as possible; and, no, you can't just only worry about present-day names, because you have historic documents to consider (all the more so since usually the renamed city is much bigger and more important than whatever hamlet still carries the name). So, no, don't blank good and valid content; at most, just {{fact}} tag it if you need to know where the data came from.

But... if you really want to take all the hatnotes I made and instead create tens or scores of X, Kentucky (disambiguation) pages between (usually) only two places instead of using direct hatnotes, I suppose that's fine... but you're still going to end up with an (uglier) hatnote and a needless dab page in the end anyway, so I wouldn't advocate it. (In some marginal cases like Leesburg with that red link, I could see moving the dab down to a See also section, but that's not standard.)  — LlywelynII 20:43, 26 August 2013 (UTC)

I very much appreciate the reply and I follow the logic, I however would profer that it is an incredibly slippery slope. Consider a town named Red Dragon, which is now named Blue Pennant. It was also known as Mordu. So, does this mean that every bad martial art film, every novel about serial killers, (Recall Red Dragon ) or every movie gets this tag. Good luck on that fella, thats about a hundred years of dabbingCoal town guy (talk) 23:33, 26 August 2013 (UTC)


I saw your note about wanting to get this article back to GA status. After seeing the call to arms to get more widely read articles up to GA status, I said I would tackle a more specific instrument article after taking Hammond organ to GA, which has now been done. Saxophone was my first choice to work on next, but I'm happy to work with cello provided somebody can help with sources.

From a quick skim through the article, it looks like your biggest problem is with the referencing and sourcing. I note it was delisted for this reason way back in 2006. The problem I've found is that it's very hard to retrofit sources around text somebody else has written, as unless you get really lucky with a Google Books search, you won't be able to find what the original author based their writing on. Indeed, the relevant sources may be offline and they may have just written up what they happened to know. I would suggest Grove's Dictionary of Music is a good place to start - Antandrus has an offline copy and might be amenable to providing specific cites of information.

Elsewhere, the coverage looks broad in scope (thus meeting GA criteria 3), but I'd have to look in more depth to confirm this. The text could do with a thorough copyedit - the first sentence of "Etymology" takes up three lines on a 1280x1024 monitor and combines multiple clauses. Tony1's self-help writing exercises are good to take a look at - although these are geared towards FAC, there's no reason they can't be applied at GAN. If I've got time, I can tackle some of this. Ritchie333 (talk) (cont) 09:55, 27 August 2013 (UTC)

I want to say thanks for your patience. I have located some books and will be updating the cello article. My main contention is that many of the dates and assertions in the article were incorrect in reegards to Strads, the dates etc etc and the overall purpose behind the Strad designs and proportions to the said instrument. Also, Hoiw about some of the external links being yanked? They are for folks who sell higher end celli, thats swell, but we do not advertise here and honestly, would you trust all of the data a salesperson provides you on anything? ESPECIALLY a piece of wood that can go for WAAAY over 50 grand? Secondly, as I have played for some years, I find it VERY difficult to believe that we actually have artiucles here about rosin, being "better" when it s dark or light. My own daughter came home and told me her teacher wanted her to buy violin rosin...yes, I said violin rosin. WTF is violin rosin? Do you know? I dont. I have made my own rosin and I can assure you, there is no violin, or bass or cello or viola rosin. Lets chat about rosin color shall we? I mean this was a GA article right? The color of the rosin is a marketing tool. Its exactly the same thing merchants used to do when they bought the same cigars wholesale. They change the wrappers and hope its all good. Lasltly, until I looked, there were no conversions for measurements via the tool provided here which was far more accurate than the math someone else had done in the measurement table. As this is a cello article, I thought I would live on the wild side and actually insert a pic of a chart showing the parts of the cello, radical huh? Coal town guy (talk) 13:50, 27 August 2013 (UTC)

Other avenues[edit]

In response to this comment, the other avenues are best left undiscussed because Arbcom is not a place any of us wants to be -- and anyway questions about minimum standards for stubs were remanded to "the community". --Orlady (talk) 19:29, 28 August 2013 (UTC)

I would usually rejoin with, "are you shitting me", but I can see that you are not. OKEY DOKEY, the bot request would still be within the reason and discussion, per the suggestion of being remanded to the community, right?Coal town guy (talk) 20:49, 28 August 2013 (UTC)

Re: AWWW SNAP[edit]

Hello, sorry for being late. I was going through a bad situation. I'm afraid I didn't undertand you question. (It might be my poor English knowdlege) Miss Bono [zootalk] 13:20, 29 August 2013 (UTC)

No worries, I am glad you are staying. We were at one point at the Teahouse discussing small populated places. Hence why I mention Spotted Horse, Wyoming. Curiosity makes you a better editor, stick around.Coal town guy (talk) 13:28, 29 August 2013 (UTC)
Oh, yeah! It very curious, how does a town only have 2 people living in it? lol :) Miss Bono [zootalk] 16:17, 29 August 2013 (UTC)

Chaplin, West Virginia[edit]

Hi there. I wanted to write a Wiki article about Chaplin, West Virginia, but found myself completely lost. It's not listed on GNIS, yet there are a lot of NARA photos in the Commons which feature the town by that name. I was able to find an old map which located it here 39°39′00″N 80°00′09″W / 39.649972°N 80.002443°W / 39.649972; -80.002443. It was sometimes called a town, and other times a coal company. Sometimes it's identified as being part of Scotts Run. Both of these red links are ok and have other articles linking to them. I wouldn't mind filling in these two articles, and maybe adding some of the great pictures. Any suggestions? Thanks! Richard Apple (talk) 14:25, 30 August 2013 (UTC)

Chaplin was for sure a coal town, I believe I recall seeing it on an older county map. There is a lady at GNIS who has helped me before, IF I can get her a map showing the town named Chaplin, it should not be an issue. Morbid curiosity, when you did the GNIS serach, did you happen to use all possible returns or just a populated place??Coal town guy (talk) 14:41, 30 August 2013 (UTC)
Found itit was west of Osage. However, I need a map of Monongalia County preceding 1938, cant find one yetCoal town guy (talk) 15:05, 30 August 2013 (UTC)
Found a map [LOOK next to southwest of Maidsville], It appears to me, that Pursglove, replaces Chaplin, BUT other sources said it was NEAR, Scotts Run, a coal town also, to the south! I can get a copy of this to the GNIS folks and see what they thinkCoal town guy (talk) 15:18, 30 August 2013 (UTC)

The Signpost: 28 August 2013[edit]

VisualEditor newsletter for September 5[edit]

This Thursday's VisualEditor update was mostly about stability and performance improvements, and some preparatory work for major planned improvements, along with bug fixes for non-English language support and right-to-left text. Everything that the English Wikipedia received today has been running on Mediawiki for a week already.

Officially, the problem with the link inspector not linking to a specific section on a page (bug 53219) was fixed in this release, although that critical patch actually appeared here earlier.

A number of bugs related to copy-and-paste functionality were fixed (48604, bug 50043, bug 53362, bug 51538, among others). Full rich copy-and-paste from external sources into VisualEditor is expected "soon".

In other fixes, you can no longer add empty ref tags (<ref/>) (bug 53345). Selecting both an image and some text, and then trying to add a link, previously deleted the selected image and the text. This was fixed in bug 50127. There was another problem related to using arrow keys to move the cursor next to an inline image that was fixed (bug 53507).

Looking ahead: The next planned upgrade is scheduled for next Thursday, and you should expect to find a redesigned toolbar with drop-down menus that include room for references, templates, underline, strikethrough, superscript, subscript, and code formatting. There will also be keyboard shortcuts for setting the format (paragraph vs section headings).

If you are active at other Wikipedias, the next group of Wikipedias to have VisualEditor offered to all users is being determined at this time. Generally speaking, languages that depend on the input method editor are not going to receive VisualEditor this month. The current target date is Tuesday, September 24 for logged-in users only. You can help with translating the documentation. In several cases, most of the translation is already done, and it only needs to be copied over to the relevant Wikipedia. If you are interested in finding out whether a particular Wikipedia is currently on the list, you can leave a message for me at my talk page.

For other questions or suggestions, or if you encounter problems, please let everyone know by posting problem reports at Wikipedia:VisualEditor/Feedback and other ideas at Wikipedia talk:VisualEditor. Thank you! Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 21:45, 5 September 2013 (UTC)

The Signpost: 04 September 2013[edit]

Disambiguation link notification for September 11[edit]

Hi. Thank you for your recent edits. Wikipedia appreciates your help. We noticed though that when you edited Three Legs Town, Ohio, you added a link pointing to the disambiguation page Native American (check to confirm | fix with Dab solver). Such links are almost always unintended, since a disambiguation page is merely a list of "Did you mean..." article titles. Read the FAQ • Join us at the DPL WikiProject.

It's OK to remove this message. Also, to stop receiving these messages, follow these opt-out instructions. Thanks, DPL bot (talk) 11:03, 11 September 2013 (UTC)

Found Message I Believe Was Directed To Me[edit]

Hey there, looking at the WV pop updates thus far, good job on the info boxes and data., However, the article space reflects a differentr count than the infop box. As WV has 55 counties, I am willing to do them. I just did Hardy County and indicated in the article space that the pop figure is based on a 2012 estimate from the 2010 census. Let me know if this is in keeping with the update. ThanksCoal town guy (talk) 15:06, 29 August 2013 (UTC)

Above is a message that was a reply to one of mine on another users page, I stumbled across it today and I was wondering if you could clarify what you mean by article space? Also it's best to contact me on my actual talk page rather than replying to a comment I make elsewhere I'm not all that active at the moment so I'm not really monitoring my watched list. Jamo2008 (talk) 19:27, 11 September 2013 (UTC)

I don't plan on updating the intro's it's a nightmare from a automation point of view since there are so many variations to how those intros are written, and I never standardized them since most where updated before I got to them, I just used some regex expressions to catch unupdated ones and leave updated ones alone. Also having the official 2010 value there is no big, after all it is the official population value of the location until 2020. Also I applaud your work on counties, I don't do them so most states are still on 2000 data there. Jamo2008 (talk) 15:10, 12 September 2013 (UTC)

McDowell County Courthouse[edit]

Looks good; the problem with the previous content (in my eyes) was that it was clearly copied from somewhere on Wikipedia, because the [2] wouldn't appear otherwise. Nyttend (talk) 22:39, 12 September 2013 (UTC)

The Signpost: 11 September 2013[edit]

AE discussion[edit]

Your name is mentioned at Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Enforcement#Doncram. You may not want to comment, but I felt obliged to inform you. --Orlady (talk) 03:07, 17 September 2013 (UTC)

VisualEditor newsletter for September 19, 2013[edit]

VisualEditor has been updated twice in the last two weeks. As usual, what is now running on the English Wikipedia had a test run at Mediawiki during the previous week.

As announced, the toolbar was redesigned to be simpler, shorter, and to have the ability to have drop-down groups with descriptions. What you see now is the initial configuration and is expected to change in response to feedback from the English Wikipedia and other Wikipedias. The controls to add <u> (underline), <sub> (subscript), and <sup> (superscript), <s> (strikethrough) and <code> (computer code/monospace font) annotations to text are available to all users in the drop-down menu. At the moment, all but the most basic tools have been moved into a single drop-down menu, including the tools for inserting media, references, reference lists, and templates. The current location of all of the items in the toolbar is temporary, and your opinions about the best order are needed! Please offer suggestions at Wikipedia:VisualEditor/Feedback/Toolbar.

In an eagerly anticipated upgrade to the reference dialog, newly added references or reference groups no longer need the page to be saved before they can be re-used (bugs 51689 and 52000). The 'Use existing reference' button is now disabled on pages which don't yet have any references (bug 51848). The template parameter filter in the transclusion dialog now searches both parameter name and label (bug 51670).

In response to several requests, there are some new keyboard shortcuts. You can now set the block/paragraph formatting from the keyboard: Ctrl+0 sets a block as a regular paragraph; Ctrl+1 up to Ctrl+6 sets it as a Heading 1 ("Page title") to Heading 6 ("Sub-heading 4"); Ctrl+7 sets it as pre-formatted (bug 33512). Ctrl+2, which creates level 2 section headings, may be the most useful.

Some improvements were made to capitalization for links, so typing in "iPhone" will offer a link to "iPhone" as well as "IPhone" (bug 50452).

Copying and pasting within the same document should work better as of today's update, as should copying from VisualEditor into a third-party application (bug 53364, bug 52271, bug 52460). Work on copying and pasting between VisualEditor instances (for example, between two articles) and retaining formatting when copying from an external source into VisualEditor is progressing.

Major improvements to editing with input method editors (IMEs; mostly used for Indic and East Asian languages) are being deployed today. This is a complex change, so it may produce unexpected errors. On a related point, the names of languages listed in the "languages" (langlinks) panel in the Page settings dialog now display as RTL when appropriate (bug 53503).

Looking ahead: The help/'beta' menu will soon expose the build number next to the "Leave feedback" link, so users can give more specific reports about issues they encounter (bug 53050). This change will make it easier for developers to identify any cacheing issues, once it starts reporting the build number (currently, it says "Version false"). Also, inserting a link, reference or media file will put the cursor after the new content again (bug 53560). Next week’s update will likely improve how dropdowns and other selection menus behave when they do not fit on the screen, with things scrolling so the selected item is always in view.

If you are active at other Wikipedias, the next group of Wikipedias to have VisualEditor offered to all users is being finalized. About two dozen Wikipedias are on the list for Tuesday, September 24 for logged-in users only, and on Monday, September 30 for unregistered editors. You can help with translating the documentation. In several cases, most of the translation is already done, and it only needs to be copied over to the relevant Wikipedia. If you are interested in finding out whether a particular Wikipedia is currently on the list, you can leave a message for me at my talk page.

For other questions or suggestions, or if you encounter problems, please let everyone know by posting problem reports at Wikipedia:VisualEditor/Feedback and other ideas at Wikipedia talk:VisualEditor. Thank you! Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 21:47, 19 September 2013 (UTC)

The Signpost: 18 September 2013[edit]

Locust Grove, King and Queen County, Virginia[edit]

You may be interested in Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Locust Grove, King and Queen County, Virginia: I've linked to a section on this talk page as part of my rationale. Nyttend (talk) 05:02, 27 September 2013 (UTC)

The Signpost: 25 September 2013[edit]

Close paraphrase issue[edit]

You've indicated here that much of the history section of McDowell County, West Virginia is a close paraphrase, but I am unclear about the source. I checked out the Lewis book, and see that it is a source, but that doesn't appear to be the one copied or paraphrased.

Can you identify the source? Is it online? if not, would you be willing to remove the material? Ideally rewrite, but removal would be a good first step.--SPhilbrick(Talk) 14:41, 30 September 2013 (UTC)

(BTW, if you care about football, nice rebound against OK State).--SPhilbrick(Talk) 14:42, 30 September 2013 (UTC)

The Signpost: 02 October 2013[edit]

The Signpost: 09 October 2013[edit]

VisualEditor newsletter on 16 October 2013[edit]

VisualEditor is still being updated every Thursday. As usual, what is now running on the English Wikipedia had a test run at Mediawiki during the previous week. If you haven't done so already, you can turn on VisualEditor by going to your preferences and choosing the item, "Enable VisualEditor. It will be available in the following namespaces: $1".

The reference dialog for all Wikipedias, especially the way it handles citation templates, is being redesigned. Please offer suggestions and opinions at mw:VisualEditor/Design/Reference Dialog. (Use your Wikipedia username/password to login there.) You can also drag and drop references (select the reference, then hover over the selected item until your cursor turns into the drag-and-drop tool). This also works for some templates, images, and other page elements (but not yet for text or floated items). References are now editable when they appear inside a media item's caption (bug 50459).

There were a number of miscellaneous fixes made: Firstly, there was a bug that meant that it was impossible to move the cursor using the keyboard away from a selected node (like a reference or template) once it had been selected (bug 54443). Several improvements have been made to scrollable windows, panels, and menus when they don't fit on the screen or when the selected item moves off-screen. Editing in the "slug" at the start of a page no longer shows up a chess pawn character ("♙") in some circumstances (bug 54791). Another bug meant that links with a final punctuation character in them broke extending them in some circumstances (bug 54332). The "page settings" dialog once again allows you to remove categories (bug 54727). There have been some problems with deployment scripts, including one that resulted in VisualEditor being broken for an hour or two at all Wikipedias (bug 54935). Finally, snowmen characters ("☃") no longer appear near newly added references, templates and other nodes (bug 54712).

Looking ahead: Development work right now is on rich copy-and-paste abilities, quicker addition of citation templates in references, setting media items' options (such as being able to put images on the left), switching into wikitext mode, and simplifying the toolbar. A significant amount of work is being done on other languages during this month. If you speak a language other than English, you can help with translating the documentation.

For other questions or suggestions, or if you encounter problems, please let everyone know by posting problem reports at Wikipedia:VisualEditor/Feedback and other ideas at Wikipedia talk:VisualEditor. Thank you! Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 18:48, 16 October 2013 (UTC)

The Signpost: 16 October 2013[edit]

File permission problem with File:Beckley Feed.jpg[edit]

Thanks for uploading File:Beckley Feed.jpg. I noticed that while you provided a valid copyright licensing tag, there is no proof that the creator of the file has agreed to release it under the given license.

If you are the copyright holder for this media entirely yourself but have previously published it elsewhere (especially online), please either

  • make a note permitting reuse under the CC-BY-SA or another acceptable free license (see this list) at the site of the original publication; or
  • Send an email from an address associated with the original publication to, stating your ownership of the material and your intention to publish it under a free license. You can find a sample permission letter here. If you take this step, add {{OTRS pending}} to the file description page to prevent premature deletion.

If you did not create it entirely yourself, please ask the person who created the file to take one of the two steps listed above, or if the owner of the file has already given their permission to you via email, please forward that email to

If you believe the media meets the criteria at Wikipedia:Non-free content, use a tag such as {{non-free fair use}} or one of the other tags listed at Wikipedia:File copyright tags#Fair use, and add a rationale justifying the file's use on the article or articles where it is included. See Wikipedia:File copyright tags for the full list of copyright tags that you can use.

If you have uploaded other files, consider checking that you have provided evidence that their copyright owners have agreed to license their works under the tags you supplied, too. You can find a list of files you have created in your upload log. Files lacking evidence of permission may be deleted one week after they have been tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. You may wish to read the Wikipedia's image use policy. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you. Stefan2 (talk) 17:33, 21 October 2013 (UTC)

No problem- I have text of the email and I will send that to permissions-en@wikimedia.orgCoal town guy (talk) 18:00, 21 October 2013 (UTC)
I have added the tag to the file page AFTER sending Wikipedia folks the mail contaiing permission to use this fileCoal town guy (talk) 18:09, 21 October 2013 (UTC)

Fractional currency FLC[edit]

Hi Coal town guy- A Fractional Currency list is currently under review at FLC. If you are interested in reviewing/commenting your input would be appreciated. Thanks-Godot13 (talk) 17:04, 24 October 2013 (UTC)

The Signpost: 23 October 2013[edit]

NO, its George Mason[edit]

There appears some confusion about the citations for Mason county's namesake. Virgil A. Lewis' works are the source for Mason county's namesake. Lewis' History of West Virginia in Two Parts, p. 616 1887, is the source for most if not all cites for George Mason as Mason county's namesake. Lewis' subsequent publication History and Government of West Virginia, p.266 1896, supersedes his previous work with S. T. Mason as Mason county's namesake and was cited in numerous publications.

Here is my summary of the namesake situation: Most historical accounts up to about 1920 indicate Mason County was named for Stevens Thomson Mason. Simple political logic would reinforce that notion, since the Va. Gen. Assy. elected Sen. Stevens Thomson Mason’s successor (12-7-1803) in the same legislative session about three weeks before passing legislation creating Mason County (1-2-1804) and the Va. Gen. Assy. had named Mason County, Kentucky (Va.) for Geo. Mason in 1788. Geo. Mason died in 1792.

The namesake confusion seems to begin about 1896 when Virgil A. Lewis’ school textbook, History and Government of West Virginia, was published; stating Mason County was named for Stevens Thomson Mason. This work contradicted his 1889 History of West Virginia in Two Parts, where Lewis wrote Mason County was named for George Mason. Other history texts after 1896 used Lewis’ wording from either his 1889 book or his 1896 book. Virgil A. Lewis was a Mason County resident and West Virginia’s first Historian/Archivist from 1905 to 1912. In 1906, former member of the U. S. House of Representative from Mercer County WV, David E. Johnston, published A History of The Middle New River Settlements and Contiguous Territory where Mason County’s namesake is listed as Stevens Thomson Mason in Appendix B.

The Mason County namesake controversy surfaces later in the West Virginia Legislative Hand Book and Manual and Official Register (Blue Book). The Blue Book description for Mason County, 1916-1920, said Mason County was named for Stevens Thomson Mason, using Virgil Lewis’ 1896 wording. In the 1921 Blue Book, the Mason County description was shortened, omitting the county namesake reference. This description continued until 1927, when the Mason County description was expanded to include Lewis’ 1889 wording stating George Mason was the county namesake. This change could be related to Clifford Myers being WV Historian (he was from Mason County) or the Mason County Clerk (John Aten) submitting new county information, based on Lewis’ 1889 book, to the WV Senate Clerk for inclusion in the 1927 Blue Book.

Clifford Myers, a Mason County resident, was West Virginia’s Historian/Archivist from 1919 to 1935. Two years after Clifford Myers became WV Historian the description in the West Virginia Legislative Hand Book and Manual and Official Register (Blue Book) for Mason County was reduced to two short sentences and listed no namesake for the county. In the 1927 when a new description for Mason County appeared in the WV Blue Book, George Mason was cited as the county’s namesake. The 1927 description continues to present.

A very noticeable clue to Virgil Lewis being the source of most of the namesake information is the consistent misspelling of Stevens Thomson Mason’s middle name as “Thompson”. (see excerpts of below) Why did Virgil Lewis change the namesake of Mason County from G. Mason (1887/1889) to Stevens Thomson Mason (1896)? Could it be that Lewis, as an educator and Superintendent of WV Schools, found definitive evidence of Mason County’s namesake and included it in his 1896 textbook for WV Schools? --Kbgh66 (talk) 03:09, 31 October 2013 (UTC)

No, you cited the works incorrectly, I have posted on your talk page and have a discussion on the county talk page...It is George Mason....Please note that the later Lewis work had the help of Jim Comstock. Also note that the WV Culture and History site, which is used in the Mason County article, has the precise use of George Mason as the namesake. Jim Comstock was wrong....Lewis published in 1889Coal town guy (talk) 03:21, 31 October 2013 (UTC)

The Signpost: 30 October 2013[edit]

Fractional currency set FPC[edit]

The images from the FLC Fractional currency have been nominated as a Featured Picture Set on English Wikipedia. As you were involved in reviewing the FLC, you may or may not wish to comment or review the FPC. Thank you.-Godot13 (talk) 06:31, 3 November 2013 (UTC)

The Signpost: 06 November 2013[edit]

The Center Line: Fall 2013[edit]

The Center Line header.svg
Volume 6, Issue 4 • Fall 2013 • About the Newsletter
State and national updates
ArchivesNewsroomFull IssueShortcut: WP:USRD/NEWS
EdwardsBot (talk) 03:13, 15 November 2013 (UTC)

The Signpost: 13 November 2013[edit]

VisualEditor newsletter for November 2013[edit]

Since the last newsletter, the VisualEditor team has worked on some feature changes, major infrastructure improvements to make the system more stable, dependable and extensible, some minor toolbar improvements, and fixing bugs.

A new form parsing library for language characters in Parsoid caused the corruption of pages containing diacritics for about an hour two weeks ago. Relatively few pages at the English Wikipedia were affected, but this created immediate problems at some other Wikipedias, sometimes affecting several dozen pages. The development teams for Parsoid and VisualEditor apologize for the serious disruption and thank the people who reported this emergency at Wikipedia:VisualEditor/Feedback and on the public IRC channel, #mediawiki-visualeditor.

There have been dozens of changes since the last newsletter. Here are some of the highlights:

  • Accidental deletion of infoboxes and other items: You now need to press the Delete or ← Backspace key twice to delete a template, reference or image. The first time, the item becomes selected, and the second time, it is removed. The need to press the delete key twice should make it more obvious what you are doing and help avoid accidental removals of infoboxes and similar (bug 55336).
  • Switch from VisualEditor to the wikitext editor: A new feature lets you make a direct, one-way editing interface change, which will preserve your changes without needing to save the page and re-open it in the wikitext editor (bug 50687). It is available in a new menu in the action buttons by the Cancel button (where the "Page Settings" button used to be). Note that this new feature is not currently working in Firefox.
  • Categories and Languages are also now directly available in that menu. The category suggestions drop-down was appearing in the wrong place rather than below its input box, which is now fixed. An incompatibility between VisualEditor and the deployed Parsoid service that prevented editing categories and language links was fixed.
  • File:, Help: and Category: namespaces: VisualEditor was enabled for these namespaces the on all wikis (bug 55968), the Portal: and Viquiprojecte: namespaces on the Catalan Wikipedia (bug 56000), and the Portal: and Book: namespaces on the English Wikipedia (bug 56001).
  • Media item resizing: We improved how files are viewed in a few ways. First, inline media items can now be resized in the same way that has been possible with block ones (like thumbnails) before. When resizing a media item, you can see a live preview of how it will look as you drag it (bug 54298). While you are dragging an image to resize it, we now show a label with the current dimensions (bug 54297). Once you have resized it, we fetch a new, higher resolution image for the media item if necessary (bug 55697). Manual setting of media item sizes in their dialog is nearly complete and should be available next week. If you hold down the Shift key whilst resizing an image, it will now snap to a 10 pixel grid instead of the normal free-hand sizing. The media item resize label now is centered while resizing regardless of which tool you use to resize it.
  • Undo and redo: A number of improvements were made to the transactions system which make undoing and redoing more reliable during real-time collaboration (bug 53224).
  • Save dialogue: The save page was re-written to use the same code as all other dialogs (bug 48566), and in the process fixed a number of issues. The save dialog is re-accessible if it loses focus (bug 50722), or if you review a null edit (bug 53313); its checkboxes for minor edit, watch the page, and flagged revisions options now layout much more cleanly (bug 52175), and the tab order of the buttons is now closer to what users will expect (bug 51918). There was a bug in the save dialog that caused it to crash if there was an error in loading the page from Parsoid, which is now fixed.
  • Links to other articles or pages sometimes sent people to invalid pages. VisualEditor now keeps track of the context in which you loaded the page, which lets us fix up links in document to point to the correct place regardless of what entry point you launched the editor from—so the content of pages loaded through /wiki/Foobar?veaction=edit and /w/index.php?title=Foobar&veaction=edit both now have text links that work if triggered (bug 48915).
  • Toolbar links: A bug that caused the toolbar's menus to get shorter or even blank when scrolled down the page in Firefox is now fixed (bug 55343).
  • Numbered external links: VisualEditor now supports Parsoid's changed representation of numbered external links (bug 53505).
  • Removed empty templates: We also fixed an issue that meant that completely empty templates became impossible to interact with inside VisualEditor, as they didn't show up (bug 55810).
  • Mathematics formulae: If you would like to try the experimental LaTeX mathematics tool in VisualEditor, you will need to opt-in to Beta Features. This is currently available on Meta-wiki, Wikimedia Commons, and It will be available on all other Wikimedia sites on 21 November.
  • Browser testing support: If you are interested in technical details, the browser tests were expanded to cover some basic cursor operations, which uncovered an issue in our testing framework that doesn't work with cursoring in Firefox; the Chrome tests continue to fail due to a bug with the welcome message for that part of the testing framework.
  • Load time: VisualEditor now uses content language when fetching Wikipedia:TemplateData information, so reducing bandwidth use, and users on multi-language or multi-script wikis now get TemplateData hinting for templates as they would expect (bug 50888).
  • Reuse of VisualEditor: Work on spinning out the user experience (UX) framework from VisualEditor into oojs-ui, which lets other teams at Wikimedia (like Flow) and gadget authors re-use VisualEditor UX components, is now complete and is being moved to a shared code repository.
  • Support for private wikis: If you maintain a private wiki at home or at work, VisualEditor now supports editing of private wikis, by forwarding the Cookie: HTTP header to Parsoid ($wgVisualEditorParsoidForwardCookies set to true) (bug 44483). (Most private wikis will also need to install Parsoid and node.js, as VisualEditor requires them.)

Looking ahead:

  • VisualEditor will be released to some of the smaller Wikipedias on 02 December 2013. If you are active at one or more smaller Wikipedias where VisualEditor is not yet generally available, please see the list at VisualEditor/Rollouts.
  • Public office hours on IRC to discuss VisualEditor with Product Manager James Forrester will be held on Monday, 2 December, at 1900 UTC and on Tuesday, 3 December, at 0100 UTC. Bring your questions. Logs will be posted on Meta after each office hour completes.
  • In terms of feature improvements, one of the major infrastructure projects affects how inserting characters works, both using your computer's built-in Unicode input systems and through a planned character inserter tool for VisualEditor. The forthcoming rich copying and pasting feature was extended and greater testing is currently being done. Work continues to support the improved reference dialog to quickly add citations based on local templates.

If you have questions or suggestions for future improvements, or if you encounter problems, please let everyone know by posting a note at Wikipedia:VisualEditor/Feedback. Thank you! Whatamidoing (WMF) 22:13, 20 November 2013 (UTC)

The Signpost: 20 November 2013[edit]

The Signpost: 04 December 2013[edit]

  • Featured content: F*&!

The Signpost: 11 December 2013[edit]

The Signpost: 18 December 2013[edit]

VisualEditor newsletter • 19 December 2013[edit]

Since the last newsletter, the VisualEditor team has worked on some toolbar improvements, fixing bugs, and improving support for Indic languages as well as other languages with complex characters. The current focus is on improving the reference dialog and expanding the new character inserter tool.

There have been dozens of changes since the last newsletter. Here are some of the highlights:

  • Rich copying and pasting is now available. If you copy text from another website, then character formatting and some other HTML attributes are preserved. This means, for example, that if you copy a pre-formatted suggested citation from a source like this, then VisualEditor will preserve the formatting of the title in the citation. Keep in mind that copying the formatting may include formatting that you don't want (like section headings). If you want to paste plain, unformatted text onto a page, then use Control+ Shift+V or Command+ Shift+V (Mac).
  • Auto-numbered external links like [1] can now be edited just like any other link. However, they cannot be created in VisualEditor easily.
  • Several changes to the toolbar and dialogs have been made, and more are on the way. The toolbar has been simplified with a new drop-down text styles menu and an "insert" menu. Your feedback on the toolbar is wanted here. The transclusion/template dialog has been simplified. If you have enabled mathematical formula editing, then the menu item is now called the formula editor instead of LaTeX.
  • There is a new character inserter, which you can find in the new "insert" menu, with a capital Omega ("Ω"). It's a very basic set of characters. Your feedback on the character inserter is wanted here.
  • Saving the page should seem faster by several seconds now.
  • It is now possible to access VisualEditor by manually editing the URL, even if you are not logged in or have not opted in to VisualEditor normally.  To do so, append ?veaction=edit to the end of the page name.  For example, change to to open a random page in VisualEditor.  This is intended to support bug testing across multiple browsers, without requiring editors to login repeatedly.

Looking ahead: The transclusion dialog will see further changes in the coming weeks, with a simple mode for single templates and an advanced mode for more complex transclusions. The new character formatting menu on the toolbar will get an arrow to show that it is a drop-down menu. The reference dialog will be improved, and the Reference item will become a button in the main toolbar, rather than an item in the Insert menu.

If you have questions or suggestions for future improvements, or if you encounter problems, please let everyone know by posting a note at Wikipedia:VisualEditor/Feedback. Thank you! Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 20:42, 19 December 2013 (UTC)

Possibly unfree File:Beckley Feed.jpg[edit]

A file that you uploaded or altered, File:Beckley Feed.jpg, has been listed at Wikipedia:Possibly unfree files because its copyright status is unclear or disputed. If the file's copyright status cannot be verified, it may be deleted. You may find more information on the file description page. You are welcome to add comments to its entry at the discussion if you object to the listing for any reason. Thank you. Stefan2 (talk) 22:18, 27 December 2013 (UTC)

The Signpost: 25 December 2013[edit]

The Signpost: 01 January 2014[edit]

Kentucky counties[edit]

Thanks, I'm just getting started. Now that I know how to search the Google free books (old books in the public domain) database it's gotten much easier. In case you did not know you can search here and every page of the book is viewable free. - Gilliam (talk) 15:57, 9 January 2014 (UTC)

There is also a great online KY History resource linked at the List of Counties in Kentucky Page here, and KY Place Names is an oldy but a goody as wellCoal town guy (talk) 16:01, 9 January 2014 (UTC)
Gilliam, WOW, what a resource! I had no idea, with your clue it didn’t take long to figure it out. Is this a commonly known Google trick, and if not, should it be spread around? Thank you, Sammy D III (talk) 18:44, 17 January 2014 (UTC)

The Signpost: 08 January 2014[edit]

Valley, West Virginia[edit]

Hey Coal town guy! I was working on an article at User:Caponer/Valley, West Virginia and I was wondering if you knew of any other online sources for West Virginia post offices. Valley's post office was in operation between 1928 and 1937. Any guidance you could provide would be of the greatest help! I'm going to begin authoring articles for all the populated places/post offices in Hampshire and Mineral to bring them up to snuff! Here's hoping your New Year is off to a good start! -- Caponer (talk) 00:45, 13 January 2014 (UTC)

The West Virginia Barnstar[edit]

Hey Coal town guy! I wanted to let you know that I added your incredible award to the list at Wikipedia:Awards by WikiProject. You did such a phenomenal job conceiving of and creating this award that I wanted to ensure it was included with the barnstars for the other U.S. states. -- Caponer (talk) 06:11, 16 January 2014 (UTC)

The Center Line: Winter 2013[edit]

The Center Line header.svg
Volume 7, Issue 1 • Winter 2014 • About the Newsletter
State and national updates
ArchivesNewsroomFull IssueShortcut: WP:USRD/NEWS
MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 01:15, 17 January 2014 (UTC)

VisualEditor newsletter for Janaury 2014[edit]

Since the last newsletter, the VisualEditor team has worked mostly minor features and fixing bugs. A few significant bugs include working around a bug in CSSJanus that was wrongly flipping images used in some templates in right-to-left (RTL) environments (bug 50910) a major bug that meant inserting any template or other transclusion failed (bug 59002), a major but quickly resolved problem due to an unannounced change in MediaWiki core, which caused VisualEditor to crash on trying to save (bug 59867). This last bugs did not appear on any Wikipedia. Additionally, significant work has been done in the background to make VisualEditor work as an independent editing system.

As of today, VisualEditor is now available as an opt-out feature to all users at 149 active Wikipedias.

  • The character inserter tool in the "Insert" menu has a very basic set of characters. The character inserter is especially important for languages that use Latin and Cyrillic alphabets with unusual characters or frequent diacritics. Your feedback on the character inserter is requested. In addition to feedback from any interested editor, the developers would particularly like to hear from anyone who speaks any of the 50+ languages listed under Phase 5 at mw:VisualEditor/Rollouts, including Breton, Mongolian, Icelandic, Welsh, Afrikaans, Macedonian, and Azerbaijani.
  • meta:Office hours on IRC have been heavily attended recently. The next one will be held this coming Wednesday, 22 January at 23:00 UTC.
  • You can now edit some of the page settings in the "options" dialog – __NOTOC__ and __FORCETOC__ as selection (forced on, forced off, or default setting; bugs 56866 and 56867) and __NOEDITSECTION__ as a checkbox (bug 57166).
  • The automated browser tests were adjusted to speed them up and bind more correctly to list items in lists, and updated to a newer version of their ruby dependencies. You can monitor the automated browser tests' results (triggered every twelve hours) live on the server.
  • Wikipedia:VisualEditor/User guide was updated recently to show some new and upcoming features.

Looking ahead: The character formatting menu on the toolbar will get a drop-down indicator next Thursday. The reference and media items will be the first two listed in the Insert menu. The help menu will get a page listing the keyboard shortcuts. Looking further out, image handling will be improved, including support for alignment (left, right, and center) and better control over image size (including default and upright sizes). The developers are also working on support for editing redirects and image galleries.

Subscriptions to this newsletter are managed at Wikipedia:VisualEditor/Newsletter. Please add or remove your name to change your subscription settings. If you have questions or suggestions for future improvements, or if you encounter problems, please let everyone know by posting a note at Wikipedia:VisualEditor/Feedback. Thank you! Whatamidoing (WMF) 20:07, 17 January 2014 (UTC)

The Signpost: 15 January 2014[edit]

The Signpost: 22 January 2014[edit]

Thank you![edit]

Allaroundamazingbarnstar.png All-Around Amazing Barnstar
Coal town guy, thank you for going above and beyond, as you always do, in taking the initiative to have Valley, West Virginia added to the Geographic Names Information System. Because of all your dedication and hard work, West Virginia's many communities are now represented, for all to know! -- Caponer (talk) 02:15, 25 January 2014 (UTC)

The Signpost: 29 January 2014[edit]

The Signpost: 29 January 2014[edit]

Nomination of Blue Bucket Cow Camp, Oregon for deletion[edit]

A discussion is taking place as to whether the article Blue Bucket Cow Camp, Oregon is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.

The article will be discussed at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Blue Bucket Cow Camp, Oregon until a consensus is reached, and anyone is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on high-quality evidence and our policies and guidelines.

Users may edit the article during the discussion, including to improve the article to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the article-for-deletion notice from the top of the article. Valfontis (talk) 21:41, 7 February 2014 (UTC)

Ghost towns[edit]

Hey there. You probably know more about ghost towns than anyone. I'm finding that many places listed as "ghost towns" in the southern U.S. don't really meet the strict definition. There needs to be a name for places that are post-boomtowns, but still have people living there (eg. "Chester, Mississippi"). I'm as guilty as anyone, having added "ghost town" to places where absolutely nothing is left behind (eg. "Peyton, Mississippi"). Just wondering what your view is on the use of "ghost town". Cheers. Magnolia677 (talk) 15:36, 12 February 2014 (UTC)

Its tough honestly and a dam good question. My understanding, has been , so far, that if a place is sparsely inhabited and has virtually no industry or jobs, its a ghost town. HOWEVER, as you very rightly point out, there are places that are literally nothing more than a few foundation stones with NO inhabitants excluding possibly the infrequent meth freak or hermit. I had asked about this before and I agree, there should be a different category for such places. HMMMMM, perhaps a new category should be in order. As of now though, I believe you are correct to place these locations in the category of ghost town. My old home is a ghost town, sadly the meth freaks are not infrequentCoal town guy (talk) 15:42, 12 February 2014 (UTC)

Interesting you mention the drug problems. You and I have both edited "Oceana, West Virginia". Very sad. Regarding the ghost towns, I'll keep adding them to the ghost town category. I've recently added a bunch of long-lost river towns to "Category:Mississippi populated places on the Mississippi River". Another user, "Chillin662", has been doing great work creating articles for many forgotten hamlets in Mississippi. Cheers! Magnolia677 (talk) 15:06, 13 February 2014 (UTC)

WV barnstar[edit]

Thanks for devising the West Virginia barnstar, which I just awarded to Caponer after doing GA reviews for a couple of his Hampshire County articles, and following Wikilinks to a number of others. Nice to have a state-specific recognition like that. Ammodramus (talk) 02:06, 13 February 2014 (UTC)

I merely provided the specs, Kelvinsong did the great art work. I thought WV should have a barnstar and thought the great seal of WV should be on it with our Motto. Coal town guy (talk) 14:19, 13 February 2014 (UTC)
Thanks sm!!!—Love, Kelvinsong talk 22:50, 13 February 2014 (UTC)

The Signpost: 12 February 2014[edit]

File:Pocahontas Coalfield Centennial Celebration medal.jpg listed for deletion[edit]

A file that you uploaded or altered, File:Pocahontas Coalfield Centennial Celebration medal.jpg, has been listed at Wikipedia:Files for deletion. Please see the discussion to see why it has been listed (you may have to search for the title of the image to find its entry). Feel free to add your opinion on the matter below the nomination. Thank you. howcheng {chat} 02:19, 15 February 2014 (UTC)

Please see my note at Wikipedia:Files for deletion/2014 February 14 regarding the medallion's possible PD status, and some work you could do to help the situation. Nyttend (talk) 06:03, 20 February 2014 (UTC)
I am very appreciative, I have provided data on the medal at the deletion discussion pageCoal town guy (talk) 13:48, 20 February 2014 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for February 15[edit]

Hi. Thank you for your recent edits. Wikipedia appreciates your help. We noticed though that when you edited Pocahontas Coalfield, you added links pointing to the disambiguation pages Freeman, West Virginia and Upland, West Virginia (check to confirm | fix with Dab solver). Such links are almost always unintended, since a disambiguation page is merely a list of "Did you mean..." article titles. Read the FAQ • Join us at the DPL WikiProject.

It's OK to remove this message. Also, to stop receiving these messages, follow these opt-out instructions. Thanks, DPL bot (talk) 09:10, 15 February 2014 (UTC)

Pocahontas Coalfield[edit]

Definitely an improvement, but considering it includes my ancestral home of Cucumber, I think it ought to be an FA some day. Acroterion (talk) 02:59, 18 February 2014 (UTC)

VisualEditor Newsletter—February 2014[edit]

Since the last newsletter, the VisualEditor team has worked on some small changes to the user interface, such as moving the reference item to the top of the Insert menu, as well as some minor features and fixing bugs, especially for rich copying and pasting of references.

The biggest change was the addition of more features to the image dialog, including the ability to set alignment (left, right, center), framing options (thumbnail, frame, frameless, and none), adding alt text, and defining the size manually. There is still some work to be done here, including a quick way to set the default size.

Looking ahead: The link tool will tell you when you're linking to a disambiguation or redirect page. The warning about wikitext will hide itself after you remove the wikitext markup in that paragraph. Support for creating and editing redirects is in the pipeline. Looking further out, image handling will be improved, including default and upright sizes. The developers are also working on support for viewing and editing hidden HTML comments, some behavioral magic words like DISPLAYTITLE, and in-line language setting (dir="rtl").

If you have questions or suggestions for future improvements, or if you encounter problems, please let everyone know by posting a note at Wikipedia:VisualEditor/Feedback. Thank you! Whatamidoing (WMF) 04:20, 20 February 2014 (UTC)


Hi Coal town guy- Thanks for your support on the FLC. I have also nominated the image set at FPC. Gold certificates next...--Godot13 (talk) 21:50, 20 February 2014 (UTC)

No worries, I am very anxious to see the Gold Cert effort. I got one in change (Gold Cert small), 20 dollar gold cert where it states redeemable in Gold Coin, I was STOKED. The same week, I got a 5 dollar was quite the find for me.Let me know when you have time, I FINALLY managed to get pics of a scrip machine, and thus now I decent pics of the device that makes coal scrip..Coal town guy (talk) 21:54, 20 February 2014 (UTC)
Wow! I've heard of people getting silver certificates as change here and there, but I've never heard about a gold certificate as change. I should do some shopping in your neck of the woods ;-) -Godot13 (talk) 22:35, 20 February 2014 (UTC)
I could have had some OLD large size Gold Certs at a bar for a tip when I bounced, BUT I gave them back to the patron......HOWEVER, I did win a CC silver dollar in a poker game.....YES, I kept the CC dollarCoal town guy (talk) 01:58, 21 February 2014 (UTC)

The Signpost: 19 February 2014[edit]

The Signpost: 26 February 2014[edit]


Was this an accident? --NeilN talk to me 14:41, 28 February 2014 (UTC)

YES, My apologies, please, I am sorry, had a PC glitchCoal town guy (talk) 14:50, 28 February 2014 (UTC)

Teahouse talkback: you've got messages![edit]

WP teahouse logo 3.png
Hello, Coal town guy. Your question has been answered at the Teahouse Q&A board. Feel free to reply there!
Please note that all old questions are archived. Message added by Mz7 (talk) 21:08, 7 March 2014 (UTC). You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{teahouse talkback}} template.

(test) The Signpost: 05 March 2014[edit]

Map request[edit]

Your request at WP:WikiProject U.S. Roads/Maps task force/Requests#Pocahontas Coalfield has been rejected because the article is not within the scope of WP:USRD. I suggest that you look at WP:Graphics Lab/Map workshop instead for assistance. (P.S. you may want to look into archiving your talk page here because of its length.) Imzadi 1979  16:20, 11 March 2014 (UTC)

Care to be an ambassador?[edit]

Hi, CTG! I was looking around today and I found an editor that is working tirelessly on an article on a ghost town in Minnesota (Elcor, Minnesota). He writes quite well, but I left him a kind note today on WP:OR. Two things: Do you know of any barnstar for work on ghost towns? and secondly, could you maybe drop in and take a look and see what you think of his article? It seemed really good to me. You work much more on settlements than I. It seems to be at least a "C" and possibly higher. Let me know what you think, ok?

BTW, I changed my username. This is Gtwfan52. John from Idegon (talk) 19:16, 11 March 2014 (UTC)

I am delighted to assist. That article has alot of work, it takes amazing dedication to produce that. I have replied on your talk page in detailCoal town guy (talk) 20:44, 11 March 2014 (UTC)


Hey, Coal town guy! I appreciate the feedback on the Elcor, Minnesota Wiki page. Anything you can do to help clean it up from a Wiki perspective using bots or otherwise to bring it up to Wiki standards, please feel free. With regard to the encyclopedic content, I don't know that there's much more to add. I have not edited the page since last November, and only recently decided to describe how the land changed hands after demolition of the Corsica mine stack, describing a series of steel company mergers until present day. A friend of mine from the Iron Range Historical Society (I also started this page) brought my attention to the original page, which was apparently started by a fan of Sam LoPresti. It was a stub article and not even accurate at that. I took the liberty of expanding and correcting it. I am somewhat of an expert (or at least hobbyist) on east Mesabi Range ghost towns, but have some personal experience with this one. And in response to an earlier message from John from Idegon will be removing some of the personally cited material. Regrettably, my occupation does not allow me to write Wiki pages for every Iron Range ghost town.DrGregMN (talk) 01:32, 12 March 2014 (UTC)

The Signpost: 12 March 2014[edit]

File:State Line KY postmark.jpg listed for deletion[edit]

A file that you uploaded or altered, File:State Line KY postmark.jpg, has been listed at Wikipedia:Files for deletion. Please see the discussion to see why it has been listed (you may have to search for the title of the image to find its entry). Feel free to add your opinion on the matter below the nomination. Thank you. Sfan00 IMG (talk) 10:03, 17 March 2014 (UTC)

Barrett Ridge, Mississippi[edit]

Hey there. Can I get your opinion on what to do with Barrett Ridge, Mississippi?

Not on GNIS. Not on ACME topographic maps. Probably located along Highway 683 here 34°25′28″N 88°42′08″W / 34.42447°N 88.70234°W / 34.42447; -88.70234.

This article [2] says that Highway 683 is also Barrett Ridge Road.

This article [3] mentions St. Thomas Church, which can be seen along Highway 683 on a topographic map.

These articles also mention the community: [4], [5], [6].

Aside from cleaning up the text in the article, should it get an infobox? Should rough geo-coordinates be added, based on discussion in the articles? Should it be added to the Lee County template? Or is it not really a "place", and shouldn't even have an article? Thanks! Magnolia677 (talk) 04:37, 19 March 2014 (UTC)

VisualEditor newsletter—March 2014[edit]

Since the last newsletter, the VisualEditor team has mostly worked on changes to the template and image dialogs.

The biggest change in the last few weeks was the redesign of the template dialog. The template dialog now opens in a simplified mode that lists parameters and their descriptions. (The complex multi-item transclusion mode can be reached by clicking on "Show options" from inside the simplified template dialog.) Template parameters now have a bigger, auto-sizing input box for easier editing.  With today's update, searching for template parameters will become case-insensitive, and required template parameters will display an asterisk (*) next to their edit boxes. In addition to making it quicker and easier to see everything when you edit typical templates, this work was necessary to prepare for the forthcoming simplified citation dialog. The main priority in the coming weeks is building this new citation dialog, with the ultimate goal of providing autofill features for ISBNs, URLs, DOIs and other quick-fills. This will add a new button on the toolbar, with the citation templates available picked by each wiki's community. Concept drawings can be seen at mw:VisualEditor/Design/Reference Dialog. Please share your ideas about making referencing quick and easy with the designers.

  • The link tool now tells you when you're linking to a disambiguation or redirect page. Pages that exist, but are not indexed by the search engine, are treated like non-existent pages (bug 54361
  • Wikitext warnings will now hide when you remove wikitext from the paragraph you are editing.
  • The character inserter tool in the "Insert" menu has been slightly redesigned, to introduce larger buttons. Your suggestions for more significant changes to the special character inserter are still wanted.
  • The page options menu (three bars, next to the Cancel button) has expanded. You can create and edit redirect pages, set page options like __STATICREDIRECT__, __[NO]INDEX__ and __[NO]NEWEDITSECTION__, and more.  New keyboard shortcuts are listed there, and include undoing the last action, clearing formatting, and showing the shortcut help window. If you switch from VisualEditor to wikitext editing, your edit will now be tagged.
  • It is easier to edit images. There are more options and they are explained better. If you add new images to pages, they will also be default size.  You can now set image sizes to the default, if another size was previously specified. Full support for upright sizing systems, which more readily adapt image sizes to the reader's screen size, is planned.
  • VisualEditor adds fake blank lines so you can put your cursor there. These "slugs" are now smaller than normal blank lines, and are animated to be different from actual blank lines.
  • You can use the Ctrl+Alt+S or  Command+ Option+S shortcuts to open the save window, and you can preview your edit summary when checking your changes in the save window.
  • After community requests, VisualEditor has been deployed to the Interlingual Occidental Wikipedia, the Portuguese Wikibooks, and the French Wikiversity.
  • Any community can ask for custom icons for their language in the character formatting menu (bold, italic, etc.) by making a request on Bugzilla or by contacting Product Manager James Forrester.

The developers apologize for a regression bug with the deployment on 6 March 2014, which caused the incorrect removal of |upright size definitions on a handful of pages on the English Wikipedia, among others. The root cause was fixed, and the broken pages were fixed soon after.

Looking ahead:  Several template dialogs will become more compact. Looking further out, the developers are also working on support for viewing and editing hidden HTML comments. You will be able to see the Table of Contents change live as you edit the page, rather than it being hidden. In-line language setting (dir="rtl") may be offered to a few Wikipedias soon.

If you have questions or suggestions for future improvements, or if you encounter problems, please let everyone know by posting a note at Wikipedia:VisualEditor/Feedback or by joining the office hours on 19 April 2014 at 2000 UTC. Thank you! MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 22:44, 20 March 2014 (UTC)

Western Kentucky help[edit]

Do you have printed local histories for any of the Western Coal Fields counties? Early this month, I took a Green River ferry in Butler County (SE corner of the region), and I'd like to write an article about it, but I can't get enough sources. It's been around for a long time; it's documented in 1916, by which time it had its current name of "Reeds Ferry". If you could help find documentation on this ferry, I'd really appreciate it. Nyttend (talk) 23:14, 21 March 2014 (UTC)

I do not own printed coalfield material from Western KY coalfield counties, BUT I know some folks who might, give me a day or 2...There was at one time a series of e books for the older lit, let me take look...Coal town guy (talk) 01:51, 22 March 2014 (UTC)
Thanks! Either actual print or digital versions of print would work; I was meaning "can you identify books in which it's covered". There's no Butler County entry in Filby's Bibliography of American County Histories, so anything you can dig up via your acquaintances will be most welcome. Nyttend (talk) 04:59, 22 March 2014 (UTC)
Found a few decent started sources...:Book, Kentucky Encyclopedia by John Kleber, parts of green river data is on Google Books
Listing of coal towns in Butler County, I do not know their proximity to Green
The Green River Pioneers by James Ramage
Butler County Historical and Genealogical Society, 1987 by Lois Russ
Journal of the Senate of the Commonwealth of Kentucky 1889
Butler County Roger G. Givens, Nancy Richey 2012 pages 7 -9 have some great data, those pages can be read on Google books as well.Coal town guy (talk) 19:15, 22 March 2014 (UTC)
Really appreciate the help, especially the Arcadia Publishing book. Besides their content on this ferry, I'm particularly interested by Givens/Richey because they spell it "Read's" instead of "Reeds", as I'd not thought to check under that spelling. Nyttend (talk) 01:22, 23 March 2014 (UTC)
I have actualy helped some folks at Arcadia, I like them, they actually like to get into the history, elbow deep, its rather impressive honestly. A few of them used to come to the field and it was honestly impressive to see them there, there is a series they did on Southern WV and they were really thereCoal town guy (talk) 02:02, 23 March 2014 (UTC)
Yeah, I've been a big fan to use the vernacular :-) of Arcadia since buying their Beaver Falls: Gem of Beaver County about the city in which I wish I lived, and I've since been given as Christmas presents a couple of their books on historic bridges. I've seen numerous books on cities and counties, and all seem to be comparable quality. At first, I hesitate to use these books, since they're by local authors instead of by significant historians, but the same is true of the typical county history that we routinely use without question. Nyttend (talk) 02:13, 23 March 2014 (UTC)

The Signpost: 19 March 2014[edit]

Woodyard, West Virginia[edit]

Hi-I came across Woodyard, West Virginia in Roane County-GNIS-1741042-ghost town. Thanks-RFD (talk) 22:00, 24 March 2014 (UTC)

GROOVY, many thanks, its documented now.Coal town guy (talk) 01:13, 25 March 2014 (UTC)

The Signpost: 26 March 2014[edit]

Peelers, Mississippi[edit]

Hey there. I want to create an article about Peelers, Mississippi (GNIS), and what I'd like to figure out is, was it ever a port on the Mississippi River, or did it come about after Eagle Lake was cut off from the river. I have a pretty good map from 1862, and it's not on it. Eagle Lake was created in 1866 (see page 151). It had a post office from 1892 to 1922 (see [7]). I'd like to add a few more to places to this category. Just wondering if you might have an old map that shows Peelers on the old river. Thanks! Magnolia677 (talk) 00:03, 4 April 2014 (UTC)

The Signpost: 02 April 2014[edit]

You have been nominated for a gift from the Wikimedia Foundation![edit]

You have been selected to receive a merchandise giveaway. Please send us a message if you would like to claim your shirt. Thank you again for all you do! --JMatthews (WMF) (talk) 06:58, 9 April 2014 (UTC)

Ogden, West Virginia[edit]

Hi-I had to make a minor change in one of the articles Ogden, West Virginia you started; a space was needed. I had to move the article to make the change. It should not be any problem. How are you doing?-RFD (talk) 11:09, 10 April 2014 (UTC)

I ewill be going home for a weekend and will of course be updating some pics in the National Register Page......MUCh appreciate the helpCoal town guy (talk) 15:50, 10 April 2014 (UTC)

The Signpost: 09 April 2014[edit]

The Signpost: 23 April 2014[edit]

VisualEditor newsletter—April 2014[edit]

Since the last newsletter, the VisualEditor team has mostly worked on performance improvements, image settings, and preparation for a simplified citation template tool in its own menu.

  • In an oft-requested improvement, VisualEditor now displays red links (links to non-existent pages) in the proper color. Links to sister projects and external URLs are still the same blue as local links.
  • You can now open templates by double-clicking them or by selecting them and pressing  Return.  This also works for references, images, galleries, mathematical equations, and other "nodes".
  • VisualEditor has been disabled for pages that were created as translations of other pages using the Translate extension (common at Meta and If a page has been marked for translation, you will see a warning if you try to edit it using VisualEditor.
  • When you try to edit protected pages with VisualEditor, the full protection notice and most recent log entry are displayed. Blocked users see the standard message for blocked users.
  • The developers fixed a bug that caused links on sub-pages to point to the wrong location.
  • The size-changing controls in the advanced settings section of the media or image dialog were simplified further. VisualEditor's media dialog supports more image display styles, like borderless images.
  • If there is not enough space on your screen to display all of the tabs (for instance, if your browser window is too narrow), the second edit tab will now fold into the drop-down menu (where the "Move" item is currently housed). On the English Wikipedia, this moves the "Edit beta" tab into the menu; on most projects, it moves the "Edit source" tab. This is only enabled in the default Vector skin, not for Monobook users. See this image for an example showing the "Edit source" and "View history" tabs after they moved into the drop-down menu.
  • After community requests, VisualEditor has been deployed as an opt-in feature at Meta and on the French Wikinews.
The drop-down menu is on the right, next to the search box.

Looking ahead:  A new, locally controlled menu of citation templates will put citations immediately in front of users. You will soon be able to see the Table of Contents while editing. Support for upright image sizes (preferred for accessibility) is being developed. In-line language setting (dir="rtl") will be offered as a Beta Feature soon. Looking further out, the developers are also working on support for viewing and editing hidden HTML comments. It will be possible to upload images to Commons from inside VisualEditor.

If you have questions or suggestions for future improvements, or if you encounter problems, please let everyone know by posting a note at Wikipedia:VisualEditor/Feedback or by joining the office hours on Monday, 19 May 2014 at 18:00 UTC. If you'd like to get this on your own page, subscribe at Wikipedia:VisualEditor#Newsletter for English Wikipedia only or at meta:VisualEditor/Newsletter for any project. Thank you! Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 20:23, 23 April 2014 (UTC)

The Signpost: 30 April 2014[edit]

Photo advice[edit]

In your opinion, what's the best kind of building to photograph when visiting a former coal town? I'm talking about an infobox image: what kind of setting is best for the infobox? For example, when visiting Harlan County KY recently, I got a residential neighborhood in Lynch, and I got a downtown scene in Cumberland. Nyttend (talk) 02:12, 5 May 2014 (UTC)

IMO, ANYTHING showing an original structure that was integral to the town is the best, IMO. A post office, a school, a church or yes, a downtown shot that would be as close to the original as possible. I will have EXTENSIVE updates soon as I just got back from McDowell County in WV and a few other places. Coal town guy (talk) 15:32, 5 May 2014 (UTC)

Possibly unfree File:UBB Memorial.jpg[edit]

A file that you uploaded or altered, File:UBB Memorial.jpg, has been listed at Wikipedia:Possibly unfree files because its copyright status is unclear or disputed. If the file's copyright status cannot be verified, it may be deleted. You may find more information on the file description page. You are welcome to add comments to its entry at the discussion if you object to the listing for any reason. Thank you.  Ronhjones  (Talk) 22:59, 6 May 2014 (UTC)

Possibly unfree File:Bartley WV Miners Memorial.jpg[edit]

A file that you uploaded or altered, File:Bartley WV Miners Memorial.jpg, has been listed at Wikipedia:Possibly unfree files because its copyright status is unclear or disputed. If the file's copyright status cannot be verified, it may be deleted. You may find more information on the file description page. You are welcome to add comments to its entry at the discussion if you object to the listing for any reason. Thank you.  Ronhjones  (Talk) 23:02, 6 May 2014 (UTC)

Re your comments at the PUF, this is exactly why I virtually never upload images of this sort: I often find them, and I'd love to upload more, but it's basically too much of a mess in most cases. The exceptions are things that are themselves dated without copyright notice (e.g. this historical marker, dated 1956), or things without notice for which I've got external documentation (e.g. this sign; it's in a National Register district, and the nomination mentions when it was placed), or things that are too old, such as the numerous Confederate monuments in western Kentucky. Nyttend (talk) 03:40, 8 May 2014 (UTC)
You may release all rights if you want, or you may do nothing additional — the image as it stands right now has no copyright issues whatsoever. Remember that you retain copyright when releasing something under GFDL/CC; the licenses impose certain requirements on reusers (for example, attribution and copyleft), and these requirements would be worthless if the licenses involved a public domain release. As long as you retain copyright, the {{PD-US-no notice}} template should be linked (as it is now), not transcluded: either way, humans can figure out that the object in the picture is in the public domain, but transcluding the template causes the image to end up in a category for images that themselves are in the public domain, and bots (and inattentive humans) might misunderstand and think that the whole image is in the public domain. The only reason we need to mention PD-US-no notice is to prevent copyright-based deletion here on Wikipedia; it's really not relevant for any other reason, and transcluding it would make the image appear to have two different copyright statuses. If you feel like releasing the image into the public domain, you can do that (remove the GFDL/CC template and add {{PD-self}}), and in that case you could transclude the no-notice template — both say that the image is in the public domain, and that's the most important thing, since we basically need to have all templates stating the same copyright status, and the reason for PD status isn't as important. See the permission templates I've used at File:Pivot Point historical marker.jpg, for example. I hope this isn't too confusing! At the end, please remember that you have to be able to demonstrate PD status (if challenged) for anything you're photographing — with most things, including buildings and landscapes, of course they're not copyrightable, but if you have something copyrightable, you need to be able to demonstrate that it's too old or that it failed to comply with registration requirements. Pretty much any image of a pre-1978 work will be fine if you state that it was published without notice; don't lie, of course, but pretty much anything in good faith will be accepted. Nyttend (talk) 17:25, 8 May 2014 (UTC)

Great user page![edit]

You have a really nice user page. I love the design and the photo (which I assume you took). Came here from the Organized Labor Wikiproject. Keep up the good work researching those unions and documenting West Virginia's history. Mvblair (talk) 18:19, 9 May 2014 (UTC)

The Signpost: 07 May 2014[edit]

Mississippi River towns[edit]

Hi there. Our paths haven't crossed in a while. I wanted to share this link with you. There are still a few more old river towns in Bolivar County, but that's about it. I only added the plantations on the river where it was evident that a populated place was also established. I also added a few ghost towns along the Tombigbee, but there are a ton left to do. Lots of fun! Cheers. Magnolia677 (talk) 19:43, 10 May 2014 (UTC)

Copyright frustrations[edit]

I appreciate your frustrations but please don't shoot the messengers, they're only trying to ensure Wikipedia stays within the law. Sadly US copyright law is convoluted and trying to list all the possibilities is probably endless. Two good and well explained places to start are c:Commons:Hirtle chart for the generalities around dates and c:Commons:Freedom of panorama#United States about photgraphing statues and buildings. But to answer one of your questions, if you photograph a memorial it is your responsibility as the uploader to establish that the subject of the photo is a public domain item. Nthep (talk) 09:05, 16 May 2014 (UTC)

Please do not post on this page. I have bad genetics I am a meat pop tart, I will in a free society post my contention with any rule that is applied with virtually NO explanation. Last I recalled, in a volunteer environment, where we all work together, it would be logical and cogent to COOPERATE. I am very appreciative of the other admins who actually shook things up and INFORMED me about the reasoning of said deletion. Thats rather cool. In other words, if you actually let people know why something happens, odds are, JUST A HUNCH, everything would go rather smooth.....HOWEVER, to the absurdist extreme, to tell me, my consternation is "shooting the messenger" I cant help you there. GOOD FAITH ASSUMPTIONS ASIDE HA HA HA I mean why help people LEARN HOW TO CONTRIBUTE MORE when it is far far easier to essentially provide a kiss off message and certainly encourage future contributions..I assure you I am aching to post another memorial pic..honest....... Coal town guy (talk) 14:01, 16 May 2014 (UTC)

The Signpost: 14 May 2014[edit]

Elcor, Minnesota[edit]

Hi, CTG! I want to thank you for the Wiki Ghost Towns Barnstar and nomination for Editor of the Week. I appreciate all your comments and support of this article. At this point, I don't think there's much more I can do with it. I've referenced all the RS that I can, have added photos, proper licensure, added content for clarification and cleaned up the article to try to bring it up to Wiki standards. I don't know who rates these things, but would you take another look at it? I welcome any further suggestions!DrGregMN (talk) 19:49, 18 May 2014 (UTC)

VisualEditor newsletter—May 2014[edit]


Did you know?

VisualEditor - Editing References - Cite Pulldown.png

The cite menu offers quick access to up to five citation templates.  If your wiki has enabled the "Cite" menu, press "Cite" and select the appropriate template from the menu.

Existing citations that use these templates can be edited either using the "Cite" tool or by selecting the reference and choosing the "Basic" item in the "Insert" menu.

Read the user guide for more information.

Since the last newsletter, the VisualEditor team has mostly worked on the new citation tool, improving performance, reducing technical debt, and other infrastructure needs.

The biggest change in the last few weeks is the new citation template menu, labeled "Cite". The new citation menu offers a locally configurable list of citation templates on the main toolbar. It adds or opens references using the simplified template dialog that was deployed last month. This tool is in addition to the "Basic" item in the "Insert" menu, and it is not displayed unless it has been configured for that wiki. To enable this tool on your wiki, see the instructions at VisualEditor/Citation tool.

Eventually, the VisualEditor team plans to add autofill features for these citations. When this long-awaited feature is created, you could add an ISBN, URL, DOI or other identifier to the citation tool, and VisualEditor would automatically fill in as much information for that source as possible. The concept drawings can be seen at mw:VisualEditor/Design/Reference Dialog, and your ideas about making referencing quick and easy are still wanted.

  • There is a new Beta Feature for setting content language and direction.  This allows editors who have opted in to use the "Language" tool in the "Insert" menu to add HTML span tags that label text with the language and as being left-to-right (LTR) or right-to-left (RTL), like this:  <span lang="en" dir="ltr">English</span>. This tool is most useful for pages whose text combines multiple languages with different directions, common on Right-to-Left wikis.
  • The tool for editing mathematics formulae in VisualEditor has been slightly updated and is now available to all users, as the "Formula" item in the "Insert" menu. It uses LaTeX like in the wikitext editor.
  • The layout of template dialogs has been changed, putting the label above the field.  Parameters are now called "fields", to avoid a technical term that many editors are unfamiliar with.
  • TemplateData has been expanded:  You can now add "suggested" parameters in TemplateData, and VisualEditor will display them in the template dialogs like required ones.  "Suggested" is recommended for parameters that are commonly used, but not actually required to make the template work.  There is also a new type for TemplateData parameters: wiki-file-name, for file names.  The template tool can now tell you if a parameter is marked as being obsolete.
  • Some templates that previously displayed strangely due to absolute CSS positioning hacks should now display correctly.
  • Several messages have changed: The notices shown when you save a page have been merged into those used in the wikitext editor, for consistency.  The message shown when you "<visualeditor-toolbar-cancel>" out of an edit is clearer. The beta dialog notice, which is shown the first time you open VisualEditor, will be hidden for logged-in users via a user preference rather than a cookie.  As a result of this change, the beta notice will show up one last time for all logged-in users on their next VisualEditor use after Thursday's upgrade.
  • Adding a category that is a redirect to another category prompts you to add the target category instead of the redirect.
  • In the "Media" dialog, it is no longer possible to set a redundant border for thumbnail and framed images.
  • There is a new Template Documentation Editor for TemplateData.  You can test it by editing a documentation subpage (not a template page) at edit mw:Template:Sandbox/doc, and then click "Manage template documentation" above the wikitext edit box.  If your community would like to use this TemplateData editor at your project, please contact product manager James Forrester or file an enhancement request in Bugzilla.
  • There have been multiple small changes to the appearance:  External links are shown in the same light blue color as in MediaWiki.  This is a lighter shade of blue than the internal links.  The styling of the "Style text" (character formatting) drop-down menu has been synchronized with the recent font changes to the Vector skin.  VisualEditor dialogs, such as the "Save page" dialog, now use a "loading" animation of moving lines, rather than animated GIF images.  Other changes were made to the appearance upon opening a page in VisualEditor which should make the transition between reading and editing be smoother.
  • The developers merged in many minor fixes and improvements to MediaWiki interface integration (e.g., edit notices), and made VisualEditor handle Education Program pages better.
  • At the request of the community, VisualEditor has been deployed to Commons as an opt-in. It is currently available by default for 161 Wikipedia language editions and by opt-in through Beta Features at all others, as well as on several non-Wikipedia sites.

Looking ahead:  The toolbar from the PageTriage extension will no longer be visible inside VisualEditor. More buttons and icons will be accessible from the keyboard.  The "Keyboard shortcuts" link will be moved out of the "Page options" menu, into the "Help" menu. Support for upright image sizes (preferred for accessibility) and inline images is being developed. You will be able to see the Table of Contents while editing. Looking further out, the developers are also working on support for viewing and editing hidden HTML comments. VisualEditor will be available to all users on mobile devices and tablet computers. It will be possible to upload images to Commons from inside VisualEditor.

If you have questions or suggestions for future improvements, or if you encounter problems, please let everyone know by posting a note at mw:VisualEditor/Feedback or by joining the office hours on Thursday, 19 June 2014 at 10:00 UTC. If you'd like to get this newsletter on your own page (about once a month), please subscribe at w:en:Wikipedia:VisualEditor/Newsletter for English Wikipedia only or at meta:VisualEditor/Newsletter for any project. Thank you! Whatamidoing (WMF) 22:16, 21 May 2014 (UTC)

The Signpost: 21 May 2014[edit]

The Signpost: 28 May 2014[edit]

The Signpost: 04 June 2014[edit]

The Center Line: Spring 2014[edit]

The Center Line header.svg
Volume 7, Issue 2 • Spring 2014 • About the Newsletter
State and national updates
ArchivesNewsroomFull IssueShortcut: WP:USRD/NEWS
MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 07:05, 8 June 2014 (UTC) on behalf of Imzadi1979

The Signpost: 11 June 2014[edit]

New photos[edit]

Just wanted to let you know that I visited the Eastern Kentucky coal country yesterday; photos will be forthcoming for localities such as Wheelwright and Burton. Wheelwright seemed the epitome of a coal town: at the end of a dead-end road, along a stream, lots of what were clearly company-built houses, and a falling-apart downtown. Several of the pivotal buildings mentioned in the National Register nomination are gone, although I got photos for some of the ones that remain. For a little while in the recent past, they had jobs, although unusual ones: the Otter Creek Correctional Center operated there from 1981 until closing in 2012. I'm definitely left wondering what the locals do for a living, aside from the school, post office, and gas station employees; I saw no sign of any current mining operations, and there's no way you can farm the surrounding countryside. Maybe they all drive to Prestonsburg for work? Nyttend (talk) 19:52, 15 June 2014 (UTC)

All you need to do is look at the population figures for the last 40 years and you will know what will happen...McDowell County, West Virginia is doing it now. Most folks stay in service industries until their parents die, then they move out. I am green with envy that you went. I used my google fu to its maximum and found a neat way to drie my photography...I look up demolition contracts and offers for the areas I take pics of. So far, it has worked. I will back and active soon, taking care of a few presdervation things Coal town guy (talk) 14:42, 17 June 2014 (UTC)
I agree with you that it's not particularly neutral, between two massive sections on court rulings and environmental record, and the trespassing section needs to go per WP:NOTNEWS unless there's a longer-term relevance. We definitely need to mention them, but right now almost all the article is dedicated to saying how horrible the company is ("is" and not "was", since much hasn't been updated since they got bought up), way past what would be neutral. You mention community service: this definitely needs to be redone, but it isn't something we'd trash. Go back to Wheelwright for a minute: if we were writing a comprehensive article about the owner, Elk Horn Coal, we'd want to mention Wheelwright because it was (in a way) a model town, and we'd definitely need to mention how they built a swimming pool, above-average-quality housing (after the first few years), and a golf course that was free for all workers. In the same way, we should mention what Massey has done for its workers and their communities. Finally on those photos, I'm still getting them organised; it might be several days before they're uploaded. I had hoped to get a lot of Lexington photos on my way back, but the roads between Salyersville and Wheelwright were so slow (I got stuck behind a funeral procession south of Salyersville and behind bicyclists climbing the ridge just west of Wheelwright) that I lost a lot of time, so I'm making it my goal to get back to Lexington on Saturday and dodge the isolated thunderstorms. Nyttend backup (talk) 17:36, 18 June 2014 (UTC)
Sounds good. A few of my "usual haunts" are going the way of the dozer very soon. I do also relate to photo delays......Coal town guy (talk) 00:47, 19 June 2014 (UTC)
Floyd County photos uploaded; some are at Wayland, Burton, and Bosco, but several more are on Commons. I've just created Commons:Category:Wheelwright, Kentucky (although in all fairness, 14 of the 18 images are from the 1940s), and five other images are in the parent Floyd County category, including one of the post office at the redlinked Lackey. I have work to do on images from Breathitt, Clark, Estill, Fayette, Henry, Knott, Lee, Madison, Magoffin, Perry, Powell, Scott, and Wolfe counties, although of course some of them aren't Eastern Coal Fields (e.g. Henry County map), but you'd do well to look at the Commons categories for each county if you're curious what I got. If you don't feel like looking, I'll be happy to look for something specific if you'd like. Nyttend (talk) 00:32, 21 June 2014 (UTC)
Thanks for letting me know. A mini-stub, with just text, tends to make me think of an auto-generated entry from a database such as GNIS. That's part of the reason I try to get these small-town pictures; when we don't have text from any other source, a photo really helps to demonstrate that we've done some work, that it's definitely still there and not simply a group of building foundations or a GNIS error. Nyttend (talk) 20:04, 22 June 2014 (UTC)
ANY Time. I do have a few hundred coal town pics on hand to help flesh out some of these places...I have at times not posted them, BUT I must agree with what you are sayingCoal town guy (talk) 21:11, 22 June 2014 (UTC)

The Signpost: 18 June 2014[edit]

VisualEditor global newsletter—June 2014[edit]

The character formatting menu

Did you know?

The character formatting menu, or "Style text" menu lets you set bold, italic, and other text styles. "Clear formatting" removes all text styles and removes links to other pages.

Do you think that clear formatting should remove links? Are there changes you would like to see for this menu? Share your opinion at

The user guide has information about how to use VisualEditor.

The VisualEditor team is mostly working to fix bugs, improve performance, reduce technical debt, and other infrastructure needs. You can find on weekly updates detailing recent work.

  • They have moved the "Keyboard shortcuts" link out of the "Page options" menu, into the "Help" menu. Within dialog boxes, buttons are now more accessible (via the Tab key) from the keyboard.
  • You can now see the target of the link when you click on it, without having to open the inspector.
  • The team also expanded TemplateData: You can now add a parameter type  "date" for dates and times in the ISO 8601 format, and  "boolean" for values which are true or false. Also, templates that redirect to other templates (like {{citeweb}}{{cite web}}) now get the TemplateData of their target (bug 50964). You can test TemplateData by editing mw:Template:Sandbox/doc.
  • Category: and File: pages now display their contents correctly after saving an edit (bug 65349, bug 64239)
  • They have also improved reference editing: You should no longer be able to add empty citations with VisualEditor (bug 64715), as with references. When you edit a reference, you can now empty it and click the "use an existing reference" button to replace it with another reference instead. 
  • It is now possible to edit inline images with VisualEditor. Remember that inline images cannot display captions, so existing captions get removed. Many other bugs related to images were also fixed.
  • You can now add and edit {{DISPLAYTITLE}} and __DISAMBIG__ in the "Page options" menu, rounding out the full set of page options currently planned.
  • The tool to insert special characters is now wider and simpler.

Looking ahead[edit]

The VisualEditor team has posted a draft of their goals for the next fiscal year. You can read them and suggest changes on

The team posts details about planned work on VisualEditor's roadmap. You will soon be able to drag-and-drop text as well as images. If you drag an image to a new place, it won't let you place it in the middle of a paragraph. All dialog boxes and windows will be simplified based on user testing and feedback. The VisualEditor team plans to add autofill features for citations. Your ideas about making referencing quick and easy are still wanted. Support for upright image sizes is being developed. The designers are also working on support for viewing and editing hidden HTML comments and adding rows and columns to tables.

Supporting your wiki[edit]

Please read VisualEditor/Citation tool for information on configuring the new citation template menu, labeled "Cite". This menu will not appear unless it has been configured on your wiki.

If you speak a language other than English, we need your help with translating the user guide. The guide is out of date or incomplete for many languages, and what's on your wiki may not be the most recent translation. Please contact me if you need help getting started with translation work on

VisualEditor can be made available to most non-Wikipedia projects. If your community would like to test VisualEditor, please contact product manager James Forrester or file an enhancement request in Bugzilla.

Please share your questions, suggestions, or problems by posting a note at mw:VisualEditor/Feedback or by joining the office hours on Saturday, 19 July 2014 at 21:00 UTC (daytime for the Americas and Pacific Islands) or on Thursday, 14 August 2014 at 9:00 UTC (daytime for Europe, Middle East, Asia).

To change your subscription to this newsletter, please see the subscription pages on Meta or the English Wikipedia. Thank you! Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 04:59, 25 June 2014 (UTC)

West Virginee[edit]

How you doing? I wrote you a couple of times but didn't hear back. I'm slowly adding pics from Virginia, West Virginia and Kentucky. Lovely part of the county. Magnolia677 (talk) 14:12, 26 June 2014 (UTC)

Life gets in the way of editing. I'm soon to be in the same boat. I have a few more Appalachian photos to upload, then just monitor my watchlist. I finally finished this project. Remarkably, there are still a few more ghost towns on the Mississippi that were once populated places and have a GNIS number. Your trip sounds wonderful. Nice to get caught up with you! Magnolia677 (talk) 17:23, 26 June 2014 (UTC)

The Signpost: 25 June 2014[edit]

Killarney, West Virginia[edit]

Hey there. Can you have a look at Killarney, West Virginia? It's listed as a ghost town, but Pocahontas has a fairly modern coal processing plant off Highway 33 there. I just added a picture of it to the Killarney article. Then again, there's not much else there, so it probably is a ghost town. Thanks! Magnolia677 (talk) 13:10, 1 July 2014 (UTC)

The Signpost: 02 July 2014[edit]

The Signpost: 09 July 2014[edit]

The Signpost: 16 July 2014[edit]

The Signpost: 23 July 2014[edit]

The Signpost: 30 July 2014[edit]

Kentucky help[edit]

Thanks for the offer! But what do you mean? Are you perhaps referring to this edit? If you feel like writing "good stubs" or better, I can help you find NR nominations if you're not already familiar with the NPS website. Nyttend (talk) 23:57, 7 August 2014 (UTC)

Okay, a few basic points; I'm probably telling you some things you already know, but I just want to make sure. (1) Please please please don't create NRIS-only stubs! You probably already know this, but these stubs really aren't informative encyclopedia articles, and we're better with a redlink than an NRIS-only stub. Plus, NRIS occasionally contains statements that (once you check the documentation) are egregious errors; see "Perfect example of NRIS errors" at WT:NRHP. (2) You can access NRIS via User:Elkman's website. If you want to find information for a specific site, get its refnum from the county list (it's the eight-digit number immediately below the date when the site was listed), and put the refnum in the lower blank. You can also type the name into the upper blank, but sometimes there are typos or turned-around names (e.g. most personal names are listed as "Lastname, Firstname, House"), so it's normally easier to use the refnum. (3) The best common source for NR site articles is the nomination form. Once you get the infobox for a site, Elkman's page will give you the URL for a site (look below the information on the left side of the page), as well as the URL for the associated group of photos. NPS has digitised most nominations, with the major exceptions being restricted-address locations and locations listed since about 2008. KHC has nominations online for sites listed since about 2010 (just put the name into Google), so the only ones that aren't online at all are sites listed from around 2008 until 2010. (4) If you want to produce a "good stub", like several users often do, this should be enough. If you want to produce fewer but fuller articles, like I generally do, don't forget your county histories! You mention Perry County; for one of these "good stubs", see its only listing, the Presbyterian church in Buckhorn. Nyttend (talk) 02:54, 8 August 2014 (UTC)

VisualEditor newsletter—July and August 2014[edit]


The VisualEditor team is currently working mostly to fix bugs, improve performance, reduce technical debt, and other infrastructure needs. You can find on weekly updates detailing recent work.

Screenshot of VisualEditor's link tool
Dialog boxes in VisualEditor have been re-designed to use action words instead of icons. This has increased the number of items that need to be translated. The user guide is also being updated.

The biggest visible change since the last newsletter was to the dialog boxes. The design for each dialog box and window was simplified. The most commonly needed buttons are now at the top. Based on user feedback, the buttons are now labeled with simple words (like "Cancel" or "Done") instead of potentially confusing icons (like "<" or "X"). Many of the buttons to edit links, images, and other items now also show the linked page, image name, or other useful information when you click on them.

  • Hidden HTML comments (notes visible to editors, but not to readers) can now be read, edited, inserted, and removed. A small icon (a white exclamation mark on a dot) marks the location of each comments. You can click on the icon to see the comment.
  • You can now drag and drop text and templates as well as images. A new placement line makes it much easier to see where you are dropping the item. Images can no longer be dropped into the middle of paragraphs.
  • All references and footnotes (<ref> tags) are now made through the "Cite" menu, including the "Basic" (manual formatting) footnotes and the ability to re-use an existing citation, both of which were previously accessible only through the "Insert" menu. The "<visualeditor-dialogbutton-referencelist-tooltip>" is still added via the "Insert" menu.
  • When you add an image or other media file, you are now prompted to add an image caption immediately. You can also replace an image whilst keeping the original caption and other settings.
  • All tablet users visiting the mobile web version of Wikipedias will be able to opt-in to a version of VisualEditor from 14 August. You can test the new tool by choosing the beta version of the mobile view in the Settings menu.
  • The link tool has a new "Open" button that will open a linked page in another tab so you can make sure a link is the right one.
  • The "Cancel" button in the toolbar has been removed based on user testing. To cancel any edit, you can leave the page by clicking the Read tab, the back button in your browser, or closing the browser window without saving your changes.

Looking ahead[edit]

The team posts details about planned work on the VisualEditor roadmap. The VisualEditor team plans to add auto-fill features for citations soon. Your ideas about making referencing quick and easy are still wanted. Support for upright image sizes is being developed. The designers are also working on support for adding rows and columns to tables. Work to support Internet Explorer is ongoing.

Feedback opportunities[edit]

The Editing team will be making two presentations this weekend at Wikimania in London. The first is with product manager James Forrester and developer Trevor Parscal on Saturday at 16:30. The second is with developers Roan Kattouw and Trevor Parscal on Sunday at 12:30.

Please share your questions, suggestions, or problems by posting a note at the VisualEditor feedback page or by joining the office hours discussion on Thursday, 14 August 2014 at 09:00 UTC (daytime for Europe, Middle East and Asia) or on Thursday, 18 September 2014 at 16:00 UTC (daytime for the Americas; evening for Europe).

If you'd like to get this newsletter on your own page (about once a month), please subscribe at w:en:Wikipedia:VisualEditor/Newsletter for English Wikipedia only or at Meta for any project. Thank you! Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 18:14, 8 August 2014 (UTC)

The Signpost: 06 August 2014[edit]

McDowell County localities[edit]

We generally use a simple issue to decide whether a location belongs on the county template: if it's not itself a municipality, is it in an incorporated area, or is it unincorporated? For county template purposes, a neighborhood is any portion of a municipality; to take some examples (sorry that it's so far away, but I can't think of something near you), Acton, Indiana, surrounded by farm fields, is considered an Indianapolis neighborhood because it's within the city limits, while North Corbin, Kentucky isn't considered part of Corbin because it's outside the city limits. These places don't belong on the county template, unless of course we've made a mistake and they're really not in the city limits of Gary. Nyttend (talk) 22:44, 11 August 2014 (UTC)

I have to differ with all three of them. Begin by going to Google Maps and puting in Gary, and it will give the city limits. If you put in Wilcoe, you'll see a spot that's definitely in the limits. The same is true of Elbert, with Gary's city limits extending southward past Elbert all the way to Filbert, and for Thorpe, as the city limits go east a little bit past the spot where Leslie Creek flows into the Tug Fork. I'm not clear why you say that Thorpe is 9.1 miles away; Google says that it's 2.6, and Elbert 2.3. Are there perhaps two-or-more places of each name in the area? Nyttend (talk) 22:59, 11 August 2014 (UTC)

Gary, WV "neighborhoods"[edit]

I saw your note on Nyttend's talk page. Those descriptions are actually my fault (though I wrote them about five years ago). Gary and its constituent communities were sort of an odd situation when I was writing articles on every place with a post office in WV. At the time, I wasn't quite sure how to handle distinct communities that were legally incorporated as part of another distinct community, and "neighborhood" seemed like the closest description. In hindsight, I think you're right that it's not a very good description, and it's probably just better to call it a community and explain its legal situation in more detail. I'll leave that to you, since you know way more about the area than I do. By the way, you might want to take a look at Warriormine, West Virginia; I think it's a similar situation to Gary where a separate community became legally part of another one, so that probably isn't a neighborhood either. TheCatalyst31 ReactionCreation 22:48, 11 August 2014 (UTC)

I just replied to Nyttends page, its a custom that started in the last few years in McDowell, Coalwood claimed War was a neighborhood, the then Mayor, stated how unusual that was as War is a City......Its not at all anybodys fault per se, it is however some misinformation that not many care enough to correct.......Coal town guy (talk) 22:54, 11 August 2014 (UTC)
I will however in the spirit of cooperation follow ANY consensusCoal town guy (talk) 22:55, 11 August 2014 (UTC)
If you have any sources that talk about the situation with Gary, they'd be useful; the Gary article used to explain that Elbert, Filbert, Thorpe, and Wilcoe were once separate communities before Gary was incorporated, but that got removed because it was unreferenced. The Filbert article claims that it's still partly unincorporated, so if you have anything on that it'd be great too. I think Nyttend's right that the consensus is that places shouldn't be in the navbox if they're part of an incorporated city, but it's not enforced too strictly; Warriormine's been in the McDowell County navbox for years, and former settlements within incorporated cities are usually allowed, so it's a bit murky. This might be worth making an exception, though it'd take some discussion first. TheCatalyst31 ReactionCreation 23:02, 11 August 2014 (UTC)
MOST EXCELLENT (rubbing hands together)...a few years ago, I had the pleasure of meeting with the VP of the NSCA, (National Scrip Collectors Association), the idea of these places being seperate was paramount for 2 reasons, 1)Greed and 2)generating higher revenue and creating greater profit.Each of these places had its own mine and yes, its own company store and yes, its own coal company scrip. You of course HAD to spend the company scrip in that specific company town. It meant that you could NOT come from another town and use another towns scrip, UNLESS you wanted to take a HUGE hit on the value of your credits. Bottom line, it was historically known that these were their own little places. WHEN the coal mined out, When the individual companies in each of these places faded out, people would say, oh yes, they are a neighborhood, BUT in reality, in civil matters or an actual map, no. I have to date never ever seen a map, from the state or any county that explicitly stated, oh they are part of Gary etc etc. Coal town guy (talk) 23:38, 11 August 2014 (UTC)
I understand what you mean, but at the present time all of them are within Gary's city limits; they can definitely have separate identities in historical contexts and in the mind of the man-on-the-street, but as we're going by legal status, we have to depend on Google's boundaries unless we have reason to believe that they've made a mistake somewhere. However, it's not just a Google thing: Elbert, Filbert, and Thorpe are depicted in the city limits by USGS topographical maps. If you go to Gary on and set it on topo mode, you'll see the city limits (dashed lines, e.g. the ones at N 37.34839 W 81.54336) extending down to Filbert and east of Thorpe. My Census Bureau map of Gary (final page of this document) depicts city limits functionally identical to the ones shown by Google, so I don't think we can say that Google's in error here. Nyttend (talk) 00:25, 12 August 2014 (UTC)
AGREED...Found an excellent ref, and want to ask, what do we do??...Here s why, According to the book,U.S. Steel and Gary, West Virginia: Corporate Paternalism in Appalachia, they were formerly independant, BUT part of the condition for Gary to incorporate was to make them part and parcel of Gary. Which they did in 1971. Since they were at one time independant and a few have current post offices, how do we handle that?? In my opinion it would be a misnomer to say they are a neighborhood especially since they were independant, is it possible to make them historical places or in some way designate they were actual places before Gary was incorporated??? Coal town guy (talk) 00:29, 12 August 2014 (UTC)
"Historical places" — I'm really only familiar with two usages of this phrase (both of which would be wrong): either what the GNIS means by (historical), i.e. a ghost town, or a community that's really historic, and I doubt that's what you mean. Could you give an example of what you're thinking of adding to the article? Not trying to say "don't be bold", as I won't complain if you start editing these articles; it's just that I can't answer you properly because I'm not clear what you're suggesting. PS, I'm left wondering whether the following text might be kind-of what you're thinking as an intro. Wilcoe is a mining community within the city limits of Gary, WV, US. Does this work? Nyttend (talk) 00:47, 12 August 2014 (UTC)
Correct, it can not be a "historical" place under GNIS, I know one still has an active post office, HOWEVER, a former coal town within the limits of Gary is probably the most accurate descriptor.The rub as it were would be how to categorize it. Would it be in the county template as an unincorporated community as I cant say, its a ghost town??........I will edit the locations with that intro for sure. The neighborhood thing is not accurate as a descriptorCoal town guy (talk) 01:16, 12 August 2014 (UTC)
No, it still wouldn't go on the county template: the whole point of those is to show current municipalities and current locations outside municipal limits. In states with townships, we don't list former townships, and when municipality A annexes municipality B, we don't include B — for example, that's why {{Hamilton County, Ohio}} doesn't include Mill Creek Township, Hamilton County, Ohio or Spring Grove Village, Cincinnati. In the same way, when an unincorporated area gets annexed, we don't include it, because it's already on there via the municipal article. They all should go into Category:Neighborhoods in West Virginia, since it's meant for everything that's part of a municipality, whether historically-freestanding towns or Wheeling's East End. Nyttend (talk) 01:24, 12 August 2014 (UTC)
AHA, I got it! I can edit the City of Gary article, remove the individual places from the template, I like the above because its a rather good example of how to approach itCoal town guy (talk) 01:41, 12 August 2014 (UTC)
Should have all of the edits complete by tomorrow, I did however get them off of the county template. I wanted to say thanks to you for helping out here. I want to be able to address these places properly.Coal town guy (talk) 01:45, 12 August 2014 (UTC)

Mooreville, Mississippi[edit]

I hope you're having a great summer! I was asked to have a look at these four census-designated places and created articles where I could. I started with Mooresville, Mississippi and I'm already stumped. Mooreville, Mississippi (no "S") is an unincorporated community in Lee County (GNIS), and Mooresville, Mississippi (GNIS) is a CDP in Lee County at the same geo-coordinates (the "S" somehow got added to new article, but it's just a variant of "Mooreville"). Complicating this is that the Mooreville (CDP) listing on GNIS also lists another place called "Evergreen", though Evergreen has no GNIS listing in Lee County and is not on ACME topo.

Would you suggest the following:

Or, should the text on the Wiki article state that it is both an unincorporated community and a CDP? Thanks! Magnolia677 (talk) 20:25, 17 August 2014 (UTC)

(talk page stalker) It looks like the Census Bureau either misspelled the name or is using an alternate spelling, but it's pretty clear that Mooreville and "Mooresville" are the same place. I'd suggest you do what you suggested above, though it might be worth mentioning that Mooreville is both a CDP and an unincorporated community (since while all CDPs are unincorporated, some aren't communities in the traditional sense). As for "Evergreen", that looks like it's just the name of another topographic map, which is in turn named after a nearby place in Itawamba County. TheCatalyst31 ReactionCreation 20:50, 17 August 2014 (UTC)
Thanks! Magnolia677 (talk) 21:43, 17 August 2014 (UTC)
I could be very wrong but I thought evergreen was a very old district name. But yup, s or no s it's the same place. Is there any reference stating which is correct? I can't look at this time but gnis May have a form at the details listing of the accepted entry. I start PT tomorrow. So I should be back to snuff soon. Coal town guy (talk) 01:06, 18 August 2014 (UTC)
AHA, Mooresville is an accepted name variant, [LOOKY LOOKY]....Hope this is not old hat for some of you, I will of course taker a look at the Factfinder to see if its still a CDP or notCoal town guy (talk) 15:31, 19 August 2014 (UTC)
Mooreville, is a CDP. [here], at least as far as 2013 data, did you want to edit this for the article??Coal town guy (talk) 15:37, 19 August 2014 (UTC)
Hey there. Would you have a moment to make the edit? If not I can do it on the weekend. Thanks! Magnolia677 (talk) 22:11, 19 August 2014 (UTC)
More here and here. I can add this in a few days if you're busy. Magnolia677 (talk) 22:21, 19 August 2014 (UTC)

The Signpost: 13 August 2014[edit]

You're welcome[edit]

We definitely need a button for thanking someone for thanking them for the edit... not sure where that would end, though. Well just two things, thanks for all your work -- I see you got an Editor of the Week, very nice -- but also, I wonder why it is named Peanut. Herostratus (talk) 20:40, 19 August 2014 (UTC)

The Signpost: 20 August 2014[edit]

Clarksville, Mississippi[edit]

Have a peek at Clarksville, Mississippi. Long forgotten, like so many coal towns, if not for Wikipedia. Magnolia677 (talk) 01:39, 27 August 2014 (UTC)

Do you know of any online source of a map showing the community in relation to others? If so, I could send an entry nom to GNISCoal town guy (talk) 19:57, 27 August 2014 (UTC)

Yes:[8], [9], [10], [11]. Thanks! Magnolia677 (talk) 21:36, 27 August 2014 (UTC)

Got it, I can contact GNIS as it was is close vicinity to Pinckneyville. It will be anywhere from 5 to 10 days for them to note it. (talk) 03:24, 28 August 2014 (UTC)

Coal town guy (talk) 03:26, 28 August 2014 (UTC)

The Signpost: 27 August 2014[edit]

Adamsville, West Virginia[edit]

Hi-I came across Adamsville, West Virginia in Harrison County-GNIS-1534808-thanks-RFD (talk) 18:14, 31 August 2014 (UTC)

YAAAY, got it, Many thanks!Coal town guy (talk) 00:53, 1 September 2014 (UTC)

GNIS-new additions-access[edit]

Hi-How do I access GNIS to check for any new additions about places, communities, ghost towns, etc., involving Wisconsin (or elsewhere)? I had to use the Wisconsin Hometown Locator to go through each county, etc., and takes a long time to go through the hometown locator. Many thanks-RFD (talk) 13:01, 1 September 2014 (UTC)

The best way is to search all populated places or locals for a county and sort by entry date. I understand for Wisconsin thats a deal, BUT if you do the same search for ALL popultaed places or locals without specifying a county, the return will be large and take quite a bit of time to sort. I checked WV the other night, all of the new entries were ones that I submitted ;-)Coal town guy (talk) 22:42, 1 September 2014 (UTC)

The Signpost: 03 September 2014[edit]

The Signpost: 10 September 2014[edit]

The Signpost: 17 September 2014[edit]

Ona, West Virginia[edit]

Hey there. A while back I added this link to the Ona article. The Kennedy brothers spent some time in West Virginia, and there are some fascinating pictures. Most seem to be copyrighted, but I've been trying to hunt down others that are public domain. Most presidential shots are formal and staged, but the West Virginia shots all show them just hanging out at some coffee shop, or standing outside a mine. Also, way back I added something to the Cleveland, Mississippi article, about when Robert compared the poverty in WV to that in Mississippi. He in fact was referring to McDowell County, but I can't seem to track down my source. On a personal note, having been to both Cleveland and Welch in the past year, two more beautiful cities you could not find. Anyway, I'm on the hunt for some public domain Kennedy photos. I think they'd add a lot to some WV articles. Cheers. Magnolia677 (talk) 09:03, 18 September 2014 (UTC)

Food for thought, Kennedy also visited Bramwell, West Virginia and Slab Fork, West Virginia. The tree he stood at in Bramwell still stands, its down from the post officeCoal town guy (talk) 14:15, 18 September 2014 (UTC)

The Signpost: 24 September 2014[edit]

The Center Line: Summer 2014[edit]

The Center Line header.svg
Volume 7, Issue 3 • Summer 2014 • About the Newsletter
State and national updates
  • None submitted
ArchivesNewsroomFull IssueShortcut: WP:USRD/NEWS
MediaWiki message delivery (talk) on behalf of Imzadi1979, 21:50, 30 September 2014 (UTC)

The Signpost: 01 October 2014[edit]

VisualEditor newsletter—September and October 2014[edit]

Did you know?

TemplateData is a separate program that organizes information about the parameters that can be used in a template. VisualEditor reads that data, and uses it to populate its simplified template dialogs.

With the new TemplateData editor, it is easier to add information about parameters, because the ones you need to use are pre-loaded.

See the help page for TemplateData for more information about adding TemplateData. The user guide has information about how to use VisualEditor.

Since the last newsletter, the Editing team has reduced technical debt, simplified some workflows for template and citation editing, made major progress on Internet Explorer support, and fixed over 125 bugs and requests. Several performance improvements were made, especially to the system around re-using references and reference lists. Weekly updates are posted on

There were three issues that required urgent fixes: a deployment error that meant that many buttons didn't work correctly (bugs 69856 and 69864), a problem with edit conflicts that left the editor with nowhere to go (bug 69150), and a problem in Internet Explorer 11 that caused replaced some categories with a link to the system message, MediaWiki:Badtitletext (bug 70894) when you saved. The developers apologize for the disruption, and thank the people who reported these problems quickly.

Increased support for devices and browsers[edit]

Internet Explorer 10 and 11 users now have access to VisualEditor. This means that about 5% of Wikimedia's users will now get an "Edit" tab alongside the existing "Edit source" tab. Support for Internet Explorer 9 is planned for the future.

Tablet users browsing the site's mobile mode now have the option of using a mobile-specific form of VisualEditor. More editing tools, and availability of VisualEditor on smartphones, is planned for the future. The mobile version of VisualEditor was tweaked to show the context menu for citations instead of basic references (bug 68897). A bug that broke the editor in iOS was corrected and released early (bug 68949). For mobile tablet users, three bugs related to scrolling were fixed (bug 66697bug 68828bug 69630). You can use VisualEditor on the mobile version of Wikipedia from your tablet by clicking on the cog in the top-right when editing a page and choosing which editor to use.

TemplateData editor[edit]

A tool for editing TemplateData will be deployed to more Wikipedias soon.  Other Wikipedias and some other projects may receive access next month. This tool makes it easier to add TemplateData to the template's documentation.  When the tool is enabled, it will add a button above every editing window for a template (including documentation subpages). To use it, edit the template or a subpage, and then click the "Manage TemplateData" button at the top.  Read the help page for TemplateData. You can test the TemplateData editor in a sandbox at Remember that TemplateData should be placed either on a documentation subpage or on the template page itself. Only one block of TemplateData will be used per template.

Other changes[edit]

Several interface messages and labels were changed to be simpler, clearer, or shorter, based on feedback from translators and editors. The formatting of dialogs was changed, and more changes to the appearance will be coming soon, when VisualEditor implements the new MediaWiki theme from Design. (A preview of the theme is available on Labs for developers.) The team also made some improvements for users of the Monobook skin that improved the size of text in toolbars and fixed selections that overlapped menus.

VisualEditor-MediaWiki now supplies the mw-redirect or mw-disambig class on links to redirects and disambiguation pages, so that user gadgets that colour in these in types of links can be created.

Templates' fields can be marked as 'required' in TemplateData. If a parameter is marked as required, then you cannot delete that field when you add a new template or edit an existing one (bug 60358). 

Language support improved by making annotations use bi-directional isolation (so they display correctly with cursoring behaviour as expected) and by fixing a bug that crashed VisualEditor when trying to edit a page with a dir attribute but no lang set (bug 69955).

Looking ahead[edit]

The team posts details about planned work on the VisualEditor roadmap. The VisualEditor team plans to add auto-fill features for citations soon, perhaps in late October.

The team is also working on support for adding rows and columns to tables, and early work for this may appear within the month. Please comment on the design at

In the future, real-time collaborative editing may be possible in VisualEditor. Some early preparatory work for this was recently done.

Supporting your wiki[edit]

At Wikimania, several developers gave presentations about VisualEditor. A translation sprint focused on improving access to VisualEditor was supported by many people. Deryck Chan was the top translator. Special honors also go to संजीव कुमार (Sanjeev Kumar), Robby, Takot, Bachounda, Bjankuloski06 and Ата. A summary of the work achieved by the translation community has been posted here. Thank you all for your work.

VisualEditor can be made available to most non-Wikipedia projects. If your community would like to test VisualEditor, please contact product manager James Forrester or file an enhancement request in Bugzilla.

Please join the office hours on Saturday, 18 October 2014 at 18:00 UTC (daytime for the Americas; evening for Africa and Europe) and on Wednesday, 19 November at 16:00 UTC on IRC.

Give feedback on VisualEditor at mw:VisualEditor/Feedback. Subscribe or unsubscribe at Meta. To help with translations, please subscribe to the Translators mailing list or contact Elitre at Meta. Thank you!

Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 00:10, 8 October 2014 (UTC)

The Signpost: 08 October 2014[edit]

Talkback from Eman235[edit]

Nuvola apps edu languages.svg
Hello, Coal town guy. You have new messages at Eman235's talk page.
Message added 05:25, 14 October 2014 (UTC). You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.

Eman235/talk 05:25, 14 October 2014 (UTC)

KY counties[edit]

Don't worry; it's not what you think. See the "Badges" section of d:Wikidata:Development plan; this kind of thing is now being handled by Wikidata. Apparently the FA/FL stars will be managed by someone (or a bot) over at that site, although of course here we're going to retain control over what content is featured; we'll simply pass it along to Wikidata for processing. I'm guessing that this is intended to merge FA/GA stars at top right and in the interwiki links on the bottom left; with a single button click at Wikidata, a new FA will get its star, and all other Wikipedia articles about the subject will immediately have the English article marked as an FA. Nyttend (talk) 14:24, 15 October 2014 (UTC)

The Signpost: 15 October 2014[edit]

The Signpost: 22 October 2014[edit]

The Signpost: 29 October 2014[edit]

Nada, Ky.[edit]

Hello, Coal town guy. A while back, I wrote an article about the Nada Tunnel, in Powell County, Kentucky. Ever since then, I can't seem to find any solid references for the red link Nada, Kentucky (a few pages link to it). I've been through Nada so I know that a small town is there but it doesn't appear on the GNIS website, even though the community is apparently mentioned in the NRHP. Do you have access to a source stating that Nada is in fact an unincorporated place so that we can start the Nada article? Either way, thanks for looking into it.- Gilliam (talk) 10:22, 1 November 2014 (UTC)

Okay, I created it. Thanks for the Lombard tip. I added what I could and will try to improve.- Gilliam (talk) 22:42, 1 November 2014 (UTC)

VisualEditor newsletter—November 2014[edit]

Screenshot on an iPad, showing how to switch from one editor to the other
Did you know?

VisualEditor is also available on the mobile version of Wikipedia. Login and click the pencil icon to open the page you want to edit. Click on the gear-shaped settings in the upper-right corner, to pick which editor to use. Choose "Edit" to use VisualEditor, or "Edit source" to use the wikitext editor.

It will remember whether you used wikitext or VisualEditor, and use the same editor the next time you edit an article.

The user guide has information about how to use VisualEditor. Not all features are available in Mobile Web.

Since the last newsletter, the Editing Team has fixed many bugs and requests, and worked on support for editing tables and for using non-Latin languages. Their weekly updates are posted on Informal notes from the recent quarterly review were posted on Meta.

Recent improvements[edit]

The French Wikipedia should see better search results for links, templates, and media because the new search engine was turned on for everyone there. This change is expected at the Chinese and German Wikipedias next week, and eventually at the English Wikipedia.

The "pawn" system has been mostly replaced. Bugs in this system sometimes added a chess pawn character to wikitext. The replacement provides better support for non-Latin languages, with full support hopefully coming soon.

VisualEditor is now provided to editors who use Internet Explorer 10 or 11 on desktop and mobile devices. Internet Explorer 9 is not supported yet.

The keyboard shortcuts for items in the toolbar's menus are now shown in the menus. VisualEditor will replace the existing design with a new theme from the User Experience / Design group. The appearance of dialogs has already changed in one Mobile version. The appearance on desktops will change soon. (You can see a developer preview of the old "Apex" design and the new "MediaWiki" theme which will replace it.)

Several bugs were fixed for internal and external links. Improvements to MediaWiki's search solved an annoying problem: If you searched for the full name of the page or file that you wanted to link, sometimes the search program could not find the page. A link inside a template, to a local page that does not exist, will now show red, exactly as it does when reading the page. Due to a error, for about two weeks this also affected all external links inside templates. Opening an auto-numbered link node like [12] with the keyboard used to open the wrong link tool. These problems have all been fixed.


The tool for quickly editing TemplateData will be deployed to all Wikimedia Foundation wikis on Thursday, 6 November.  This tool is already available on the biggest 40 Wikipedias, and now all wikis will have access to it. This tool makes it easier to add TemplateData to the template's documentation.  When the tool is enabled, it will add a button above every editing window for a template (including documentation subpages). To use it, edit the template or a subpage, and then click the "Manage TemplateData" button at the top.  Read the help page for TemplateData. You can test the TemplateData editor in a sandbox at Remember that TemplateData should be placed either on a documentation subpage or on the template page itself. Only one block of TemplateData will be used per template.

You can use the new autovalue setting to pre-load a value into a template. This can be used to substitute dates, as in this example, or to add the most common response for that parameter. The autovalue can be easily overridden by the editor, by typing something else in the field.

In TemplateData, you may define a parameter as "required". The template dialog in VisualEditor will warn editors if they leave a "required" parameter empty, and they will not be able to delete that parameter. If the template can function without this parameter, then please mark it as "suggested" or "optional" in TemplateData instead.

Looking ahead[edit]

Basic support for inserting tables and changing the number of rows and columns in tables will appear next Wednesday. Advanced features, like dragging columns to different places, will be possible later. The VisualEditor team plans to add auto-fill features for citations soon. To help editors find the most important items more quickly, some items in the toolbar menus will be hidden behind a "More" item, such as "underlining" in the styling menu. The appearance of the media search dialog will improve, to make picking between possible images easier and more visual. The team posts details about planned work on the VisualEditor roadmap.

The user guide will be updated soon to add information about editing tables. The translations for most languages except Spanish, French, and Dutch are significantly out of date. Please help complete the current translations for users who speak your language. Talk to us if you need help exporting the translated guide to your wiki.

You can influence VisualEditor's design. Tell the VisualEditor team what you want changed during the office hours via IRC. The next sessions are on Wednesday, 19 November at 16:00 UTC and on Wednesday 7 January 2015 at 22:00 UTC. You can also share your ideas at mw:VisualEditor/Feedback.

Also, user experience researcher Abbey Ripstra is looking for editors to show her how they edit Wikipedia. Please sign up for the research program if you would like to hear about opportunities.

If you would like to help with translations of this newsletter, please subscribe to the Translators mailing list or contact us directly, so that we can notify you when the next issue is ready. Subscribe or unsubscribe at Wikipedia:VisualEditor/Newsletter. Thank you!

Whatamidoing (WMF) 20:41, 6 November 2014 (UTC)

The Signpost: 05 November 2014[edit]

The Signpost: 12 November 2014[edit]

The Signpost: 26 November 2014[edit]

George Crumb[edit]

The rules are pretty unambiguous: we reject claims of fair use for images of living people, unless the image itself is significant. For example, we permit one of Bibi Aisha because she's only famous for being in a specific nonfree picture; we show the picture because it's really the most important part of her biography, and nobody except family and acquaintances would have heard of her if not for the picture. Just an average picture being used for ID is essentially never permitted; the only exceptions that I can remember are one of J.D. Salinger, used in his article before his death (he was such a recluse that it was deemed irreplaceable; this 1950 photo was apparently his last public appearance, even though he lived until 2010), and some guy (don't remember who) that had been sentenced to lots of life sentences in a high-security prison, and we concluded that nobody except for the prison photographer was going to be able to get a photo.

My best suggestion is that you find a decent photo and contact the photographer to request a copyright release. The easiest way to do this is often through Flickr, especially since changing the license there just requires the click of a button. Perhaps you could contact grupocatorceb and request a change of license on this picture? You could say something like "I'm trying to improve his Wikipedia article,, but I couldn't find any copyright-acceptable pictures of him. Would you be willing to help us by changing the license on your picture to CC-by or CC-by-sa?" Nyttend (talk) 05:15, 6 December 2014 (UTC)

The Signpost: 03 December 2014[edit]

Your two cents[edit]

You may be interested in this discussion. Magnolia677 (talk) 00:54, 10 December 2014 (UTC)

The Signpost: 10 December 2014[edit]

The Signpost: 17 December 2014[edit]

VisualEditor newsletter—December 2014[edit]

Screenshot showing how to add or remove columns from a table

Did you know?

Basic table editing is now available in VisualEditor. You can add and remove rows and columns from existing tables at the click of a button.

The user guide has more information about how to use VisualEditor.

Since the last newsletter, the Editing Team has fixed many bugs and worked on table editing and performance. Their weekly status reports are posted on Upcoming plans are posted at the VisualEditor roadmap.

VisualEditor was deployed to several hundred remaining wikis as an opt-in beta feature at the end of November, except for most Wiktionaries (which depend heavily upon templates) and all Wikisources (which await integration with ProofreadPage).

Recent improvements[edit]

Basic support for editing tables is available. You can insert new tables, add and remove rows and columns, set or remove a caption for a table, and merge cells together. To change the contents of a cell, double-click inside it. More features will be added in the coming months. In addition, VisualEditor now ignores broken, invalid rowspan and colspan elements, instead of trying to repair them.

You can now use find and replace in VisualEditor, reachable through the tool menu or by pressing ⌃ Ctrl+F or ⌘ Cmd+F.

You can now create and edit simple <blockquote> paragraphs for quoting and indenting content. This changes a "Paragraph" into a "Block quote".

Some new keyboard sequences can be used to format content. At the start of the line, typing "*  " will make the line a bullet list; "1.  " or "# " will make it a numbered list; "==" will make it a section heading; ": " will make it a blockquote. If you didn't mean to use these tools, you can press undo to undo the formatting change. There are also two other keyboard sequences: "[[" for opening the link tool, and "{{" for opening the template tool, to help experienced editors. The existing standard keyboard shortcuts, like ⌃ Ctrl+K to open the link editor, still work.

If you add a category that has been redirected, then VisualEditor now adds its target. Categories without description pages show up as red.

You can again create and edit galleries as wikitext code.

Looking ahead[edit]

VisualEditor will replace the existing design with a new theme designed by the User Experience group. The new theme will be visible for desktop systems at in late December and at other sites early January. (You can see a developer preview of the old "Apex" theme and the new "MediaWiki" one which will replace it.)

The Editing team plans to add auto-fill features for citations in January. Planned changes to the media search dialog will make choosing between possible images easier.


If you would like to help with translations of this newsletter, please subscribe to the Translators mailing list or contact us directly, so that we can notify you when the next issue is ready. Subscribe or unsubscribe at Meta.

Thank you! WhatamIdoing (WMF) (talk) 23:37, 20 December 2014 (UTC)