User talk:Drmies

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Dutch cuisine[edit]

Blue Tongue.jpg
This is how I would crop it.
Haring 03.jpg

This is how WE illustrate the Dutch cuisine here on Wikipedia... Hafspajen (talk) 23:06, 25 June 2014 (UTC)

  • Bleh. Raw onions and the smell of herring. Not good. Drmies (talk) 14:45, 26 June 2014 (UTC)
It seems that this is the Dutch cuisine talk page... Is there anything, besides Drmies' personal dislike of raw onions and herring, really wrong with the image? Perhaps the moustache? - Takeaway (talk) 23:17, 26 June 2014 (UTC)
I prefer the Rollmops. Face-smile.svg The Banner talk 23:28, 26 June 2014 (UTC) Did somebody serve kroketten, Bitterballen or frikandellen?
Well, the composition. Because the man's face (eyes, and so on) is not visble, only the big gap, tounge and moustache and the - fish. It is kinda scary, especially in high resolution. Also the herring and the mans face and hand have the same colour. It is backed up with the colour of the garment, and all this emphasize the gap. . Hafspajen (talk) 23:19, 26 June 2014 (UTC)
" --fish" is nice coming from someone whose culture eats gravlax. BTW, I've never had a frikandel, though I'd pay some good money for a Kwekkeboom kroket. Or one from Van Dobben--I don't want to appear too picky. Drmies (talk) 23:54, 26 June 2014 (UTC)
Klanten bij een haringkar.jpg
We don't eat gravlax upside down. Hafspajen (talk) 23:56, 26 June 2014 (UTC)
The man's face is only partially shown because I didn't want to deal with privacy rights. The moustache came with the man. The tongue comes with eating herring this way (I already threw out the photos of lips squishing down onto the soft, oily fish). That the man's skin colour is similar to the colour of the fish is unfortunate but unless I can find someone of perhaps African descent eating a herring this way, that will always be the case. The gap formed between arm, fish and face is a result of the aforementioned and tends to only distract people who view an image as if it were a piece of abstract art: you see it and I see it but hardly anyone else does. The reason to include this image is to show that many Dutch people, unlike elsewhere, do indeed eat their fish "upside down", and that it isn't a very aesthetically pleasing thing to witness up close for the uninitiated. But hey, that's Dutch cuisine for you.... - Takeaway (talk) 13:54, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
Can we use this image instead? Hafspajen (talk) 14:28, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
I'd thought of using that image, just as I'd thought about using this one. Both images don't show the fish in detail. - Takeaway (talk) 14:41, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
Blame the fish... but can't you take a separate picture on the fish on a plate? Hafspajen (talk) 14:48, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
You could of course take a separate photo of the fish on a plate but that wouldn't really be the same as seeing a slightly rotted down Dutch style herring with chopped raw onions ready to slide into someone's mouth, would it? Perhaps you shouldn't be hanging around at the Dutch cuisine article so much? - Takeaway (talk) 14:55, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
Was working on that article before you started, you know. And this picture brings back the memories of Grandad, why do you have such a big nose? Why do you have so big teeth? Hafspajen (talk) 15:00, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
So images such as this one and this one didn't make you feel squeamish but a close-up of someone eating a herring the Dutch way does? Every cuisine in the world has things that seem strange, and even disgusting, to others, but is that a reason to not show it here on Wikipedia? - Takeaway (talk) 20:37, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
This is a far better picture than the guy who has half his face cut off.

Xanthomelanoussprog, Drmies, Crisco 1492, Yngvadottir, Dennis Brown, Kelapstick, Gerda Arendt, LadyofShalott Mandarax, Viriditas, De728631, Dougweller - and any other page stalkers - do you think this picture above should be used in Dutch cuisine? Hafspajen (talk) 20:43, 27 June 2014 (UTC)

  • Being a redneck from North Carolina (and Texas originally), I would be the wrong one to ask. Where I come from, that is what we call "bait". Dennis Brown |  | WER 20:51, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
  • Think it's okay- but then I've been watching in the news how Uruguayans eat their food, so maybe I've become a bit desensitised. Face-smile.svg Xanthomelanoussprog (talk) 20:53, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
I may nominate it for Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates‎, so you all can hear what the professionals say about low quality pictures... Hafspajen (talk) 20:56, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
Oh, don't assert yourselves with all that rotten fish you manage to eat and see, we Swedes eat ever worse things, right, like Surströmming. The tounge picture is of bad quality, that is the problem. And there is better to use. Hafspajen (talk) 21:15, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
Hafspayen, you might want to nominate the badly focussed, or oversharpened, or white-balance-what's-that?, or the-built-in-flash-is-fine-for-food, or the 300x176px images that you apparently did feel to be of high enough quality first. Face-smile.svg - Takeaway (talk) 21:20, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
  • I was shocked that Swedes eat crawdads cold, blech.... I wonder if you suck the heads or not? Dennis Brown |  | WER 21:24, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
(edit conflict)I tell you, Takeaway, what the problem is, and why you go on fighting for this picture. Because it is your own picture. And yes, Dennis, it is sad with the craydish. Swedes eat very strang things sometimes. Hafspajen (talk) 21:26, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
  • I was called but have no idea of Dutch cuisine. To caller: I added a ref to the composer, a pdf, it has a short paragraph in Swedish about a string quartet (at the end). I got the place of premiere. If anything else is worth mentioning, feel free to add, just double the ref name.
Gerda, you are doing a great job. I will look once more. Hafspajen (talk) 21:29, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
There doesn't seem much of a problem, really. The only problem here Hafspayen, is that the photo disgusts you for whatever reason. It doesn't seem at all to be the bad quality because you easily accept photos that show much worse quality. So please play nice... - Takeaway (talk) 21:39, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
This is how I would crop it.
  • I guess I never realized we were actually talking about inclusion. Takeaway's picture is not bad at all. I do kind of miss the rest of the guy's head, though, and if it had had a less distracting background it'd be great. But it shows detail that the others don't, and that's useful. Those guys standing together by the herring cart, well, the essence of eating herring is not that it's a social event (it's not), and the one guy is better looking but the detail is lacking. I do appreciate everyone's interest in the matter and while I dislike the onions, I have started to eat maatjesharing, if only because I feel I should, and it didn't make me puke. Thanks, Drmies (talk) 22:05, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
  • Ok, now I will butt in. Both photos aren't perfect. The top photo is a bit over cropped, but the other one NEEDS cropping. Are we trying to show the environment or the method of eating? Knock around 25% off the top, bottom and right, plus 10% off the left, then it might be the better picture, without all the distracting background. Right now, you can't even tell it is a fish at thumbnail resolution. Dennis Brown |  | WER 22:03, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
    • I just cropped and worked on the contrast a bit, then uploaded it here locally. Use it or don't, it won't break my heart. Dennis Brown |  | WER 22:14, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
OK, here is the deal, Takeaway. If you graciously chuck that half faced man, I can go through your pictures and see, if I can nominate something for Featured picture‎; (if I find any). As for Hafspayen, it is Hafspajen. Copy and paste works for most. And Dennis crop is simply brilliant. Great picture, great balance. Both arms forms triangles, the white of the box repeat itself in the white text area, and the composition works great. Hafspajen (talk) 22:12, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
  • I'm just sad that the guy in Takeaway's photo has a shirt like that. C&A is toch voordeliger, of course, but man, what those Dutch wives put their husbands in... Takeaway, I assume that's not you in the picture, with a herring selfie? Or your husband, maybe? If so, my apologies. Drmies (talk) 22:29, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
    Herring selfie is a red link, Doc, looks like you have another DYK to earn. Dennis Brown |  | WER 22:34, 27 June 2014 (UTC)

I thought the extent of Dutch cuisine was those chocolate sprinkly things they're so obsessed by. Every time I've been to the Netherlands I've looked out for the nearest Chinese restaurant. Dutch beer is OK though. Eric Corbett 22:35, 27 June 2014 (UTC)

Sorry, but are you proposing a deal on an admin's talk page Hafspajen??? :O Lol! I really don't feel the need to have any of my photos nominated as a featured picture here on Wikipedia. I also think that the image with the "better looking man" lacks detail in the fish but on the other hand, if you look closely, you can see half chewed herring inside his mouth and something seems not completely correct with one of his molars. Nope, neither a herring selfie nor my hubby. I don't know who's hubby he is actually, if anyone's. - Takeaway (talk) 22:41, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
Take it or leave it. It was meant like nice gesture, but your ways are making it impossible to be nice with you. Hafspajen (talk) 22:52, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
Thank you so much for your kind words Hafspajen. So very civil of you. - Takeaway (talk) 23:06, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
By the way, one of the reasons for lopping off so much of the man's face in the first image was because I didn't want to deal with any privacy issues here on Wikipedia. What about the photo of Mr. Goodlooking? Did he give permission to have his image used or are we just assuming that everything's O.K.? - Takeaway (talk) 22:49, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
You're thinking of Personality rights, not privacy. And from this photo, I doubt you could pick this guy out of a crowd (very similar to the first photo in that respect), and he seems to be intentionally posing for the photo (which is less certain in the first photo). My guess is that we are safe here. Either way, I don't care what photo if any that you use, but policy isn't a bar here. Dennis Brown |  | WER 23:02, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
It is you who are not arguing about facts, but has to drag in comments like Perhaps you shouldn't be hanging around at the Dutch cuisine article so much, and The only problem here Hafspayen and proposing a deal on an admin's talk page Hafspajen??? :O Lol! and Hafspayen, you might want to nominate the badly focussed, or oversharpened, or white-balance-what's-that? and this kind of comments and edit summaries like thx Hafspa'''j'''en. And when I am telling you that it is not very nice, you go and tell me that I am the uncivil? Come on. Hafspajen (talk) 23:31, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
Thank you so very much again Hafspajen. All your comments have only been nice and reasonable. - Takeaway (talk) 23:38, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
No, you don't get it. I am telling you that the picture is wrong, and you are telling me that I am as a person all wrong. Now that's a difference. Hafspajen (talk) 23:40, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
I'm so sorry that I don't get it. I must be much more stupid than you are. - Takeaway (talk) 23:43, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
You might want to reconsider calling another editor stupid. I've been blocked for far less. Eric Corbett 23:50, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
Oops. I meant to say that I must be way less smart than Hafspajen is. Sometimes I'm just too much in a hurry when typing things. - Takeaway (talk) 23:53, 27 June 2014 (UTC)

Copula (linguistics)[edit]

Hello, Drmies. I have just removed your last two additions to Copula (linguistics). I don't think that the definitions of "linking verb" in those two grammar textbooks constitute a significant controversy in the understanding of the English copula. It looks more like slightly different uses or explanations of the term complement rather than substantive disagreement about the term linking verb or the nature of the copula (though I haven't actually read the books you cited yet). If you disagree, maybe we can hash it out at Talk:Copula (linguistics). Happy editing, Cnilep (talk) 01:56, 26 June 2014 (UTC)

  • Cnilep, what controversy? I added detail on what grammars say a "linking verb" does. That one textbook recognizes two kinds of complement and another adds a third is ancillary: what matters is that the reader gets a broader idea of "linking verb" than what the current section gives, which is nothing except for some forms of "to be". Are you aware that there is no article for "linking verb", that English verbs has nothing on the topic, and that Wikipedia is read by a whole bunch of students who are not professors on linguistics, and maybe would like to know what a "linking verb" is and does? I have the feeling that you (and a colleague from the linguistics project) aren't really interested in what Wikipedia can do for the average reader. You may not know this, unless you have children in the US school system, but nobody knows what a "copula" is. Millions of schoolchildren are raised with the concept of "linking verb", however, which redirects to your copula. As for your "complement" suggestion--that article is already owned by someone. Drmies (talk) 02:45, 26 June 2014 (UTC)
Although the word controversy sometimes describes an argument or fight, the word (also) means "holding different ideas". If "one textbook recognizes two kinds" while "another adds a third", that is controversy in the sense I meant the word. Sorry if I was unclear; I was thinking in terms of WP:NPOV, which suggests that articles should treat "all significant viewpoints". I was thinking that it said something about major viewpoints and significant controversies, but I don't see that now.
That said, I suspect that the two authors don't actually hold such different ideas. A bit I removed said, "But while some grammar books recognize only those two types, English allows for predicate prepositional phrases as well". What I imagine (though as I said, I haven't read Lester's book) is that Lester may not have intended to argue that predicate adjectives and predicate nouns are the only types of complements English linking verbs allow. If he does, that seems like a rather odd view since, as you say, other kinds of phrases can also be complements.
I am well aware that the vast majority of people interested in language have no particular interest in the specific terms of art that linguists use. I was not aware that the traditional-grammar usage of "linking verb" is not treated on Wikipedia. That can be fixed; I'll be happy to work with you (or, come to that, on my own) to add content to the current redirect page.
By the way, I recently rewrote the page Traditional grammar. If you would care to give it a quick reading, your opinions on which parts are most in need of clarification or improvement would be helpful. Happy editing, Cnilep (talk) 04:40, 26 June 2014 (UTC)
I've moved your sentences to Linking verb and made a few additions. Cnilep (talk) 05:11, 26 June 2014 (UTC)
  • Now that's progress. Thank you. I'm a bit miffed because of what you see in the history of Complement. I strongly disagree with the tenor of that article and the reasons for the revert--as a grammarian I simply can't stand for the "fulfill the meaning" kind of stuff. Your rephrasing to "in addition" is fine with me, thanks.

    My concern with our linguistics coverage is that all of the articles I've looked at related to this matter is highly technical. I'm teaching Advanced English Grammar this summer, and for most of that audience (English and Education majors, senior and graduate students; our text is Huddleston and Pullum) our articles are way too technical, practically incomprehensible (I tried it out in class), so imagine what it's like for the reader without that background--I think you can understand that since you taught some regular US students, I surmise. It's for them also that we should write. Coming from a dependency-grammatical descriptive background I have great problems with books such as Lester's (don't bother getting a copy unless you're going to teach high school, maybe--and he does say, "there are two types of subject complements") though even that is a leap forward compared to the treatment of grammar in most other US K-12 books I've seen, but to treat (as basic treatment) all this stuff based on valence is simply too complex and theoretical for the average reader. I wish to find a middle way, a proper treatment (by which I mean properly descriptive based on current theory) that is accessible to a reader with a high school or basic college education. I think with your Linking verb you are striking such a balance, and I thank you for that. Drmies (talk) 14:56, 26 June 2014 (UTC)

  • BTW, (your) Traditional grammar looks like a very fine piece of work. I can see some room for expansion, in citing more of these morphosyntactic examples (the treatment of prepositions and subordinators is always a litmus test) and in pointing out where and how such treatments fall short, for instance in theories of the predicate. But the history section is a good start for many students--though it seems to me that while "The primacy of Latin in traditional grammar persisted until the beginning of the 20th century" is accurate, the indirect influence of that method persists, at least in the US educational system: even if the teaching of grammar is often marginal (and typically done in the context of writing, really in the context of AP writing) the very tenets of the traditional Latin-based grammar persist--in the primacy of part of speech, in the incorporation of semantic arguments rather than syntactic proof, in usage prescription under the guise of grammatical validity. That is something worth stressing, I think, to make that foundational connection clear. You know, how answering the phone is dictated by Latin-derived theories of the copula: "This is she". Drmies (talk) 15:27, 26 June 2014 (UTC)

Do you agree with this reversion?[edit]

Dan56 continues to revert my helpful contributions. @ Black Sabbath (album) they undid several improvements that I made yesterday. Can't you see that he is reverting me to hound me and prevent progress at the article? Harmelodix (talk) 16:56, 26 June 2014 (UTC)

  • To start with a partial answer: yes, I see no reason to believe that Dan56 is hounding you in the sense of WP:HOUNDING. I also don't subscribe to the notion that Dan is "prevent[ing] progress" or something like that. However, I do not agree with their edits to the "Music and lyrics" section, which strike me as not improving the article. Drmies (talk) 17:01, 26 June 2014 (UTC)
    • Will you help me restore my work that Dan56 undid? Harmelodix (talk) 17:17, 26 June 2014 (UTC)
(talk page stalker) I see DramaMongering, for the last few days with this user, it seems. Mlpearc (open channel) 17:29, 26 June 2014 (UTC)
Care to explain why you decided to make your first ever edit to Farrah Fawcett? Drmies, this is a Wiki-gang of Dan56, Mlpearc, and Caper, and they are trying to hound me away from the project. Harmelodix (talk) 17:34, 26 June 2014 (UTC)
  • Caper454, I did you a favor and reverted your last edit. You can't say shit like that--not on this talk page, not in Wikipedia. See WP:NPA, which does not explicitly exclude amateur psychology and pretend-psychological advice, but is otherwise clear enough. Capice? Drmies (talk) 18:07, 26 June 2014 (UTC)
  • Harmelodix, I'm not going to throw myself into this fight by also editing the article. And yes, I don't see POV pushing there, though I do see edit-warring all over the place. Also, I resent being asked loaded questions--as if my not seeing POV pushing is caused by my blindness or something like that.

    Dan, I am sure you read my comment, and I suggest you restore at least that edit, since, well, it's better written.

    All of you, what's the matter with you? Mlpearc, I don't know if you're following that editor around just cause they're obnoxious in one article--but come on, you know better than to do that. Even if the FF article needs a tweak, do you think it's helpful to do that now? Harmelodix, that edit had nothing to do with your edit, so AGF, please.

    Keep y'all's conflicts limited to one article, one issue at the time, and leave the personal accusations out of it. You can't accuse someone of drama mongering and then doing nothing to lower the atmosphere. Drmies (talk) 18:16, 26 June 2014 (UTC)

Thank you[edit]

I appreciate your change to the discussion in response to my comment. My intent was not to chide, but to encourage reconsideration. And that you did. By the way, my wife and I have catered over a dozen seders, for as many as 110 people. Small in comparison, but the primary motivation is always service to those seated at the tables. Everything else is secondary. Thank you. Cullen328 Let's discuss it 02:55, 27 June 2014 (UTC)

  • No, thanks for setting me straight, Cullen, and again, my apologies for diminishing a rather big thing. BTW, I thought of you the other day while making, you guessed it, rice and beans--again, without using a microwave (or lard). All the best, Drmies (talk) 03:04, 27 June 2014 (UTC)

Dan56 and WP:OWN[edit]

I take it by this edit that you might be starting to come around to my complaints about Dan56. He has undone nearly all the work I've done there this week, so I am going to walk away from the article, which he only reverts progress at BTW, where is his effort to expand and improve it to GA? I can't spend my mental energy and precious time if the next time I log-in Dan56 has undone it all, and I am pretty sure that's exactly why he does it. I'll try to find another corner of Wikipedia where he won't obstruct me, but I have a feeling that he has already edited most of the pages I like. Well, thanks for helping me, Drmies, but Dan56 is far too exhausting and difficult, and its just not worth it. I will say that its an extremely effective tactic, to undo hours of an editor's work to a state of poor quality prose both drives that editor away and maintains the article at the level he wants it at. Thanks again, but I think I'm probably done here. Harmelodix (talk) 16:22, 27 June 2014 (UTC)

  • Harmelodix, I am not the person to talk you back into it, I'm afraid. I do see problems with Dan's behavior in this article, but I do not yet see proof that it is directed particularly at you, for instance, or that it's happening all over the place. I did find that revert to be pretty exasperating, and if I were an uninvolved admin (at this stage I'm probably not, so I'll play it safe) I'd get pretty pissed (well, I am) and warn them admin-style. You know, maybe one of the talk page stalkers is willing to have a look at it. Hell, maybe Malik Shabazz is willing.

    Anyway, one of the possible next steps is an WP:RFC/U, as a kind of fact-finding mission into an editor's behavior, which can end with a recommendation to seek this or that way of dispute resolution. Don't run off yet, please. Drmies (talk) 16:32, 27 June 2014 (UTC)

    • Thanks for encouraging me, Drmies, but Dan56 undoes almost everything I do, so he is exasperating me. I don't know th3e first thing about RFC/U, its too intimidating to be a realistic option for me. Since you are too involved to warn him, will you please consider restoring my contributions that he undid last night? Otherwise, its just a matter of his reverting everything I do and nobody is defending my edits, so he wins by attrition and I just seem like a complainer. Harmelodix (talk) 16:40, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
      • As tempted as I am to hit 'undo' (or, really to hit rollback and call those edits disruptive), I can't, since I must practice what I preach. Mind you, I'm still not happy with your edits in the first place--not because they weren't improvements, because they were, but because of the timing. I want to let that RfC ride for a little while, and then see what happens. I'm here for the long haul and I think that it's better to go through the tedious, lengthy, and painstaking process of hammering out consensus than to try and force improvement when some editors are clearly in disagreement. But I do think that Dan is pushing it, and if I hadn't been so involved (I am because you asked me to) I might have acted already in some fashion or another. Drmies (talk) 16:48, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
        • So, Dan56 deserves sanctions but since I pinged you he gets off with nothing? Dan56 continues to label my good-faith edits as tedious and hounding, which I take as personal insults if not outright attacks. Isn't this actionable yet? Harmelodix (talk) 16:50, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
  • To be clear though, I made those improvements before I started the RfC and Dan56 removed them. Harmelodix (talk) 16:53, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
          • I am an editor in that article now. I have made content comments in the RfC section. I have clearly expressed my displeasure with their behavior. It would not be right for me to act. Drmies (talk) 16:55, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
      • (edit conflict)x2 Although I've never had any problem with him, I know that Dan56 has a bit of a reputation. I've seen other editors suggest an RfC/U about him, but nobody has done it (as far as I know). Harmelodix, please don't let him run you off the project. I'll leave him a message about his behavior. — Malik Shabazz Talk/Stalk 16:52, 27 June 2014 (UTC)

I think you made a grave mistake[edit]

This is the second time that that team creates an new article and uses merge to destroy a proper article, just because the leader of the pack does not agree with that article. I am gravely disappointed in you and I take offence of the rude comment you use.

Aymatth2 states it so nice that I can propose the replacement of his advertising article by my version, but the effect is that the whole crew will turn against it and it never happens. I really had expected a bit more background research. The Banner talk 19:01, 27 June 2014 (UTC)

  • What comment, Banner? "Cheesehead" is purely hypothetically used, if that's your problem. And maybe you should consider that I took up for you in urging your opponents to look at your nomination as made in good faith. If your argument for deletion is, basically, "advertising" and there is not a soul to support that notion, then maybe you were incorrect. AfD is not the venue to seek in-depth background research--and didn't you actually challenge them to write the article on the building? Drmies (talk) 19:30, 27 June 2014 (UTC)

If it hadn't have been Drmies who kept it it would have been any of the 1500 or whatever number of admins we have. That you can't see that it didn't stand a chance of ever being deleted from the outset is the worst thing. As I said, show the sources which document the restaurant in detail and discuss the cuisine and it might be worth keeping in its own right.♦ Dr. Blofeld 19:27, 27 June 2014 (UTC)

What you want is that I turn the article in the same type of advertising as the article about the hotel. I take pride in it to keep "my" restaurant articles absolutely neutral and without promo. That you don't like that is not my problem. The Banner talk 10:20, 28 June 2014 (UTC) "my" as in articles written by me, do not claim ownership but think I have an extra responsibility towards those articles to keep them accurate and spam-free.
  • Banner, I had a look at the merge discussion after I saw that you nominated the restaurant for deletion. That AfD is most likely going to close as "merge", given the comments in the merge discussion. I could of course close it as made in bad faith--that you'd rather see it deleted than merged is not evidence of you putting the project before your own article. Now, various suggestions are made there that would allow it to stand alone, and I suggest you listen to them. You may hate that "gang", but they've been here for a while and you would be wise to consider that they may be right even if they don't like you (or you think they don't). Kom op zeg, we're all grown ups here. Drmies (talk) 19:34, 27 June 2014 (UTC)

Banner, you're seriously abusing the AFD process. It's not there to settle your personal scores and differences. You nominated the hotel article for no other reason than the merge proposal for the restaurant article in the first place and now you've nominated your own restaurant article out of some bizarre reason that you fear the "gang" are going get one up on you by having it merged and you want the "community" to somehow override this through an AFD through a delete or keep or whatever. Madness. If that's not enough to get you banned from ever nominating an article for AFD again I'm not sure what is. You're most welcome to post at the village pump or whatever and get wide input on the merger proposal but it's really rather disrespectful to nominate your own article during a merge discussion. The AFD should be speedily closed. ♦ Dr. Blofeld 19:50, 27 June 2014 (UTC)

  • Ernst, even if you're right, please--this is a happy place, so consider tone. Let's not raise the temperature any more. You all are headed toward a street fight, and I don't want to referee that. All of you have helped me in the past, and I like to think that I've done some of you a good turn as well in the past couple of years. I really wish you all could work this out amicably. Drmies (talk) 20:03, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
  • "Speedy keep", item 1., requires "and no one other than the nominator recommends that the page be deleted". I don't really want to close that if my closing vote is the only one to suggest that "no other than...". Drmies (talk) 20:05, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
    • In fact, you are giving a premium on aggressive behaviour and team work. The Banner talk 10:12, 28 June 2014 (UTC)
Are you even capable Banner of saying something even remotely positive? All doom and gloom with you!♦ Dr. Blofeld 10:22, 28 June 2014 (UTC)
Oh, by the way. Do you consider this and this a positive action? And what about this and this edit? Looks like preparing another battleground as I had De Bloemenbeek and De Heeren van Harinxma prominent on my job list... The Banner talk 17:34, 28 June 2014 (UTC)
You took them off of your user page in a hissy fit, claiming never to work on restaurants in hotels again, I do consider it a positive yes, because you gave up on them. I even stubbed one of them.♦ Dr. Blofeld 12:43, 30 June 2014 (UTC)
Oh, yes, I can: I believe that The Netherlands will become World Champion and that they will beat Mexico five to one. And I enjoyed it that England and Spain were going home so soon but I predict that the USA will have a shock win over Belgium. Face-smile.svg The Banner talk 16:20, 28 June 2014 (UTC)
You may be right! :-) I was very impressed with them in the opening game in particular.♦ Dr. Blofeld 17:29, 28 June 2014 (UTC)

@The Banner: You can't say that I've haven't made an effort to try to get the restaurant article expanded and kept [1] Does that really look like the actions of somebody who is deliberately trying to destroy somebody's work?♦ Dr. Blofeld 12:42, 30 June 2014 (UTC)

Knowing that you work in a team, it really looks like it that the article over the hotel is only created to be able to destroy/merge the restaurant article after you could not get the article you liked it. Your sudden effort to create articles about restaurants/hotels that I had prominently on my job list just add to that. And then we have the ridiculous story about Kilmurry Ibricane, where a perfectly good article was destroyed to create an article without realistic content. Without the article about the RC parish, you would have no serious content at all for the civil parish. So now you have a silly article about a civil parish with a list of priests serving it. Sorry, mate, the warmth you radiate is about 100 degrees Kelvin. The Banner talk 14:19, 30 June 2014 (UTC)

On good articles.[edit]

I currently have Rape during the Rwandan Genocide up for GA status, but the reviewer has dropped off the face of wikipedia. Last comment on the review was 27 April 2014, and has not edited since 3 June 2014. I asked on the GA help desk what should I do but have had no response. Do you know of anyone who might finish the review? BTW, Moosezilla, scary. Tenner the Scofi channel make a movie on it, gotta be better than Sharknado Face-smile.svgDarkness Shines (talk) 19:37, 27 June 2014 (UTC)

  • DS, I just read a couple of paragraphs--the lead, and half a dozen body paragraphs. I don't think I can help you: I can't stomach it. I was going to consider doing the review, but I'm sorry. Oh, the reviewer is Dana boomer? I hope she's alright.

    Anyway, and you know I deliver the bitter medicine, I think the article needs a good scrubbing for punctuation and prose things (note the copy edits I made in the first paragraph). I'd ask Eric or some other hardcore copy editor. As for the reviewer, I don't know GA reviewers as well as I should. Crisco 1492 might have advice, or might take it on. Good luck with it, DS, and thanks for taking that up. Drmies (talk) 19:58, 27 June 2014 (UTC)

No worries mate, I know it does not make for pleasant reading. Eric duly asked. Thanks for the advice. Darkness Shines (talk) 20:07, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
Thanks. And I prefer Sharktopus over Sharknado any day, but don't tell Kelapstick, who was an extra in that movie, I believe. Drmies (talk) 20:10, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
Remembering Sharktopus makes me melancholic, miss him. (Don't tell the BracketBot.) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 21:17, 27 June 2014 (UTC)


Hi Drmies. My comment about not messing with you, on User talk:QTxVi4bEMRbrNqOorWBV‎ was not out of any negative experience with you. We have never interacted.Jytdog (talk) 20:54, 27 June 2014 (UTC)

  • Well, nice to meet you then. I was just a bit surprised at where that came from. Thanks, Drmies (talk) 21:51, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
    • nice to meet you as well! Jytdog (talk) 22:10, 27 June 2014 (UTC)

Has anyone noticed...[edit]

...a recent increase in the number of uncooperative, stubborn, argumentative, truculent and querulous editors, who are also strangely sensitive to perceived insults? Could this be related to schools being out and millions of high school students (who, of course, know everything, and are certain of everything they know) with nothing else to do being unleashed on the Internet? BMK (talk) 21:57, 27 June 2014 (UTC)

  • "Strangely sensitive to perceived insults", no. I think the last few months there's been more bickering at ANI and in a few hot spots. (I haven't checked on the MRM and the gun articles in a while--much better for my health.) I also think you're getting old, BMK, and you begrudge the young fools their youth. You're right to do so, and I agree, but you can't let them know that: it's a sign of weakness, and our doctors already know way too much about those. Drmies (talk) 22:16, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
    • Geez, haven't you heard that 60 is the new 40? BMK (talk) 22:19, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
      • I didn't like my 40. I want my 25 back. Drmies (talk) 22:25, 27 June 2014 (UTC)
        • Just wait until you hit 50.... They do things to you that make a prostate exam look like a prom date. Dennis Brown |  | WER 00:43, 28 June 2014 (UTC)
          • Well, I hope that at your prom at least you got kissed. Drmies (talk) 00:56, 28 June 2014 (UTC)

──────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────── I notice some very good newcomers on Buddhism-articles. Very pleased with it! Joshua Jonathan -Let's talk! 03:58, 28 June 2014 (UTC)

  • Maybe they made good use of Dennis's rectal dilators. Yes, Dennis, feel free to explain that on someone else's talk page. And don't put that picture here: Hafspajen will find twenty others, stick them in a gallery here, and upset the children. Drmies (talk) 04:08, 28 June 2014 (UTC)
What picture? Has anyone said Pictures ? slightly euphoric, weird glow in eyes, still slightly euphoric Hafspajen (talk) 12:40, 28 June 2014 (UTC)
  • Drmies, you love that photo as much as I do, and you know it. Dennis Brown |  | WER 13:36, 28 June 2014 (UTC)
Of course he loves it!! Hafspajen (talk) 16:35, 28 June 2014 (UTC)
Reminds me, we're going to see the Monty Python Live broadcast next Sunday night. I hope they aren't as disappointing as the Everley Brothers were. But you youngsters may not recall the Everley Brothers. Dougweller (talk) 13:46, 30 June 2014 (UTC)

RE: "Complaining"[edit]

I didn't revert anything, other than the erroneous restoration of citation overkill. FTR, "complaining" (a present participle) was Harmelodix's original phrasing ([2]); all I did now was change it to "complain". Unlike Harmelodix, my edit summaries explain why I make my changes, much clearer than a dubious "c/e" explaining nothing. Dan56 (talk) 02:44, 28 June 2014 (UTC)

  • What it looks like is reverting piecemeal. I call "complaining" a gerund/participle, but that's just a technical deformation. Harmelodix, if "complaining" was your word, tsk tsk! (By the way, you seem to suggest that there's something wrong with using the participle; I don't see what hte problem is.) Happy editing, Drmies (talk) 03:49, 28 June 2014 (UTC)

Would you please add an edit notice to Talk:Cancer pain for me?[edit]

Per Talk:Cancer_pain#Invitation_to_readers_to_comment.3F (the last couple of comments). --Anthonyhcole (talk · contribs · email) 04:24, 28 June 2014 (UTC)

  • Anthonyhcole, I am very sympathetic to your proposal, and I'll do it if you get a few more supporters. I'm not afraid to invoke IAR, so I will certainly not say "the rules say it can't be done", but I'd like to see a bit more support, and for the RfC to run just a wee bit longer. Is that fair? Drmies (talk) 14:12, 28 June 2014 (UTC)
  • I ran to mommy, and she did it for me. I do appreciate you taking the time to look at it. (Run for arbitrator.) --Anthonyhcole (talk · contribs · email) 14:28, 30 June 2014 (UTC)
  • Haha, I knew, before checking, that "mommy" was Bishonen. She is a much braver person than I am. Good luck with it, Anthony. Drmies (talk) 14:49, 30 June 2014 (UTC)

History is a nightmare from which I am trying to awake[edit]

Sadly, your plea for help on Wikipedia talk:WikiProject History did not get a warm response. Sorry. bobrayner (talk) 11:55, 28 June 2014 (UTC)

  • Ha, nice passive! But Ubikwit's nomination needs to be judged on its own merits, unless you wanted to propose a speedy keep per item 2, "disruption"--but clearly there are those who are unrelated to the nominator who voted for deletion. I don't understand Ad Orientem's comment either--an admin (a closing admin) shouldn't have a problem closing that thing based on arguments, and the AfD is hardly that problematic. There's no socking, no outside canvassing, nothing. Look: if someone like Cullen votes to delete, there must be something to it (regardless of nominator's intent), since Cullen is the nicest guy in the world and will do his utmost to prevent any article from deletion.

    I did see that Ubikwit had filed an SPI which was laughed out of court as a fishing expedition. If this is really serious business (HOUNDING etc) then you (plural) should do something about that; I'm hardly familiar with the matter. Thanks, Drmies (talk) 14:07, 28 June 2014 (UTC)

not fast[edit]

Any explanation?

Today, I met the article of Wilhelm Killmayer again, and I think it was you with whom I struggled about a reference for the hook "The calm already contains the catastrophe", right? (April 2011, before the templates for noms were invented) - Also today, I changed my battle cry "I stand singing in defiance" to "Ich gehe nicht schnell" ;) - visit my talk for dreams pictured, by Hafspajen, of course, --Gerda Arendt (talk) 18:49, 28 June 2014 (UTC)

Ahem, do you MEET articles? Hafspajen (talk) 18:55, 28 June 2014 (UTC)
This one, yes. (I ment to clarify, that I didn't meet Killmayer in person, unlike a few others who mostly have infoboxes ...) - I created a new one who was a red link in the dream article, and he is a student of Killmayer, just as Rudi Spring (whom I know) - small world, --Gerda Arendt (talk) 19:29, 28 June 2014 (UTC)
You know Rudi Spring? How exiting! Hafspajen (talk) 19:36, 28 June 2014 (UTC)
(ec) I listened to some concerts with him and met him afterwards. The Rheingau Musik Festival mentioned in his hook opened today. One of the concerts was a Christmas hook. - I looked up our old DYK discussion, just for fun ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 19:49, 28 June 2014 (UTC)
To an Englishman, "I met the article" sounds wrong, "I encountered the article" sounds slightly wrong, whereas "I encountered a problem" sounds mostly right. I think "I looked at the article again" or "I remembered the article" might have been what was intended. "I took on the article" or "I continued editing the article" would also work. --Demiurge1000 (talk) 19:41, 28 June 2014 (UTC)
Unless Gerda was joking... Hafspajen (talk) 19:43, 28 June 2014 (UTC)
I did nothing intentional, not even "look again", - I happened to arrive at the article by chance, --Gerda Arendt (talk) 19:49, 28 June 2014 (UTC)

Face-smile.svgHafspajen (talk) 19:53, 28 June 2014 (UTC)

"chanced upon the article" is better... --Demiurge1000 (talk) 19:55, 28 June 2014 (UTC)
Thank you, - never encountered the use of chance as a verb, and certainly not with preposition "upon". Fit's the 2011 hook nicely, Fin al punto, or "pointy", --Gerda Arendt (talk) 20:19, 28 June 2014 (UTC)

IPA pronunciation of German things[edit]

An IPA for all of you

Good morning Drmies, do you sprekken this Deutsch thing that some people east of Holland and west of Poland still seem to? If you do, or any of your stalk page talkers do, please could you add an appropriate IPA pronunciation thingummy to Altes Stadthaus, Berlin? The original article author is not happy with his attempt and has therefore removed it. --Demiurge1000 (talk) 19:54, 28 June 2014 (UTC)

  • Hmm, troubles with IPA on Wikipedia? Never heard of such a thing. Gerda stalks often enough I don't even think you have to ping her ;) She might could help. Dennis Brown |  | WER 21:17, 28 June 2014 (UTC)
Not really, every German word in IPA looks excessively strange to me ;) - I remember a dispute when I tried to correct Buxtehude, - solved when we realized that it was the Danish pronunciation, - he now has both, --Gerda Arendt (talk) 22:26, 28 June 2014 (UTC)
(talk page stalker) To paraphase Homer Simpson – "Mmm, IPA" – and maybe a nice Kölsch for the "German things" part of the subject of this section... What a good idea for a hot summer day. Thanks for planting the thought. Think I'll have me one right now. I would suggest you folks do likewise.
Looks like all I have in the fridge is a Grapefruit IPA and an American Red Ale... Decisions, decisions... Mojoworker (talk) 00:11, 30 June 2014 (UTC)
  • I've been told that the Russian River Brewing Company Pliny the Elder is the best American beer in the world. I'm looking forward to trying that on a road trip to Colorado. Drmies (talk) 17:42, 30 June 2014 (UTC)
  • As a northern German I like to think that Kölsch ([kœːɫʃ]) is actually not a Bier ([biːɐ̯]). It must be some sort of medicine rather since it is served in such homoeopathic doses. De728631 (talk) 19:23, 30 June 2014 (UTC)

Amusing vitriol[edit]

Kind of gets you right here. Should I sign it for him?--Bbb23 (talk) 22:02, 28 June 2014 (UTC)

You'll have to: I blocked him. Acroterion (talk) 22:16, 28 June 2014 (UTC)
  • I understood all those words, but I've never seen them used in that particular order, and with so little punctuation. Dennis Brown |  | WER 22:19, 28 June 2014 (UTC)
    Acroterion, I think the block is justified, not just for the garbage on my talk page, but for other reasons as well. Dennis Brown, I know what you mean. There was something impressive about it. I wonder if he talks like that in real life. Another editor removed it. I suppose it's not good to keep it around, but it made me think of a reverse barnstar. The image of manure comes to mind.--Bbb23 (talk) 23:03, 28 June 2014 (UTC)
    Yes, I wouldn't have blocked indef solely for that particular screed, impressive as it was. Acroterion (talk) 23:05, 28 June 2014 (UTC)
    It's funny, I also felt that it was impressive in its own way, I just didn't want to be the first to say so. It was almost hypnotizing in its incoherence, taunting you to try to make sense of it all. I must have read it 6 times. Dennis Brown |  | WER 23:17, 28 June 2014 (UTC)
    I got it! It was a verbal Blivet. Dennis Brown |  | WER 23:20, 28 June 2014 (UTC)
    Fascinating - never even heard of it. Me, I just think it had cadence.--Bbb23 (talk) 23:48, 28 June 2014 (UTC)
  • I think you need to get some shit, Bbb. I got plenty, these days--one revert and one pissy comment after another. No fun. Drmies (talk) 23:45, 28 June 2014 (UTC)
  • Perhaps you should send some my way, Drmies. God knows I give enough of it to you and your talk page stalkers.--Bbb23 (talk) 23:48, 28 June 2014 (UTC)
  • I've noticed that as well Mies. I'm sorry for my contributions towards your frustration. I would gladly buy you a beer or six if I could afford the gas money to your house. Dennis Brown |  | WER 00:07, 29 June 2014 (UTC)

Try saying it outloud in an excited tone, it is really funny. Chillum (Need help? Ask me) 07:32, 29 June 2014 (UTC)

  • Chillum, it's so nice to see your name again in various place, and thank you for stopping by here. I hope you came back out of joy. Drmies (talk) 15:09, 29 June 2014 (UTC)

Thank you. I have really been impressed with how many people remember me and welcome me so warmly since I recently came back after a very long break. Chillum (Need help? Ask me) 07:24, 30 June 2014 (UTC)

Kpop articles[edit]

Aer you going to go through every single Kpop article and remove the stage name, real name and hangul translations of both from all kpop articles, or just random ones you feel like? Seems like there should be consistency, and the majority of articles have a member info box giving member names and translations. You are arbitrarily removing them from one or two articles, but ignoring the other hundreds with the exact same formatting.

Also, U2 members have their own individual wikipedia pages which have all of those facts on them. Not exactly a relevant comparison.

Also, it's not consistent across all things, but jpop articles also have tables with such information (where people have put it in) and that's even when the member real names are used. Are you going to go through all the foreign language music group articles and remove any translations, birth dates, nicknames etc from all of those pages as well? You seem to have arbitrarily chosen to remove such information from a couple of pages without any real justification or system, and ignored the fact this is typically relevant and factual information. I would think that having the hangul of a foreign person's name would be entirely relevant, since it's usually presented on most pages which are about a person with a name written natively in a foreign script. e.g. Japanese, Russian, Korean people

Lonyo (talk) 15:13, 29 June 2014 (UTC)

  • It is a relevant comparison. A list of members should be a list of members--names and instruments. That the U2 members have their own articles is irrelevant; you should ask yourself why someone who reads an encyclopedia would want to know someone's blood type or favorite color, and if they don't have an article, they are as yet non notable and needn't have a date of birth listed. I'm not "arbitrarily" doing anything: I'm just not doing everything (but more than one or two). I'm leading the way, so to speak, so you can follow my example. As for all these scripts--great, but we're the English wiki and I fail to see the relevance. Yes, all these tables need to go, and I appreciate your help. Drmies (talk) 15:30, 29 June 2014 (UTC)
  • Also, please see WP:BLP on properly verified information and MOS:FLAG for that abuse of flag icons. Thank you, Drmies (talk) 15:33, 29 June 2014 (UTC)

So the fact that the article no longer makes sense is fine? In the Members box on the right, it has nicknames. In the members list, it has real names. Some of those are not obviously linked. And apparently foreign scripts on English wikipedia are bad. And it's amazing how it's been a way for years and now it's a problem. This is why people think Wikipedia is getting dumb. Yay removal of factual information that allows peopel to actually understand who people in a group are. It would be like having a Spice Girls article with "Posh, Sporty" etc, and then a list of real names, but nothing to indicate who was who. So good job, you've made the page less helpful. Lonyo (talk) 22:07, 30 June 2014 (UTC)

  • Well, fix the Members box on the right. And copy the information which is still left in the history, and put it on your Myspace page. This is an encyclopedia, not a collection of fan pages or a promotional outlet for SM Entertainment. (Seriously, Lonyo. Five million years of evolution, the invention of script and internet, so we can have articles on teenage bubblepop? That is the height of your ambition?) Drmies (talk) 23:46, 30 June 2014 (UTC)

Admin assistance[edit]

Please could you or one of your admin stalkers take a look at Special:Contributions/Pacnews. I'm getting fed up of reverting them but it is a very slow-moving thing. They're obviously WP:SPA and probably WP:COI. I'm not even sure that the article subject is really notable but the hassle might be stopped with a block. Ta muchly. - Sitush (talk) 16:59, 29 June 2014 (UTC)

  • (talk page stalker) Copyvio. I dropped them a stiff note about that; I'm hoping that new wrinkle may get them talking, or modifying the article more constructively. Others may wish to weigh in on the edit warring or AfD the article, but the editor is demonstrably drawing on additional sources, so the subject may squeak by on notability. Yngvadottir (talk) 17:42, 29 June 2014 (UTC)
  • IMO in this instance you've been too nice - since your final warning about blanking some time ago, you've kept describing their edits in edit summaries as good faith! I have left a second final warning with notes about both blanking and edit warring and insisting they start talking; I note that you have left one note on the article talk page. If they resume either blanking or edit warring with no talking, leave a message; it may well be the reason behind their edits is COI, but at this point what matters is the disruptive effect, and it's just possible they don't realize we do block for such behaviour. Yngvadottir (talk) 12:23, 6 July 2014 (UTC)


Phew, that was close. I take full responsibility for the Mexican goal, since I poured tequila shots at halftime. Drmies (talk) 20:01, 29 June 2014 (UTC)

Proost! Here's to another chance of having a classic final with Oranje as of one of the protagonists. Man of the match? De728631 (talk) 20:13, 29 June 2014 (UTC)
Ja, proost, De--ik ben met bier nummer vier bezig, geloof ik. Huntelaar...I don't know, it hurts me to say that. I think that Robben was the Man of the Match. Now, you'll have to clear the obstacle of Algeria... I mean, fo shizzle, how'd you get that lucky? Drmies (talk) 20:16, 29 June 2014 (UTC)
Well, to be fair I'd even says Ochoa deserves the title for keeping all those shots on his box handball style. And you know, they say a match will last 90 minutes and in the end the Germans will walk off the field as winners. But then they've got a history of botching premusably easy matches. Don't misunderestimate them Algerians. De728631 (talk) 20:28, 29 June 2014 (UTC)
Haha, who else but a German would make a handball comparison? Yes, he's a great goalie, and if it weren't for him they wouldn't have tied Brazil. Drmies (talk) 20:32, 29 June 2014 (UTC)
  • De728631, I think you know a thing or two about "close" now. (Not "Klose", oddly enough.) Man! Y'all came this close! Who knew that these Algerians could play like that? But der Mannschaft rolls along: congratulations. Drmies (talk) 23:47, 30 June 2014 (UTC)

June 2014[edit]

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  • Hafspajen, I love you. Can you make BracketBot stop? Drmies (talk) 23:51, 29 June 2014(UTC)
Yes dear, do you want to opt out the bot, or what? Hafspajen (talk) 23:59, 29 June 2014 (UTC)
I did and I got reverted. I am not trusted. Dangerous life. Hafspajen (talk) 00:47, 30 June 2014 (UTC)
Ok, it is back again. Hafspajen (talk) 01:32, 30 June 2014 (UTC)
  • BracketBot is truly one useless critter. Here is the most laughable example of pathetic templating: User Elsa367, age 9 by self-declaration wrote a cute essay / article about caring for a dog. Of course the ending included a :). For which she/he received the BracketBot message faster than the speedy delete notice.[3] sigh... I sent a Wikilove Puppy of thanks and hope this editor sees it. Fylbecatulous talk 11:31, 1 July 2014 (UTC)

Jason Russell[edit]

Dr, you closed the RfC at Jason Russell. I noticed that no one actually implemented the changes, so is took a stab myself. Style aside, do you think my change honored the spirit of the RfC? Two kinds of pork (talk) 23:41, 29 June 2014 (UTC)

  • Sure, and thanks--though what you have now is pretty much what we had then, except for the viral part. So let's try and keep an eye on it: with that RfC in hand reverts are easy, and that is why they're so good to have (I say this for the onlookers). Hey, is one of your kinds from Conecuh County, Alabama? Cuz we ate the hell out of you today, with mustard. Drmies (talk) 00:32, 30 June 2014 (UTC)
The viral part is perhaps the most reported part of this story. One of me goes better with slaw on the bottom of the bun.Two kinds of pork (talk) 00:40, 30 June 2014 (UTC)
I'm familiar with that, yes, though I frequently fry that in your own fat after having cooked it for an hour or six. Drmies (talk) 02:18, 30 June 2014 (UTC)
I ate the hell out of my brothers and sisters today. We are truly the magical animal.Two kinds of pork (talk) 03:52, 7 July 2014 (UTC)

Gender bias task force[edit]

Hi Drmies, I saw you recently closed an AN/I discussion about an Obi topic ban with the comment that he had been put on notice.

He is causing a problem at Wikipedia:WikiProject Countering systemic bias/Gender bias task force. I set this up last year as a gender gap task force, and stupidly used the term "gender bias" in the title instead of gender gap. Obi has arrived to say that it must therefore cover systemic bias against men too. I've had to post an RM to have the page moved to gender gap. He is dominating the page and now the RM discussion. Can you keep an eye on it? I think the situation isn't going to stop (whether there or anywhere else) until someone deals with it; the concept of "on notice" doesn't seem to work.

I've also asked Bbb23 because he seems to be active on men's rights sanctions. SlimVirgin (talk) 03:26, 1 July 2014 (UTC)

  • But he's only made 98 edits to that talk page, and only 84 in the last few days! It wasn't me putting him "on notice", but rather all those editors who were ready to deliver a topic ban. Listen, I don't think I can tell an editor to stop posting somewhere. The community can, though: I think you should take this to AN. That's kind of kicking the can down the road, but that's the appropriate place to kick it. Can't easily "enforce" something (Bbb-style on the MRM pages, with a ruling by the community) if there's nothing to enforce yet. So that should be the next step--it's lengthy and frustrating (for everyone involved), but it's the right way. Drmies (talk) 04:45, 1 July 2014 (UTC)
  • The idea of having to engage further to avoid further engagement is not appealing, and it's of the many reasons we have a gender gap in the first place. That talk page could be exhibit one! SlimVirgin (talk) 05:08, 1 July 2014 (UTC)
  • Sure, I understand. But you have a choice: either you continue to accept it in the project (and the talk page indicates that this is likely perceived as disruption by others) or you engage it in a forum where you can get the community to stop it in all forums. It is likely that, given the problems raised by a number of editors in that ANI thread, you will have your way if you ask for a topic ban of sorts. By the same token, I feel that AN is generally a better, less temperamental forum for such a discussion. I wonder, and maybe Bbb23 (or Binksternet or TParis, or one of the other cats active on the MRM talk pages) can shed light on this: can the MRM community sanctions apply to this project page? I don't remember the exact wording, and it may sound like kind of a stretch, but it's an avenue to explore. Or Obi can of course cease and desist. Drmies (talk) 05:22, 1 July 2014 (UTC)
  • The MRM sanctions say (my bold): "Sanctions imposed may include restrictions on reverts or other specified behaviors, bans from editing the Men's rights pages and/or closely related topics, blocks of up to 1 year in length, or any other measures the imposing administrator believes are reasonably necessary to ensure the smooth functioning of the project. Additionally, a 1-revert rule applies to all related pages (until October 27, 2014)."

    These are in place indefinitely. The gender gap page shouldn't be a "closely related topic," but Obi wants to turn it into one, and in that case those sanctions do apply. SlimVirgin (talk) 05:28, 1 July 2014 (UTC)

  • That's interesting. Obiwankenobi, SlimVirgin makes a good point. If you are successful in your opposition to SlimVirgin's requested name change--of course, it's the spirit, not the letter, which means here if you are successful in broadening/redefining the scope of the project--you may well succeed in pushing that project under the umbrella of the MRM restrictions, at which point your multiple plethora of discussion/talking points could hypothetically be seen as disruptive, since the "smooth functioning of the project" is jeopardized, if not by content then by sheer number. Drmies (talk) 05:37, 1 July 2014 (UTC)
  • (edit conflict) SlimVirgin left a message on my talk page about this. I'm taking the position that the project is subject to MRM sanctions, just as I have on other pages that are not necessarily obvious. I have notified SPECIFICO about the sanctions because he has never been notified before. Obi, OTOH, has been notified back in 2013. Obi's behavior, both on the main project page and in the move discussion, is clearly sanctionable (in my view). It's just a question of whether I should impose sanctions, which means he would have to appeal them to ANI if he wished to, or if he should be taken to AN. My god, if prolixity was sanctionable in and of itself, he would be banned forever; he goes on and on and on. Anyway, I'm not doing anything more tonight.--Bbb23 (talk) 05:32, 1 July 2014 (UTC)
  • Clearly, Bbb (thanks for weighing in), you are the bad cop. Or you have BIG COJONES--is that a violation of anything? Well, SlimVirgin, these are serious considerations. I also am done for the day: I got a lot to do tomorrow and I'm going on a road trip so I might not be able to check in for a little while. Perhaps the other two editors I pinged have something to say as well, perhaps Obi will choose the better path. Thanks, Drmies (talk) 05:39, 1 July 2014 (UTC)
I think it's a fair point, and I hadn't considered it in that light. I will disengage and take a wikibreak to consider my actions. I will not pursue it further and I will stop posting there for a self-imposed page ban of at least one month to consider my actions, and will not try to impose a different scope (before yesterday, I never knew the scope was only female gender though to be honest - like gender studies I figured it covered both) - anyway I'm done and I'm taking the path of disengagement and reflection. Sorry SlimVirgin for having mucked up your task force.--Obi-Wan Kenobi (talk) 10:27, 1 July 2014 (UTC)
  • Okay, so I've been asked to give an opinion here by four different people on all sides of this thing. Considering I haven't stepped foot in this topic area in almost a year, I'm not sure why I'm considered some kind of expert on the sanctions. Bbb23 and Drmies are clearly more qualified, in my eyes, to implement it. That said, I don't agree that the MRM sanctions apply to the Wikiproject task force - however - they would apply to any discussion about the task force and the MRM. This would follow the same logic that not all biographies are covered under the Gun Control sanctions, but any sections of a biography discussing gun control would be. But (big sigh) I think we've all lost our marbles here because we're talking about sensitive subjects and everyone feels the other is being insensitive to our concerns. There is a serious lack of communication, and I fear part of it is because Obi-wan was recently involved in a heated ANI dispute and he's feeling a bit attacked at the moment which is hindering his ability to articulate his thoughts well. The RM will help solve the confusion over the name, and Obi-wan is going to take a break from MRM for the summer. Let's all try to show a little more sensitivity and understanding.--v/r - TP 17:11, 1 July 2014 (UTC)
I think TP's viewpoint presents a lot of value here. It would make sense to treat the sanctions the same way we treat stuff like WP:BLP - it applies to discussions of the topic regardless of where they are, but doesn't necessarily apply to discussions on pages categorically. A discussion of Warren Farrell would be covered by the sanctions, even if it's happening for some odd reason at Talk:Koalas. On the other hand, a discussion of Koalas that takes place at the task force in question here probably wouldn't be covered (though, I could see an exception if it was intended as an obviously WP:POINTy disruption stemming from a conversation about the MRM.) Despite the fact that I fairly frequently disagree with Obi, I do believe he makes valuable contributions to the project, and sincerely hope that he's able to step back in a way that allows him to be more productive after having some time to cool off from some of the recent discussions. Although I don't usually publicly announce it myself (and one of them was related to a significant IRL situation where stepping back seemed to be the only viable option, as an editor who works on gender stuff on Wikipedia, I end up stepping back from controversial areas involving gender on Wikipedia myself fairly frequently when I feel like heated discussion has gotten to me in a way that makes it hard for me to be productive. Kevin Gorman (talk) 18:28, 1 July 2014 (UTC)
I, too, agree with TP on this issue. Some articles are covered by MRM in all contexts. Others are subject to sanctions, but it depends on the issue. When I said the project was subject to sanctions, that was shorthand for saying what TP said more eloquently. BTW, it also makes the analysis of whether someone should be sanctioned more difficult. As for Obi, I applaud his withdrawal and apology. Any sanctions against him at this point would be punitive (and a bit mean, too).--Bbb23 (talk) 22:29, 1 July 2014 (UTC)

Please help[edit]

Please have a look at this and help if possible, I have no idea who to turn to with this so I'm trying to contact more experienced Wikipedians.

--Samotny Wędrowiec (talk) 22:55, 1 July 2014 (UTC)

  • Sorry, but as the great Polish American poet B. Dylan said, it ain't me you're looking for. Besides, your complaint there is a bit on the vague side. There are no names, no issues, no diffs, no specifics, so you're probably not going to get much in the way of a practical response. Drmies (talk) 04:02, 3 July 2014 (UTC)

This be the one[edit]

Thought you might want a closer look at that original left-handed 65 SG Mlpearc (open channel) 05:14, 2 July 2014 (UTC)


If you can pull yourself out of those complicated gender discussion, and take a look at Towel. Are we trying to assemble all possible ways of using a towel or what? It is a list of Hundred ways to use a towel, much like 100 Aspects of the Moon or the series of Thirty-six Views of Mount Fuji. Hafspajen (talk) 13:13, 2 July 2014 (UTC)

* As an extra privacy measure, a towel can be wedged into or draped over the gaps of bathroom stall doors or changing rooms.

  • Rolled up in a horseshoe shape, a towel can be used as an emergency toilet seat cover in frigid or unsanitary conditions.
  • Place a towel over delicate surfaces, such as a car hood or table, and place harsh items on the towel instead.
  • A thick towel can be used to prevent items from rolling off a slanted surface, such as tools on a roof.
  • Rolled up lengthwise, a towel can be used as a keyboard rest.
  • A towel can be used to conceal items, such as surprises in a basket or valuables in the front seat of a vehicle.
  • The controls of gym equipment can be covered with a towel to prevent distraction by unwanted biofeedback readings.
  • As emergency gift wrap.
  • As a cushion when kneeling on a hard surface.
  • As an emergency writing surface with an available marker.
  • Sacrifice a cotton towel as fuel for a fire or as the fabric for a torch.
  • A small sports towel can be used as a substitute handkerchief.
  • For impact protection of the head, a sufficiently thick towel can be used in construction of a makeshift soft helmet.
  • A towel can be rolled up and used as a headrest or assist in compiling wayward soft items, such as multiple small items of clothing, into a suitable pillow.
  • Sacrifice a towel by cutting it into strips for all things string, ribbon and cordage can be used for.
  • When camping in cold weather, wrap fire warmed rocks in a cotton towel and place in the bottom of a sleeping bag for extra warmth.
  • Lay a towel over a vent or grille to prevent items from falling through.
  • A large towel can be used as a makeshift sack or hobo's style bindle.
  • As an emergency, though awkward, one person changing room.
  • To shoo insects or as a fly swatter.
  • To remedy the noise of vibrating appliances.
  • Towels are often draped over the heads of suspects or crime victims to protect privacy during transport.
  • A towel can be used as a placemat to eat on or, if its large enough, as a tablecloth.
  • In the absence of an air pump, attend a flat bicycle or other small tire by lining the rim with a towel(s). This will restore some emergency semblance of functionality to the tire and help prevent further damage to either it or the rim.
  • When standing on a moving vehicle, such as a bus or subway, and no seats or handholds are free, a towel can be looped around an overhead bar to balance oneself.
  • A suitable sized towel can be used in construction of a hammock or other suspensory apparatus.
  • In a water scarcity situation, morning dew can be mopped up from from grass, boulders or other surfaces with a towel and water squeezed out.
  • When lost at sea and fresh water has ceased to be available, non-cartilaginous fish can be diced and placed into a towel and the moisture wrung out. The moisture from such bony ocean fish is not excessively salty, and can sustain life.
  • Where it can be threaded through, or a length passed under the base of large items, a towel can be used as make shift handle to carry heavy or awkward things.
  • As a makeshift apron.
  • A small towel can be placed over the eyes as a night mask.
  • As a painters drop.
  • When the need to shatter glass or ceramic arises, a towel over or around the item will protect from hazardous shards and also muffle the sound.
  • As a substitute rug.
  • Cook bacon in a microwave by wrapping it between two layers of clean kitchen towel and cooking till done.
  • A disposable kitchen or tea towel can be used in microwave cooking to prevent liquids, such as soup or chili, from splattering the interior of the oven.
  • Drivers often keep a towel in their vehicles to deal with repeat instances of fogged up interior windows.
  • As a substitute curtain.
  • As a complimentary exercise to pull-ups, towel pull-ups may be implemented to help in further working the forearm.
  • Distract aggressive animals with a towel.

  • Scream into a rolled up towel to vent frustration in a stress management situation. ( This is only a small part of a very long list...)'Hafspajen (talk) 13:37, 2 July 2014 (UTC)
    • Wikipedians enervated by listcruft are advised to cover their computer's screen with a towel to avoid further inconvenience. De728631 (talk) 16:53, 2 July 2014 (UTC)
Ah, Dougweller wiped out out the 100 interesting things you can do with a towel... Hafspajen (talk) 21:03, 2 July 2014 (UTC)
But you can never just throw it in, can you. Martinevans123 (talk) 21:46, 5 July 2014 (UTC)
Phew! The orange-picker can be so cruel! haha. Martinevans123 (talk) 22:38, 5 July 2014 (UTC)
Got that orange space-suit ready, DrM?: [4]. Martinevans123 (talk) 16:57, 7 July 2014 (UTC)


Here we have one of the dog-article changers. A Yorkshire Terrier live to 17-20 years, according to Wikipedia! Althoug, this say different. Hafspajen (talk) 17:59, 2 July 2014 (UTC)

She's new, we'll see how she goes. She says she lives at home with her boyfriend, which doesn't make a lot of sense. Could be a kid. Dougweller (talk) 20:48, 2 July 2014 (UTC)
(talk page stalker) This little gem: "not to metion im quite smart" caught my eye since it seems to contradict what she's trying to say. Every second word on her user page is misspelt, which makes me believe that it's someone flying a false flag, just pretending to be a young girl. Thomas.W talk 20:58, 2 July 2014 (UTC)
Hm, a dream-boyfriend? Hafspajen (talk) 20:59, 2 July 2014 (UTC)
I have just put the WikiProject:Dogs recent changes watchlist up on my toolbar, beside the one for the Cats. You'd be amazed at the vandalism that can be done to a seemingly benign article like Tortoiseshell cat! I will begin to look after the doggys too. Fylbecatulous talk 21:03, 2 July 2014 (UTC)
Thank GOD, you have heard my prayers. (But don't tell me I put too many pictures in articles. I never put in too many - ever) Hafspajen (talk) 21:05, 2 July 2014 (UTC)
ツ I love images. That's what they say with the cats articles too. But they are all so cute. Here's some funny vandalism for giggles... These type of cats can also mate with hamsters, making what's called a tortster, talk about gansta! (from tortoiseshell cat article page; removed by ClueBot) ツ Fylbecatulous talk 21:11, 2 July 2014 (UTC)
This is from a dog article: The Great Pyrenees , life_span = 40-45 years, Food- Ham, Colors blue and green. Are they dogs? No these animals are closely related to the fish, because of their small features. Scientists believe that in the year 2020, the Great Pyrenees, also known as the American Spagogie, will have taken control of The United States of America and will have partial control over eastern France. In the year 2056 the breed will be running the Summer Olympics. This breed is clearly superior to others and all other animals in the world. The founder of the Great Pyrenees breed was and still is Daryl Dixion. The Great Pyrenees is a new breed that has been used for ten years by the Canary tribe, including those of the Basque people, who inhabit parts of the region in and around the Trylsafjlk Mountains of southern Hawaii and northern Texas. Long Live The Great Pyrenees! ... Hafspajen (talk) 21:19, 2 July 2014 (UTC)
Okay, I am amazed, just speechless. I must admit, it is clever and creative... Face-surprise.svg Fylbecatulous talk 21:30, 2 July 2014 (UTC)
There is more. Hafspajen (talk) 22:03, 2 July 2014 (UTC)
Here you go: "the polar bears believed that they were not dogs and instead thought they were retarded, midget polar bears. so they protected them, taught them how to swim and hunt seal. they would dive into the cold waters and swim into the seals mouths, and set a bomb inside them, (a bomb that only destroys seals of course)after a short while the bomb would go off" -...
  • that is one, and there was the: The Coton de Tulear developed on the island of Madagascar and is still the island's national dog. For food the cotons used to gather in a pack of 40 to 50 and would naw at the ankles of elaphents, this hunting form would last days. the cotons had such great stamina and strength the elephents could never seem to kill them. ... Hafspajen (talk) 22:21, 2 July 2014 (UTC)

Another one[edit]

I don't know how you ended up being the victim (*uhem, I mean editor) that I keep bringing these types of Bright Line items to, but an IP made this edit adding a more complete list of executives to the Key People parameter, whereas our norms are to only include CEO and co-founders for the most part. I wouldn't want anyone to think I was involved in such an edit and I wonder if you would be comfortable reverting it. CorporateM (Talk) 20:10, 2 July 2014 (UTC)

CorporateM, they are all listed as co-founder. --kelapstick(bainuu) 20:43, 2 July 2014 (UTC)
In addition, the documentation for the userbox says up to four people. I have just reformatted it using {{ubl}}. --kelapstick(bainuu) 20:47, 2 July 2014 (UTC)
Oh oops! I am moving too fast. They are all listed as co-founders on the website too and we do typically include co-founders in the infobox. Looks like a swing and a miss on this one. CorporateM (Talk) 20:59, 2 July 2014 (UTC)

Your input/comment is requested[edit]

I feel that you have a decent understanding of the situation between Lightbreather, myself and others and feel that your comment can shed some light on it here at Arbitration Enforcement. My apologies for involving you, but I feel that cooler heads should prevail. --Scalhotrod - Just your average banjo playing, drag racing, cowboy... (Talk) 01:44, 3 July 2014 (UTC)

  • Well, I did, but I'm not sure you like what I had to say. I think you should have used the talk page much more, and you may well be edit warring. Sorry. Drmies (talk) 04:15, 3 July 2014 (UTC)
  • I value your fairness and forthrightness. I'm working to better Wikipedia, not get into fights which is what happens the more I converse with LB. But its not just me that seems to be avoiding communication with her, quite a few of her article Talk page postings have gone unaddressed. Either Editors don't care or they don't want to interact with her either. The ARE is a good exercise though, I've learned some new things and found some interesting information about LB as well. --Scalhotrod - Just your average banjo playing, drag racing, cowboy... (Talk) 05:21, 3 July 2014 (UTC)
  • I'm better at drinking beer with people than solving problems, no doubt. FWIW, tonight's brew is brought to you courtesy of Grand Lake Brewing, from some altitude up here in Colorado. Drmies (talk) 05:00, 4 July 2014 (UTC)


Sibylle von Olfers Marietje in Sneeuwland
Same wall, floor, l'estetique..

Do you remember the story about the Baltic Youth-hostel and the drunk Russians? now this is what it looked like (except guitar and table). The newly found recreation place - yeah, right. Hafspajen (talk) 14:10, 3 July 2014 (UTC)

I used to enjoy Amsterdam youth hostels with their co-ed dorms. Dougweller (talk) 15:56, 3 July 2014 (UTC)

How are those? Hafspajen (talk) 16:00, 3 July 2014 (UTC) The Story of the Butterfly children ? This looks like and this (look inside book) like a really fine illustrator to me. Hafspajen (talk) 18:09, 3 July 2014 (UTC)

Dutch or Flemish[edit]

Pieter Claesz, in the article Still life#Dutch and Flemish painting someone put the caption Dutch painter. Is he , or is he Flemish? Hafspajen (talk) 03:00, 4 July 2014 (UTC)

  • Wow. I just looked at the article--born in "Belgium", career in "Holland". I really don't know, Hafspajen. What do the books call him? (I had a somewhat similar situation: go to Early Sorrows and see where his "nationality" links to--but I suppose you can't do this with the language of painting.) Drmies (talk) 04:53, 4 July 2014 (UTC)
  • Seems to be classed as Dutch. The New York Metropolitan Museum of Art has his bio under "Dutch Paintings in the Met", and refers to Flemish painters, with whom he is thought to have trained in Antwerp, as if he wasn't Flemish. Apparently until recently confused with a Pieter Claesz from Steinfurt, his birthplace seems to have been ascertained from his name as written on a document written two days after his death (Pieter Claesz van Berchem), and his son's name.''If one tripped on his or her left leg and was born on an odd-numbered day, or tripped on his or her right foot and born on an even-numbered day, one should ask someone else to slap his or her corresponding hand in order to negate the bad luck. Xanthomelanoussprog (talk) 06:48, 4 July 2014 (UTC)
Thanks for the god advice and classification. Has anyone seen Mies lately? Hafspajen (talk) 20:54, 4 July 2014 (UTC)
Oh, I'm here--just not here so much. We went for a walk today--in Rocky Mountain National Park, and now I want to get a job in Denver and move out west. Holy moly Haffy, you wouldn't believe how majestic this part of America is. It blew me away. One more day, and then we have to rush back to Alabama, in a day and a night. Drmies (talk) 00:13, 5 July 2014 (UTC)
But I do. My relatives took me there. Was hiking there it was fantastic. And try Bryce Canyon National Park and Yosemite too. Hafspajen (talk) 00:14, 5 July 2014 (UTC)
I'm glad that you are in my neck of the world Drmies and that you are enjoying it. I hope that you didn't get snowed on. Enjoy the rest of your trip. MarnetteD|Talk 04:30, 5 July 2014 (UTC)
My daughter-in-law and her family are from Denver. My son talks about moving there with the extended family, of course. I so want to go. I love high altitude; having grown up in the foothills in the piedmont of South Carolina. (yes, we haz mountains there...). and the added benefit of (shhhhh) medical marajuana. Fylbecatulous talk 12:39, 5 July 2014 (UTC)

Have you seen the trainwreck at ANI about the 'Siduri Project'[edit]

The guy now has 4 accounts and still hasn't a clue. I should have blocked 2 at the beginning but took it to ANI instead, and now.... Dougweller (talk) 13:41, 4 July 2014 (UTC)

  • I looked at their "project page". Clearly they misunderstand what Wikipedia is. I don't think there is anything preventing you from blocking any alternate accounts though, is there? Drmies (talk) 00:09, 5 July 2014 (UTC)
I've done that and the user is happy with it. I'd hoped someone completely uninvolved would step in but never mind, it was the sensible thing to do. Dougweller (talk) 19:02, 5 July 2014 (UTC)

DYK for Robert Dulmers[edit]

Gatoclass (talk) 16:03, 4 July 2014 (UTC)

You speak Dutch, right?[edit]

IIRC you both speak Dutch and are an admin. Would you be willing to have a word with User:Natubico, also known as User:VKing, about why this kind of thing isn't appropriate? (The Nicolas Pleumekers vhose views he's trying to promote is clearly the person operating both accounts.) I've tried to a very limited extent to engage at User talk:Natubico#Oost, but given the response don't feel I'm going to get through. According to his own userpage he has limited English, so a Dutch-speaker may do a better job of getting through. I'm also reluctant to get involved in any protracted debate with him as some of the views he expresses ("Non-blondes, of which there are so many by now, that planet Earth is in serious danger of becoming totally unliveable", "natural blond-race-territory had been invaded and taken in more and more for centuries again by blackhaired, Southern-European agressors, like Romans and Gallics", "those, who (or who's forfathers) in the past have emigrated to an other race's natural territory") look to me like outright neo-Nazism, but again this may just be a problem with translation and these phrases in the original Dutch aren't as offensive as they appear. Since he also thinks vitamins are a species of microbe, believes hair dye causes mental illness, and, assuming Google Translate is correct in its translation of nl:Overleg_gebruiker:VKing is banned for life from Dutch Wikipedia, I'm not hopeful. Mogism (talk) 00:16, 5 July 2014 (UTC)

  • Where's the blond stuff at? Drmies (talk) 03:40, 5 July 2014 (UTC)
    • Looks like that stuff is also on their userpage: VKing (the first paragraph in the "The name VKing" section). Writ Keeper  03:49, 5 July 2014 (UTC)
      • Ha. Thank you WK. Now what do we do? MfD the user page? I do not approve of this kind of racialist soapboxing. Delete it? Scrap that section? Your advice is appreciated. Drmies (talk) 03:54, 5 July 2014 (UTC)
        • Agreed. My guess is blank the relevant sections (basically the entire "The name VKing" section, including the "Vivism" subsection) per the first bullet at WP:POLEMIC for now; I'ma go do that if you haven't already. There's quite a bit of inoffensive stuff on the user page too as far as I can tell, so outright deletion of the entire page is probably not in order, unless someone tries to edit-war the sections back in. If we do want to delete the page, an MfD is going to be the way to go. AS for the editor themself, I haven't looked too closely at their edits, so I dunno whether a block is appropriate or not (though I see you blocked Natubico already). Writ Keeper  04:05, 5 July 2014 (UTC)
          • Thanks. I saw a bunch of edits that seemed positive enough, at first glance anyway, so I'm hesitant to block. The other account (look at the user page) was an easy block--it represented an organization. Let's see; perhaps VKing has something to say on the matter. Thanks for the help, Drmies (talk) 04:09, 5 July 2014 (UTC)
            • I could be wrong, but I have a hunch that things will not end well for our Viking friend. Cullen328 Let's discuss it 04:13, 5 July 2014 (UTC)
              • He's also very concerned about our treatment of grass- link to Commons page. This guy ought to have a gig at the Leicester Comedy Festival. Xanthomelanoussprog (talk) 07:49, 5 July 2014 (UTC)
                • Having read his website and some of the delightful views expressed there ("Now, when all the violating of the natural Northern-European territory by subtropical invaders had reached the limit and made the Northern-Europide blood cooke finally, it may have been the subtropical elements, including the Jewish, who by that time already were in decisive positions, who canalised this anger thus, that it would bring them material gains. They made them colonise Asian and African countries, instead of invade the countries of former subtropical occupants in order to take a bloody revenge.", "The German government couldn't affort any more, to maintain all those Jews, concentrated in camps, it may have been forced, to reduce their number as painlessly as possible, because otherwise finally none of them could have been taken care of any more.", and so on) this guy is clearly either an outright troll or a fully paid-up neo-Nazi. As long as he limits himself to adding photos of Dutch and Belgian parks, which is what he seems mostly to be doing, that's fine, but I'm not going to waste any more time trying to engage with him. Mogism (talk) 11:39, 5 July 2014 (UTC)
                  • I have filed a request for information with Kafka, a Dutch investigation bureau/archive specialized in (extreem) right wing politics in The Netherlands. Let's see if they can shed a bit of light on this person. The Banner talk 12:25, 5 July 2014 (UTC)
  • I left VKing a note, and removed a silly list from their talk page--it should have been in a sandbox in the first place, but it's also a BLP violation since they themselves considered hair coloring as a possible cause of mental illness. In other words, if someone is on the "blond" list but they're a natural redhead, then being listed incorrectly will only serve to bring back the trauma, and the consequences of hair trauma are of course not studied well enough but likely disastrous. Drmies (talk) 14:48, 5 July 2014 (UTC)

Tiny glitch...[edit]

I promised not to interact with you-know-who, although his friends rejected (C) the peace proposal or just ignored it (S and A). But for the last few days I am looking at Template:Odense with two links to disambiguation pages. Could you give a note to "him" to get it fixed? The Banner talk 15:36, 5 July 2014 (UTC)

  • Ernst? (I'm not sure I like being intermediary.) Drmies (talk) 15:42, 5 July 2014 (UTC)
    • Should happen not too often... The Banner talk 16:08, 5 July 2014 (UTC)
Given that I do a fair amount of work with lists and you seem to do a fair amount of scrutinizing of disambiguation links I'd say quite the opposite actually and that it's likely to be a frequent occurrence. And the dab solving tool no longer exists... One wonders though why you would be spending a few days looking at a template I recently created though... You're quite welcome to help dab my templates or lists so long as it's constructive and you don't leave snarky edit summaries. Unlike you I have no problems with any editor making a constructive edit to things like that. Better to do that than report the "error" to Drmies every time it happens. ♦ Dr. Blofeld 16:27, 5 July 2014 (UTC)
I suggest Wikipedia:WPCleaner The Banner talk 17:18, 5 July 2014 (UTC)
I would suggest Link Classifier, it's changed my life, DABs show up in bright yellow background (and redirects with green text). Fully customizable as well. --kelapstick(bainuu) 17:29, 5 July 2014 (UTC)
Does it offer solutions for de dab-links? The Banner talk 17:58, 5 July 2014 (UTC)
Kelapstick I tried to add Link Classifier, and don't seem to have gotten it to work. Can you see if you can tell the problem (I know nothing about js code.) I did already have installed a related script that makes redirects green, but changes none of the other link colors. Maybe that conflicts? LadyofShalott 18:14, 5 July 2014 (UTC)
It doesn't offer a solution for DAB links, but it does highlight them, so they are much easier to recognize. I will have a look LoS. --kelapstick(bainuu) 18:16, 5 July 2014 (UTC)
Try purging your cache LoS, and see if it works. User:Anomie/linkclassifier would have been better for me to have linked. There is also an "on/off" button that can be installed, which I may try. My favourite is how it links pages nominated for deletion in red. --kelapstick(bainuu) 18:21, 5 July 2014 (UTC)
I did look into the wiki cleaner thing but it looked too technical so I didn't follow through.♦ Dr. Blofeld 18:35, 5 July 2014 (UTC)
Dr. Blofeld, my comment re link classifier was mainly directed at you, I find it handy when I preview an edit to see where the DABs and redirects are showing up without any effort, thus not requiring DAB solver, as they are captured before the edit is saved. --kelapstick(bainuu) 18:39, 5 July 2014 (UTC)

Just tried it and it cocked up by current coding so reverted it.♦ Dr. Blofeld 18:44, 5 July 2014 (UTC)

It's actually adding:
importScript('User:Anomie/linkclassifier.js'); // Linkback: [[User:Anomie/linkclassifier.js]]
importStylesheet('User:Anomie/linkclassifier.css'); // Linkback: [[User:Anomie/linkclassifier.css]]
My mistake in adding the wrong link above. --kelapstick(bainuu) 18:53, 5 July 2014 (UTC)
It still doesn't identify dab pages or wrong article links, only redirects, and in a lot of cases I don't want to see piped links also turning green within articles. I think I'll pass on it, thanks anyway.♦ Dr. Blofeld 20:16, 5 July 2014 (UTC)
Thanks for fixing it for me, K! I like it! LadyofShalott 21:15, 6 July 2014 (UTC)
  • Funny: I have no idea what any of you are talking about, and I'm going to keep it that way. :) Drmies (talk) 23:53, 5 July 2014 (UTC)

Zimmermanh1997 - Part Ugh![edit]

As you have previously dealt with this user, I am making you aware of the new SPI against User:Zimmermanh1997, which can be found here. - NeutralhomerTalk • 22:27, 5 July 2014 (UTC)

  • Thanks; and I see that Diannnaa has already taken care of matters. Drmies (talk) 23:54, 5 July 2014 (UTC)

DYK nomination of James McLemore[edit]

Symbol question.svg Hello! Your submission of James McLemore at the Did You Know nominations page has been reviewed, and some issues with it may need to be clarified. Please review the comment(s) underneath your nomination's entry and respond there as soon as possible. Thank you for contributing to Did You Know! Cloudchased (talk) 23:43, 5 July 2014 (UTC)

Contributions welcome[edit]

Your input concerning a repeated incident by another user at Wikipedia:Reliable sources/Noticeboard would be appreciated. Cheers. LRD NO (talk) 02:09, 6 July 2014 (UTC)

Further shenanigans at Ashwant Dwivedi[edit]

Drmies is presumably on the interstate, and I have stuck both my mouth and my foot in, so I wonder if other experienced editors/admins could have a look at Pacnews' edits, in particular stuff like this. (They've also added sources, albeit not strong ones, but I gave them a second final warning for blanking earlier today.) I'm hoping this can be resolved without a block, but Sitush was right to flag it further up the page, it needs further eyes on it - and maybe someone is a better diplomat than me. Yngvadottir (talk) 19:09, 6 July 2014 (UTC)

Well, pound to a penny we now have a sock. Any takers? - Sitush (talk) 21:04, 6 July 2014 (UTC)
Yes, Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/Pacnews The Banner talk 21:19, 6 July 2014 (UTC)
Thanks - at least someone else can see the suspicion. Actually, I suspect the socking has gone at that article pretty much since its creation but the gaps in time and AGF mean I would usually assume that it is a result of someone forgetting their password. This one is a bit more ... well, you've said it at the SPI. - Sitush (talk) 23:29, 6 July 2014 (UTC)
This SPI was quickly processed and the verdict is: "Technically indistinguishable" So, Mr admin-trainee Deor, another project to earn kudos. Face-smile.svg The Banner talk 10:12, 7 July 2014 (UTC)

Media review on FAC[edit]

Hello Drmies. Judging by your profile, you seem interested in Wiki's media files. I was thinking if you were able to check the non-free media (photos and audios) used in Megadeth, my FA nominee. The review page is here for comments. Everything the best.--Retrohead (talk) 09:58, 7 July 2014 (UTC)

Let me try it again...[edit]

Some time ago I posted here an draft article that I was not happy about due to lack of sources. That gave me some extra sources and made me launch that article. So, now I want to try it again but this time it is a bit more difficult. The case is Rôtisserie Rue du Bois. To make it harder, there are some confusing hits on the internet. Rôtisserie Rue du Bois was not part of Hotel Victory (mentioned on internet as Hotel Acsoay) but they did share an entrance at Van den Boschstraat 3 in Alkmaar. Main entrance for the restaurant, side-entrance for the hotel. Still it were different entities. Any help would be appreciated, even an advice to move it into the fridge. The Banner talk 13:44, 8 July 2014 (UTC)

Our Robocop Remake[edit]

Just reading about this. What the hell? It's, like... well, it's better than Sy-Fy at least. "Nearly every review that’s been written thus far highlights Fatal Farm’s contribution, which features an impressively long series of graphically exploding penises, which Seger describes as 'a real stand-out'." — Crisco 1492 (talk) 12:40, 10 July 2014 (UTC)

  • Don't tell Badmachine. It would kill him. Drmies (talk) 20:46, 10 July 2014 (UTC)

Don't tell me it is a good one[edit]

Older fawn boxer enjoys boating on Lake Lanier in Landrum, SC.

This is a single purpose account, with the one mission to edit the Boxer article and to put this picture in the article. and to put pictures about [the fish he catces on Wiki. [5]. We can't get rid of this dog, it keeps comming back as a bumerang. And it is not a good picture, (half the dog is in the shadow) and it shows more of the boat than of the dog, the dog sitts in a weird angle, there are a lot of weird shadows in the picture and it really has no encyclopedic value. Hafspajen (talk) 17:24, 10 July 2014 (UTC)

  • I left them a note. Happy dog, not a happy picture. Drmies (talk) 18:14, 10 July 2014 (UTC)
Oh, so you are here! Thank you! Hafspajen (talk) 18:21, 10 July 2014 (UTC)
No, I forbid you to move into a house around graves - every Chinese knows that is bad luck. Dutch should know that too. Hafspajen (talk) 18:45, 10 July 2014 (UTC)
  • Unfortunately this only ships to the US (unless I want to fork out an additional $100). I think you should get me one. Also, that house looks lovely, I'll take two. --kelapstick(bainuu) 18:38, 10 July 2014 (UTC)
  • That is the coolest cooler ever. De728631 (talk) 18:42, 10 July 2014 (UTC)
World class saucing company with years of experience making top shelf products- that would be Lea and Perrins. Xanthomelanoussprog (talk) 19:53, 10 July 2014 (UTC)
  • to boldly go where no man has gone before;Hafspajen (talk) 19:55, 10 July 2014 (UTC)
  • Older fawn boxer falls off boat, no lifejacket, sinks- Not wagging but drowning'. If you're trying to sell a house for $1.5 million, why write the description in ALL CAPS? Xanthomelanoussprog (talk) 20:45, 10 July 2014 (UTC)
  • You would not believe the neighborhood. The size of the lots, of the houses, and how tastelesslynouveau riche everything looks: I mean, the interior of this million and a half dollar home, whose stomach can handle that? They're all homes from the last decade or two, made to look, in that typical American way, like they're old--what they call "modern" here means something like "pre-flapper". Today was the day for lawn mowing, apparently: I must have seen a dozen crews at work (there's maybe two dozen homes in the area)--presumably the only time there's non-white people in the area. I knocked on a few doors for information on the cemetery; at one house the cars were in the driveway but no one answered, and I wonder if they just don't open for riff-raff. Mind you, this is just after I came from Mount Meigs, Alabama, part of which is historically black, and which butts up against Pike Road, Alabama, which is a white upper middle class expansion, now with its own school district and all. A very strange morning. Drmies (talk) 20:53, 10 July 2014 (UTC)

Your sage advice...[edit]

Hi Drmies, now that seemingly (hopefully?) that LB has made her last remark in the ARE process, I'd like to ask something of you. You advised in your comments that it would be good for me to use "more process". Beyond using and participating more on article Talk pages where LB is involved, did you have any other recommendations? Best regards, --Scalhotrod - Just your average banjo playing, drag racing, cowboy... (Talk) 20:55, 10 July 2014 (UTC)

  • Hey Hotrod--I hope my comments made clear that I have not been following those articles very closely. That particular case, as far as I could tell, was really about talk page discussion: contentious subject matter does, unfortunately, often involve copious amounts of talk page diplomacy. So that's all I have to say, really. It's not very sage, I'm afraid, and I can't say offhand what else you could be doing. Not edit warring (if that's what you were doing, or what they think you were doing) is always a good idea: one easily gets slammed with a block for that. But to speak the plain truth (to quote Blazing Saddles), I've outvolved myself from many such areas--guns, Korea massacres, flag icons, etc., and I'm feeling much better. Take care, and your opponent also, Drmies (talk) 21:17, 10 July 2014 (UTC)
  • I understand your desire to "outvolve" yourself entirely... :) One additional question, you just used the word "opponent". Admin EdJohnson did as well in the ARE. Truth be told, I don't consider LB or anyone here on WP an opponent. That kind of belief IMO would defeat the group effort nature of the site. I'm not ignorant to the fact that spirited, often heated, debates happen continuously on the site, but at the end of the day (to quote Rodney King) "Can't we all just get along?" That's the spirit in which I edit and make the effort (most of the time) to interact with others. --Scalhotrod - Just your average banjo playing, drag racing, cowboy... (Talk) 21:29, 10 July 2014 (UTC)
  • It's especially on Wikipedia that I think the word actually is appropriate, since that's very often how these things go here, unfortunately. But really that's by the by. Drmies (talk) 00:27, 11 July 2014 (UTC)


I have serious doubts about this totally unreferenced article, List of animals representing first-level administrative country subdivisions. I asked a Canadian editor living in Japan since 1987 if the Cairn terrier indeed is [6] the Ehime prefectures animal and he said no, it is the Japanese river otter. Many of those animals mentioned has nothing to do with Japan, More weird, the Aichi prefecture has Great Dane, ? according to article, also Hyōgo prefecture has Great Dane, ? ... Kumamoto prefecture - Pug, and intensly weird - Tochigi prefecture has Puli? how on earth, the Puli is Hungary's national symbol. Hiroshima ... has Basilosaurus. These look like jokes to me. Those animals like Great Dane, Puli has nothing to do with Japan. And Fukuoka prefecture has Appaloosa horse, that is an American horse. Hafspajen (talk) 00:04, 11 July 2014 (UTC)

This strikes me as much more reliable version Hafspajen (talk) 00:49, 11 July 2014 (UTC)

SOOOO, it was Anselm, - here - revert to original. Sherlock Holmes (talk) 00:49, 11 July 2014 (UTC)