User talk:Factor-ies

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Hello. There is currently a discussion at Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. Thank you.Hullaballoo Wolfowitz (talk) 00:11, 2 June 2013 (UTC) Welcome!

Welcome message[edit]

Hello, Factor-ies, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions.

I notice that one of the first articles you edited was Louis Lozowick, which appears to be dealing with a topic with which you may have a conflict of interest. In other words, you may find it difficult to write about that topic in a neutral and objective way, because you are, work for, or represent, the subject of that article. Your recent contributions may have already been undone for this very reason.

To reduce the chances of your contributions being undone, you might like to draft your revised article before submission, and then ask me or any other editor to proofread it. See our help page on userspace drafts for more details. If the page you created has already been deleted from Wikipedia, but you want to save the content from it to use for that draft, don't hesitate to ask anyone from this list and they will copy it to your user page.

One firm rule we do have in connection with conflicts of interest is that accounts used by more than one person will unfortunately be blocked from editing. Wikipedia generally does not allow editors to have usernames which imply that the account belongs to a company or corporation. If you have a username like this, you should request a change of username or create a new account. (A name that identifies the user as an individual within a given organization may be OK.)

Here are some pages that you might find helpful:

I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! Please sign your messages on talk pages using four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically insert your username and the date. If you need help, check out Wikipedia:Questions, ask me on my talk page, or ask your question on this page and then place {{help me}} before the question. Again, welcome! – S. Rich (talk) 00:40, 5 July 2013 (UTC)

More advice[edit]

I posted the message above because I saw your comments on the ANI page. Perhaps a belated welcome will help you understand what is going on. Two difficulties are apparent: One, you have a conflict of interest in adding material which refers to your gallery and the artists that exhibit there. Two, the material you've added does not have citations based on reliable sources. In Wikipedia, the burden is on the editor who wants to add or remove material to justify the edit. In your case, you did not meet the burden in providing a source for the material. Your nemesis, Hullaballo, was entirely correct in removing it. So, what should you do? First, don't expect much to result from the ANI you posted. That is an area of Wikipedia that more experienced editors get involved in and you were in over your head when posting the notice. Not a problem, though, because that discussion will be closed with no action taken. But your COI remains. I recommend adding information about yourself on your WP:USERPAGE and declare your COI. At that point, when you want to post something about your gallery or yourself, you post something on the article talk page and justify the proposed addition. For example, when the NYT has an article about an artist in your gallery, you say "This NYT article discusses such-and-such (and provide the citation) which I would like to add to the article. I raise this because I am the owner of the gallery in question." If, after a while, no one objects you go ahead and post the info. Be advised, though, that WP:NOTNEWS and WP:NOTDIRECTORY will apply. So even if the NYT has an article that does not mean the info is encyclopedic. Lastly, I suggest you post something on the ANI that says "I have received guidance about COI on my talk page. I intend to review it and abide by WP policies. Please close this discussion." If you've got questions, post them here. I will watch this page for a week or so. Happy editing. And Happy Fourth of July! – S. Rich (talk) 00:57, 5 July 2013 (UTC)

Dear S. Rich, I want to thank you for your comments, which I whole-heartedly appreciate. I have a question. Your recommendation is excellent, that when I have information about myself or my gallery to add to an article, I post it first on the article talk page and allow for comment within the Wikipedia community. Yours is a wise idea, and I shall follow your advice. Only out of curiosity, is that an actual Wikipedia set policy, a Wikipedia suggestion, or your own common sense. Even if it is a set policy, you are the only one to suggest it--so kudos to you! The second difficulty you raise, that my material did not have citations based on [[WP:RS|reliable sources, indicates, I think, that you had not read my contributions before writing this letter to me. That is understandable, as you are offering me general advise. In your good nature, you are accepting Mr. Wolfowitz' version of the facts. In reality some of the articles he deleted as "unsourced" were perfectly sourced. Now, in a new development, Mr. Wolfowitz wrote a comment on the ANI that verifies my contention that his edits were personally, not neutrally, motivated. His motivation seems to be a retribution for some imagined wrong that he perceives me to have done to my artist and friend, Al Hirschfeld. Given this new development, I am not asking the discussion to be closed. I have responded to his comment some hours ago. In the near future I may accept your kind offer to review my contributions before I upload them. But for now I will close this letter with Happy Seventh of July! Margo Feiden Factor-ies (talk) 14:49, 7 July 2013 (UTC)
Perhaps to clarify. WP:RS refers to reliable source, like the NYT. Along with that, we have verifiability, meaning other editors can get to the source via the internet, or in published material. When it comes to citing yourself, e.g., articles/books/etc. that you may have written, look at WP:SELFCITE. I am not going to parse the particular edits that you and Wolfwitz made, but I have the feeling that Wolfwitz was correct in the various changes. But I and many other editors remain accessible to answer your questions. For but one example/resource, look at WP:HELPDESK. – S. Rich (talk) 15:10, 7 July 2013 (UTC)

Please give me some credit--the contributions that I say were sourced were certainly not self-sourced. HW has a history of very disruptive editing, and has been blocked because of that on at least one occasion. He also repeatedly broke with Wikipedia's policies, and when other editors unknown to me undid his edits, HW went back and deleted the material all over again. Factor-ies (talk) 16:48, 7 July 2013 (UTC) (This post continues on for 3 more sentences)I'm afraid that before one can make a sound judgment in this case, one must go through it contribution by contribution. However, I expect to follow your excellent suggestion and post my contribution first on the article talk page and allow for comment within the Wikipedia community, That should steel me against HW continuing to behave as he has done. Factor-ies (talk) 16:54, 7 July 2013 (UTC)

Here's what I recommend WRT (with regard to) the ANI you posted. Put {{resolved}} at the top of your comments/top of the section. (Just copy & paste {{resolved}}.) These ANI threads become mere drama, and they often turn on the person who started the thread. By posting resolved, everyone can move on. – S. Rich (talk) 17:42, 7 July 2013 (UTC)
As you said you did not want to continue the discussion, I posted {{resolved}} on the ANI. At this point I am taking your userpage off of my watchlist. If you'd like to contact me, please feel free to do so by adding a comment on this page. And add {{TB|Factor-ies}} ({{TB}}) on my talk page. This will let me know you've left a message here and I will respond. Happy editing. – S. Rich (talk) 01:34, 9 July 2013 (UTC)
I suggest that you leave the ANI discussion alone. The particular discussion you started will automatically archive after 36 hours of inactivity. If you respond, the 36 hour clock will restart. IMHO, there is nothing to be gained by keeping the discussion open. I am not offering any opinion as to whether Hullaballo is correct or not. Only that the matter is one which is basically closed as far as the allegations and counter-allegations go. (As above, if you want me to answer here, leave a "Talk back" message on my user page.) – S. Rich (talk) 03:01, 10 July 2013 (UTC)


Thank you again for your excellent advice. I have proposed some new content at Talk: Don Freeman and Talk: Ruth Gikow as you suggested. I look forward to hearing your thoughts. Thanks again, Factor-ies (talk) 02:55, 20 July 2013 (UTC)

I've taken a quick look. Right off the bat, using a paid advert as a reference is not going to work. So modify your proposed edit by striking out that line. (See the Wiki markup <s></s> immediately below.) Next, you are going to face resistance over the fact that most of the references are simply "Goings on". From my visits to NYC, I recall looking at that New Yorker section to find events, but that did not make the occurrence of such events significant in and of themselves. Compare, if the artists are exhibiting in MMOA that is significant because MMOA has its own notability. Next, two of the references you post are the CSM and Daily News. They are good WP:RS (especially when compared with Goings on). Well, with that in mind you can modify the edit so that the references can be incorporated into the article. But you must make your edits about Freeman and Gikow. The involvement of the gallery is incidental, so as written the proposed edit won't work because of the weight given to the gallery. Lastly, you might post your proposed edits (after modification) on the WikiProject Visual Arts talk page (See: Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Visual arts.) Be a Wikipedian first, and galleryist second. Look at Ideological Turing Test for guidance. – S. Rich (talk) 03:36, 20 July 2013 (UTC)

Suggestions[edit]

You might put in the following template at the top of the talk pages where you have a request. {{edit request}}. Click on the link for more information. As a real life example, look at Talk:Education Management Corporation. Also, a {{connected contributor}} template on the top of those other articles may be appropriate. Regards. – S. Rich (talk) 05:07, 25 July 2013 (UTC)