User talk:Iryna Harpy

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hello, I've edited article about Ukrainians but you changed it, I'm not sure what was the reason, people I've added have Ukrainian ancestors.


Weihnachten10.gif Happy Holiday Cheer
Season's Greetings! This message celebrates the holiday season, promotes WikiLove, and hopefully makes your day a little better. Spread the seasonal good cheer by wishing another user an Awesome Holiday and a Happy New Year, whether it be someone with whom you had disagreements in the past, a good friend, or just some random person. Share the good feelings! Joys! Paine
Thank you, Paine Ellsworth. Wishing you and yours a wonderful festive season! --Iryna Harpy (talk) 02:44, 24 December 2014 (UTC)
Pleasure! – Paine  (and thank you, too!)
I wish you the same, Iryna. I'm glad I'm not down in the southern hemisphere heat. I quite like having a proper winter. RGloucester 16:12, 24 December 2014 (UTC)
Thank you, RGloucester. I feel quite the same about our weather, particularly as winters have become very mild and the warm weather extends over a far more protracted period than it did when I was younger. Happy Christmas! --Iryna Harpy (talk) 21:56, 24 December 2014 (UTC)


Dear Iryna, First of all, Merry Christmas! All the best to you in upcoming 2015 year. And, secondly, as I understand, it is uncommon to translate one part of the geographic name: Cabo Verde, not Green Cabo; Bila Tserkva, not White Tserkva; Bilyi Cheremosh, not White Cheremosh. You can find name White and Black Cheremosh on some rafting sites, but not in the serious sources. For example, in Kubijovyc`s Encyclopedia of Ukraine, UofT Press, vol.1, p.415 is written "... the river is formed by the confluence of Chornyi Cheremosh (87 km long with a basin of 856 sq km) and the Bilyi Cheremosh (61 km long..." etc. Thus I assume in the Cheremosh article have to be as I edited yesterday. With best wishes, Mykola Swarnyk (talk) 06:19, 25 December 2014 (UTC)

Thank you for the Christmas greetings, and wishing you the same. Considering the lack of English language reliable sources using the convention of Black Cheremosh, rather than Chornyi Cheremosh, I would agree with you, particularly given that the translation is in the body of the article. I'll revert myself. Cheers! --Iryna Harpy (talk) 09:36, 25 December 2014 (UTC)
Ah, I see you've done it already. Good to see you developing the article further. Happy editing! --Iryna Harpy (talk) 09:38, 25 December 2014 (UTC)

RT Talk[edit]

I'm confused by your last post. I made no comment on the quality of Al Jazeera. After re-reading the other recent relevant posts I'm not sure if you meant it for someone else or if my wording has caused a misunderstanding. Hope you're having a great Christmas! --Trappedinburnley (talk) 10:04, 25 December 2014 (UTC)

Second Battle of Donetsk airport[edit]

Russian Wiki has BOTH Ukrainian AND rebel claims listed in It specifically includes both "old terminal being controlled by rebels and new one by UA" claim and meeting between rebel and UA commanders, and Ukrainian claim of control over airport - all of them.

I don't really understand why English one should just drop separatists' claims altogether, given that they are widely reported as well.

I just wonder how it's possible to call for "neutral point of view" on an article that ONLY lists even completely unfounded claims from officials of single party to the conflict (I'm not saying all claims are unfounded - but some like >500 Russians killed are just gross) while not mentioning claims that actually have wider reporting (see amount of sources for rebel and UA commanders' meeting, from the whole media spectrum) and have 50-minute videos around (

If you consider some of the sources unreliable, feel free to remove those, but then please remove unfounded Ukraininan claims as well and keep the reliable ones instead of just reverting edits.— Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 05:21, 26 December 2014 (UTC)

This is not Russian Wikipedia, it's English Wikipedia... and we adhere to policies, guidelines which probably don't tally with your POV with what WP:NPOV means. Read the NPOV information carefully: all articles rely on reliable sources and not personal interpretations of primary sources (also known as original research). Thank you for your understanding, and do familiarise yourself with our policies and guidelines. --Iryna Harpy (talk) 06:03, 26 December 2014 (UTC)
And this is not Ukrainian wikipedia as well. Please, read the policies yourself and actually look at how many reliable sources the edit you reverted had. If you want to improve it, just remove the unreliable ones, reverting the whole edit that has many reliable sources is just plain wrong. (talk) 14:00, 26 December 2014 (UTC)


--BoguSlav 05:08, 30 December 2014 (UTC)

Keep up the good work! Face-smile.svg --Iryna Harpy (talk) 05:11, 30 December 2014 (UTC)

Happy New Year Iryna Harpy![edit]

Thank you, Hafspajen. Wishing you the same... and adding a big thank you for all of your hard work over the years, particularly for your work in the field of images for articles! --Iryna Harpy (talk) 22:34, 31 December 2014 (UTC)
I want to join the greetings and wish you the best New Year. З Новим Роком і Різдвом Христовим! Aleksandr Grigoryev (talk) 00:56, 1 January 2015 (UTC)

And in return[edit]

Happy New Year Iryna Harpy![edit]

Happy New Year Iryna Harpy![edit]

З новим роком !![edit]

Have a happy and prosperous New Year my friend. And peace. I can't say that enough. --Taivo (talk) 03:55, 1 January 2015 (UTC)

A sentiment I thoroughly commend and second. Best wishes, and enjoy that warmth over there! (And thanks for your close work on those contentious articles like Ukraine et al) Nishidani (talk) 09:31, 1 January 2015 (UTC)

Happy New Year Iryna Harpy![edit]


Thanks, same to you. Żyrafał (talk) 13:36, 1 January 2015 (UTC)

Happy New Year Iryna Harpy![edit]

Happy New Year![edit]

Fuochi d'artificio.gif

Dear Iryna Harpy,
HAPPY NEW YEAR Hoping 2015 will be a great year for you! Thank you for your contributions!
From a fellow editor,
--FWiW Bzuk (talk)

This message promotes WikiLove. Originally created by Nahnah4 (see "invisible note").

Thanks, you too[edit]

Happy New Year Iryna Harpy![edit]

Chris Troutman (talk) 01:04, 2 January 2015 (UTC)

Re:Happy New Year Anupam![edit]

Dear User:Iryna Harpy, I really appreciate your new year's wishes! I hope that you had an enjoyable night to bring in 2015! With regards, AnupamTalk 02:05, 2 January 2015 (UTC)


Thanks Iryna, happy new year to you too! Cheers, --Therexbanner (talk) 02:14, 2 January 2015 (UTC)

Happy New Year![edit]

Happy New Year![edit]

new year greeting[edit]

happynewyear — Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 21:44, 5 January 2015 (UTC)

Thank you. Happy New Year to you, too. --Iryna Harpy (talk) 21:54, 5 January 2015 (UTC)

You've got mail![edit]

Hello, Iryna Harpy. Please check your email – you've got mail!
Message added 22:35, 5 January 2015 (UTC). It may take a few minutes from the time the email is sent for it to show up in your inbox. You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{You've got mail}} or {{YGM}} template.

RGloucester 22:35, 5 January 2015 (UTC)

Happy New Year![edit]

Hi Iryna, so sorry for the late reply, I didn't see the message until now as I wasn't on Wikipedia. Thank you so much and Happy New Year to you too! I wish you a lot of success! Thank you for the discussions and I hope we can collaborate and discuss in future edits. Smart Nomad (talk) 00:03, 7 January 2015 (UTC)

My pleasure, Smart Nomad. Wishing you a wonderful New Year and, yes, by all means it would be chuffed to work in collaboration with you again! --Iryna Harpy (talk) 00:13, 7 January 2015 (UTC)


Fairy and Flower.jpg

"My brain is away with the fairies" diff - what a nice phrase! Joshua Jonathan -Let's talk! 07:28, 8 January 2015 (UTC)

The Signpost: 07 January 2015[edit]

What is the population of Russia?[edit]

There are two opinions, see eg. the Demographics of Russia or List of countries and dependencies by population.Xx234 (talk) 08:31, 10 January 2015 (UTC)

With the May 2014 annexation of Crimea, the population of Russia has increased to over 146 million. Demographics of Russia;
The population of Russia includes Crimea and Sevastopol. List of countries and dependencies by population Xx234 (talk) 07:42, 20 January 2015 (UTC)
Apologies for not getting back to you sooner regarding this matter. A lot of these articles have fallen behind, or have been usurped by POV contributors. I think the balanced way in which to address this is as it has been done on the Russia article where the demographics show the population with and without Crimea in order not to breach WP:RECENTISM and WP:NOTNEWS, but still acknowledge facts on the ground.
Please feel free to ping me from the talk pages of any of the articles you think need to be discussed. Cheers! --Iryna Harpy (talk) 09:18, 20 January 2015 (UTC)


The part altered had no source nor does reflect reality. I'm altering again. Thanks. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Junipher2189 (talkcontribs) 23:46, 11 January 2015 (UTC)

Please leave a comment on the talk page of the article stating that you've removed it, as well as your rationale. In that way, should anyone try to restore it, there is a record of the removal and a point from which to discuss the issue with other editors. Cheers! --Iryna Harpy (talk) 23:54, 11 January 2015 (UTC)

The Signpost: 14 January 2015[edit]


Thanks for template-izing the dab note in laganas. Unfortunately, you changed its content as well as its form, so it no longer made sense, and another editor deleted it.... I have corrected it. --Macrakis (talk) 19:40, 17 January 2015 (UTC)

Ah, I see what you were trying to accomplish. I've now hatnoted the appropriate pages at Tracta and Tracta (dough), and LaganasI hope that's what you were trying to accomplish. Cheers! --Iryna Harpy (talk) 00:00, 18 January 2015 (UTC)
Thanks, I've made a few more tweaks to those. In particular, in general, articles entitled X (Y) don't need a dabnote to X. See WP:D : "There is not always a need to add disambiguation links to a page whose name already clearly distinguishes itself from the generic term. " --Macrakis (talk) 00:08, 18 January 2015 (UTC)
(talk page stalker) Actually, I now made Lagana a dab page – there's no evidence that the resort is the primary topic, and I've never heard it referred to without 's', so the issue is now moot. I removed the hatnote consequently. Regards, No such user (talk) 12:44, 20 January 2015 (UTC)
Cheers for that, No such user. Commendations on simple and rational solution! --Iryna Harpy (talk) 21:59, 21 January 2015 (UTC)

Wolfsangel in modern Ukraine[edit]

Hi. You reverted my edit "In Ukraine it (wolfsangel) was used by SNPU (Social-National Party of Ukraine)[1] till 2004 and is currently used by Neo-Nazi Social-National Assembly[2] and Azov Battalion[3]" speaking about some Shestakov. As you can see there is no such persons in that source. Please be more attentive. Also you wrote on my talk page "If you wish to portray Ukrainians as fanatical nationalists who'd cut your throat as soon as look at you". It is unappropriate, i am Ukrainian myself so it is disgusting to me to read such things (to see Nazi in my country also, naturally). Cathry (talk) 07:20, 17 January 2015 (UTC)

Cathry, Shestakov is what New Yorker Jews call a putz. He is a student who reads too much useless paper and come up with his own pseudo-ideas for the purpose to completely discredit history of Ukraine depicting Ukrainians practically identical with Nazis. There was a reason why Ukrainians never were acknowledged as a side at the Nuremberg Trial. The sign that you referred is known as Idea of Nation (I/N), not Wolfsangel as Shestakov tries to depict, first of all. Second of all, since Oleh Tyahnybok became a head of party he introduced a lot of changes and the party's program oscillated away from a radical nationalism to moderate with elements of socialism. Svoboda is less radical than the Right Sector and has some disagreements with the current Social National Assembly society in Ukraine. Aleksandr Grigoryev (talk) 21:33, 17 January 2015 (UTC)
I did not use any "Shestakov"'s materials. OUN is described as fascist organization by many historians, so is Iron Guard for example. Interesting similarity with sign i referred to Cathry (talk) 22:40, 17 January 2015 (UTC)
"since Oleh Tyahnybok became a head of party" - lol Cathry (talk) 22:41, 17 January 2015 (UTC)
I used "Shestakov" as an abbreviation for Shekhovtsov because I couldn't even be bothered double-checking the spelling of an unknown PhD student (i.e., doesn't even have his doctorate yet) who likes to opine and present the same WP:OR you're so fond of. His op-ed articles are found exclusively at, and carries the same validity as any other blog-come-forum: zero, unless it's by a recognised authority and, even then, must be weighed carefully as to whether the 'authority' is a known Ukrainophobe, in which case the use of this authority in context needs to be discussed per WP:CON according to how reliable they actually have been in their career, and whether they are seen as being contentious by well established peers. Would you like to publish your own op-ed based on your POV analysis at openDemocracy? Here's the link. It's that simple.
While we're on the subject of pushing your personal analysis (AKA WP:OR), the parallels you're drawing between Wolfsangel are your own: "Oooh, I can see it! It must be true." Also, keep your 'LOL's to yourself on my talk page. I'm not even vaguely interested in engaging with you on your level yet again, and I have even less interest in your trying to engage in this manner with other editors discussing what is encyclopaedic and what is scraping the bottom of the barrel of cyberspace's blogs and forums in order to cherry pick material that you want to shoehorn. Enough of your WP:COATRACKing articles.
Oh, and incidentally, Umland's credentials are lay bare by his being a member of Valdai International Discussion Club: a Ukrainophobe right wing think tank posturing as being left-of-centre, funded and maintained by the RF. They do try to look credible by allowing a certain level of Russophobic sentiment, but it's all under control and guaranteed not to poke more than a couple of tiny holes into Putin's administration. Good luck with getting his extremist views accepted at the RSN. --Iryna Harpy (talk) 23:23, 17 January 2015 (UTC)

Buhas bus attack[edit]

Iryno, could you please check the article? Some people refuse acknowledge that event as a terrorist act for some bizarre reason. Aleksandr Grigoryev (talk) 21:25, 17 January 2015 (UTC)

Iryna, there's been at least one 3RR report about this article. See Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Edit warring#User:Leftcry reported by User:My very best wishes (Result: Warned). It appears that you commented on the report. I'm unclear if there has been any consensus on using the term 'terrorism' in this area. Leftcry is one of the people reverting the 'terrorism' allegation about certain groups. Let me know if you have any ideas. Thanks, EdJohnston (talk) 06:46, 19 January 2015 (UTC)
It's another one of those murky situations in which I'd be reticent to use 'terrorism' unless it's attributed to both sides using the term regarding the incident, EdJohnston. I'm happy to elaborate here. If you'd prefer, I'll take my observations about the reports to the article's talk page. --Iryna Harpy (talk) 09:06, 19 January 2015 (UTC)
Yes, the article talk page would be best. If you can add any links to prior discussions, that would be useful. Thanks, EdJohnston (talk) 14:00, 19 January 2015 (UTC)
  • Don't bother getting mixed up in this nonsense, Iryna. That IP is most likely Nickst. See this SPI I filed. RGloucester 00:48, 21 January 2015 (UTC)

Your 3RR report[edit]

I think this is generally a very bad idea to report someone to 3RRNB when each of you made 3 reverts. I do understand, however, that editing by this user is highly problematic. Here is just a random example [1]. What "German police in 1941" he refers to? Schutzstaffel? My very best wishes (talk) 15:21, 19 January 2015 (UTC)

@My very best wishes: Yes, I realise that now. Issuing myself a trout slap. I was so busy trying to keep up with all the alerts on articles on my watchlist that I ended up confusing myself as to where I was up to on reverts with the user in point, and on which articles. Getting him to engage in BRD on the talk pages is a lost cause until after the fact when he leaves inarticulate, off the point comments and accusations simultaneously and expects that I should respond instantly doesn't help with the confusion.
As regards the "German police in 1941", your guess is as good as mine. Much of his information is gleaned from forums, blogs and extremist sites. He, then, searches out supporting evidence for his POV in more reliable (albeit BIASED sources) in order to shoehorn content. Again, the fact that his English is poor only adds to the frustration in trying to decipher what the content involves.
Here is something to read. But I will not be around here, at least for a while. Good luck! My very best wishes (talk) 22:08, 19 January 2015 (UTC)
Thanks for that, My very best wishes. I hadn't encountered that excellent essay before. Bookmarked! --Iryna Harpy (talk) 22:12, 21 January 2015 (UTC)

Odd question: floor numbering[edit]

This might seem odd. Do you know what style of floor numbering Ukraine uses? In working on the Donetsk airport article, there is some confusion over which scheme to use. At the moment, it is mixed. We have some "second floors", and some "first floors", both referring to the same floor. RGloucester 00:40, 22 January 2015 (UTC)

@RGloucester:No, it's not a strange question. Ekograf and I were trying to work it out a couple of months ago as the article used as the main reference was written by a Ukrainian who, I suspect, was confusing 'logical' floor numbering system with the US system. I tried to find some form of floor plans to confirm my suspicions, but was unable to find anything at that time.
Ground floor would be the equivalent of 'low floor', unlike the US 1st floor, so I feel fairly confident that the author has confused it with 'basement'. What that would mean is that there was a ground floor, a first floor, a second floor, and a third floor (parallel to UK and Australian convention). The 'cyborgs' would have been holding down the first and second floors, while the separatists infiltrated the top remaining floor (3rd floor) and the ground floor.
I'll run a search again in Ukrainian for the floorplans as they may have been released. Wish me luck. --Iryna Harpy (talk) 03:12, 22 January 2015 (UTC)
Much obliged, Iryna. I will await your reply. RGloucester 03:54, 22 January 2015 (UTC)
@RGloucester: Nope: no joy. All I've been able to come up with is the same info as before, being articles about Yanukovich opening the terminal (here + here + here, etc.), as well as various ministerial planning meetings. All of this material simply confirms is that the building had 7 floors.
It did remind me, however, that the dispute with Ekograf was actually over the fact that there were only 3 floors remaining. In other words, the cyborgs were only holding down 1 floor (being the first floor), while the separatists had infiltrated the top remaining floor (the second floor) and the ground floor (which tallies with photos of the separatists lurking around pillars where the glass had been blown out of the windows taken at the time). In keeping with other international airports, there would have been no basement. The carpark was located near the terminal as is the standard. Ah, well, that's my opinion. Again, all of the sources certainly suggested that the Ukrainian special forces were holding down one remaining area. Sorry, but that's the best I can do as I have to log off for the day. Cheers! --Iryna Harpy (talk) 05:22, 22 January 2015 (UTC)
No problem. My understanding is that the cyborgs were on the 1st floor (UK-style), and that the ground floor, basement, and second floor were under separatist control. There definitely is a basement, or some kind of subterranean complex. There are tunnels under the terminal building that lead to various other airport buildings. Separatists used these to infiltrate the basement. Cyborgs said that they threw burning tyres in to smoke them out... RGloucester 05:26, 22 January 2015 (UTC)
When in doubt, best to write as the source says. EkoGraf (talk) 06:29, 22 January 2015 (UTC)
The sources conflict, because British sources use British-style numbering, and American sources use American-style numbering. English-language Ukrainian sources vary in what system they use, which is what causes the problem. RGloucester 06:32, 22 January 2015 (UTC)
And when in double doubt, quote them. EkoGraf (talk) 06:36, 22 January 2015 (UTC)
The obvious solution is to go to the original Ukrainian sources, and see what they say. I've already done that, now, and I understand that the Ukrainians were on the UK-style first floor. RGloucester 06:41, 22 January 2015 (UTC)
I don't have any doubt that the Ukrainians were only defending the one floor (in fact, it would make no sense for them to try and cover more than one floor when on the defensive, particularly as they didn't know how many of the enemy would be coming). Getting serious military training from childhood (in Plast - I kid you not) provided me with good grounding. Don't believe that Ukrainian Plast was always as sweet and wholesome as the article makes it sound: it wasn't an Anglophone world scout programme. If you think Baden-Powell's original programme was a tad gruesome, you'd probably pass out if you knew the kind of survival (and attack) techniques we earned our badges in.
Back on topic, I can see where the basement would come into it. Reading the budgetary and other planning stages materials, the terminal was planned to have 6 floors. I'd have to assume that the basement wasn't counted as being one of the floors at that phase if it served another function. Good work in figuring it out that the separatists were had the basement, ground and second floors. --Iryna Harpy (talk) 09:33, 22 January 2015 (UTC)

The Signpost: 21 January 2015[edit]

Reference Errors on 23 January[edit]

Hello, I'm ReferenceBot. I have automatically detected that an edit performed by you may have introduced errors in referencing. It is as follows:

Please check this page and fix the errors highlighted. If you think this is a false positive, you can report it to my operator. Thanks, ReferenceBot (talk) 00:18, 24 January 2015 (UTC)

Fixed Cheers! --Iryna Harpy (talk) 00:25, 24 January 2015 (UTC)

2014-15 Russian military intervention in Ukraine[edit]

Hi Iryna, I have noticed you posting in the articles re. the Ukrainian crisis. Since you seem to hold some authority I was wondering if you could clarify something for me. I've been trying to clean up the lead of 2014-15 Russian military intervention in Ukraine.

However, I am running into some difficulty and the root of that seems to be that the article is ill defined. There is a lot of information that either has no subcategory or more correctly goes into a different page. The main point of difference seems to be the status and repatriation of Russian soldiers, so I was wondering if that is the direction the article should head towards since all the other parts have their own respective main page (Crimea, War in Donbass, International reactions to x,y,z etc.)

I can still attempt to clean up the lead, but I feel it would be easier if I had a firm grasp on what actually belongs in the article, as opposed to a some other article. Thanks Hollth (talk) 06:20, 24 January 2015 (UTC)

Casualties of the war in Donbass[edit]

Created the article Casualties of the war in Donbass. If you can do something to improve and expand it that would be great. EkoGraf (talk) 07:20, 25 January 2015 (UTC)