User talk:Katangais

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Orphaned non-free image File:ACStrange 01.jpg[edit]

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File:ACStrange 01.jpg listed for deletion[edit]

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Use of Old SA Flag[edit]

Hi. I noticed that you added the old South African flag to the Glen Syndercombe article. Firstly, thanks for your edits. I keep an eye on a number of military biographies and I think its time to start removing the old SA flag from articles like this - see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:INFOBOXFLAG#Avoid_flag_icons_in_infoboxes.

Replace it with South Africa - no flag - would be my recommendation. The Navy flag template is another story - I think thats OK as is Gbawden (talk) 10:59, 15 August 2012 (UTC)

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Rhodesia lead[edit]

I appreciate that the lead of the article needs to be "short and sweet", as you put it, but as it is the lead is somewhat misleading and doesn't give proper context. I really do think it was better as I had it. If you think it might be better to trim down the version of the lead I wrote, perhaps we should do that. Here are some issues I have with the present lead:

  1. "it occupied the region presently known as Zimbabwe"; seems to imply it might not be known as Zimbabwe in the future, I would prefer "now Zimbabwe"; "renamed Zimbabwe in 1980" is even better as it gives more context.
  2. "based in Salisbury"; I know you mean the seat of government, but this still sounds strange to me. I would not say the entire United Kingdom was based in London.
  3. "was considered an immediate successor state to"; no it wasn't. Only Rhodesia itself considered itself anything remotely close to this. The rest of the world said it was a colony in rebellion.
  4. "the former British dependency of Southern Rhodesia." Again this is misleading. "the former" could be taken as POV, as it lends perhaps undue credence to UDI (which I personally think was legitimate, by the by, but we have to be neutral here). "British dependency" is wrong, as before 1965 Southern Rhodesia was called a colony (a self-governing one), not a dependency. "British Dependency of Southern Rhodesia" was the name used during the interim period of British rule between Zimbabwe Rhodesia and Zimbabwe (December 1979 to April 1980).
  5. "During an effort to thwart future transition to indigenous African rule"; Not sure this is true. I would say they were trying to block an immediate transition, as this was what was being threatened. Neither the 1961 nor 1965 constitutions impeded on black political progress, nor even the 1969 one, incidentally, though the last of these did limit black aspirations to potentially being equal partners in government with the white community once blacks collectively contributed enough tax.
  6. "Rhodesia's white settlers"; could be taken as POV again, as many (though not all) of the whites were locally-born, or born in South Africa. Smith himself was born in Selukwe (now Shurugwi), for example.
  7. "UDI regime"; could be taken as POV again as "regime" is a loaded word implying the government is illegitimate and/or oppressive.
  8. "conceded to biracial democracy"; I'm not sure this is fair. Smith took part in negotiations throughout the 1970s, all of which had some form of multiracial rule as their objective. Up until the 1978 Internal Settlement they failed, granted, but the failure of the previous talks had far more to do with the perhaps excessive demands of ZANU and ZAPU than the stance taken by Smith.
  9. "A provisional government subsequently headed by Smith and his ally Abel Muzorewa"; this is again rather misleading. Muzorewa headed the Zimbabwe Rhodesian government alone; Smith was just a minister without portfolio. And to call Muzorewa "Smith['s] ... ally" is rather spurious, considering they were political opponents right up to the Internal Settlement.
  10. "The state was officially christened after Sir Cecil Rhodes" seems to imply Smith's government actually did this at some point after 1965.

I look forward to working together on the lead. As I say above, I really do recommend you have another look at the lead I wrote, and perhaps trim it down if you think it's too long. Thanks, and I hope you're well Cliftonian (talk) 07:19, 24 August 2012 (UTC)

New Message![edit]

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Disambiguation link notification for September 11[edit]

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WikiProject Namibia[edit]

Hi Katangais, I see that you frequently edit articles on the history of Namibia. Just wanted to make you aware of the existence of Wikipedia:WikiProject Namibia, maybe you want to become a member? Cheers, Pgallert (talk) 10:37, 16 September 2012 (UTC)

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Disambiguation link notification for October 2[edit]

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Flags in infoboxes[edit]

Please do not add national flags to infoboxes as you did to R4 assault rifle. See WP:INFOBOXFLAG for further information. Thank you. Socrates2008 (Talk) 10:52, 10 October 2012 (UTC)

Talkback[edit]

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Roger (talk) 07:49, 22 October 2012 (UTC)

Getting Africa Peer Review Working[edit]

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Lisbon Appt[edit]

Hey Katangais, I hope you're well. I've just nominated the Lisbon Appointment article I wrote at FAC; I hope I don't seem presumptuous, but as somebody I've often worked with on Rhodesia-related articles, I thought you might be interested. Keep well, and have a good weekend! Cliftonian (talk) 09:43, 9 November 2012 (UTC)

November 2012[edit]

Please do not add or change content, as you did to Frank Schoeman, without verifying it by citing reliable sources. Please review the guidelines at Wikipedia:Citing sources and take this opportunity to add references to the article. Thank you. GiantSnowman 08:51, 19 November 2012 (UTC)

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April 2013[edit]

Please do not assume ownership of articles such as Vortex (novel). If you aren't willing to allow your contributions to be edited extensively or be redistributed by others, please do not submit them. I know you provided the original plot summary. Stop reverting it back to your own version, oh and while you're at it, read the book again! It's apparent from your reversions that your recall is poor.--Eaglestorm (talk) 05:47, 5 April 2013 (UTC)

Don't wave that argument in my face, my dear fellow. I have never purported to claim ownership of any article, and take it as an insult to my editing ability that you believe it to be such. My summary doesn't include the precise aircraft used, the codenames for each mission, the names of towns that only appear in one chapter, and strategically important but story-wise insignificant details - which is what makes it a synopsis. Readers want to find out it was a Mirage III CZ or an F1 that bombed that Cuban brigade, they can buy Vortex themselves and find out. They want to find out that the Blue Train takes South African officials from Pretoria to Cape Town and back for their parliamentary sessions, they can research RSA's government. Regarding your edits, Zaire isn't mentioned once in the book. Yes, an ANC liaison is arrested along with some of his troops, but the Cubans couldn't and didn't round up the entire organisation - as Vega's eventual assassin proves. The results of South Africa's final counteroffensive in Namibia aren't disclosed in the book. Vortex only mentions that the Cubans suffered heavy losses in their own Namibian offensive, by throwing troops against stronger SADF positions. Furthermore, the Cuban tactical groups weren't confirmed to be pulverized by US air strikes as you claim, although the book shows the effects of said air strikes against certain positions, including Vega's, to emphasize the overall potential and psychological effect.
All you've done is throw in some unnecessary tactical details, none of which we need. You have yet to give me a single example of how my work is "poor" or what details are not in order. Furthermore, you altered the summary without discussing it on the talk page first, citing your reasons for doing so even when it became clear I have legitimate cause to oppose them. Consequently, your edits will continue to be undone. Katangais (talk) 17:07, 5 April 2013 (UTC)
You currently appear to be engaged in an edit war. Users are expected to collaborate with others, to avoid editing disruptively, and to try to reach a consensus rather than repeatedly undoing other users' edits once it is known that there is a disagreement.

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Notice of Edit warring noticeboard discussion[edit]

Hello. This message is being sent to inform you that there is currently a discussion involving you at Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Edit warring regarding a possible violation of Wikipedia's policy on edit warring. Thank you.--Eaglestorm (talk) 04:03, 6 April 2013 (UTC)

ANEW and Vortex[edit]

Please read my comments at WP:ANEW and consider yourself warned.--Bbb23 (talk) 15:24, 6 April 2013 (UTC)

Owen Gun[edit]

Hello, Please don't add countries as 'users' of this weapon without an explict reference confirming that the weapon was actually used by their military/security forces. The patent approval in South Africa doesn't establish that this gun was actually used in the country, and nor does that photo of a 'Rhodesian' weapon (military museums often have exotic weapons on display which were never used by the country's armed forces). Nick-D (talk) 00:05, 3 May 2013 (UTC)

BLP violations at Arnold Vosloo[edit]

As I noted in both edit summaries, and am now reiterating here, ethnicity and descent categories cannot be added to biography articles unless they are supported by reliably sourced article content. It is a violation of both BLP policy and constitutes original research to attempt to determine an individual's descent or ethnicity based solely on their surnames. --Jezebel'sPonyobons mots 21:27, 17 June 2013 (UTC)

Talkback[edit]

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Rhodesian UDI[edit]

Hi Katangais, I remember you were interesting in Rhodesian stuff, so I'm dropping you a note to let you know that the Rhodesian UDI article is now at FAC here. I'd be great to have input from you on this if you are interested. Hope you are well, thanks Cliftonian (talk) 10:49, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

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Italians settlers in Somalia and diplomatic relations[edit]

This discussion is almost complete just a few more things left to discuss, Katangais. AcidSnow (talk) 18:03, 29 December 2013 (UTC)

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January 2014[edit]

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  • Culture Clash: The Influence of Behavioural Norms on Military Performance in Asymmetric Conflicts]</ref> now on display at the [[Museum of the Armed Forces (Angola)|Museu das Forças Armadas]], [[

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Poles in Africa[edit]

I am not here to have a debate or anything I am just here to inform you that there are 30,000 Poles living in South Africa.[1] But since you said that they "never formed a significant community" then I guess its fine not to include them. AcidSnow (talk) 21:33, 22 January 2014 (UTC)

30,000 Polish expats or contract workers and their families. According to the European immigrant averages from K. Vaque's The Plot against South Africa, less than a third of the resident figure were actually born in Africa. 30,000 is an exceptionally small number when compared to the 8,000,000 South African nationals with direct or indirect European ancestry. Therefore, the article doesn't cover them. --Katangais (talk) 21:55, 22 January 2014 (UTC)
I know that already since you already said they "never formed a significant community". I was here to inform why I edited the article. AcidSnow (talk) 22:07, 22 January 2014 (UTC)

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Please use the edit summary to explain your reasoning for the edit, or a summary of what the edit changes. Thanks! Roger (Dodger67) (talk) 21:02, 26 January 2014 (UTC) Roger (Dodger67) (talk) 21:02, 26 January 2014 (UTC)

Orphaned non-free image File:SWAPO PLAN.PNG[edit]

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Orphaned non-free image File:Cassinga Victims.PNG[edit]

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File:Bosoorlog.png listed for deletion[edit]

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Replaceable fair use File:Eland90II.jpg[edit]

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March 2014[edit]

Stop icon

Do not create, add, maintain, insert, or restore hoaxes on Wikipedia, such as you did with the article OTO Melara 76 mm. Usually, hoaxes will be caught and marked for deletion shortly after they are created. If you are interested in how accurate Wikipedia is, a more constructive test method would be to try to find inaccurate statements that are already in Wikipedia – and then to correct them if possible. Please do not disrupt Wikipedia. Feel free to take a look at the five pillars of Wikipedia to learn more about this project and how you can contribute constructively. Thank you.

NOTE: This edit doesn't make any sense, if at all, please note that the hoax you added has totally nothing to do with the OTO Melara gun as the Rooikat uses only the Denel GT4/GT7 (76mm/105mm) guns, which are not derived from the OTO Melara product. If you do this because you are ignorant, all's forgiven but if you had done this deliberately then you have to watch what you're editing next. Wikipedia will not tolerate rubbish input. Dave ♠♣♥♦™№1185©♪♫® 10:29, 22 March 2014 (UTC)

Hi Dave,
I'm sorry to hear you had a problem with my revision. However, I work on articles concerning historical arms and armour of the South African National Defence Force on occasion and have compiled extensive sources concerning that field. In this case I can assure you that the edit in question is perfectly sound. According to my copy of Jane's Armour and Artillery, the GT-4 76mm gun on the Rooikat was first trialled on a Ratel prototype in the late '80s. While they were marketing this vehicle as a tech demonstrator, ARMSCOR claimed that this particular armament was derived directly from the OTO Melara type found on naval ships. The source also states that shells from the OTO Melara 76 can be fired from the GT-4:
"...or a new two-man turret armed with a 76mm gun which is a further development of the OTO Melara naval weapon of this calibre."
"The ammunition of the naval gun can also be fired [from the Rooikat] by replacing the percussion primer with an electric primer."
Quotes credited to Jane's respective entries on "AC-100 Amphibious Combat Vehicle", the Ratel variant referenced above, and the "Vickers OMC Rooikat 76 mm armoured car". Again, reference is Jane's Armour and Artillery (2000-2001) edition, by Christopher F. Foss, ISSN 0143-9952.
Thanks!
--Katangais (talk) 17:00, 22 March 2014 (UTC)
  • If it is to be added in the "See also" section, you must first write up on the ammunition (76×900mmR) in a new sub-section and provide the citation tag to back up your claim in reference to the Denel GT4 and not the Rooikat, which is already off tangent. You can't simply add in something and expect people to know immediately what you're referring to, right? --Dave ♠♣♥♦™№1185©♪♫® 18:00, 25 March 2014 (UTC)
  • Nothing to gloat about in your face but an Admin from Commons has reviewed that image and deleted it after much considerations. While we appreciate your good faith intention, I just want to tell you that it was a misdirected effort. Please listen to me intently as nothing personal was directed against you but the Wikipedia foundation cannot afford and refuses to be drawn into any lawsuit because of any individual editor's insistance that a copyrighted image can be reuse without the actual owner's permissions to do so. Hope you understand the foundations' difficulty. Peace, out. --Dave ♠♣♥♦™№1185©♪♫® 17:45, 26 March 2014 (UTC)
While I am certainly disappointed that "much considerations" was taken without notifying the uploader or affording him a chance to discuss the disputed image directly with an administrator, I do understand that no such action is ever personal. Hundreds, if not thousands of files are deleted from Commons each week barring lengthy debate. I continue to hold that your claim to have seen the image in Jane's is an anecdote, and not a proof in itself of a file's copyright status. Assuming you locate this publication at some point in the future, I would appreciate your notifying me with the relevant detail so I can better research the original photographer.
Thanks, --Katangais (talk) 19:57, 26 March 2014 (UTC)
  • Actually no, the WP:ONUS is on you, not me. In fact, you have to understand that Wikipedia operates differently from you as a one-man-army, we are a community first and if you're harming the community project in any manner, then rest assure that you will be removed, eventually. That new image you jjust uploaded will be removed soon, not because I said so but because Google holds the copyright and you have to get in touch with someone with WP:OTRS to get google to assist to release it or else, that will go out the window whether you like it or not. Please, don't try to game the system, focus on the content instead of bickering with others on images with copyright issues/problems. --Dave ♠♣♥♦™№1185©♪♫® 21:11, 26 March 2014 (UTC)
Believe me, I've tried going through the whole WP:OTRS process with interested Zimbabwean military veterans who actually possess images of the topic in question. In fact, the legal terminology - "please agree to submit this to OTRS in a formal cover letter, with record of your permission under Creative Commons license, etc" - scared them off and I've been ostracised as a scam artist on at least one veterans' contact site already. So that avenue is closed to me for the immediate future, no thanks to your kind and - since you insist on painting yourself as no more than a helpless cog in the larger Wikipedia community machine - the site's copyright paranoia at large.
I then attempted to research any photographs that may have been taken at public domain dates in South Africa, but the Eland Mk7 vehicle wasn't actually out of the assembly/remanufacturing stage in 1963. It was first released for trials with the South African Army in 1964, and wasn't viewed publicly until 1966 - when the first freely available public photographs outside of classified SANDF records may have been taken.
I did contact an independent photographer - a SA lecturer in England - last July with several images available, but he declined to give any notice to OTRS. I uploaded one of his Eland pictures based on the unofficial permission granted but with no legal context it was only a matter of time before he tired of my pestering and severed contacts. I then requested that the image be deleted accordingly, which it was.
Following weeks of futile searching for any image that may have been released into the public domain for the photographer, and later months, as I am still continuing to search - I uploaded the image you claimed appeared on Jane's. It's non-free, yes, but no free alternatives exist. If you can prove that a free alternative exists, please by all means replace it. But you can't. I've tried for going on two years now. It simply isn't possible. The fact that most of the vehicles still in South Africa's reserve inventory in 2008 have now been sold as scrap metal or are turning up in other, more authoritarian, African nations like Chad and Benin which forbid taking unauthorized photos of weapons in their existing inventory doesn't help matters.
In closing: you probably don't appreciate a word of what I just typed. It's blatantly obvious you care nothing for the year of exhausting correspondence, research, and pleading which I've undergone, all to get a picture on that one article. Gaming the system...harming the community project...you know what, mate? Stripped of the rhetoric, all that says is sticks and stones. I'm done caring. Let the "community project", not User:Dave1185, take whatever action is justified. I will ensure that an image is always available for reference on Eland Mk7 until that free alternative becomes available.
Thanks, --Katangais (talk) 23:12, 26 March 2014 (UTC)

────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────

  • Read WP:TLDR. Seriously, you need to drop that confrontational attitude, we're all volunteer here so that doesn't mean that you should be lashing out on others when they're helping with the community project. PLEASE FOCUS ON THE CONTENT, we can do without images if none are available. Take note that some featured article pages has no images (yes, you heard it right... none at all!) to show to the world but the deligence and hardwork of the editors made their mark in the end. In the final analysis, you do have a choice to stop running into a brickwall should you chose to and nobody enjoys watching another person making the same mistake over and over again despite telling them repeatedly that it is all a big mistake, not unlike the cautions and warning you've been recieving above for the uploading of images with questionable copyright status. --Dave ♠♣♥♦™№1185©♪♫® 18:43, 31 March 2014 (UTC)

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Replaceable fair use File:Eland90.PNG[edit]

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Thanks for uploading File:Eland90.PNG. I noticed that this file is being used under a claim of fair use. However, I think that the way it is being used fails the first non-free content criterion. This criterion states that files used under claims of fair use may have no free equivalent; in other words, if the file could be adequately covered by a freely-licensed file or by text alone, then it may not be used on Wikipedia. If you believe this file is not replaceable, please:

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Discussion at Wikipedia:Non-free_content_review#File:Eland90.PNG[edit]

You are invited to join the discussion at Wikipedia:Non-free_content_review#File:Eland90.PNG.  Ronhjones  (Talk) 23:15, 1 April 2014 (UTC)

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April 2014[edit]

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why[edit]

why do you have a problem that afrikaners are a white people? can that atleast be mentioned in the lede of the article 120.50.35.122 (talk) 19:55, 6 May 2014 (UTC)

not "europeans" white africans![edit]

i think i said somthing wrong and i do not want it, this is not about "european" but about "white african" i dont think you have a problem too

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June 2014[edit]

Information icon Please do not add or change content, as you did to Lenin Steenkamp, without verifying it by citing a reliable source. Please review the guidelines at Wikipedia:Citing sources and take this opportunity to add references to the article. Thank you. GiantSnowman 16:34, 3 June 2014 (UTC)

A barnstar for you![edit]

Original Barnstar Hires.png The Original Barnstar
I have noticed your editing of the Afrikaner page, I appreciate it very much, thank you. Dutch Ninja (talk) 03:20, 10 June 2014 (UTC)

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Your edit in "Equipment" in Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant[edit]

I see you entered your footnote for this edit as a bare URL. Could you write it in the normal way, please, the using cite-web or cite-news template? --P123ct1 (talk) 15:15, 16 August 2014 (UTC)

Sherman SSB picture[edit]

Hey Katangais, how are you? I'm sorry to bother you, but I just wanted to ask you if you know anything about the sourcing for this image. It's come up during the GA review for Southern Rhodesia in World War II. Hope you're well, and have a great week. Cheers —  Cliftonian (talk)  18:10, 21 September 2014 (UTC)

Always nice to hear from you, Cliftonian. Hope your GA review goes smoothly. If my memory serves me right, the image you referenced came from the AML Masondo Library in Saxonwald. I last saw it being displayed rather prominently in the portrait corridor adjoining the library to the Ditsong museum. As opposed to paintings, few of the photographs there carry an annotation about their copyright status/original author. Works are generally attributed to the SANDF Archive.
Hope this helps,
--Katangais (talk) 19:24, 21 September 2014 (UTC)

South Kasai[edit]

Hi Katangais,

It's great to see someone with (as I assume from your name) an interest in Congolese history! I just wondered whether you might care to take a quick look at South Kasai which I've re-written. The sources on South Kasai are not at all good so any gaps are probably due to this rather than oversight, but I'd certainly appreciate any comments on it as it's up for GAN. All the best, —Brigade Piron (talk) 08:47, 24 September 2014 (UTC)

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