User talk:Marcocapelle

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Request for mediation rejected[edit]

The request for formal mediation concerning Category:Christianity under the Roman Empire, to which you were listed as a party, has been declined. To read an explanation by the Mediation Committee for the rejection of this request, see the mediation request page, which will be deleted by an administrator after a reasonable time. Please direct questions relating to this request to the Chairman of the Committee, or to the mailing list. For more information on forms of dispute resolution, other than formal mediation, that are available, see Wikipedia:Dispute resolution.

For the Mediation Committee, User:Sunray (talk) 00:46, 28 June 2014 (UTC)
(Delivered by MediationBot, on behalf of the Mediation Committee.)


HI, I recall looking at the saints tree and decided it was a mess - hence my suggestion to start a slower conversation vs. at CFD where people feel pressured to !vote. Take a look at the whole tree and see what other inconsistencies you find - we should never have a female category as a subset of a male one, for example - I did a lot of clean up in the royalty tree since princesses were often children of princes, instead of sibling categories. But then once you start that broader discussion we can take our time to figure out best solution, and then if anything needs to be killed or renamed we can bring to CFD, pointing to previous pseudo-consensus from the other page. Let me know if this makes sense.--Obi-Wan Kenobi (talk) 04:05, 29 June 2014 (UTC)

Explanation of "unncessary diffusion"[edit]

When I undid St. Timothy I hadn't realised that the parent category had been sub-divided. I don't believe that Category:New Testament people as a whole needs diffusion. I just don't have the energy to continually fight these misguided attempts to do so. While sorting people by the bit of the New Testament they get a mention in sounds like a good idea initially, maturer reflection shows that it leads to an unhelpful proliferation of categories. Taking Timothy as an example, he's mentioned in the Acts of the Apostles, several Pauline epistles, and Hebrews. A category for each of these on the bottom of his article, in addition to the 14 other categories he's already in, is too many. And under the current scheme what does one do with Jesus? Add another 27 categories to his article? I'm cross-posting this to Laurel's talk page as well. Beeswaxcandle (talk) 09:35, 6 July 2014 (UTC)

  • Dear Beeswaxcandle, I realize that occasionally people fall in two categories, but I created the categories such that it doesn't happen very often. To add on your 27 number, I agree that it's definitely not meaningful to subdivide any further than these three categories. Marcocapelle (talk) 09:40, 6 July 2014 (UTC)

Female religious leaders[edit]

Hi, I'm sorry I didn't notice your proposals at Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2014 June 2 about women clergy earlier; I'm glad it's still open! Thanks for making these proposals. I have suggested using "Religious leaders" rather than "clergy"; please comment. – Fayenatic London 10:19, 7 July 2014 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Eastern Orthodoxy-related controversies[edit]

Hello Marcocapelle,

I wanted to let you know that I just tagged Eastern Orthodoxy-related controversies for deletion in response to your request.

If you didn't intend to make such a request and don't want the article to be deleted, you can contest this deletion, but please don't remove the speedy deletion tag from the top.

You can leave a note on my talk page if you have questions. Vanjagenije (talk) 20:59, 10 July 2014 (UTC)

Removal of categories[edit]

Hi, thanks for your edits but removal of these categories was ill advised, I've restored them. You may want to note on Talk pages before or after removing any similar. Cheers. In ictu oculi (talk) 15:28, 18 July 2014 (UTC)

Talk pages in categories[edit]

Hi. I've looked at Talk:Christian views on the Old Covenant too and don't see how it has been added to any categories. I would think that no talk pages (including user talks) should be in categories. I also saw your reverted edit that implied my own talk page is in a number of categories. If that is true, and if you find out how to remove them, I would appreciate it if you could pass that technique along to me. It is definitely not my intention, and I'd be happy to know how to rid the categories of such things also. Evensteven (talk) 16:03, 18 July 2014 (UTC)

Don't worry about the latter, I thought I was still on your personal talk page but I was actually the article's talk page when I noticed the categorizations. So that was initially just a wrong insert from my side. As for the first point, you'll have understood that I have no idea how to remove them. Marcocapelle (talk) 16:08, 18 July 2014 (UTC)
[edit conflict] Thanks, regarding my talk page. On second thought though, do some special categories exist specifically for article talk pages? I'm thinking of project classifications (importance, article quality ratings, etc) of articles specifically. Talk:Christian views on the Old Covenant includes use of three templates for three projects that the article belongs to, and perhaps those templates create (transclude) automatic entries for such special-purpose categories. In that case, I would guess that they shouldn't be touched except through the controlling templates, as automation would be responsible for providing accuracy and consistency. Evensteven (talk) 16:17, 18 July 2014 (UTC)
Dear Evensteven, I removed the links to the categories from Talk:Christian views on the Old Covenant and this resulted in removal of the categories that were in this particular discussion. So at least that's part of the deal! Still, the talk page is classified in a number of other categories that aren't mentioned on the talk page. I don't have any idea why. Marcocapelle (talk) 20:37, 18 July 2014 (UTC)
  • Marcocapelle, cc User:Evensteven, As previous request, could you please stop deleting categories, discuss first on Talk pages, thank you. In ictu oculi (talk) 16:43, 18 July 2014 (UTC)
    • In ictu oculi, I have not been involved in deleting categories. This communication is about talk pages themselves being in categories, and I was asking questions only. In particular, I was interested in removing my own user talk page from any categories it might have been in, as this did not seem right. I'd be glad to know if I'm off track about that, as this is not a subject I know much about at present. Evensteven (talk) 20:38, 18 July 2014 (UTC)


Don't you think that Christian views on Hades should be merged into Christian views on Hell? Editor2020 04:42, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

  • I completely agree. However, trying to get articles merged is not a priority for me personally. Meanwhile I've come to the finding that it's even more difficult to have an article edited, merged or deleted than have a category merged or deleted, because people really feel as if they're the owner of an article (especially so with articles that have a very limited audience of readers and editors, like this one will undoubtedly have). Having said that, if you would be willing to nominate this page to be merged/deleted and you would update me about it then I'll definitely support you. Marcocapelle (talk) 05:15, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

German words and phrases[edit]

Hi Marcocapelle,

I think I disagree with your removal of Fach from Category:German_words_and_phrases. If you look at the article it discusses terminology of various Fächer at length. But you're removing many other articles and it's hard to tell what your criteria are. Isn't Category_talk:German_words_and_phrases the obvious place to outline your project? Sparafucil (talk) 21:36, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

  • It is definitely the right place, but so far I've experienced that nobody ever replies when I post something as a category talk. It seems like this is just not a place where anyone would ever look into. Which I think is very unfortunate. As for your disagreement, I think generally I've been quite conservative, but occasionally I may have acted too quickly, like the one you mention. For further info please check Wikipedia:Categories_for_discussion/Log/2014_June_12#Category:French_words_and_phrases (which was posted merely as an example language). Marcocapelle (talk) 21:50, 19 July 2014 (UTC)
Well, you could assume if no one replies there that it's not that controversial. I don't understand your rational though; can't you explain it? I didn't quite understand what you were getting at before withdrawing the Fr. deletion proposal either. Sparafucil (talk) 23:00, 20 July 2014 (UTC)


I'm thinking about renaming Category:Christian politics to Christianity and politics, as a subcategory of Religion and politics. Thoughts or input? Editor2020 18:50, 20 July 2014 (UTC)

  • Definitely agree, not only for consistency, but also because it would additionally allow to classify controversies between Christianity and politics in here. Funny detail, two articles are already classified in Category:Christianity and politics while it doesn't even exist yet. Marcocapelle (talk) 19:27, 20 July 2014 (UTC)
@Editor2020: Wait, there's also a Category:Church and state law which is almost all (but not entirely) about Christianity and hence has a substantial overlap with Category:Christian politics. I think, ideally, the highest level should become:
and a level below that
(the latter two containing most of current Category:Christian politics but not the part overlapping parts with Category:Church and state law).

Marcocapelle (talk) 20:15, 20 July 2014 (UTC) Marcocapelle (talk) 20:22, 20 July 2014 (UTC)

I'm reluctant to add even more categories to the multitude we have now. Editor2020 20:12, 21 July 2014 (UTC)
ps. I'm not sure, but I think that Category:Church and state law is supposed to be about Separation (or non-separation) of Church and State, i.e "church and state" law. Editor2020 20:21, 21 July 2014 (UTC)
Really? I hadn't even considered this. The current content of the category is also much broader than just that and I don't see an urgent reason to limit the contents to just separation issues. About what I wrote above, let's just forget it for now. If you propose the rename, I'll support it. Marcocapelle (talk) 20:27, 21 July 2014 (UTC)

Category:Christian law[edit]

You seem to be changing the scope of Category:Christian law, as the articles you are adding do not fit the main article template, which is a link to Church order? Editor2020 03:11, 21 July 2014 (UTC)

@Editor2020: Yes, I know, this can't be the final solution. The previous main article used to be Canon law which did not make sense because Canon law is a category on its own. And there is no article about Christian law because it redirects to Canon law! So my bet is that the original intention has been to have this category for Canon law/Church order related topics. But currently the category has become a strange mix of Church order, the two new "Law" child cats and some single articles of which I'd say they are more about ethics or beliefs than about law.
I have deliberately not moved out anything from this category as I haven't figured out a solution yet. Though I did add Canon law as a child category. And I grouped the two "Law" child cats so that they can easily be transferred somewhere else if anyone would know good solution for this. Now I'm thinking of it again, maybe the best solution is to just split the Christian law category in two, so Christian law and Church Order? What's your opinion? Marcocapelle (talk) 17:20, 21 July 2014 (UTC)

July 2014[edit]

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Category tree[edit]

Do you know if it is possible to display a graphical representation of a category and all of its subcategories, up to X levels deep? Editor2020 21:08, 21 July 2014 (UTC)

It has been possible for sure, and I don't think the option was hard to find. Since I can't find it back now, I'm afraid the option has been removed. Marcocapelle (talk) 21:18, 21 July 2014 (UTC)