User talk:Taiwan boi

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Welcome!

Hello, Taiwan boi, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are a few good links for newcomers:

I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! Please sign your name on talk pages using four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically produce your name and the date. If you have any questions, check out Wikipedia:Where to ask a question or ask me on my talk page. Again, welcome!  Alai 17:40, 27 January 2006 (UTC)

Contents

afd[edit]

Please see Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/NCSE_Grand_Canyon_Raft_Trip and the associated article NCSE Grand Canyon Raft Trip. Thanks Happy Couple 22:03, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

Bereans[edit]

I've moved your content to a separate Berean Christadelphians article. Hope that's ok. RiJB (talk) 16:57, 1 February 2008 (UTC)

I didn't mind that, but you've cut a lot of it out. --Taiwan boi (talk) 09:44, 2 February 2008 (UTC)


I just copied and pasted, and made a minor alteration to the opening paragraph. I'm sorry if some sections got lost in the ether, but I think it may be subsequent alterations by others that have been the source of the cuts, not my setting up the article RiJB (talk) 12:13, 2 February 2008 (UTC)

Accusation of bad faith[edit]

With reference to your accusation on the Christadelphians talk page that I acted in bad faith by not logging in, I refer you to the Wikipedia guideline on Good faith, especially the section under the heading Accusing others of bad faith:

"Making unwarranted accusations of bad faith (as opposed to explanations of good faith) can be inflammatory, and is often unhelpful in a dispute. If bad faith motives are alleged without clear evidence that others' editing is in fact based upon bad faith, it can also count as a form of personal attack, and in it, the user accusing such claim is not assuming good faith.

Your accusation is therefore inflammatory, is a form of personal attack, and in the words of the guideline is itself "not assuming good faith". Your attempt elsewhere in that discussion to reveal my identity is also contrary to Wiki guidelines and is contrary to good etiquette. The reference to Wikipedia FAQ which you cited specifically says "we welcome anonymous contributions" and "you are actually more anonymous (though more pseudonymous) logged in than you are as an "anonymous" editor". Your implication that I somehow contravened a Wikipedia policy or guideline on good faith was therefore in error and could itself be considered to be in bad faith. Taiwan Girl (talk) 11:05, 2 February 2008 (UTC)

Taiwan Girl are you really accusing Taiwanboi of bad faith for accusing you of bad faith? ;) RiJB (talk) 12:15, 2 February 2008 (UTC)
Of course he is. His standard tactic is to invent reasons why the other person is wrong, in an attempt to deflect attention from his own wrongs. It's the tu quoque fallacy, and none of it addresses the fact that he's in error. --Taiwan boi (talk) 14:13, 2 February 2008 (UTC)
Well this is totally expected, and up to your usual standard of inaccuracy. Good faith is to be assumed on Wikipedia unless there is clear evidence otherwise. In this case there is clear evidence otherwise, as I pointed out more than once (and you never responded). You were invited several times to make use of a source which I would not have contested, and you deliberately chose not to. You also deliberately misrepresented the source you were using, until I exposed your misrepresentation. That is not good faith, that's acting in bad faith, and my identifying it was not unwarranted. You were grossly abusive of the article, and consistently acted in bad faith, which is why not one person attempted to support you.
I didn't attempt to reveal your identity, I only used an abbreviation of what I know your first name to be. The reference to the Wikipedia FAQ specifically defines people who login without a username as 'anonymous'. The issue of who is more anonymous was not under dispute. I rightly identified you as anonymous, according to the standard Wiki definition. --Taiwan boi (talk) 14:10, 2 February 2008 (UTC)
I won't discuss personal attacks with you. I have consistently tried to confine myself to the actual material, and I suggest you do the same. I won't dignify your accusations of "bad faith", "vandalism", or "misrepresentation" with a reply.Taiwan Girl (talk) 04:44, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
There are no personal attacks here. You acted in bad faith. You misrepresented your source regarding conscientious objection, you refused to use a source which wasn't disputed, and now you're continuing to make edits without substantiating your claims. Quoting the attitudes of a Christadelphian who lived in the 19th century does not constitute quoting evidence for the attitudes of 21st century Christadelphians. --Taiwan boi (talk) 07:54, 3 February 2008 (UTC)

February 2008[edit]

Information.svg Hello. Please don't forget to provide an edit summary, which wasn't included with your recent edit to Christadelphians. Thank you. NeilN talkcontribs 01:01, 3 February 2008 (UTC)

Thanks, I do keep forgetting that. --Taiwan boi (talk) 01:02, 3 February 2008 (UTC)

A friendly word of advice[edit]

Hi Taiwan boy. I'm going to make a suggestion that may seem a little childish to you, but if you could at least think about it, then that would be great. Can you sit on replying immediately to comments made by Taiwan girl, as that person is clearly Trolling you. I've given Taiwan girl a friendly warning and really don't want to take it any further than that, and while they are in the wrong hear, I think that if you take a bit more time to reply (or don't reply if needs be) then hopefully things will calm down a bit. Please don't take this the wrong way and think I'm attacking you, as I'm not! --Samtheboy (t/c) 09:16, 3 February 2008 (UTC)

Ok Sam, I'll give that a go and see what happens. --Taiwan boi (talk) 10:46, 3 February 2008 (UTC)

Suggestion[edit]

In order to encourage NPOV in the Bereans article, I wonder what you would think of inviting a Berean Christadelphian and a non-Christadelphian to review it? RiJB (talk) 20:29, 3 February 2008 (UTC)

I've already mentioned it to a number of Bereans, but they don't appear the slightest bit interested in editing it. As for a non-Christadelphian reviewing it, that's 'Taiwan Girl'. --Taiwan boi (talk) 23:44, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
Ah, OK. I was thinking of someone who perhaps knew very little of Christadelphians at all, i.e. they might pick up on things of particular interest or matters that needed further explanation, or parts that did not come across as neutral. On the Berean front, I do seem to remember we had a Berean editor in the past, but it may have been another subgroup. Actually, you quoting of Stephen Male makes me wonder if I should drop in and see him - he lives just down the road.RiJB (talk) 23:43, 4 February 2008 (UTC)
I mentioned it again yesterday on a Berean forum, and received the response basically that Wikipedia is stupid and dumb and worldly and anarchistic, and all the rest. --Taiwan boi (talk) 01:56, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
You should tell them that yes, it is all that, but it's also viewed by millions of people around the world, so are you sure that you are happy that an article about yourselves is up there without being reviewed by you? --Samtheboy (t/c) 06:32, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
That is almost exactly what I said:

Yes, Wikipedia has many flaws and for the most part I'm not remotely interested in it. However, there is already an article on the Christadelphian community, including articles on the Unamedended, Nazarene, and Berean schisms, so I spend some time ensuring that these articles are factual. I see that as a personal responsibility. I'm sure you wouldn't want the Berean article to represent you falsely.

I've been told 'I think we'll stick with the Book of Life'. --Taiwan boi (talk) 14:18, 5 February 2008 (UTC)

Please consider taking the AGF Challenge[edit]

I would like to invite you to consider taking part in the AGF Challenge which has been proposed for use in the RfA process [1] by User: Kim Bruning. You can answer in multiple choice format, or using essay answers, or anonymously. You can of course skip any parts of the Challenge you find objectionable or inadvisable.--Filll (talk) 13:49, 16 April 2008 (UTC)

Battle of Qadesh[edit]

Sorry about the removed part, I accidently removed it while adding some details in the above section. Just feel free to add more such facts. Egyptzo (talk) 21:30, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for the notice. --Taiwan boi (talk) 22:27, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

Hi there, only to tell you that we might start an "election" of the best battle section, it will be "my" version against "Egyptzo's" version. Super Knuckles (talk) 00:12, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

-isms[edit]

Thanks for your comments, and I hope I didn't cause any offense. What I said about '-isms' was really prompted by a couple of instances I've come across where a feminist historian has been summarily dismissed as a crank when in fact this was just an excuse to ignore the (very solid) evidence they were presenting. Ronald Hutton does this for example, responding to Max Dashu's critique of his work by stating that she is "not an academic of any sort" and that addressing any of her points is beneath him. In fact, she had pointed out some serious flaws in his work, supported with very solid evidence. I see this too often in the study of history, important work being marginalised on the basis of its author's supposed (and often misrepresented) ideologies, rather than on the basis of an actual evaluation of the work. But then, I'm just an amateur historian, and probably not a very good one at that... Fuzzypeg 22:03, 26 May 2008 (UTC)

Welcome![edit]

Ichthus.svg Hello Taiwan boi! Welcome to Wikiproject Christianity! Thank you for joining. Below are some useful links to facilitate your involvement. Happy editing! - -- TinuCherian (Wanna Talk?) - 17:14, 1 June 2008 (UTC) Ichthus.svg
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Welcome to VandalProof![edit]

Thank you for your interest in VandalProof, Taiwan boi! You have now been added to the list of authorized users, so if you haven't already, simply download and install VandalProof from our main page. If you have any questions, please feel free to contact me or any other moderator, or you can post a message on the discussion page. Daniel (talk) 06:01, 9 June 2008 (UTC)

WikiProject Christianity Newsletter[edit]

Cautious request for assistance[edit]

I think you are doing a marvellous job with Noah's Ark, and it's sad you have to make such extensive use of procedures in your attempts to refine that article. I am currently facing many of the same issues, challenges based on speculations related to content and to character. Unfortunately I am alone, so people feel they can agree to change text without sources, on the strength of numbers alone. I'm kind of curious to see just how far one has to go in such circumstances before Wiki policies are actually respected by those involved. WQA, RfC and even Admin have so far failed to actually examine the issues (admitting this in several cases), but have taken sides anyway. A current mediation request seems to be resulting in one of the mediators taking a side (and yet again following the majority rather than sources), though I could be speaking too early. If mediation fails, and I hope it doesn't, a set of trivial issues in which my case is abundantly provable will have been forced all the way ArbCom, because one person after another has jumped too quickly to side with a majority without investigating the facts.

Interestingly, even now I could simply remove the OR text introduced by others, and return my own sourced text, Wiki policy is clear about that. However, in practice, I will simply be reverted, and others would claim it is me, not they who are using edits to obstruct progress.

The irony is that I'm actually defending the free speech of scholars with whom I disagree, but who articulate a range of issues with a set of good and clear ideas. And then, of course, either Wiki has a policy against personal attacks, including unfounded accusations, or it doesn't.

I think you're doing wonderfully at Noah's Ark. I might be asking your help if the mediators I'm currently working with find they cannot help establish consensus. If you know any other Wikipedians who are familiar with defending against obstructive tactics, and are not overawed by a group of people with opinions but no valid argument, I would appreciate a chance to see if they're free at the moment. Alastair Haines (talk) 08:13, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

Thank you! Best news I've had in weeks. ;) Save your time for more important things in the meanwhile. Let's trust the mediators and get on with constructive editing. Adding sources! :) Alastair Haines (talk) 08:50, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

Noah's Ark and PiCo[edit]

Hmmm, I think you are choosing a good option. Much better to involve someone known and familiar with the issues, and especially someone with a kind of stake in seeing peace between two parties already respected for other reasons.

I think I know what the problem is. You, me and PiCo all can see weaknesses in the way Wiki works. I think we have different levels of confidence in how that works out long term. That affects our decisions. PiCo is more relaxed about things long term, you and I are more hopeful that sourcing will introduce long term assets for readers.

Then, regarding attributions of good and bad faith, it's not such a big deal when editors are anonymous, I guess people can become relaxed about that too.

In a way I'm making excuses for PiCo here, in another way I'm thinking aloud, trying to guess at legitimate motives that might be in conflict. Wiki does mean different things to different people. At one level it's an "interactive reading experience", you can "poke the text" to see if it will poke back at you! Now, that's a reader I'm willing to bounce around a bit with. I'm here to provide content that will last, others may be here to engage with ideas in a more robust way than reading a paper and ink affair can provide. Think "Web Three point Zero".

I'm kind of willing to be a part of making the text of Wiki an "interactive experience" for some interesting and interested readers. As crazy as people like you and I may seem to more "normal people" who are probably more like PiCo than us, I think most would be happy to give us some space, especially if we give them some. But this does need to be courteous, and the bottom line is that sources must be allowed to have the final say.

I'll email PiCo and see if he's willing to chat about this outside public view. I'm genuinely interested in PiCo's approach to Wiki, and his approach to the Bible as a topic. He writes very well, has a very sharp mind, and has a wealth of life experience beyond mine. He's also honest about himself, including his own inconsistencies.

I'm sure he knows he's driving you nuts, that he's not playing completely fair and that he's bound to lose in the end. I think he also sees very clearly indeed that you are relentless as well as right, so there's no long term risk to anyone, except to PiCo himself. I'm sure there's more to it than this, and I'm not sure I'll ever know what.

Anyway, I'll drop PiCo an email, and see if it's helpful for me to just hear more about as much of his perspective as he's happy to share. Alastair Haines (talk) 12:10, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

I had no idea I was supposed to do anything but wait for the next action, you didn't actually suggest I do anything. I did look at requests for mediation and there was nothing there. My comment was made in good faith -- see my comments to Alastair Haines. I had already thought about taking the article off my watch list and now wish I had done that earlier. Doug Weller (talk) 16:49, 3 July 2008 (UTC)

Mediation[edit]

Sorry if I haven't done something I'm supposed to do - I have no idea how the mediation process is supposed to work. It's you who are taking the initiative with this, so please go ahead and do whatever needs to be done. PiCo (talk) 10:26, 4 July 2008 (UTC)

I'm not quite sure where we are on this, but I'm quite happy for you to take the running. Let me know if there's anything I can do. Cheers. PiCo (talk) 15:12, 4 July 2008 (UTC)
See Alastair's post in your Talk page. As for what you can do, you can start by answering my questions on the Noah's Ark page, discussing your edits before making them, and adhering to Wikipedia policy. --Taiwan boi (talk) 15:56, 4 July 2008 (UTC)

Some advice to ignore[edit]

Hi Taiwan boi,

I'm flagging up front that I really understand your frustration at NA. I think you're doing a fine job with sourcing, and you're being patient above and beyond the call of duty in dealing with obstructions.

I also want to note that the advice I'd give is ignorant of too much, and simply not involved enough to have much weight, but I'm going to throw it on the table for you to consider anyway. The only thing that could possibly go wrong is if you agreed with it, and then it turned out to be wrong, then I'd feel awful.

Anyway, here's the idea. An illustration, then a concrete example, then the idea. The illustration—two men have houses next door to one another. One is very responsible, let's call him Able, the other somewhat casual or presumptious, let's call him Cain. Cain has an apple tree that has overgrown the boundary fence, rotten fruit falls from the branches into Able's garden. Able patiently clears away this rubbish, asking Cain if he would be so kind as to organise to chop down the intruding branches some time. Cain says yes but doesn't do anything, reminder after reminder, until Able's patience is running out. But just when Cain has finally bought an axe ready to do what he knows he should, Able show's up with the Sheriff's department to enforce the removal of the branches. Cain is now unhappy with Able. Whenever Able's dog barks in the night, Cain reports it and a patrol car visits Abel's house.

I think Doug would have been happy, man to man, to admit his involvement at NA made life difficult for you. But when he senses you're "on the war path", he'd rather clear out and let you have your way. I'm a long, long way from being any good at this myself, but I think it can be more important to let people have genuine open doors to informal apology, than to guarantee future constraints on their behaviour. A change of heart is the strongest possible security for the future.

When I look at my attempts to put this into practice, not only do I fail, it seems to get me into trouble more often than help anyone else! So please ignore my advice. As unattainable as the ideal may be, victory is only valuable because of the peace it brings, victory without peace is not victory. The more you have right on your side, the more generously you need to extend opportunities for a change of heart to your opponents.

What would I know? Enough of my ramblings. Keep doing what seems best to you, you're doing great. Alastair Haines (talk) 10:50, 4 July 2008 (UTC)

Christianity WikiProject Newsletter - July 2008[edit]

This Newsletter was automatically delivered by TinucherianBot (talk) 09:21, 9 July 2008 (UTC)

Talk page refactoring[edit]

Don't do it - reply after my post but don't intersperse it and multiply my signature. It's rude and breaks up the thread of my arguments. As for atheists being just as biased, an atheist can accept the historicity of Jesus without accepting the historicity of the resurrection, so no - being an atheist does not give you a COI. As a christian you take the whole package which does give you a COI. The biggest problem with the JM article is faithful souls who spend most of their time trying to discredit it rather than reading the books and trying to make it an interesting and informative article. Sophia 11:00, 18 July 2008 (UTC)

I repeat - do not refactor my posts. Sophia 19:10, 18 July 2008 (UTC)

Noah's ark[edit]

I realise the page is part of a religious narrative, it's also a story of mythology (just like the stories from greek mythology, christian mythology etc), that's why it needs the term "mythology". I would ask that you put back my addition to the topic please. NathanLee (talk) 10:55, 8 August 2008 (UTC) From the box on mythology: "In its academic sense, the word myth simply means "a traditional story", whether true or false. (—OED, Princeton Wordnet) Unless otherwise noted, the words mythology and myth are here used for sacred and traditional narratives, with no implication that any belief so embodied is itself either true or false." This is a story of type mythology. That needs to be clear in the introduction. NathanLee (talk) 11:02, 8 August 2008 (UTC)

CWM Bias?[edit]

Just wondering if you could look at [2] Cheers 60.229.34.127 (talk) 23:44, 26 October 2008 (UTC)

Personal attacks?[edit]

TB, you seem to be extremely thin-skinned and quick to take offense. I suggest you calm down. You accuse me of adding misleading material to Noah's Ark, but in fact I've added nothing whatsoever, merely combined some sections which treat a common subject and given them a more descriptive name. I know, you think some of this material is not about a belief in a literal (i.e., real, touchable, made-out-of-wood) ark, and my point is that you're mistaken. This is something to talk out on the Talk page, not something to seek arbitration over. Please go to the article Talk page and put your case. PiCo (talk) 00:53, 7 December 2008 (UTC)

Time to take a step back[edit]

Taiwanboi, you are obviously very emotional about this - and I honestly don't really understand why, because you haven't explained. I suggest we both take 12 hours off and that you come back tomorrow and set out your concerns in a more balanced frame of mind. Let us assume good faith and keep civility in mind, ok? PiCo (talk) 12:44, 21 December 2008 (UTC)

(sigh) And did you report yourself while you were about it? Go to bed, get a good night's sleep, and try to find a life outside Wikipedia. PiCo (talk) 13:02, 21 December 2008 (UTC)

That's my boi...[edit]

)

Alphabetization and collation[edit]

I am inviting you to comment, in your capacity as a librarian, at Wikipedia talk:Manual of Style#Alphabetization and collation. -- Wavelength (talk) 21:02, 28 January 2009 (UTC)

2,300 Day or Day-year principle[edit]

Doug Krieger (talk) 01:11, 9 March 2009 (UTC)kriegerdwmDoug Krieger (talk) 01:11, 9 March 2009 (UTC)

- Dear Taiwan boi -

I noticed that the section containing the 1260 day had some additions which were deleted - it apparently was removed - I do not think it appropriate to remove such from the discussion - the "Day-year discussion/topic" is highly controversial and the Seventh-Day Adventists do not have the exclusive rights to the discussion. I am again entering this into the document - frankly, there should be room for additional opinions on this topic - let's remain professional about this discussion - further deletions would not be productive. I am surprised at your restrictions and the comment that somehow the futuristic interpretation of the 2300 days is not germane to the topic - that could not be further from the truth. kriegerdwm (talk)

Doug Krieger (talk) 01:47, 9 March 2009 (UTC)kriegerdwmDoug Krieger (talk) 01:47, 9 March 2009 (UTC) The 2,300 days interpreted as "years" as in "Day-year" is germane to the topic - to interpret the 2300 days as years is considered by many futurists as erroneous and anti-literal and a distortion to the hermeneutic of Scripture; therefore, its inclusion is altogether appropriate - that's also it. Your desire to include the SDA interpretations of the 2300 days and omit the futurists interpretation thereof is both narrow and prejudicial in the "Day-year" discussion. Furthermore, the 2300 days has horrendous socio-political implications for today - likewise, it is the great interpretive gulf between traditional evangelical premillenarians and historicism, in particular, those within Amillenarianism, Mormonism, Seventh-day Adventism and Jehovah Witnesses. To deprecate Israel's participation in the debate could be considered Antisemitic - "you and your people" pertain to the Jewish people, not the church. Biblical literalism among the Dispensationalists are adamant about this matter - not hearing their voices on this most volatile topic would be a gross prejudicial exclusion - anti-intellectual and religiously provocative.

Codex Vaticanus[edit]

Thanks for your correction. Leszek Jańczuk (talk) 17:39, 10 March 2009 (UTC)

Galen[edit]

I am posting on your page because I notice your interest in Galen on his article’s discussion page. I have myself written a dissertation and published a couple papers on him. I have made some additions to the web page, and have added a lot of comments on the discussion page that I hope will contribute to the communities’ understanding and the article’s quality. If you have any thoughts about this that you would like to share with me, feel free to post them on my talk page under the Galen category. —Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|Cosans (talk) 18:02, 13 March 2009 (UTC)]] comment added by Cosans (talkcontribs) 17:51, 13 March 2009 (UTC)

hello...I found the von Staden reference. It is a good scholarly account of the issues with human dissection and why it was allowed at Alexandria but not else where in antiquity. I think it is understandable as well. Here is part of my response to your comments on the Galen page: "I am not sure on how religious we should call the sensitivities against dissection and vivisection. Von Staden has a really good article on this (1975"The Discovery of the Body", Yale Journal of Biology and Medicine 65: 223-241). I think it would be better to say there were cultural traditions about what do do with human bodies...and dissecting them was not in those bounds." Cosans (talk) 15:05, 15 March 2009 (UTC)

Noah's Ark FAR[edit]

I have nominated Noah's Ark for a featured article review here. Please join the discussion on whether this article meets featured article criteria. Articles are typically reviewed for two weeks. If substantial concerns are not addressed during the review period, the article will be moved to the Featured Article Removal Candidates list for a further period, where editors may declare "Keep" or "Remove" the article's featured status. The instructions for the review process are here. --Vassyana (talk) 15:35, 20 March 2009 (UTC)

WikiProject Christianity Newsletter - April 2009[edit]

WikiProject Christianity Newsletter - May 2009[edit]

WikiProject Christianity Newsletter - June 2009[edit]

WikiProject Christianity Newsletter - July 2009[edit]

John Carter (talk) 23:38, 16 July 2009 (UTC)

Jstor documents[edit]

Hi, I'm an italian student; Italy is not really interested to culture; I need a few documents from jstor, I'm wondering if i can help you: let me know if you can help me :) Antonwebern88 (talk) 10:10, 21 July 2009 (UTC)

WikiProject Christianity Newsletter - August 2009[edit]

Christadelphians[edit]

Thanks, Taiwan boi. --Woofboy (talk) 22:40, 23 October 2010 (UTC) Great additions. --Woofboy (talk) 23:31, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

Talk:Immersion baptism#You have made some good changes Taiwan boi[edit]

You are invited to join the discussion at Talk:Immersion baptism#You have made some good changes Taiwan boi. Walter Görlitz (talk) 06:09, 27 October 2010 (UTC) (Using {{Please see}})

I will state this simply and on your talk page. You continue to misrepresent my position by stating "Explain your refusal to adhere to WP:RS]. You are mistaken in stating that I am not adhering to WP:RS. I am. You are also mistaken in suggesting that the sources are not reliable sources. They are not only reliable, they are recognized by many as reliable. They may not be modern, but that doesn't make them unreliable.
Now I will remind you to read [Wikipedia:Five pillars]], particularly Wikipedia has a neutral point of view", "Wikipedians should interact in a respectful and civil manner", and most importantly: "Wikipedia does not have firm rules". Again, if I want to ignore a rule in favour of another, there's nothing wrong with that. However, I am not ignoring WP:V and WP:RS. If you want to carry on a discussion on either of the baptism articles feel free, but if you continue to be uncivil, I will ignore your requests entirely. --Walter Görlitz (talk) 04:17, 28 October 2010 (UTC)
Let me show you: I don't care about your petty WP:RS issue as it's moot. I am no longer going to discuss this with you. --Walter Görlitz (talk) 06:10, 28 October 2010 (UTC)
I note you deleted my comments on your Talk page. That was not vandalism, that was an explanation of the WP:RS criteria which you have to follow.--Taiwan boi (talk) 15:22, 28 October 2010 (UTC)

Immersion baptism[edit]

I really think that what would work best here is an RfC, which the disagreeing sides putting forward their best case in the least possible words for their positions. One of the problems that I think the article has is that while Calvin per se may or may not be a particularly well qualified academic linguist by our existing views of the subject, he most certainly is an extremely notable speaker on the subject, particularly if the content is in accord with what might be standard practice in Calvinist religious groups. If the latter is the case, it might be good to say something to the effect that Calvin is speaking the Calvinist position, I don't know. In any event, like I said, maybe the best thing to do is to get the disputants to make summaries of their positions, file an RfC, post links to the RfC on the talk pages of relevant WikiProjects and maybe directly relevant articles, and then hope for responses. John Carter (talk) 14:08, 29 October 2010 (UTC)

I noticed the post to the Christianity project earlier today, actually. I myself was off yesterday, which is why I only responded today. Believe me, this is possibly far from being the only page we deal with where individuals seek to give more weight to a given view than it might necessarily deserve, particularly on religious matters. And your point about RS as opposed to consensus academic RS is a good one - obviously, I think most people would qualify Calvin as an RS for Calvinism, just like most people count The Watchtower as an RS for the Jehovah's Witnesses. That doesn't mean that either are really the best RS's in general, however. WP:WEIGHT then becomes the problem, and I think that is probably the main point here. What would probably work best here, I think, is an RfC. Among the things I might get together for such an RfC would be, if possible, as many encyclopedic and other generally well regarded more-or-less "standard sources" and what they say about the subject, including any that support the Calvinist position. But I have noticed that matters of WP:WEIGHT tend to require such overkill at times. Most people here, possibly with the exception of User:Dbachmann and some others who really do know linguistics, don't really feel that qualified to speak about linguistics and translation matters on their own, and would probably welcome a more thorough indication of the more recent spectrum of academic opinion on the matter. And, if it does go to an RfC, I would try to ensure that any editors who are comfortable with linguistics matters be among those who are contacted, by maybe leaving a note at WP:LING as well. Yeah, it sucks, but, sometimes, that's about the only alternative, unfortunately. John Carter (talk) 14:50, 29 October 2010 (UTC)
Right now I am involved in a mediation about the Ebionites because two editors, who are very unusually interested in that article ;), somehow seem to believe that certain sources which have been generally discounted by the academic community, but seem to be widely accepted by the comparatively few non-notable neo-Ebionites out there, absolutely need to be referenced and discussed at length in that article. This is after a previous ArbCom on the subject, by the way. I don't think that we really do have policies regarding translation matters, unfortunately. User:Dbachmann, though, I think is an academically qualified linguist, and his input, and that of a few other such linguists, if we have others - I dunno, might be the only thing short of an RfC which might help resolve the issue. John Carter (talk) 15:14, 29 October 2010 (UTC)
If you've got any that aren't already quoted in full at User:John Carter/Ebionites or it's talk page, I wouldn't mind seeing them. But, yeah, sometimes, one has to go to greater lengths than one would have thought. I myself get the impression that at this point right now they might not be that useful. Things might change later though once the current matters are resolved. John Carter (talk) 15:38, 29 October 2010 (UTC)
If you mean e-mailing the sourced material itself, after maybe scanning it, that would be great. But we're probably thinking about word for word reproduction of what the sources say, unfortunately, given the contentiousness of the topic as it now stands. But I do think that there might be some sort of resolution to this matter in the somewhat near future, and I'm not sure that in this instance, given what some parties have said already, any additional information would necessarily be particularly useful right now. When and if things change, however, that would be wonderful. But, specifically, if you know of any academic sources which have specifically commented about Oskar Skarsaune's recent proposals about the earlier usage of the name by Jewish groups, that would be very, very welcome. John Carter (talk) 16:18, 29 October 2010 (UTC)

I am growing tired of your aggressive behaviour. We are not on your timetable to provide you with answers you feel that you need. And in the case of this request, you're going to have to go back in time and actually read what the other editors have written instead of stomping your feet around like a spoiled child. In particular this response and this response were made, so I'm not sure for what you're still waiting. --Walter Görlitz (talk) 03:02, 31 October 2010 (UTC)

October 2010[edit]

Information.svg Welcome to Wikipedia. Although everyone is welcome to contribute constructively to the encyclopedia, we would like to remind you not to attack other editors, as you did on Talk:Baptism. Please comment on the contributions and not the contributors. Take a look at the welcome page to learn more about contributing to this encyclopedia. You are welcome to rephrase your comment as a civil criticism of the article. Thank you. Your comment was completely uncivil. I am starting to think you don't follow the faith you're discussing. I removed your rude comments. Please try again. Walter Görlitz (talk) 07:04, 30 October 2010 (UTC)

Again. Please stop with the trash talking: "Is that it? No response to my points? No explanation for why you removed numerous WP:RS/WP:V with which you disagree?". If you want us to take you seriously you'll stop taunting. It's unbecoming. --Walter Görlitz (talk) 16:03, 2 November 2010 (UTC)
Pointing out that my points haven't been addressed is not trash talk. Accusing someone of being a sock puppet, most certainly is.--Taiwan boi (talk) 22:15, 2 November 2010 (UTC)
If it were just pointing it out, it would me, but they way you're doing it is. I don't know how familiar you are with North American colloquialisms, but trash talking is when players or fans of opposing teams taunt or use jibes to insult those with whom they are dialoguing. That is the reference I'm making. --Walter Görlitz (talk) 22:32, 2 November 2010 (UTC)

WP:YEC[edit]

Hi! Would you be interested in joining this WikiProject? We are short on editors and it would be nice to have another guy onboard...--Novus Orator 06:47, 8 November 2010 (UTC)

The editors involved will uphold all of Wikipedia's policies and guidelines to the letter. You do not have to support or agree with the topic to join. We just need editors who are neutral and willing to contribute constructively. Please join.--Novus Orator 07:55, 8 November 2010 (UTC)
If you know of any other editors who would be interested please alert them to this opportunity. Thanks again!--Novus Orator 07:57, 8 November 2010 (UTC)

Lima/Esoglou[edit]

Lima learned his editing style from a fellow editor (Lost Caesar) who also got in a dispute with me and also dropped out, changed his name, and returned. It's no surprise to see Lima do the exact same thing. I wonder whether RomanHistorian is next. Leadwind (talk) 15:04, 22 November 2010 (UTC)

Once the RfC got underway, his behavior abated. But he has a sneaky habit of letting something sit and then ninja-editing later with a misleading summary for the edit. Let me know if you get something started. Leadwind (talk) 21:06, 22 November 2010 (UTC)
My experiences with Esoglou are limited to the "baptism" and "immersion baptism" where he pushed for a narrow definition in line with his views. It seems like his goal is not to reason and persuade, but to wear down the opposing party, so he gets frustrated and leaves the discussion. I tried compromising with him earlier in the year but it was difficult, but maybe he'd say the same about me. Swampyank (talk) 05:00, 23 November 2010 (UTC)

Email[edit]

I can email you if you leave me yours. Swampyank (talk) 15:35, 25 November 2010 (UTC)

Sorry to butt in, but you can try the old "thisismyemail at address dot com". Ng.j (talk) 19:10, 28 November 2010 (UTC)
Thanks, but although that will stop bots it won't stop people.--Taiwan boi (talk) 13:36, 29 November 2010 (UTC)

Christian Historicm[edit]

STOP SCREWING WITH THE HISTORICISM (CHRISTIANITY) PAGE. HISTORICISM WAS NOT THE FIRST MODE OF PROPHETIC INTERPRETATION IN CHRISTIANITY. IMMEDIACY (or the doctrine of imminence) WAS.

HISTORICISM DIDN'T EVOLVE UNTIL THE MID-2ND TO 4TH CENTURIES.

MAN, you're ignorant.

Ike Eickman (talk) 07:49, 29 November 2010 (UTC)

Immersible baptism[edit]

Thank you. LoveMonkey (talk)

Please be advised that your multiple edits at Immersion baptism constitute a breach of WP:3RR.

--Walter Görlitz (talk) 03:21, 1 December 2010 (UTC)

One, two, three.--Taiwan boi (talk) 03:25, 1 December 2010 (UTC)

Christianity and violence[edit]

Hi Taiwan boi, I notice from your user page that you are interested in Christianity, ancient civilizations and medieval civilization. I think you might be interested in an article that I've been working on the past month viz. Christianity and violence. Would you care to take a look at it and give your input on the [[Talk:Christianity and violence|talk page? Or just edit the article directly. Thanx.

--19:54, 29 November 2010 (UTC)

December 2010[edit]

You have been blocked temporarily from editing for edit warring, as you did at Immersion baptism. Once the block has expired, you are welcome to make useful contributions. If you would like to be unblocked, you may appeal this block by adding the text {{unblock|reason=Your reason here ~~~~}} below this notice, but you should read the guide to appealing blocks first. HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 00:43, 2 December 2010 (UTC)

During a dispute, you should first try to discuss controversial changes and seek consensus. If that proves unsuccessful you are encouraged to seek dispute resolution, and in some cases it may be appropriate to request page protection.


@Taiwan boi: In a section earlier on this Talk Page, you identify precisely three reverts, suggesting that you had not at that time violate WP:3RR. You should note that WP:3RR states "An administrator may still act whenever they believe a user's behavior constitutes edit warring, and any user may report edit-warring, even if the three-revert rule has not been breached. The rule is not an entitlement to revert a page a specific number of times." I would advise you not to rely on the number three when reverting. Consider adopting WP:BRD as a model for interacting with other editors. {{WP:1RR]] should be the goal, not WP:3RR. --Richard S (talk) 18:18, 1 December 2010 (UTC)


@Any admin who cares to consider shortening the block: WP:3RR states "Editors violating the rule will usually be blocked for 24 hours for a first incident." I'm not sure if Taiwan boi is a first-offender but I he does seem to be a valuable contributor to a number of Christian-related articles and I would request that his block be reduced to 24 hours if he promises to stop edit-warring. (NB: I have no knowledge of whether or not he is a repeat offender wrt edit-warring so this request is made on the condition that he is not an inveterate edit warrior.) --Richard S (talk) 18:18, 1 December 2010 (UTC)

He's not blocked for 3RR, he's blocked for an edit war (along with the other editor involved) that has been going on for several days. Now, if he wants to talk about 1RR or avoiding that article for a while, we can negotiate terms for an unblock or shortening of duration. I'm not going to be unreasonable about it. HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 18:33, 1 December 2010 (UTC)
The edit war in question ended on November 28 when my edit was supported by four independent editors. The next edit war lasted less than a day, and ended when I stopped editing the article and another editor accepted my wording and Walter had to agree with it because it was decided on the NPOV noticeboard that he was wrong. I am not contesting the block, but you can review my entire editing history at Wikipedia and decide for yourselves if I'm a habitual disruptive editor or a regular constructive contributor. With regard to the article in question it has taken me a month to have standard WP:RS included, after my attempts to replace 100 year old sectarian works with standard modern academic commentaries and professional lexicons were reverted repeatedly for several weeks. Two of the editors have an openly acknowledged religious POV and have been frustrating the efforts of myself and editors swampyank and Leadwind to improve the article. One of these editors was the subject of an RFC which included his conduct on the baptism page (that was two years ago, and several independent editors have informed me that his conduct has been consistently the same up to now). I realise I shouldn't resort to edit warring, but it is very frustrating when one or two POV editors can hold an entire article to ransom and there are no Wiki policies which can be applied to resolve the situation. It's not as if I haven't tried alternatives to edit warring. I sought 3PO, notified the WP:RS board, and asked the advice of the administrator of the Christianity project. No one answered my 3PO request, editors on the WP:RS board said they weren't sufficiently familiar with the sources to determine which should be given WP:WEIGHT, and the administrator of the Christianity project told me there was nothing he could do, and I would just have to keep trying to get it in somehow.--Taiwan boi (talk) 00:30, 2 December 2010 (UTC)
If you decide you want to contest the block, I'm willing to listen to you, though I'm unlikely to be on tomorrow, so you'll have to chat with whoever's patrolling CAT:RFU at the time. 00:43, 2 December 2010 (UTC)
Thanks, I appreciate that. However, I agree with the block in principle since I was involved in edit warring a couple of days ago (even though the war was resolved on November 28 by an overwhelming consensus of editors). I am a supporter of blocks as a means of dissuading edit wars, and I don't exempt myself from that. I would rather sit out the block.--Taiwan boi (talk) 00:46, 2 December 2010 (UTC)

response[edit]

Anti-Catholic POV is not welcome in the article either. You've already been blocked once for your behavior. That should have been an indicator for you. So cut the crapFarsight001 (talk) 02:34, 12 December 2010 (UTC)

I did not "confirm" that I want the article to reflect Catholic POV. Don't put words in my mouth. Furthermore, you did not quote from WP:RS, so please don't lie. Third, I didn't say you were blocked for anti-Catholic behavior, but rather poor behavior. As the block message indicates, it was for edit warring. And as I indicated, that should probably be a sign that you should be fixing your approach. Farsight001 (talk) 08:51, 12 December 2010 (UTC)
It should surprise you that the Catholic Church doesn't much HAVE a pov on this subject, as it doesn't much matter to them what was normitive at the time. And since they don't have much of a pov, it would be impossible for me to want it reflected in the article. As for your quoting RS - ok, maybe you did somewhere else (I did not check), but I was not talking about that as this is a different conversation. And accusations of lying are uncivil only if untrue.Farsight001 (talk) 10:50, 12 December 2010 (UTC)
As for my apparent history of edit warring, you would benefit in looking at more than the warning on my page. I was reverting rampant and repetitions article vandalism. It was probably a couple dozen reverts in the course of 2 hours involving removing blp violations, returning citations to the article, and other things like that. The person who placed that warning on my page did so after looking at the edit history, but before looking at the edits themselves. There was no real edit warring there and the other user was promptly blocked after being reported.Farsight001 (talk) 10:53, 12 December 2010 (UTC)

I do not appreciate your deletion of my comment on the immersion baptism talk page. I removed a comment because it was nothing but a personal attack and made no attempt to be productive, and thus, per policy, can be deleted without warning. This I explained in the edit summary. YOU deleted my comment, which was not a personal attack, and however rude it may have come across, was a genuine attempt to make progress. You provided no explanation for it whatsoever. So explain. Further deletion of productive comments will be reported, I can guarantee that.Farsight001 (talk) 12:15, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

Here is the post of mine you removed while simultaneously making a comment of your own and re-adding the insult exclusive post of another user: http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Talk%3AImmersion_baptism&action=historysubmit&diff=402113439&oldid=402113147 Farsight001 (talk) 20:11, 14 December 2010 (UTC)

Regardless of whose signature is on what, the diff I provided distinctly says that it was YOU who made the edit in question. Signatures can be faked, diffs cannot, and the diff says it was you. Blatantly lying and saying that it was not when there is obvious proof that it was really damages others' motivation to take you seriously.Farsight001 (talk) 08:17, 17 December 2010 (UTC)
No, you seem to be the one confused. LoveMonkey made an edit. I removed it, as it was nothing but an insult and then made a comment of my own. Next, you made an edit (the diff I provided), in which you very obviously deleted my comment, put LoveMonkey's back in, and made a comment of your own. There is no way around it - the diff is yours, so it was you who deleted my comment. As I already said, it doesn't matter what the signature says, as signatures can be faked. The diff says you did it, and the diff cannot be faked.Farsight001 (talk) 09:43, 17 December 2010 (UTC)

Peace... what a wonderful situation... four of the more prickly Wiki-personalities on one page... must be great fun.

First of all, Farsight, please don't remove the comments of other editors even if they are uncivil. Hmm... well, when I went to WP:TALK in order to double-check my understanding of policy, I found the following:

Removing harmful posts, including personal attacks, trolling and vandalism. This generally does not extend to messages that are merely incivil; deletions of simple invective are controversial. Posts that may be considered disruptive in various ways are another borderline case and are usually best left as-is or archived.


It might be useful to review what is considered a personal attack.

Now, I'm not defending LoveMonkey. He has a contentious style that is often uncivil but what he wrote is not a personal attack according to the definition in WP:NPA.

That said, I would assume good faith and take Taiwan boi at his word when he says that he did not intend to delete your comment. The Wikimedia software is pretty good at catching edit conflicts but not always. I think I've had this sort of thing happen to me once or twice. It's possible to grab an old revision of a page, edit it and then put it back thereby undoing somebody else's edit unintentionally. It shouldn't happen but I think it does.

Anyway, I think it would be better for everybody to just cool down and focus on the project which is, in case you've forgotten, to write an encyclopedia.

--Richard S (talk) 15:59, 17 December 2010 (UTC)

Oh this is getting to be cliche but for my own two cents. As usual Richard is right and I concur. LoveMonkey (talk) 19:26, 17 December 2010 (UTC)

Bowl of porridge[edit]

What was you were thinking with that "bowl of porridge" entry? Kindly do not do another like that. --PMDrive1061 (talk) 16:07, 16 December 2010 (UTC)

  • I haven't cost you anything. Nonsense titles really raise red flags and I had no idea what you had in mind and I didn't accuse you of vandalism. What you should have done was to place the content on a user subpage and not the article space, which I'll do for you: User: Taiwan boi/Porridge test page --PMDrive1061 (talk) 18:14, 16 December 2010 (UTC)

PS: Please don't come onto my talk page or that of any other user with a chip on your shoulder like that. The problem took less than two minutes to fix and all you had to do was to ask. --PMDrive1061 (talk) 18:19, 16 December 2010 (UTC)

My friend, you had better damned well calm down because if you continue to hurl abuse at me or any other user on this site, I will block you so fast your head will spin. Read the rules. You misappropriated the article space, I left polite note regarding my concerns, restored the text in a user subpage for you and still you're griping. My advice would be to drop the matter. The issue is fixed, you have a subpage that you can work with to your heart's content and I consider the matter dropped. PMDrive1061 (talk) 04:04, 17 December 2010 (UTC)

PS: You've been here long enough to know that nothing on this site is ever lost. --PMDrive1061 (talk) 04:11, 17 December 2010 (UTC)

Ike[edit]

Apologies if you feel things didn't happen fast enough. My time on wiki is limited. I do appreciate how frustrating it can be having spent some months of my life arguing with what turned out to be one editor and 6 sockpuppets with no sign of help from admins etc. However, it is important in a dense, obscure content dispute not to get carried away by mere incivility into making hasty decisions, hence my efforts to explore "triunism". Anyway - it's sorted now. Fainites barleyscribs 23:26, 18 December 2010 (UTC)

contacting you[edit]

You want me to email you. How, exactly? Leadwind (talk) 01:54, 23 December 2010 (UTC)

Sorry to need special help, but on your user page under Toolbox, all I see is this:

   * What links here
   * Related changes
   * User contributions
   * Logs
   * Upload file
   * Special pages
   * Permanent link

Leadwind (talk) 20:16, 27 December 2010 (UTC)

I think Leadwind has to put in an email address under his own profile before the option will become available to him. LoveMonkey (talk) 19:51, 28 December 2010 (UTC)
Thanks, LoveMonkey. Tb, see email. Leadwind (talk) 21:30, 1 January 2011 (UTC)

Table of terms[edit]

I've drawn up a table of terms at Talk:Christian mortalism#Table of terms regarding the intermediate state. Please take a look and comment. StAnselm (talk) 22:17, 2 January 2011 (UTC)

WP:POINT in your RFC draft[edit]

Hello! You may recognize me as one of the editors who has posted a comment in your Esoglou RfC draft. I have a concern about part of the draft.

Why do you list WP:POINT as one of the "applicable policies and guidelines" for this RfC? When WP:POINT talks about "not disrupting Wikipedia to make a point", it's talking specifically about cases where an editor pretends to hold a certain position in order to turn people against that position or makes a bad edit to show why that kind of edit should be prohibited. To violate WP:POINT, Esoglou would have to deliberately do X in an effort to turn people against X (e.g. add anti-Catholic POV to articles in an effort to turn people against any edits that are critical of Catholicism).

As far as I can tell, your description of the dispute doesn't show that Esoglou has violated WP:POINT. If I overlooked some relevant evidence that you provided, please let me know. --Phatius McBluff (talk) 06:30, 12 January 2011 (UTC)

Here is my reply to your reply on my talk page:
You are unhappy that I posted "personal attacks on other editors" in my comment. First of all, I don't consider what I wrote to be "personal attacks". A personal attack would be a direct insult such as "You're stupid." I was simply making observations about another editor's behavior. Second of all, I was under the impression that the behavior of any involved party is fair game for scrutiny on a RfC. That is how I interpreted WP:SHOT#There is no "immunity" for reporters. I have since edited my comment to reflect your WP:COAT concerns. Let's put this particular issue behind us.
I didn't publicize your draft "as if it's the final version". After noticing LoveMonkey link to your draft on a talk page, I took the liberty of informing a couple of other editors who I thought would have an interest. These editors were User:Pseudo-Richard (whose opinion about Esoglou is relevant because he's had experience editing with Esoglou) and Esoglou himself. In neither case did I say that the RfC was finalized.
In retrospect, I realize that it may have been inappropriate for me to advertise it to Richard before it was finalized, although I did explicitly tell him that it was only a draft. If you seriously believe that other editors would find my action (i.e. advertising it to Richard) inappropriate, then I will remember that in the future.
As for Esoglou, frankly, I think he had the right to know as soon as possible. Everything on Wikipedia, including your draft, is in principle visible to the public. Thus, I don't think you can claim any right to keep it unpublicized. If Esoglou doesn't have a right to know about it, then I don't know who does.
As for "questioning [you] about statements which [you] do not intend to include in the draft"... Well, my question about WP:POINT was a good faith inquiry, nothing more. I had no way of knowing that you didn't intend to include it in the final version. I apologize if my question offended you, but don't see how else I should have acted upon noticing the WP:POINT link. I may or may not be knocking around Wikipedia if and when the RfC goes public; it seemed reasonable to ask you about it now. If you think I should have handled my question differently, then please let me know. Thank you. --Phatius McBluff (talk) 07:29, 12 January 2011 (UTC)
Ugh... it may have been bad form for LoveMonkey to have referred to a draft RFC but he did and so the cat is out of the bag. If you want privacy, then edit on your own computer and not on a Wikipedia page, not even in your own userspace.
If Leadwind can add a supportive "outside view", then Phatius should be able to draft a "less than supportive" "outside view".
As for me, I'm sorry that things have gotten so yucky that Taiwan boi has felt it necessary to draft (and possibly wind up issuing) a user RFC on Esoglou. Looking at the evidence that Taiwan boi has compiled so far, it seems that he has reason to complain (of course, we've only heard Taiwan boi's side of the story so far). However, my general impression is that Esoglou has been annoying and perhaps has over-argued his case but that his behavior is not so bad as to warrant the severe sanctions that Taiwan boi and Leadwind suggest. (I mean "banning"? Seriously?) A far stronger case could be made for banning LoveMonkey. Not that I'm proposing that. I'm just saying it would be better if people would lay down their sticks and stones and get back to work on the project. That's why I haven't added in an "outside view" yet.
--Pseudo-Richard (talk) 07:42, 12 January 2011 (UTC)

A few final remarks (to which you may feel free either to respond or not to respond):

Sorry, I couldn't help noticing your post on Richard's talk page. For the record, I don't have "personal gripes" against LM. On the whole, LM has been quite civil toward me, even awarding me a barnstar. My concern was with his obvious interpersonal conflict with Esoglou, which succeeded in driving me away from editing Palamism-related articles. This conflict indicates (to me, at any rate) that Esoglou may not have been solely responsible for whatever happened between him and editors elsewhere. That's the only point I was trying to make with my comments about LM. Looking back, I realize that it was silly of me to add a long list of concerns about LM to my RfC comment. As I've explained, I honestly thought at the time that your Esoglou RfC was an appropriate forum for raising those concerns. You can either believe this claim of innocence or not; I won't waste more of our time trying to make it.

I still don't understand what I did wrong in asking you about WP:POINT. It was just an honest question about why WP:POINT appeared in your draft. Again, if you think I should have handled my question in some other specific way, then let me know.

For the record, I will say that you're right to raise whatever concerns you have about Esoglou. I've put in my two cents; if the RfC goes public, then I'll be happy to let it play out as it will. I hope that our encounter hasn't created any hard feelings and that, if we edit together in the future, we can do so without animosity or negative preconceptions. --Phatius McBluff (talk) 18:27, 12 January 2011 (UTC)

January 2011[edit]

Please stop. Continuing to remove maintenance templates from pages on Wikipedia, as you did to Christian mortalism, without resolving the problem that the template refers to may be considered disruptive editing. Further edits of this type may result in your being blocked from editing Wikipedia. StAnselm (talk) 05:21, 19 January 2011 (UTC)

East-West schism[edit]

Sure is you can find a source stating that the Patriarch over stepped his bounds by all means please help. Thanks LoveMonkey (talk) 13:26, 27 January 2011 (UTC)

How to word the agreement?[edit]

Hello Taiwan boi. I see that the WP:AN3 thread is getting into too much detail and a lot of arguing back and forth. Do you see anything there which people have said that would make it reasonable to reword or change your original proposal? EdJohnston (talk) 19:16, 4 February 2011 (UTC)

A request[edit]

Hello again. I understand that you communicate with LM over email; thus, I take it that you have some influence with him. Please read the comment I posted here. I was wondering if you could try to convince LM to attribute sentences about Orthodox commentary on the RCC to specific individuals and documents whenever he edits them, even if he is only editing preexisting sentences. This will remove any doubt about whether LM is obeying the restrictions. I don't want a fight to break out again, so I want to make sure that Esoglou has absolutely no grounds for complaining about LM's behavior. --Phatius McBluff (talk) 17:15, 14 February 2011 (UTC)

Thanks, I will do that.--Taiwan boi (talk) 03:59, 15 February 2011 (UTC)

Another request[edit]

I don't want to get dragged into another of these silly arguments, so I was wondering if you could try to nip this one in the bud. Look here and here; if you agree with my reaction, then could you please back me up on it? Thx. --Phatius McBluff (talk) 00:22, 16 March 2011 (UTC)

Just an update in case you're interested. LM has responded to my post on Talk:East-West Schism. From what he says, it appears that there was an earlier agreement between him and Esoglou to the effect that LM wouldn't edit East-West Schism as long as Esoglou didn't. That, and not the more recent editing restrictions, are what LM was apparently referring to when he complained about Esoglou's editing. At this point, I have to admit that I'm a bit lost. I'm going to step out of this one, since I obviously don't follow the intricacies of LM-Esoglou politics closely enough to be of much use. Frankly, I don't think that LM and Esoglou can be trusted to interact responsibly while editing an article like East-West Schism. However, given my reading of the current editing restrictions, those restrictions don't technically forbid either party from editing that article. (The restrictions do forbid either party from editing material that concerns the other's religion while editing the article, but that's precisely what I don't trust LM and Esoglou to adhere to. One User:DGG appears to have just made a similar point.) Ugh. What a mess. --Phatius McBluff (talk) 19:11, 16 March 2011 (UTC)

Replied[edit]

Please see my reply at User talk:EdJohnston#Esoglou editing in Eastern Orthodoxy section again. Thanks, EdJohnston (talk) 02:43, 7 November 2011 (UTC)

Comment?[edit]

Do you perhaps wish to comment in good time on this? Esoglou (talk) 09:45, 19 November 2011 (UTC)

Ichthus: January 2012[edit]

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ICHTHUS

January 2012

Ichthus is the newsletter of Christianity on Wikipedia • It is published by WikiProject Christianity
For submissions contact the Newsroom • To unsubscribe add yourself to the list here

Ichthus: May 2012[edit]

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ICHTHUS

May 2012

From the Editor[edit]

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This month marks the observation of Pentecost, one of the most important feast of the Christian liturgical year. It is our hope here that all of you, regardless of your religious affiliation (if any), find that the holiday, and its accompanying activities, an enjoyable and beneficial experience. We also hope that this "Birthday of the Church" is one which gives you the same joy as the birthday of yourself or your loved ones.

Ichthus is the successor to the long running WikiProject Christianity newsletter, run under the WikiProject Christianity’s Outreach department. As such, you will continue to see information about our latest featured and good articles, DYKs, as well as new members who have joined our project. You might also see links to Christianity related news from the mainstream media!

With that, I wish you all happy reading!

John Carter, Asst. Editor

P.S. Please click here to add the new Christianity-related topics Noticeboard to your watchlist to follow the latest discussions relevant to WikiProject Christianity and subprojects.

Help Bring Wikipe-tan "into the fold"[edit]

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As many of you may know, our unofficial mascot, dear Wikipe-tan, hasn't yet indicated any particular beliefs. However, yes, as we all know, ahem, some people might object to our beloved mascot running around in a French maid outfit. People do talk, you know. ;) If anyone might be able to develop an image of the dear lady in a image more, well, "Christian," I would like to see perhaps a vote for next month as to which, if any, image of the dear girl we might make our own unofficial mascot. Please post your images here.

By John Carter

Christianity in other wikis[edit]

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As many of you might now, there are a large number of other Wikimedia Foundation projects, including WikiSource, Wiktionary, Wikibooks, WikiQuote, and others. I certainly believe that Wikibooks and Wikiquote might be among the more directly relevant sister projects. If any of you can think of any particular efforts in these other projects which you think would benefit from more input, please let us know here, so we can help spread the word around.

By John Carter

Spotlight on the Outreach department[edit]

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Ichthus will spotlight a different subproject or workgroup of WikiProject Christianity. This edition will spotlight on our vital Outreach department. This comparatively small, but vital, project unit is dedicated to welcoming new editors to Wikipedia and the Christianity related content, and to providing information to the various project members, in forms like this newsletter.

The scope of articles with which this group deals is truly enormous, and, given the wide variety of material with which we deal, we would very much welcome the input of more individuals, particularly individuals who are particularly knowledgeable of the less well-known and less frequently monitored articles related to Christianity.

Speaking personally, I would be very, very gratified if we were to have this become a very, very large and active unit, with members from the broad spectrum of Christian beliefs, practices, and groups. The broader the spectrum and areas of expertise of members we have, the better we will be able to help manage the content. Please consider whether you believe you might be able to contribute in this vital area.

By John Carter


Ichthus is the newsletter of Christianity on Wikipedia • It is published by WikiProject Christianity
For submissions contact the Newsroom • To unsubscribe add yourself to the list here
EdwardsBot (talk) 20:46, 29 April 2012 (UTC)

Ichthus: June 2012[edit]

Ichthus dark yellow.png

ICHTHUS

June 2012

Membership report[edit]

The parent Christianity WikiProject currently has 331 active members. We would like to welcome User:Sanju87, User:Psalm84, User:Zegron, User:Jargon777, User:Calu2000, User:Gilderien, User:Ronallenus, Thank you all for your interest in this effort. If any members, new or not, wish any assistance, they should feel free to leave a message at the Christianity noticeboard or with me or other individual editors to request it.

From the Editor[edit]

Ichthus is one of the ways that the WikiProject Christianity’s Outreach department helps update our members. We have recently added some new sections to the newsletter. Please let us know what you think of the new departments, and if there are any other suggestions for departments you would like to see. And if you have anything you would personally like to add, by all means let us know. The talk page of the current issue is probably the best place to post such comments.

With that, I wish you all happy reading!

P.S. Please click here to add the new Christianity noticeboard to your watchlist to follow the latest discussions relevant to WikiProject Christianity and subprojects.

Church of the month[edit]

Katharinenkloster Sinai BW 2.jpg
by Berthold Werner
Saint Catherine's Monastery, Mount Sinai

Vote for the project mascot[edit]

We had last month asked our members to help "bring into the fold" Wikipe-tan as the project's mascot. Voting will take place this month for which image we should adopt at Wikipedia:WikiProject Christianity/Outreach/Wikipe-tan. Please take a moment to review the images and vote for whichever is your favorite, or, if you so prefer, suggest an additional one.

By John Carter

DYK[edit]

  • ...that Anna of Kashin, a Russian medieval princess, was twice canonized as a holy protectress of women who suffer the loss of relatives?


Calendar[edit]

Thie coming month includes days dedicated to the honor of Beheading of John the Baptist, Saints Peter and Paul, the Nativity of John the Baptist, and Saint Barnabas.

Featured content and GA report[edit]

Alec Douglas-Home recently achieved FA status. This picture, in the Church of the Month section, was recently promoted to Featured Picture status. Our thanks and congratulations to all those involved.

Wikimedia Foundation report[edit]

Wikisource-logo.svg

Wikisource currently has many old texts available, most of them in the public domain. This is a potentially very valuable source for several things, including for instance links to Biblical verses, because we know that it will, basically, be around as long as we are.

By user:John Carter with inspiration from History2007

Christian art[edit]

English - Resurrection - Walters 27308.jpg

This section would include a rather large image of a specific work of art, with a link to the most directly relevant article.

Suggestion: Resurrection of Christ, an English 15th century Nottingham alabaster. Groups of painted relief panels were sold via dealers to churches on a budget , who had wood frameworks made to hold them locally. From a huge new donation of images from the Walters Art Museum to Commons, see


By Johnbod

Spotlight[edit]

A new WikiProject relating directly to Christian history is being developed at Wikipedia:WikiProject Christian history. Also, a group specifically devoted to the Mennonites and other Anabaptists is now up and running at Wikipedia:WikiProject Christianity/Anabaptist work group. Anyone interested in assisting with the development of these groups and topics is more than welcome to do so.

By John Carter

I believe[edit]

... in the statements contained in the Nicene Creed. I believe that the Bible is one of the two defining bases for belief. The other is the Sacred tradition, which provides us with means of interpreting the Scriptures, as well as some teachings which have been handed on by God outside of the scriptures. I believe that the Magisterium has been empowered to fill this interpretative function. I believe that clerical celibacy is a rule that should generally be followed. I am a member of the Catholic Church.

By John Carter

Help requests[edit]

Please let us know if there are any particular areas, either individual articles or topics, which you believe would benefit from outside help from a variety of other editors. We will try to include such requests in future issues.



Ichthus is the newsletter of Christianity on Wikipedia • It is published by WikiProject Christianity
For submissions contact the Newsroom • To unsubscribe add yourself to the list here
EdwardsBot (talk) 02:54, 12 June 2012 (UTC)

Proposed lifting of edit restriction on Esoglou[edit]

Please see this proposal to lift the edit restriction on Esoglou wrt Orthodox doctrine. --Pseudo-Richard (talk) 17:40, 12 July 2012 (UTC)

Hello Taiwan boi. You've expressed concern about lifting Esoglou's ban. Can you provide any recent diffs where you think Esoglou has been pushing a POV on Orthodox matters? If this still worries you, do you have any other ideas for allowing Esoglou to collaborate on Eastern Orthodox opposition to the doctrine of Papal Primacy? Thank you, EdJohnston (talk) 13:24, 13 July 2012 (UTC)
Never mind, Pseudo-Richard has withdrawn his proposal. Thank you, EdJohnston (talk) 13:24, 14 July 2012 (UTC)

Ichthus: July 2012[edit]

Ichthus dark yellow.png

ICHTHUS

July 2012

Membership report
The parent Christianity WikiProject currently has 336 active members. We would like to welcome User:Emilymadcat, User:Toa Nidhiki05, User:DonutGuy, and User:RCNesland, Thank you all for your interest in this effort. If any members, new or not, wish any assistance, they should feel free to leave a message at the Christianity noticeboard or with me or other individual editors to request it.

From the Editor
Ichthus is one of the ways that the WikiProject Christianity’s Outreach department helps update our members. We have recently added some new sections to the newsletter. Please let us know what you think of the new departments, and if there are any other suggestions for departments you would like to see. And if you have anything you would personally like to add, by all means let us know. The talk page of the current issue is probably the best place to post such comments.

With that, I wish you all happy reading!

P.S. Please click here to add the new Christianity noticeboard to your watchlist to follow the latest discussions relevant to WikiProject Christianity and subprojects.

Church of the month

Mission Santa Clara.jpg
by User:JaGa
Mission Santa Clara de Asis

Vote for the project mascot
We had last month asked our members to help "bring into the fold" Wikipe-tan as the project's mascot. Voting will take place this month for which image we should adopt at Wikipedia:WikiProject Christianity/Outreach/Wikipe-tan. Please take a moment to review the images and vote for whichever is your favorite, or, if you so prefer, suggest an additional one.

By John Carter

Calendar
Thie coming month (mid-July through mid-September) includes days dedicated to the honor of Mary Magdalene, James, son of Zebedee, Ignatius Loyola, Saint Dominic, Joseph of Arimathea, and the Transfiguration of Jesus.

Featured content and GA report
Grade I listed churches in Cheshire was recently promoted to Featured List status. This picture was recently promoted to Featured Picture status. Bartolome de las Casas and Edmund the Martyr were promoted to GA level this past month. Our thanks and congratulations to all those involved.


Wikimedia Foundation report

Wikibooks-logo-en.svg

Wikibooks welcomes the development of textbooks of all kinds, children's books, recipes, and other material. It currently has just under 2500 books, including several Wikijunior books for the 12 and under population. There is, at present, not even a book on Christianity. Anyone interested in helping develop such a textbook is more than welcome to do so.

By John Carter

Christian art

Hans Holbein, the Younger - Sir Thomas More - Google Art Project.jpg

The portrait of Sir Thomas More by Hans Holbein the Younger.

By John Carter

Spotlight
A new WikiProject relating directly to Christian history is being developed at Wikipedia:WikiProject Christian history. Anyone interested in assisting with the development of these groups and topics is more than welcome to do so.

By John Carter

I believe
... in the tradition of Thomas the Apostle, Mar Addai, and Saint Bartholomew. I believe that Jesus had two essences (or natures), human and divine, unmingled, that are everlastingly united in one personality. I am a member of the Assyrian Church of the East.

By John Carter


Help requests
Please let us know if there are any particular areas, either individual articles or topics, which you believe would benefit from outside help from a variety of other editors. We will try to include such requests in future issues.

Ichthus is the newsletter of Christianity on Wikipedia • It is published by WikiProject Christianity
For submissions contact the Newsroom • To unsubscribe add yourself to the list here
EdwardsBot (talk) 15:49, 17 July 2012 (UTC)

WikiProject Christianity August 2012 newsletter[edit]

Ichthus dark yellow.png

ICHTHUS

August 2012

Membership report
The parent Christianity WikiProject currently has 341 active members. We would like to welcome our newest members, User:David_FLXD, User:Alexsbecker, User:Penguin 236, User:Gugi001, User:John D. Rockerduck, and User:Margaret9mary. Thank you all for your interest in this effort. If any members, new or not, wish any assistance, they should feel free to leave a message at the Christianity noticeboard or with me or other individual editors to request it.


From the Editor
Ichthus is one of the ways that the WikiProject Christianity’s Outreach department helps update our members. We have recently added some new sections to the newsletter. Please let us know if there are changes you would like to see in the format, or if there are any particular things you would like to see included. And if you have anything you would personally like to add, by all means let us know. The talk page of the current issue is probably the best place to post such comments.

With that, I wish you all happy reading!

P.S. Please click here to add the new Christianity noticeboard to your watchlist to follow the latest discussions relevant to WikiProject Christianity and subprojects.

By John Carter


Church of the month

Frauenkirche Munich - View from Peterskirche Tower2.jpg
by User:Diliff
Frauenkirche (Church of Our Blessed Lady) in Munich, taken from the tower of St. Peter's Church


Contest of the month
We currently have a remarkable lack of Wikipedia:Wikipedia-Books. Right now, Category:Wikipedia books on Christianity contains only 12 books. We certainly could have at least one book on each major grouping within Christianity. One of the challenges for this month, then, is working to put together books on relevant topics. For this month, one contest is for editors to assemble the basic Wikipedia books for each of the main topics of the extant related projects. When finished, they should their creation of the books at the main Christianity noticeboard, and at the end of the month the project will award barnstars to those who have made a significant efforts in developing this underdeveloped content.

Also this month, we are going to have have a challenge to create and improve some of our more important missing or low-quality articles. As biographies are often a bit easier, this month we are choosing two biographies: Karl Behm, which has yet to be started, and the currently Stub-class article Nerses IV the Gracious. A barnstar will be awarded to any editor who can get these articles up to DYK quality level and ultimately selected for the DYK section of the main page.


Calendar
Thie coming month (mid-August through mid-September) includes feasts dedicated to the honor of Assumption of the Blessed Virgin Mary, Bartholomew the Apostle, Nativity of Mary, and the Exaltation of the Cross.

Featured content and GA report
Since the last report, William de Chesney (sheriff), Knights of Columbus, and Angelus Silesius were promoted to GA level. Our thanks and congratulations to all those involved.


Wikimedia Foundation report

WikiNews-Logo-en.svg

Wikinews is our sister site for developing news stories. Several events relating to Christianity, like the installation of bishops for instance, do not necessarily merit extensive coverage in wikipedia encyclopedic articles, but can and easily could be covered at greater length in a news article format. Given the number of significant news events that relate to religion, including claims of miracles, assignment of bishops and other religious leaders, church conferences, and other events, this site provides an excellent opportunity to provide in-depth coverage of current events at greater length than wikipedia.


Christian art

Cristo crucificado.jpg
Christ Crucified by Diego Velazquez.


Spotlight

John Wesley clipped.png

One of our newer editors, User:David_FLXD, has recently gone through much of our content related to Methodism and assessed it. We are very grateful for his efforts, and that of all the editors who have had a role in developing that content. We have every reason to believe that this will make it significantly easier for the Methodism work group to create and develop content relevant to Methodism. To help that along, we certainly encourage everyone to do what they can to help David and the other Methodism editors to bring the content relevant to their tradition to the highest possible level of quality.


I believe
... in the Holy Trinity, the sacraments of Baptism and Holy Communion, the Arminian conception of free will through God's prevenient grace, and the regular renewal of the individual's covenant with God. I am a Methodist.



Help requests
Please let us know if there are any particular areas, either individual articles or topics, which you believe would benefit from outside help from a variety of other editors. We will try to include such requests in future issues.

Ichthus is the newsletter of Christianity on Wikipedia • It is published by WikiProject Christianity
For submissions contact the Newsroom • To unsubscribe add yourself to the list here
EdwardsBot (talk)

WikiProject Christianity September 2012 newsletter[edit]

Ichthus dark yellow.png

ICHTHUS

September 2012

Membership report
The parent Christianity WikiProject currently has 344 active members. We would like to welcome our newest members, User:Floating Boat, User:Dewey420, and User:Jpacobb. Thank you all for your interest in this effort. If any members, new or not, wish any assistance, they should feel free to leave a message at the Christianity noticeboard or with me or other individual editors to request it.


From the Editor
Ichthus is one of the ways that the WikiProject Christianity’s Outreach department helps update our members. We have recently added some new sections to the newsletter. Please let us know if there are changes you would like to see in the format, or if there are any particular things you would like to see included. And if you have anything you would personally like to add, by all means let us know. The talk page of the current issue is probably the best place to post such comments.

With that, I wish you all happy reading!

P.S. Please click here to add the new Christianity noticeboard to your watchlist to follow the latest discussions relevant to WikiProject Christianity and subprojects.

By John Carter


Church of the month

Keble College Chapel - Oct 2006.jpg
by User:Diliff
The Chapel of Keble College, Oxford


Contest of the month
We currently have a remarkable lack of Wikipedia:Wikipedia-Books. Right now, Category:Wikipedia books on Christianity contains only 12 books. We certainly could have at least one book on each major grouping within Christianity. One of the challenges for this month, then, is working to put together books on relevant topics. For this month, one contest is for editors to assemble the basic Wikipedia books for each of the main topics of the extant related projects. When finished, they should their creation of the books at the main Christianity noticeboard, and at the end of the month the project will award barnstars to those who have made a significant efforts in developing this underdeveloped content.

Also this month, we are going to have have a challenge to create and improve some of our more important missing or low-quality articles. Last month's challenge articles were Karl Beth and Nerses IV the Gracious. Both articles are currently candidates for the DYK section of the main page. This month's challenge articles are the Stub-class article James Hastings and the not yet started Rudolf Sohm, A barnstar will be awarded to any editor who can get these articles up to DYK quality level and ultimately selected for the DYK section of the main page.


Calendar
Thie coming month (mid-September through mid-October) includes feasts dedicated to the honor of the Martyrs of Korea, Saint Matthew, Vincent de Paul, Michaelmas, Saint Jerome, Theresa of Lisieux, the Feast of the Guardian Angels, Francis of Assisi, Our Lady of the Rosary, and Teresa of Avila.

Featured content and GA report
Since the last report, Albertus Soegijapranata, and Reginald Heber were promoted to FA. Grade I listed churches in Greater Manchester was promoted to Featured List, and Jackie Hudson, Joyce Kilmer, Divine command theory, Bosa of York and Argument from morality were promoted to GA level. DYKs featured this past month include Church of Saint Benoit, Istanbul, All Saints Church, Hollingbourne, Neustädter Kirche, Hannover, St Mary's Church, Kirkby Lonsdale, Albert Ndongmo, If We Are the Body, List of places of worship in Tonbridge and Malling, Kulubnarti church, All Saints Church, Ulcombe, Val-Saint-Lambert Abbey, Igny Abbey, Church of the Holy Archangels Michael and Gabriel, Brăila, Places of Worship Registration Act 1855, Collegiate Church of San Gimignano, and St Matthew's Church, Burnley. Our profoundest thanks and congratulations to all those involved!

Wikimedia Foundation report

Wikipedia-logo-simple.png

As some of you may have seen, the Simple English Wikipedia has been experiencing some difficulties lately. This particular entity could be of great value to several individuals who are trying to learn English. As some of you who do speak foreign languages know, one of the most easily available, and, in general, useful learning aids for people is a text they know already, which allows them to focus on the specific words of the new language. Various recorded readings and translations of the Bible are among the best examples of this. Any efforts to try to enhance this vital means of informing a large segment of our readership is more than welcome. People interested in helping develop it are encouraged to leave a note regarding their specific articles of interest at the Christianity noticeboard. It would be wonderful if we could report some significant contributions to this sister site next month. And, of course, if we do have something to report, those involved would receive our greatest thanks.

Christian art

Cortona Guardian Angel 01.jpg
The Guardian Angel by Pietro da Cortona.


Spotlight

John Calvin - best likeness.jpg

WikiProject Calvinism is one of our more important subprojects. It is specifically devoted to developing content relating to the Calvinist tradition, and the primary point for development of content relating to the Pilgrims, Presbyterians, Reformed churches, Congregational church, Reformed Baptists, and Low church. We definitely encourage everyone to do what they can to help this project develop the content relating to this extremely important Christian tradition.


I believe
... that human nature is insufficient for salvation, and the grace of God is required to do so. I believe that God has preordained who will and will not achieve salvation. I believe that Jesus's atonement was sufficient for the purposes for which it was done. I believe that God's grace is of such power that it can overcome any person's resistance. I believe that those whom God has chosen for salvation will, by the undeniable power of God, persevere in God's grace. I am a Calvinist.



Help requests
Please let us know if there are any particular areas, either individual articles or topics, which you believe would benefit from outside help from a variety of other editors. We will try to include such requests in future issues.

Ichthus is the newsletter of Christianity on Wikipedia • It is published by WikiProject Christianity
For submissions contact the Newsroom • To unsubscribe add yourself to the list here
EdwardsBot (talk)

WikiProject Christianity October 2012 newsletter[edit]

Ichthus dark yellow.png

ICHTHUS

September 2012

Membership report
The parent Christianity WikiProject currently has 347 active members. We would like to welcome our newest members, User:Dplcrnj, User:Danmuz, User:Zigzig20s, and User:Jasonasosa. Thank you all for your interest in this effort. If any members, new or not, wish any assistance, they should feel free to leave a message at the Christianity noticeboard or with me or other individual editors to request it.


From the Editor
Ichthus is one of the ways that the WikiProject Christianity’s Outreach department helps update our members. This newsletter is one of the ways we do try to help people keep up with the project. We would always welcome any input for things to be included in it or additional editors to keep it going. Please let us know if there are changes you would like to see in the format, or if there are any particular things you would like to see included. And if you have anything you would personally like to add, by all means let us know. The talk page of the current issue is probably the best place to post such comments.

With that, I wish you all happy reading!

P.S. Please click here to add the new Christianity noticeboard to your watchlist to follow the latest discussions relevant to WikiProject Christianity and subprojects.

By John Carter


Church of the month

Basel - Pauluskirche1.jpg
by User:Taxiarchos228, recently promoted to Featured Image
St. Paul's Church, Basel


Contest of the month
For the upcoming month, the contest will be to develop content related to the Christmas season, including Advent and other related topics. Please feel free to see and take part in the discussion at Wikipedia talk:Christianity noticeboard#Contest of the month - Advent/Christmas content.

One of last month's challenge articles, Rudolf Sohm, has been substantially developed by User:Jack1956 and User:StAnselm. Our deepest thanks to both of them!!

Calendar
Thie coming month (mid-October through mid-November) includes All Saints' Day and All Souls' Day and major commemorations dedicated to the honor of the Ignatius of Antioch, Luke the Evangelist, Simon the Canaanite, Saint Jude, the dedication of the Lateran Basilica, the beginning of the Nativity Fast, James of Jerusalem, Reformation Day, and others.


Featured content and GA report
Since the last report, Augustinian theodicy by User:ItsZippy was promoted to FA. Grade I listed churches in Merseyside by User:Peter I. Vardy was promoted to Featured List. The images in the Church of the Month and Christian art sections of this newsletter were promoted to Featured Picture status. John Wheelwright by User:Sarnold17, Christmas Party (The Office) by User:Gen. Quon and If We Are the Body by User:Toa Nidhiki05, were promoted to GA level. DYKs featured this past month include Cathedral of Saint Demetrius, Craiova, by User:Biruitorul, Nerses IV the Gracious by User:John Carter, Church of St Candida and Holy Cross by User:BarretB, St Laurence's Church, Morland by User:Peter I. Vardy, St Mary's Church, Longfleet by User:Bermicourt, Chor von St. Bonifatius by User:Gerda Arendt, St Andrew's Church, Penrith by User:Peter I. Vardy, Holy Rosary Cathedral (Vancouver) by User:Bloom6132, Sacred Heart Cathedral (Kamloops) by User:Bloom6132, St Columba's Church, Warcop by User:Peter I. Vardy, St Oswald's Church, Ravenstonedale by User:Peter I. Vardy, and W. E. Biederwolf by User:John Foxe. Our profoundest thanks and congratulations to all those involved!

Christian art

John Henry Newman by Sir John Everett Millais, 1st Bt.jpg
Portrait of John Henry Newman by Sir John Everett Millais.
This image was promoted this past month to FM by the work of User:Spongie555. Thank you, Spongie!

Spotlight

Wikipe-tan in Santa Costume.png

WikiProject Holidays/Christmas task force is the group whose purpose is to help develop the content related to the Christmas season, including Advent, New Year's, and related holidays. As many of us know, in several parts of the world, including the United States, the Christmas season is not only the time of one of the greatest holidays of the Christian liturgical year, but it is also the "make or break" time for many retailers, whose profitability for the year often depends on their success in this time of the giving of sometimes significantly expensive gifts. In other parts of the world, the winter solstice period and sometimes specifically Christmas itself means something that might surprise many Christians, like the Christmas in Japan, where Christmas is one of the times hotels receive the greatest number of, often unmarried, couples staying there for the night. The solstice season is also significant to several other religions. Many of these days are also legal holidays in several places. In Belarus, for instance, both the Western and Eastern Christmas commemorations are legal holidays. We would certainly welcome the members of this project to donate some of their time and talents in the upcoming months to improving this significant content.



Help requests
Please let us know if there are any particular areas, either individual articles or topics, which you believe would benefit from outside help from a variety of other editors. We will try to include such requests in future issues.

Ichthus is the newsletter of Christianity on Wikipedia • It is published by WikiProject Christianity
For submissions contact the Newsroom • To unsubscribe add yourself to the list here
EdwardsBot (talk)

WikiProject Christianity October 2012 newsletter[edit]

Ichthus dark yellow.png

ICHTHUS

November 2012

Membership report
The parent Christianity WikiProject currently has 349 active members. We would like to welcome our newest members, User:Hayayika and User:Pikachu Bros.. Thank you all for your interest in this effort. If any members, new or not, wish any assistance, they should feel free to leave a message at the Christianity noticeboard or with me or other individual editors to request it.


From the Editor
Ichthus is one of the ways that the WikiProject Christianity’s Outreach department helps update our members. This newsletter is one of the ways we do try to help people keep up with the project. We would always welcome any input for things to be included in it or additional editors to keep it going. Please let us know if there are changes you would like to see in the format, or if there are any particular things you would like to see included. And if you have anything you would personally like to add, by all means let us know. The talk page of the current issue is probably the best place to post such comments.

With that, I wish you all happy reading!

P.S. Please click here to add the new Christianity noticeboard to your watchlist to follow the latest discussions relevant to WikiProject Christianity and subprojects.

By John Carter


Church of the month

Saint Augustin Church Paris.jpg

Saint-Augustin, Paris by User:Saffron Blaze

Recently promoted to Featured Image. Great work!


Contest of the month
For the upcoming month, the contest will continue with the Christmas theme, including Advent and other related topics. Please feel free to see and take part in discussion at the Christianity noticeboard.


Calendar
This coming month (mid-November through mid-December) includes the Advent season. Other major feasts are those of Margaret of Scotland, Matthew the Evangelist, Hilda of Whitby, Elizabeth of Hungary, Edmund the Martyr, the Presentation of Mary, Saint Cecilia, Clement of Rome, Catherine of Alexandria, Andrew the Apostle, Francis Xavier, Saint Barbara, John Damascene, Nicholas of Myra, Saint Ambrose of Milan, Feast of the Immaculate Conception, Our Lady of Guadalupe, Lucy of Syracuse, and others.


Featured content and GA report
Since the last report, Crucifixion and Last Judgement diptych by, among others, User:Truthkeeper88, User:Ceoil, and User:Kafka Liz and Mitt Romney by User:Wasted Time R were promoted to FA. List of 2000s Christian Songs number ones by User:Toa Nidhiki05 was promoted to Featured List. The two images in the Church of the Month and Christian art sections of this newsletter were promoted to Featured Picture status, as were these two images of Michelangelo's Pieta Michelangelo's Pieta 5450 cropncleaned edit.jpg and of Giovanni Bellini's Saint Francis in the Desert Giovanni Bellini - Saint Francis in the Desert - Google Art Project.jpg. Derek Webb by User: Pepsi2786 and others, and Scipione Piattoli by User:Piotrus were promoted to GA level. DYKs featured this past month include Archdiocese of Râmnic, by User:Biruitorul, Diocese of Caransebeş by User:Biruitorul, Wythburn Church by User:Peter I. Vardy, St. Gumbertus, Ansbach by User:Gerda Arendt, User:Dr. Blofeld, and User:Nvvchar collectively, St. Johannis, Ansbach by User:Gerda Arendt, User:Dr. Blofeld, and User:Nvvchar collectively, Nikollë Bojaxhiu by User:ZjarriRrethues, All Saints Church, Lydd by User:Dr. Blofeld, User:Rosiestep, User:Gilderien, and User:Ipigott collectively, St Mary's Church, Acton Burnell by User:Peter I. Vardy, St Eata's Church, Atcham by User:Peter I. Vardy, Nativity of St. John the Baptist Church, Piatra Neamț by User:Biruitorul, Anna Schäffer by User:Shii, List of Archbishops of Vancouver by User: Bloom6132, James Francis Carney by User:Bloom6132, St Luke's Church, Chelsea by User:PKM and User:Johnbod, Gregory Orologas by User:Alexikoua, Ambrosios Pleianthidis by User:Alexikoua, and St Giles' Church, Barrow, by User:Peter I. Vardy. Our profoundest thanks and congratulations to all those involved!

Christian art

Bruxels April 2012-11a.jpg
Three scenes of the legend of the Miraculous Sacrament, in which communion wafers were reported to bleed after being stabbed, in the St. Michael and St. Gudula Cathedral, Brussels by Jean-Baptiste Capronnier.
This image was promoted this past month to FM by the work of User:Alvesgaspar. Thank you, Alvesgaspar!

Spotlight

Gold Christian Cross no Red.svg

The core topics work group is the group whose specific purpose is to help identify and develop those articles which are of greatest importance to an overall understanding of the broad subject of Christianity, based on what is included in the core topics list. These articles include some of specific churches and individuals, history, philosophical and theological matters, and more. We have had some recent discussion regarding which articles should be included in this list, and it probably makes sense to revisit the selections, and try to figure out how best to work to make them high quality articles. Discussion is beginning at WT:X regarding these matters, and all input is welcome.



Help requests
Please let us know if there are any particular areas, either individual articles or topics, which you believe would benefit from outside help from a variety of other editors. We will try to include such requests in future issues.

Ichthus is the newsletter of Christianity on Wikipedia • It is published by WikiProject Christianity
For submissions contact the Newsroom • To unsubscribe add yourself to the list here
EdwardsBot (talk)

WikiProject Christianity Newsletter - December 2012[edit]

Ichthus dark yellow.png

ICHTHUS

December 2012

Membership report
The parent Christianity WikiProject currently has 350 active members. We would like to welcome our newest member, User:Harishrawat11. Thank you all for your interest in this effort. We would be able to achieve nothing here without the input of all of you. If any members, new or not, wish any assistance, they should feel free to leave a message at the Christianity noticeboard or with me or other individual editors to request it.


From the Editor
Ichthus is one of the ways that the WikiProject Christianity’s Outreach department helps update our members. This newsletter is one of the ways we do try to help people keep up with the project. We would always welcome any input for things to be included in it or additional editors to keep it going. Please let us know if there are changes you would like to see in the format, or if there are any particular things you would like to see included. And if you have anything you would personally like to add, by all means let us know. The talk page of the current issue is probably the best place to post such comments.

With that, I wish you all happy reading!

P.S. Please click here to add the new Christianity noticeboard to your watchlist to follow the latest discussions relevant to WikiProject Christianity and subprojects.

By John Carter


Church of the month

Pisa Baptistry.jpg

This image of The Baptistry of Saint John in Pisa by User:NotFromUtrecht

was recently promoted to Featured Image. Thank you and congratulations for the great image!


Contest of the month
As I imagine many of our editors will be editing at a greatly reduced level for the next few weeks, what with the Christmas and New Year's holidays coming, there is no specific content-related contest this month. The contest, if anything, is to make the most of the season, in whatever way, if any, you deem appropriate.


Calendar
This coming month (mid-December through mid-January) includes the Advent season, and one of the two greatest holidays of the Christian year, Christmas. Other major feasts in the next month include those of the Feast of the Epiphany, Baptism of the Lord, Saint Stephen, Thomas the Apostle, Holy Innocents, John the Evangelist, Gregory of Nazianzus, Basil the Great, Saint Genevieve, Elizabeth Ann Seton, and Saint Sava.


Featured content and GA report
Since the last report, Anne Hutchinson nominated by User:Sarnold17 was promoted to FA. Grade I listed churches in Lancashire by User:Peter I. Vardy was promoted to Featured List. The image in the Church of the Month and Christian art sections of this newsletter were promoted to Featured Picture status. Come to the Well by User:Toa Nidhiki05 and others, and Dwight Christmas by User:Gen. Quon and others were promoted to GA level. DYKs featured this past month include King's Chapel, Gibraltar, by User:Prioryman, Cathedral of the Immaculate Conception (Albany, New York) by User:Daniel Case, Tingsted Church by User:Ipigott and User:Rosiestep, St. Mary's Church (Albany, New York) by User:Daniel Case, Stubbekøbing Church by User:Ipigott and User:Rosiestep, Notre Dame Cathedral (Phnom Penh) by User:Bloom6132, and St. James' Church, Cardington by User:Peter I. Vardy. Our profoundest thanks and congratulations to all those involved!

Christian art

Parish church Urtijei internal view.jpg
The nave of the Parish Church of Urtijëi. This image was created by User:Moroderen. Thank you, Moroderen!

Spotlight

Firstchristmascard.jpg

In the spirit of Christmas, the spotlight for the coming month might actually best be on those people closest to you. We know that a lot of our editors here are associated in some way or another with schools, and many if not most of them are going on rather extended breaks for the holidays. This can give some of us a chance to meet up with old friends, spend time with our families and those close to us, and, in a sense, "recharge" for the new year. So, for all of you who are in some way part of that group, we wish you the very best of holidays. We hope you all return to editing after the holidays with your spirits lifted and with your energies at peak level. There are some small matters in development here as well, and it is our hope that some of them will be ready come the next newsletter. But, until then, we wish you all the happiest and holiest (if appropriate) holidays.


Help requests
Please let us know if there are any particular areas, either individual articles or topics, which you believe would benefit from outside help from a variety of other editors. We will try to include such requests in future issues.

Ichthus is the newsletter of Christianity on Wikipedia • It is published by WikiProject Christianity
For submissions contact the Newsroom • To unsubscribe add yourself to the list here
EdwardsBot (talk)

WikiProject Christianity Newsletter - January 2013[edit]

Ichthus dark yellow.png

ICHTHUS

January 2013

Membership report
The parent Christianity WikiProject currently has 354 active members. We would like to welcome our newest members, Alliereborn, Iselilja, Peterkp, and Sosthenes12. Thank you all for your interest in this effort. We would be able to achieve nothing here without the input of all of you. If any members, new or not, wish any assistance, they should feel free to leave a message at the Christianity noticeboard or with me or other individual editors to request it.


From the Editor
Ichthus is one of the ways that the WikiProject Christianity’s Outreach department helps update our members. This newsletter is one of the ways we do try to help people keep up with the project. We would always welcome any input for things to be included in it or additional editors to keep it going. Please let us know if there are changes you would like to see in the format, or if there are any particular things you would like to see included. And if you have anything you would personally like to add, by all means let us know. The talk page of the current issue is probably the best place to post such comments.

With that, I wish you all happy reading!

P.S. Please click here to add the new Christianity noticeboard to your watchlist to follow the latest discussions relevant to WikiProject Christianity and subprojects.

By John Carter


Church of the month

Catedral de Alejandro Nevsky, Tallin, Estonia, 2012-08-11, DD 46.JPG

This image of Alexander Nevsky Cathedral in Tallinn, Estonia by User:Poco a poco

was recently promoted to Featured Image. Thank you and congratulations for the great image!


Contest of the month
No particular contest this month. I am however getting rather close to getting together a more or less complete set of articles relating to different areas of Christianity which can be found in recent reference sources on the broad topic of Christianity, and about various subtopics, which I hope to have finished in the next few weeks. I wonder what the rest of you might think of, maybe, making the contests of future months be basically directed at filling in the gaps of our existing coverage of topics, like those topics given significant coverage in specialized reference works which we don't yet have content on, and giving the thanks, and rewards, whatever they might be, to those who create and develop such content. I am starting a discussion at Wikipedia talk:Christianity noticeboard#Future contests, and would very much welcome any input from interested parties in how to set it up, determine winners including how many winners, etc.

By John Carter




Featured content and GA report
Since the last report, the image in the "Church of the Month" section of this newsletter was promoted to Featured Image status.

Darzu ist erschienen der Sohn Gottes, BWV 40 by Gerda Arendt and others, Teuruarii IV by Lemurbaby, KAVEBEAR and others, and Peace on Earth (Casting Crowns album) by Toa Nidhiki05 and others, were all promoted to GA status.

Also this past month, the DYKs on the main page included St James' Church, Cardington by Peter I. Vardy, Bishop's Palace, Kraków by Poeticbent, Kippinge Church by Ipigott and Rosiestep, Trinitatis Church, also by Ipigott and Rosiestep, Steindamm Church by Olessi, St Laurence's Church, Church Stretton by Peter I. Vardy, Monastery of the Holy Trinity, Meteora, by Peter I. Vardy, Sonrise Church, by Aboutmovies, St. Peter's Episcopal Church (Albany, New York), by Daniel Case, All Saints Church, Claverley, by Peter I. Vardy, and Church of the Holy Virgin Mary of Lourdes, by Poeticbent. Our profoundest thanks and congratulations to all those involved!

Christian art

Pieter Bruegel the Elder - The Tower of Babel (Vienna) - Google Art Project - edited.jpg
The Tower of Babel by Pieter Bruegel the Elder
This image was created by User:Dcoetzee. Thank you, Dcoetzee!

Spotlight

Christ icon.jpg

The Spotlight this month turns to the the Syriac Christianity work group. The scope of this project includes the various traditions of Syriac Christianity, including the Assyrian Church of the East, Ancient Church of the East, Church of the East, Syriac Orthodox Church, Chaldean Catholic Church, Malankara Orthodox Syrian Church, Melkite Greek Catholic Church, Syriac Catholic Church, Syro-Malankara Catholic Church, and Saint Thomas Christians. One of these groups, the Assyrian Church of the East, is considered by scholars to have probably been, for several hundred years, the largest Christian grouping in the planet, with its numerous members in Central Asia and Eastern Asia. Numerous texts, traditions, and practices unique to these groups exist, including the Jesus Sutras and the belief of the Assyrian Church of the East that the bread they use in the preparation of their Eucharist uses the same basic yeast as that used in the bread of the Last Supper itself. Sadly, given the linguistic barriers to much of the content relative to these groups, and the comparative lack of notoriety they have in the Western world, much of this content does receive less attenion, and thus less development, than much other content. There is a large amount of extremely valuable historical material here still waiting to be adequately developed by editors with an interest in the topic, and I personally very much hope that we can draw more attention to these topics, and the content related to them.

By John Carter


Calendar
This coming month (mid-January through mid-February) includes The Presentation of Christ in the Temple or Candlemas and the Conversion of Paul. Other major feasts in the next month include those of Saint Agnes, Saint Francis de Sales, Saints Timothy and Titus, Thomas Aquinas, John Bosco, Saint Agatha, Paul Miki, [{Saint Scholastica]], and Saint Anskar.


Help requests
Please let us know if there are any particular areas, either individual articles or topics, which you believe would benefit from outside help from a variety of other editors. We will try to include such requests in future issues.

Ichthus is the newsletter of Christianity on Wikipedia • It is published by WikiProject Christianity
For submissions contact the Newsroom • To unsubscribe add yourself to the list here
EdwardsBot (talk)

WikiProject Christianity Newsletter April 2013[edit]

Ichthus dark yellow.png

ICHTHUS

April 2013

Membership report
The parent Christianity WikiProject currently has 357 active members. We would like to welcome our newest members, Thomas Cranmer, Mr.Oglesby, and Sneha Priscilla. Thank you all for your interest in this effort. We would be able to achieve nothing here without the input of all of you. If any members, new or not, wish any assistance, they should feel free to leave a message at the Christianity noticeboard or with me or other individual editors to request it.


From the Editor

We apologise for the hiatus in the publication of this newsletter due to unforseen circumstances leading to the wikibreak of John Carter, and so I have taken over as acting editor, and have taken this opportunity to move the publication date to the start of each month as planned, to better reflect on the previous month and look ahead to the next. This issue covers the period of time from mid-January to the end of March.

Since the last issue we have seen the resignation of Pope Benedict XVI and the election of Pope Francis. This has received much coverage both in the world media and on Wikipedia. While there is still much work to do, several quality articles have been written and the editors involved are thanked for their efforts.


This month we look ahead to Easter and the celebration of God's love for mankind through the crucifixion and resurrection of his Son Jesus Christ. With that, I wish you all happy reading!

P.S. Please click here to add the new Christianity noticeboard to your watchlist to follow the latest discussions relevant to WikiProject Christianity and subprojects.

By Gilderien


Church of the month

Iglesia de San Ildefonso, Oporto, Portugal, 2012-05-09, DD 01.JPG

This image of the Church of Saint Ildefonso, Portugal by Poco a poco was recently promoted to Featured Image. Thank you and congratulations for the great image!


Contest of the month
No particular contest this month. I am however getting rather close to getting together a more or less complete set of articles relating to different areas of Christianity which can be found in recent reference sources on the broad topic of Christianity, and about various subtopics, which I hope to have finished in the next few weeks. I wonder what the rest of you might think of, maybe, making the contests of future months be basically directed at filling in the gaps of our existing coverage of topics, like those topics given significant coverage in specialized reference works which we don't yet have content on, and giving the thanks, and rewards, whatever they might be, to those who create and develop such content. I am starting a discussion at Wikipedia talk:Christianity noticeboard#Future contests, and would very much welcome any input from interested parties in how to set it up, determine winners including how many winners, etc.

By John Carter




Featured content and GA report
Since the last report;

Grade I listed churches in Cumbria was promoted to Featured List status, thanks to Peter I. Vardy, and the image above of the Church of Saint Ildefonso was promoted to featured picture status.

Martin Luther King, Jr., by Khazar2, was promoted to GA status, as well Third Epistle of John by Cerebellum.

Also these past months, the DYKs on the main page included St Mary's Church, Cleobury Mortimer by Peter I. Vardy; Marion Irvine by Giants2008; Margaret McKenna by Guerillero; Archdiocesan Cathedral of the Holy Trinity by Epeefleche; St Edith's Church, Eaton-under-Heywood by Peter I. Vardy; Vester Egesborg Church by Ipigott, Rosiestep, Nvvchar, and Dr. Blofeld; Undløse Church by Ipigott, Rosiestep, Nvvchar, and Dr. Blofeld; St Martin's Church, Næstved by Ipigott, Rosiestep, Nvvchar, and Dr. Blofeld; St. Peter, Syburg by Gerda Arendt and Dr. Blofeld; Østre Porsgrunn Church by Strachkvas; Church of Our Saviour (Mechanicsburg, Ohio) by Nyttend; Dami Mission by Freikorp; Mechanicsburg Baptist Church by Nyttend; Acheiropoietos Monastery, by Proudbolsahye; T. Lawrason Riggs, by Gareth E Kegg; McColley's Chapel, by Mangoe; Oświęcim Chapel, by BurgererSF; Second Baptist Church (Mechanicsburg, Ohio), by Nyttend; Church of the Holy Ghost, Tallinn, by Yakikaki; Old Stone Congregational Church, by Orladyl Heath Chapel, by Peter I. Vardy; St. Joseph's Church, Beijing, by Bloom6132; Church of St Bartholomew, Yeovilton, by Rodw; and St. Michael's Catholic Church (Mechanicsburg, Ohio) also by Nyttend. Our profoundest thanks and congratulations to all those involved!

Christian art

Bach.jpg

Complete recording

Jesus nahm zu sich die Zwölfe, BWV 22, a cantata by the German composer J.S. Bach, was promoted to GA this month and was written by Gerda Arendt. Many thanks for her continuing work in the area of early 18th Century Church music.

Spotlight

Christ icon.jpg

The Spotlight this month turns to the the Jesus work group. The scope of this project includes the life and teachings of the central figure of Christianity, Jesus Christ and aims to write about them in a non-denominational encylopædic style. Top-priority articles include Jesus, Christ, Resurrection of Jesus, and Holy Grail, whereas High-priority articles include Aramaic Language, a former FA, as well as Sermon on the Mount, Lamb of God, and Passion (Christianity). The workgroup has also published two books, covering Christ's final days and the Parables of Jesus. The workgroup has two GAs, Nativity scene, and Jesus in Islam, but unfortunately the flagship article, Jesus was delisted in 2009. It is also responsible for three WP:1.0 articles, and the WikiWork of the project is 4.56, which indicates the "average" article is between Start and C class.


By Gilderien


Calendar
This coming month (end-March through end-April) includes Easter Sunday in Western Christianity and both Lazarus Saturday and Palm Sunday for the Eastern Orthodox Church. Other major feasts in the next month include those of Saint George, Saint Mark the Evangelist, Saint Stanislaus, James, son of Zebedee, and Benedict the Moor.


Help requests
Please let us know if there are any particular areas, either individual articles or topics, which you believe would benefit from outside help from a variety of other editors. We will try to include such requests in future issues.

Ichthus is the newsletter of Christianity on Wikipedia • It is published by WikiProject Christianity
For submissions contact the Newsroom • To unsubscribe add yourself to the list here
EdwardsBot (talk) 12:32, 29 March 2013 (UTC)

WikiProject Christianity Newsletter (May 2013)[edit]

Ichthus dark yellow.png

ICHTHUS

May 2013

Membership report
The parent Christianity WikiProject currently has 363 active members. We would like to welcome our newest members, Pleonic, MJWilliams1998, Iloilo Wanderer, Jkadavoor, Sir Ian and McBenjamin. Thank you all for your interest in this effort. We would be able to achieve nothing here without the input of all of you. If any members, new or not, wish any assistance, they should feel free to leave a message at the Christianity noticeboard or with me or other individual editors to request it.


From the Editor

StJohnsAshfield StainedGlass GoodShepherd-frame crop.jpg

This month we hear the news that the Bible is to be made into a film after outstanding success of a biblical miniseries on the History Channel, and we have seen the release of Iraqi Pastor Ali Hamzah from his confinement in Iraq.

After last month's spotlight on the Jesus work group, the flagship article, Jesus, was nominated for Good Article status after much work from FutureTrillionaire and History2007, and provisionally passed by the reviewer, although they have requested a second opinion. Our many thanks for the hard work that has gone into restoring this article to a quality piece of work.

This month the second largest denomination of Christianity, the Eastern Orthodox Church, celebrates Easter and the death and resurrection of the Son of God Jesus Christ.

P.S. Please click here to add the new Christianity noticeboard to your watchlist to follow the latest discussions relevant to WikiProject Christianity and subprojects.

By Gilderien


Church of the month

Wells Cathedral from the north crop.JPG

Wells Cathedral was this month promoted to GA status. Rodw has appealed for any help project members can give to improve this article for a FA nomination.


Contest of the month
No particular contest this month. I am however getting rather close to getting together a more or less complete set of articles relating to different areas of Christianity which can be found in recent reference sources on the broad topic of Christianity, and about various subtopics, which I hope to have finished in the next few weeks. I wonder what the rest of you might think of, maybe, making the contests of future months be basically directed at filling in the gaps of our existing coverage of topics, like those topics given significant coverage in specialized reference works which we don't yet have content on, and giving the thanks, and rewards, whatever they might be, to those who create and develop such content. By John Carter


Featured content and GA report
Since the last report;

Featured report; Madonna in the Church, by Ceoil, Truthkeeper88, and Johnbod was promoted to Featured Article status. Crucifixion and Last Judgement was promoted to featured picture status, after nomination by Crisco 1492.

Wells Cathedral, by Rodw, Robert of Ghent, by User:Ealdgyth, Christianity in Medieval Scotland, by Sabrebd, and Matthew, Mark, Luke and John, also by Sabrebd were promoted to GA status.

Also these past months, the DYKs on the main page included Lectionary 311, by Leszek Jańczuk; Herr Christ, der einig Gotts Sohn, by Gerda Arendt; Whalsay Parish Church, by Ipigott, Rosiestep, Nvvchar, Dr. Blofeld; Interpretatio Christiana, by Altenmann; First Congregational Church, Salt Lake City, by Orlady; Church of King Charles the Martyr, Royal Tunbridge Wells, by The C of E; First Church in Albany (Reformed), by Daniel Case; Pope Anastasius II, by AbstractIllusions; Iglesia de Nuestra Señora de la Palma, by Dr. Blofeld, Ipigott, Rosiestep; Colan Church, by Rosiestep, Nvvchar, Ipigott; Notre Dame Cathedral, Papeete, Bloom6132, Church of St. Wenceslaus (New Prague, Minnesota), by Elkman; St. Joseph Catholic Church (San Antonio, Texas), by Gilliam; Doubting Thomas, by Johnbod; Robert of Ghent, by Ealdgyth; and Holy Trinity Church, Holdgate, by Peter I. Vardy. Our profoundest thanks and congratulations to all those involved!

Christian art

Jan van Eyck - Diptych - WGA07587.jpg
This depiction of the Crucifixion and Last Judgement was painted by Dutch artist Jan van Eyck and promoted to Featured Picture this month.

Spotlight

Christ icon.jpg

SPOTLIGHT

This month, we turn our attention to the Encyclopedic articles sub-group, which aims to provide "a collection point for lists of articles contained in other reference sources relating to Christianity, which could serve as a basis for developing our own content". Created by John Carter, it is primarily a list of links, red or otherwise, for subjects which have an article in the reference works listed therein. This serves as a very useful list if any project members are "stuck for what to do" and there remains lots of potential for articles developed from this list.

By Gilderien


Calendar
This coming month (end-April through end-May) includes Easter Sunday for the Eastern Orthodox Church. Other major feasts in the next month include those of Matthias the Apostle, The Venerable Bede, and Empress Helena.


Help requests
Please let us know if there are any particular areas, either individual articles or topics, which you believe would benefit from outside help from a variety of other editors. We will try to include such requests in future issues.

Ichthus is the newsletter of Christianity on Wikipedia • It is published by WikiProject Christianity
For submissions contact the Newsroom • To unsubscribe remove yourself from the list here
EdwardsBot (talk)17:18, 28 April 2013 (UTC)

Love history & culture? Get involved in WikiProject World Digital Library![edit]

World Digital Library Wikipedia Partnership - We need you!
WorldDigitalLibraryLogo2.png
Hi Taiwan boi! I'm the Wikipedian In Residence at the World Digital Library, a project of the Library of Congress and UNESCO. I'm recruiting Wikipedians who are passionate about history & culture to participate in improving Wikipedia using the WDL's vast free online resources. Participants can earn our awesome WDL barnstar and help to disseminate free knowledge from over 100 libraries in 7 different languages. Multilingual editing encouraged!!! But being multilingual is not a necessity to make this project a success. Please sign up to participate here. Thanks for editing Wikipedia and I look forward to working with you! EdwardsBot (talk) 19:09, 24 May 2013 (UTC)

WikiProject Christianity Newsletter (June 2013)[edit]

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ICHTHUS

June 2013

From the Editor

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Since its formation in 2006, WikiProject Christianity has come a long way. A significant number of new articles have appeared on a wide range of topics, and the quality of some key articles has seen dramatic improvement. Yet, by the very nature of the open, crowd-sourced development environment in which we operate, as the number of pages in the project has increased at times our attention has been naturally diluted. We should of course strive for quality everywhere, but we should remember that this newsletter is called Ichthus.

Starting this month we will start a "Focus on" series, where we will try to "bring Jesus back" and focus on him. For five consecutive issues we will focus on one aspect of the study of Jesus. The goal of this series is to inform our members of what the project contains and highlight those articles which have reached quality and stability.

From this month until November we will focus on the historical Jesus, a topic which has been the subject of much discussion on article talk pages, as well as the general media. This is an important topic, and we have a good set of well referenced articles on that now. Then, starting in December we will focus on Christ, and the spiritual and theological elements that the title entails. Following that the review of the life and ministry of Jesus in the New Testament, his miracles, and parables will take place. And each month the "Bookshelf" will mention a book that fits the theme of the month.

We hope you will enjoy this journey as we present a new aspect of Jesus each month. And given that as the number of project pages increases, the ratio of those watching the pages declines, we hope that more of you will watch some of these central pages that help define this project.

Church of the month

Church of All Saints, Winthorpe - geograph.org.uk - 1117642.jpg

The current building of All Saints' Church, Winthorpe in Nottinghamshire, England which was completed in 1888, is at least the third version of the church, which dates back to at least the early 13th century.

Good articles and DYKs
The article Jesus received the good article mark last month, as did Cleeve Abbey. A number of churches were featured on the main page in the DYK section in May, namely St. Lamberti, Hildesheim, Karja church, Braaby Church, St Patrick's Liverpool, Vlah Church, Freerslev Church, Cathedral of Our Lady of the Assumption, Mata-Utu, St. Michael's Cathedral (Sitka, Alaska), St. Lamberti, Hildesheim, Karja church, Braaby Church, St. Pierre Cathedral, Saint-Pierre, Mont Saint Michel Abbey, St Patrick's Church, Liverpool, Vlah Church, St Catherine of Siena Church, Cocking, Catedral Nuestra Señora de La Asunción, Roholte Church, Notre Dame Cathedral, Taiohae, Leicester Abbey, Caracas Cathedral, Caldey Abbey, King's Mead Priory, Cathedral of the Immaculate Conception (Hong Kong) andAll Saints' Church, Winthorpe, as well as the hymn What Wondrous Love Is This.

Focus on...

Christ icon.jpg

THE
HISTORICAL JESUS

Did Jesus exist? Did he walk the streets of Jerusalem? The Historicity of Jesus article answers these questions with a firm affirmative. Historicity does not discuss if Jesus walked on water, but if he walked at all. The issue was the subject of scholarly debate before the end of last century, but the academic debate is almost over now. As the article discusses, virtually all academic opposition to the existence of Jesus has evaporated away now and scholars see it as a concluded issue. The discussion is now just among mostly self-published non-academics.

In 2011 John Dickson tweeted that if anyone finds a professor of history who denies that Jesus lived,he would eat a page of his Bible (Matthew 1 he said). Dickson's Bible is still safe.

The article discusses the ancient sources that relate to Jesus and how they fit together to establish that he existed. The evidence for Jesus is not just based on the Christian gospels, but by inter-relating them with non-Christian sources, and the fact that they all "fit together". Moreover, the existence of Jesus is not supported just by Christian scholars and in recent years the detailed knowledge of Jewish scholars and their discoveries (e.g. Shlomo Pines' discovery of the Syriac Josephus) has proven highly beneficial. We encourage you to read and follow the article, for the existence of Jesus is central to the existence of Christianity.

From the bookshelf

SanDiegoCityCollegeLearingRecourceCity-bookshelf.jpg
Jesus Outside the New Testament: An Introduction to the Ancient Evidence by Robert Van Voorst, 2000 ISBN 0-8028-4368-9

Just a few years after its publication, Van Voorst's book has become the standard comprehensive text for the discussion of ancient sources that relate to Jesus and his historicity. This detailed yet really readable book has received wide ranging endorsements - Blomberg and Harris separately referring to it as the most comprehensive treatment of the subject.

Did you know...

A Handel manuscript
  • ... that Johann Sebastian Bach wrote the initials "S. D. G.", for Soli Deo Gloria, at the beginning and end of all his church compositions to give God credit for the work, and that Handel at times did the same?

Calendar
The coming month includes days dedicated to the honor of Beheading of John the Baptist, Saints Peter and Paul, the Nativity of John the Baptist, and Saint Barnabas.


Help requests
Please let us know if there are any particular areas, either individual articles or topics, which you believe would benefit from outside help from other editors. We will try to include such requests in future issues.

Ichthus is published by WikiProject Christianity.
For submissions contact the Newsroom • To unsubscribe remove yourself from the listhere
IchtusWikiproject.JPG
EdwardsBot (talk)

WikiProject Christianity Newsletter (July 2013)[edit]

Ichthus dark yellow.png

ICHTHUS

July 2013

From the Editor

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Welcome to the July 2013 issue of Ichthus. We focus on the chronology of Jesus, as well as looking back at the project content improved over the last month.

WP:X has gained another Featured Article, Gospel of the Ebionites, by Ignocrates. The Gospel of the Ebionites is the name scholars give to an apocryphal gospel that supposedly belonged to a sect known as the Ebionites. It consists of seven short quotations discovered in a heresiology known as the Panarion, written by Epiphanius of Salamis, and its original title remains unknown. The text is a gospel harmony composed in Greek, and is believed to have been written during the middle of the 2nd century.

St Mihangel's Church, Llanfihangel yn Nhowyn was promoted to Good Article status, as was two other welsh churches, St Enghenedl's Church, Llanynghenedl, and St Peter's Church, Llanbedrgoch.

The main page also featured several DYK hooks for articles in our project, namely Bob Fu, List of places of worship in Tandridge (district), Catholic Press, Garendon Abbey, St. John's Episcopal Church (Jersey City, New Jersey), Pargev Martirosyan, Praskvica Monastery, Heather Preceptory, St. Augustin, Coburg, Longleat Priory, St Mihangel's Church, Llanfihangel yn Nhowyn, St Enghenedl's Church, Llanynghenedl, Christianization of Moravia, Christianization of Bohemia, Repton Abbey, St Peter's Church, Llanbedrgoch, Medingen Abbey, Elmhurst Christian Reformed Church, St. James on-the-Lines, and Leopold Karl von Kollonitsch.

Church of the month

Chrám svatého Michala v Kyjevě.jpg

St. Michael's Golden-Domed Monastery is part of Saint Sophia's Cathedral, Kiev in Ukraine. It is a functioning monastery that dates back to the Middle Ages.

Membership report
The parent Christianity WikiProject currently has 367 active members. We would like to welcome our newest members, Newchildrenofthealmighty, Evenssteven, Kerna96, and FutureTrillionaire. If any members, new or not, wish any assistance, they should feel free to leave a message at the Christianity noticeboard or with me or other individual editors to request it.


Focus on...

Christ icon.jpg

THE
HISTORICAL JESUS

When did Jesus live? When did he die? How do we know? We do, in fact, have excellent information about the time intervals for the life and death of Jesus. As in other people who lived and died in the first century, this gives an approximate date range, but still, give or take 3-4 years and we have pretty good estimates confirmed by a number of really diverse sources, ranging from inscriptions in Delphi to Roman and Jewish sources. The Chronology of Jesus article discusses how a wide variety of Christian, Jewish and Roman sources are used to establish the time-frame for the life and death of Jesus.

And all of his data fits together. For instance, the chronology of Paul had been discussed based on the Book of Acts long ago, then the Delphi Inscription is found in the 20th century in the Temple of Apollo. And guess what.. it confirms it and totally dates his trial in Corinth, which helps reaffirm the date of the crucifixion of Jesus. The same date range is independently estimated from the writings of Josephus on the Baptist's death. And it fits Isaac Newton's astronomical models for the crucifixion date as well as the independent lunar calculations of Humphreys. As that article shows, all these dates just fit together.

From the bookshelf

SanDiegoCityCollegeLearingRecourceCity-bookshelf.jpg
Chronos, kairos, Christos: nativity and chronological studies edited by J. Vardaman, E. M. Yamauchi 1989 ISBN 0-931464-50-1

This two volume book (with a very apt title) is gem-filled with scholarly research. Paul Maier's article in the first volume is a classic study on the chronology of Jesus and provides a useful summary of a number of issues.

Did you know...

Calendar
This month (July) contains the feast days of Mary Magdalene, and James, son of Zebedee.



Help requests
Please let us know if there are any particular areas, either individual articles or topics, which you believe would benefit from outside help from a variety of other editors. We will try to include such requests in future issues.

Ichthus is published by WikiProject Christianity.
For submissions contact the Newsroom • To unsubscribe remove yourself from the list here
IchtusWikiproject.JPG
EdwardsBot (talk)20:43, 30 June 2013 (UTC)

This issue was distributed on behalf of Gilderien, current editor of the Ichthus, at 20:43, 30 June 2013 (UTC). Comments and other feedback are always welcome at his talk page.

August 2013 WikiProject Christianity Newsletter[edit]

Ichthus dark yellow.png

ICHTHUS

August 2013

From the Editor

ბუმბული.png

Welcome to the August 2013 issue of the WikiProject Christianity newsletter. We focus on the historical Jesus and reflect on the last month.

The project has another featured picture, The ruins of Holyrood Chapel, a digitisation of an oil-on-canvas painting. Our top-importance article, Jesus, has been nominated for Featured Article status, the discussion can be seen here; Knights of Colombus has also been nominated as a FAC.

Ecgbert (bishop) and Church architecture in Scotland have both this month achieved Good Article status.

Our project had several of its articles featured in the main page DYK section, including Hinckley Priory, Little Chapel, St Peter's Church, Ropsley, Chip Ingram, St John the Evangelist's Church, Corby Glen, Great George Street Congregational Church, St Mary's Church, Walton-on-the-Hill and Bunge church.

Our thanks go to all of those who have worked to achieve these article milestones.

Church of the month

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This image, of Maillezais Cathedral and created by Selbymay was this month promoted to featured picture status.

Membership report
We would like to welcome our newest members, Thechristophermorris, Psmidi and Jchthys. Thank you all for your interest in this effort. If any members, new or not, wish any assistance, they should feel free to leave a message at the Christianity noticeboard or with me or other individual editors to request it.

Focus on...

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THE
HISTORICAL JESUS

What was Jesus like? What did he preach? Did he claim to be the Messiah? Did he predict an apocalypse? What can we know about him outside a religious context? The Historical Jesus article discusses what can be known about Jesus with various degrees of probability. While scholars agree on the over all flow and outline of Jesus' life (his baptism by John, debated Jewish authorities, healings, and his crucifixion by Pilate) they have built various and diverging portraits of the rest of his life. These range from minimalist portraits that accept very little of the gospel accounts to maximalists who accept most of the accounts as historical.

The portraits of Jesus have at times been unwitting reflections of the researchers themselves, and Crossan once quipped that some authors "do autobiography and call it biography". However, the study of historical Jesus has made one thing clear: there is so much to learn about Jesus that the more one looks, the more there is to discover.

From the bookshelf

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Jesus of Nazareth: An Independent Historian's Account of His Life and Teaching by Maurice Casey 2010 ISBN 0-567-64517-7

In this book Maurice Casey not only draws on his special expertise in the Aramaic traditions and the Q source, but provides a comprehensive review of the various approaches to the historical Jesus.

Did you know...

Calendar
This month we celebrate the feasts of St Lawrence, St Bernard, and St Augustine.



Help requests
Please let us know if there are any particular areas, either individual articles or topics, which you believe would benefit from outside help from other editors. We will try to include such requests in future issues.

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EdwardsBot (talk)22:09, 31 July 2013 (UTC)
--Gilderien Chat|What I've done 22:09, 31 July 2013 (UTC)