Wikipedia:Help desk/Archives/2007 August 5

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August 5[edit]



How do I insert an infobox on a page, such as the ones generally used for celebrities to paste a picture and other personal data?

Sroundtable 00:31, 5 August 2007 (UTC)Kevin McCabe

Have a look through Category:Infobox templates and find an appropriate infobox for the article you want to put one in. Instructions should be included in its documentation on the template page, but if for some reason they're not and you need more help, feel free to ask me on my talk page. - Zeibura (Talk) 00:34, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

How to create line breaks in {{quotation|


Or a better way to display excerpts from an interview..i.e.

Firmage: I still don’t know what it was. It could have been a relatively mundane rare experience in consciousness, it could have been a bad potato… it could have been a nightmare. Its not like I leaped out of bed and said “Well, I’ve had a vision. I’m gonna go, you know, start a science research institute or something like that. All it served to do I’d say is punctuate, a rising appreciation of some of the larger issues that we all confront together as a human family.

Interviewer: It did more than punctuate, it changed your life quite radically didn’t it.

so it breaks like this:

Firmage: I still don’t know what it was. It could have been a relatively mundane rare experience in consciousness, it could have been a bad potato… it could have been a nightmare.

Its not like I leaped out of bed and said “Well, I’ve had a vision. I’m gonna go, you know, start a science research institute or something like that.

All it served to do I’d say is punctuate, a rising appreciation of some of the larger issues that we all confront together as a human family.

Interviewer: It did more than punctuate, it changed your life quite radically didn’t it. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by (talk)

You can make a line break with <br>. PrimeHunter 01:01, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

Can't set-up an account[edit]


Sorry to be so dense, but I can't manage this.

My user name seems fine, likewise my email address, but I keep getting shot back to the wibbly-wobbly "copy this and start again" part, and it doesn't matter what pass-word I use either.

I've probably got the wrong sort of PhD.

I only wanted to add some local knowledge to an entry on a bishop's palace without broadcasting my home address, but I've been faffing around for a couple of hours.

Help Please! 01:40, 5 August 2007 (UTC)Cherry87.113.12.45 01:40, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

Well it's not your home address that gets broadcast, it's your IP address (that number you just signed your post with). Try Wikipedia:Request an account if you're having difficulties creating one. - Zeibura (Talk) 01:44, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

A couple of questions[edit]


Hi help desk. I have two questions... 1 - I know citing is needed, and I have seen people cite very specific things such as eye color. Is citing small facts like that necessary? I don't see them to be, but I would like to make sure. Thanks. 2 - Someone I've run into seems to think that if something isn't cited, it shouldn't be added. I've re-added some information before that was good but uncited, and the person took it out, despite that I put a citation needed tag. Shouldn't it be alright for it to be left if there is a tag? I would think it would be because someone might later find the information at a cite or might look for it, especially if it's something useful to the article.

Thanks. Jade Owl 21:08, 4 August 2007 (UTC)

Hi. Thanks for posting. What needs to be cited can be found here. Typically speaking, only direct quotes and material that is challenged or likely to be challenged needs to be cited. However, WP:OR states that "Wikipedia is not the place for original research." It further states, "the only way to demonstrate that you are not presenting original research is to cite reliable sources that provide information directly related to the topic of the article, and to adhere to what those sources say." So, you should source anything that isn't common knowledge or necessarily readily available to the public. For example, if you want to include information that yields 20,000 hits on google, you probably don't need to source it. Otherwise, it would be wise. Additionally, articles on living persons have a more strict requirement for sourcing. If the case of tagged information that was removed was for that of a living person, then it was appropriate for that editor to remove it. Lara♥Love 04:57, 5 August 2007 (UTC)
(edit conflict)Your editor name is JadeOwl with no space. You must use a signature which links to the correct name. If you really want the space then make a request at Wikipedia:Changing username. Your time 21:08 indicates you added the signature manually (probably using your own time zone). Please sign your messages with ~~~~ which will create a correct link with UTC time. Wikipedia:Biographies of living people has strict rules. See also Wikipedia:Verifiability#Burden of evidence. If somebody challenges a claim (even just an eye color) with a {{fact}} tag, then only remove the tag if you add a citation. You should only add information if you have it from a reliable source, and you shouldn't add {{fact}} tags to your own edits. If you don't know a source yourself then don't make the edit in the first place. It's allowed to remove unsourced information, also when it's considered obvious or common knowledge by some editors, but in uncontroversial cases it may be preferred to add {{fact}} instead of removing it. Making inline citations for every detail you add is not needed. As long as it has not been challenged and is not controversial, it's usually enough if the information can be found somewhere in the references section. PrimeHunter 05:00, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

Regarding Sockpuppets[edit]


Now, I realize "sockpuppets" is a negative term and may not even be the term I'm looking for. Basically, this is more of a policy query: can one user actively use more than one account at a time? I ask because User:1300khz, User:1400khz, and User:1490khz are likely all the same user (I can't verify this as I don't have the means). The reason I ask is that this/these user(s) have a tendency to not follow WP:MOS and the guidelines set forth at WP:WPRS to the letter, so I routinely go through and fix up stuff. Thanks for your help. JPG-GR 04:47, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

Add User:Pkc5001 to the list of possibilities. JPG-GR 04:49, 5 August 2007 (UTC)
It's my understanding that the use of multiple accounts is fine as long as they are not used to sway consensus, dodge WP:3RR, or the like. Perhaps another editor is more familiar with this. However, if the only issue seems to be failure to follow the MOS and other guides, try letting them know per talk pages. If that's already been tried and failed, you might want to consider WP:RfC. Regards, Lara♥Love 04:51, 5 August 2007 (UTC)
Sockpuppets is the right term. They are discouraged in most cases and forbidden in some cases. See Wikipedia:Sockpuppets. PrimeHunter 05:04, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

Page not fully loading[edit]


Hi, i notice that the New Zealand Warriors page isn't fully loading, as such. The footer of the page is visible, but the information edited into the wiki cuts off suddenly. I know the page is 32kb long, but i removed a large chunk of stuff to test out if that fixed anything, but it was still cut off at the same point. The information not showing up is still able to be edited. --IanRitchie 06:07, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

You were missing the </ref> part of the second note, which causes anything following that section to not show up. I fixed it.CindyBotalk 07:32, 5 August 2007 (UTC)
Funny, i hadn't touched that since i put it in - neither had previous edits, i think. Thank you! --IanRitchie 07:56, 5 August 2007 (UTC)[edit]

Can someone (an admin) please have a look at the current edit conflict going on? I'm sure this goes over the 3-revert rule.

If you need to report someone for 3RR violations, you should see Wikipedia:Administrators'_noticeboard/3RR. --Hdt83 Chat 07:40, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

No not really, it's just that I would like an outside person to review it, as I don't think a consenus is going to be reached by those two.

In that case, follow the steps for the dispute resolution policy. -- Kesh 13:43, 5 August 2007 (UTC)
Consensus has already been reached, thanks anyway --Fir0002 22:19, 5 August 2007 (UTC)
I would not say that consensus was reached. I still believe that my image All sky Rays.jpg is the best for the subject representation and is only one of a kind on Wikipedia, which shows all sky rays.I was just tiered from the edit war with fir0002 and I did not know where to look for the help. Besides I was not sure why fir00002 decided to address the viewers to my talk page to learn the reasons why he deleted the images. I believe the best place to display reasons for doing edits in an article is discussion pages in the articles and not an user talk page. Now I'd like an outside person to review it. Thanks.--Mbz1 05:01, 6 August 2007 (UTC)Mbz1

Ray Thomas[edit]


Greetings, For the Dutch Wiki I have translated the article about Ray Thomas. In that article you mention that the article has no source. Well; the external link contains the source of this article. Please remove the resource-items out of that article. I have no English Wiki-identity, so I leave it up to you. In the Dutch Wiki I am known as Ceescamel. Thanking you in advance. Cees from Amsterdam

The Wikipedia article contains many facts that are not covered in the external link and even so articles should really have inline citations. I have switched the template to say 'more sources required'. --Cherry blossom tree 10:06, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

Renaming articles[edit]


Hi, I want to rename an article, Scales (Furness), to Scales, Cumbria to keep the naming consistent with other villages in Cumbria. Where do I propose such a renaming? I can't find anything on the deletion help pages.Kijog 12:07, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

To do this, simply go to the page and click the "Move" tab up the top (next to history). Type in the new name and reason for moving. The history and talk page (assuming the correct box is ticked) will move along with it. For more information, see WP:MOVE. AndrewJDTALK -- 12:23, 5 August 2007 (UTC)
Doh, thanks for that! So obvious now... Kijog 14:43, 5 August 2007 (UTC)



The Wikipedia website keeps sending me to the Main Page. I type in, and I get sent to Main Page. Great. But there's no search box there. Wouldn't it be kind of helpful to have a search box there, since that's a big reason why people use Wikipedia?

This might be a problem with your browser, but there is a search box on It's under the circle of language selection. And if you click on the English Wikipedia button there is a search bar on every page, on the left hand side. AndrewJDTALK -- 12:27, 5 August 2007 (UTC)



How do I view other peoples contributions? Please leave the answer on my talk page - Pheonix 12:24, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

Replied on talk page AndrewJDTALK -- 12:37, 5 August 2007 (UTC)
It's fairly simple. Go to a user's page, such as User:Jimbo. On the left hand side where all the navigation button's are there is a section called 'toolbox'. There should be a 'User contributions' link and clicking that brings up a list like this. Any more questions or if it doesn't work, just ask. AndrewJDTALK -- 12:36, 5 August 2007 (UTC)
You can use Special:Contributions also.--OsamaK 12:39, 5 August 2007 (UTC)
Please note: I have moved the above 2 responses from the talk page for others to see. :-) Stwalkerster talk 13:02, 5 August 2007 (UTC)
To see other people's contributions to a specific page, check the page history. Also see: Help:Contents/Tracking changes for many related techniques. --Teratornis 16:32, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

Linking a search[edit]


I remember seeing somewhere that there's Wiki markup for linking to a Google search. Does anyone know what that code is offhand? -- Kesh 13:40, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

See Help:Interwiki linking. For example: Google:Interwiki linking. Note that if your Google Search terms contain any spaces (as they normally will if you have more than one search term) you must separate them with a non-breaking space code:
  • &nbsp;
Otherwise, the MediaWiki software will translate an ordinary space into an underscore when generating the search URL from the interwiki link (that's because in real interwiki links the underscore is necessary, but the Google "interwiki" link is kind of a hack, because Google Search is not a wiki). --Teratornis 13:51, 5 August 2007 (UTC)
Ah, that was it! Thanks. -- Kesh 13:57, 5 August 2007 (UTC)
Incidentally, you could find the answer to this question by a Google search on the Help desk archives for "Google", but the first half-dozen or so search results are irrelevant. However, since you had seen this technique before, you would probably recognize it toward the bottom of the first search results page. Help desk questions tend to be repetitive, so saving a link to a Google search on the Help desk makes a powerful tool to answer new Help desk questions, and also to answer many of one's own questions that come up in the course of routine editing on Wikipedia. (I expressed that site-specific search as an external link rather than as an interwiki link because I don't know how to cram the extra search options into the interwiki link form.) Between searching the Help desk archives, and the Editor's index, there aren't many Wikipedia editing questions one cannot answer, or at least determine a procedure for finding an answer. I consider this perhaps the most remarkable feature of Wikipedia, how the MediaWiki software encourages the user community to build up a vast store of how-to knowledge about the project itself, which we can then easily search. Ironically, Wikipedia is not a how-to guide in terms of the main article space, but in the project space, Wikipedians have built up a fanstastically comprehensive how-to knowledgebase. I can't think of any more generally-useful lesson than learning how that came to be, because people who know how to organize a project on the scale of Wikipedia can probably organize just about anything. --Teratornis 14:52, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

How to resolve issues with another editor?[edit]


At the Sebaceous cyst article, an editor has placed an image of a scrotum (presumably his own, given that he is listed as the author of the image) with several cysts. I do not think this image is suitable:

1. It adds very little to the educational value of the page. 2. There are already 2 images, more than enough considering the article's length. 3. The image could easily be considered obscene.

Several people have tried to remove the image, but he unfailingly reverts their "vandalism" and usually leaves a snarky edit summary as well. I have left a comment on the talk page, but I am doubtful that any progress will be made. I am also quite new to the Wikipedia. How should I go about dealing with this? --Tzler 13:53, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

Wikipedia is not censored, so that's really not an issue. However, it sounds like this is an editing dispute that could use our dispute resolution process. -- Kesh 14:00, 5 August 2007 (UTC)
I don't understand how unnecessary obscene content is not an issue. If someone painted their scrotum red, took a photograph and uploaded it to the article on the colour Red, you can imagine it wouldn't stay up there for long. I will, however, wait for his reply on the talk page and hopefully convince him to remove the image. --Tzler 14:28, 5 August 2007 (UTC)
If he's "unfailingly reverting", read WP:3RR, then take it up at WP:AN/3RR --L-- 14:38, 5 August 2007 (UTC)
Wikipedia:Profanity says:
"Words and images that would be considered offensive, profane, or obscene by typical Wikipedia readers should be used if and only if their omission would cause the article to be less informative, relevant, or accurate, and no equally suitable alternatives are available. Including information about offensive material is part of Wikipedia's encyclopedic mission; being offensive is not."
Wikipedia:What Wikipedia is not#Wikipedia is not censored says:
"...some articles may include objectionable text, images, or links if they are relevant to the content (such as the articles about the penis and pornography)..."
I have posted to the talk page that I don't think this image is necessary for a non-sexual subject. PrimeHunter 15:09, 5 August 2007 (UTC)



is there anyway that i can set a countdown timer to put on my userpage? for example if I wanted to countdown to august 15th is there anyway I could set one up to automatically countdown till that day? It doesent have to countdown every second (althoug that would be cool :D ) but just the days. so if i was to go on on august 13th it would say something like "2days left". Anyone know if this is possible? Thanks AlienSandbox 16:13, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

The exact opposite is done in Template:User for. It is a bit complicated, but I do not see why it cannot be converted to count down to date in the future. -- Kainaw(what?) 16:15, 5 August 2007 (UTC)
Fortran template? I don't think you mean that one...:-) Stwalkerster talk 16:17, 5 August 2007 (UTC)
Correct, it is Template:User Wikipedian For. -- Kainaw(what?) 16:21, 5 August 2007 (UTC)
{{age in days}} gives the number of days between two dates or from a date until today. It gives a negative result for future days, but you can take the absolute value with {{Abs}} to get the positive number of days from today until a given date. For example, {{Abs|{{Age in days|month1=8 |day1=15 |year1=2007}}}} evaluates to 2539. Or use #expr to change sign (so past dates would get a negative number): {{#expr:-{{Age in days|month1=8 |day1=15 |year1=2007}}}} evaluates to -2539. See also Help:Magic words#Time and Category:Date-computing templates based on current time. PrimeHunter 17:48, 5 August 2007 (UTC)



I have recently put to photos in different articles, Ruff Ryders and The Duck Factory but they are not showing up. What is the problem?

Hi! Please could you tell me what the filenames of the images were? :-) Stwalkerster talk 16:54, 5 August 2007 (UTC)
Yes, the file names are Ruff Ryders Logo.jpg and The Duck Factory Cover.jpg (Phreekie)
Thanks. When inserting images, you use the following code:
which produces
However, you had just inserted
I hope this helps, and I have fixed the Ruff Ryders one for you. You can do the other one if you like :-) Stwalkerster talk 17:27, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

Excess Quotes?[edit]


Hello, I have a question about policy. I've come across a television series (Buffy The Vampire Slayer in which nearly every article has a Quotes section, in addition to linking to that episode's entry on wikiquotes. Would I be remiss in removing the excess quotes and quote sections? In most cases, they add nothing to the page, and the same quotes can be found on wikiquotes. I figured I should ask before I went ahead and did anything, however most of the talk pages for the episodes are sparse/empty. Zytch 16:50, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

Answered off wiki. For future reference, see WP:QUOTE --L-- 18:01, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

Wikipedia Question[edit]


When editing a page, how do you make a link of an extrernal website accesable by clicking something unrealated. EX: Baseball team roster Pitchers a b c d how would you put a link to a player page that would be accessable by clicking on player a's name? Thanks for the help.

Basically, the url in square brackets, a space, then the text you want to link it to. So:
[ file lake shoe]

produces: file lake shoe, linking to Google. Hope this helps, - Zeibura (Talk) 17:15, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

Centering Boxes[edit]


Hi, Thanks for coming to help. If you look at this page, I was wondering whether I could center any of these boxes. Oh, and how do you make text centered as well :P Thank You :) Tiddly Tom 18:49, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

Unfortunately I don't know of any simple way to center userboxes, but to center text use
tags. - Zeibura (Talk) 19:18, 5 August 2007 (UTC)
Thanks for your help, do you know a not simple way of doing it :P Tiddly Tom 20:30, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

1000 artcicles, that every wikipedia should have[edit]


I am a editor of the Hungarien Wikipedia, so I`m not really familiar with this English version. I am in a summer camp, and I am going to hold a instruction on Wikipedia, tell people about this great project. On the Hungarien Wikipedia I saw a list, called: articles, what must be in every Wikipedia. I can not find that in this English version, so can you guys help me, that where is it...
Thank you very much Kisb92 19:23, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

See WP:VITAL. --L-- 19:24, 5 August 2007 (UTC)
Thank you very-very much :-)!!

User Vandalism[edit]

  • All the users edits were made over a month ago, so it's best to assume it's stopped. If (s)he continues to vandalise, file a report at WP:AIV. - Zeibura (Talk) 20:21, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

Removing templates[edit]


I nominated a large number of templates for deletion, but nothing happened. Did I do something wrong?

They are template:MonthR 31 We, template:MonthRf, template:Year A, template:Year A 1 and many more. HandigeHarry 20:26, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

You didn't list them on the discussion page. See Wikipedia:Templates for deletion#How to use this page. PrimeHunter 20:35, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

people by alphabetical index[edit]


i have been trying to access the list of biographies done alphabetically and all i get is stupid sub catagories you have a main index but i dont feel like spending my life going through it picking one name or musical group out of a hat. I cant believe that there is no biographical index in wikipedia> that would be absolutely astounding could you please direct me thank you —The preceding unsigned comment was added by (talkcontribs) 20:35, 5 August 2007.

The huge alphabetical lists of people were deleted. See Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/List of people by name. You can for example use the search function instead. PrimeHunter 20:57, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

How to catagorize[edit]


I recently submitted the biography of our organization International President, Dr. Johannes Maas. He has had a distiguished career building orphanages in India, and served as an advisor for The White House. Our web page is The page is asking me to catagorize the page. Will you please assist me in this process. Thank you. Ms Carol Penrod, Executive Secretary Worldwide Faith Missions

Hi, you might want to look at Wikiproject Biography's 11 easy steps to producing at least a B article because your article needs to be sourced as well as categorized. As for the category, look at similar biographies as Dr. Johannes Maas and see how they are categorized. Then, to add the article to a category, type [[Category:the name of the category you feel is appropriate]] at the bottom of the page. (To preview it, you have to scroll all the way down to the bottom). Another thing you may want to look at is moving the article's title to Johannes Maas. See WP:NAMES where it says "Academic and professional titles (such as "Doctor" or "Professor") should not be used before the name in the initial sentence or in other uses of the person's name. Verifiable facts about how the person attained such titles should be included in the article text instead". Hope this helps.CindyBotalk 21:31, 5 August 2007 (UTC)
Lots more info on editing wikipedia can be found in the welcome message on your talk page now too at User Talk:Carol Penrod.CindyBotalk 22:29, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

wireless secuity[edit]


What is the basic security framework in a wireless LAN?

I'm guessing this is the same class assignment... see below. AndrewJDTALK -- 22:12, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

Wireless Security[edit]


Hi, there. I am doin my class activity here in class about Wireless stuff.. One of the question that i am going to answer is to "Determine the basic security framework that will be use in WLAN?" So what it would be???

Do your own homework. This isn't the place for information questions, this is for queries about Wikipedia. Although I might suggest looking at WLAN. AndrewJDTALK -- 22:12, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

Is there a thing in somthing that says "Make a new page"[edit]


Please help me.—The preceding unsigned comment was added by Piazzajordan2 (talkcontribs).

Before creating an article, please search Wikipedia first to make sure that an article does not already exist on the subject. Please also review a few of our relevant policies and guidelines which all articles should comport with. As Wikipedia is an encyclopedia, articles must not contain original research, must be written from a neutral point of view, should cite to reliable sources which verify their content and must not contain unsourced, negative content about living people.
Articles must also demonstrate the notability of the subject. Please see our subject specific guidelines for people, bands and musicians, companies and organizations and web content and note that if you are closely associated with the subject, our conflict of interest guideline strongly recommends against you creating the article.
If you still think an article is appropriate, see Help:Starting a new page. You might also look at Wikipedia:Your first article and Wikipedia:How to write a great article for guidance, and please consider taking a tour through the Wikipedia:Tutorial so that you know how to properly format the article before creation. PrimeHunter 22:17, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

What did I do wrong in writing about Norway Corporation Repertory Company?[edit]


When I tried to write an article about Norway Corporation Repertory Company, it was flagged for speedy deletion because, according to the tags, I had failed to give a reason for notability of the company. I did not know how to submit it as a stub, and evidently, my efforts to explain why the article should indeed be posted were in vain.

What did I do wrong?

Any answers to that question would be welcome.

Parker Gabriel 22:23, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

Obviously Wikipedia wasn't shure of its value. if it is a small page, they have little need, if its a shor page about a company that isn't well known, how do they know the facts? OV
See Wikipedia:Why was my article deleted?. If you don't understand anything in that document, let us know what isn't clear. See WP:NOTABILITY for Wikipedia's notability guidelines. Unfortunately, I am not an administrator so I cannot see your deleted article, which might let me recommend another wiki where you might develop your article free from Wikipedia's rather demanding requirements. Since you know what you are trying to write about, you might search on WikiIndex for another wiki that caters to your subject area of interest. A search on Wikipedia for repertory company finds quite a number of articles, so you might look at some of them to see what sort of article on this subject survives on Wikipedia. And see Wikipedia:WikiProject Theatre. --Teratornis 02:20, 6 August 2007 (UTC)
Note to other Help desk volunteers: read the discussion on User talk:Parker Gabriel before adding your comments to this question. --Teratornis 02:23, 6 August 2007 (UTC)

A question about other people editing your stuff on Wikipedia[edit]


Wikipedia talks a good talk but when you try to edit pages, they MONITOR them. What's the point of having an encyclopedia that is supposed to be the people's encyclopedia if big brother is watching? How is it different than any other site? —Preceding unsigned comment added by (talkcontribs)

It's not Big Brother, it's users. Like you. Like me. Ordinary people patrol new pages, recent changes etc to spot unhelpful edits. They make the encylcopedia better by kicking out all the vandalism and unhelpful edits that an online encylcopedia needs. Without them there would be a picture of naked women on the Pokemon page, "GEORGE IS GAY" splattered across the BlahBlah Senior College page and quickly people would give up on the concept. If your complaint is that we monitored an edit you made and intervene then it is testimony to the fact that it was a bad edit. If it was a good one, you would have no idea that somebody was watching it. How is it different to any other site? Because Wikipedia gives you the chance to change it. We're just trying to write an encyclopedia here. AndrewJDTALK -- 23:00, 5 August 2007 (UTC)
You may gain some insight into how Wikipedia works by reading this article:
Wikipedia is very different from most other Web sites. For starters, Wikipedia is a wiki, a site that is editable by its users. While there are thousands of wikis, and new ones starting every day, wikis are still a tiny minority among the millions of "traditional" Web sites (in which most or all of the editing is by the site owners). On Wikipedia we have 21,896,982 registered users along with a similarly large number of unregistered users. With all those people constantly hacking away at each other's edits, editing on Wikipedia can be very stressful for new users until they read the friendly manuals and learn enough about the policies and guidelines to make sense of what is going on here. Perhaps the biggest mental adjustment is getting used to way that "saving" your edits to a page is different than saving a document in most types of programs a person will have used before. When someone saves a word processing document or a spreadsheet on their personal computer, generally the file stays the same until the user decides to change it. Not so on Wikipedia. When you save your edits here, they only persist until the next user comes along and edits them further (every edit does persist in the page history, but only the current revision of a page is normally visible). Therefore, editing on Wikipedia becomes kind of a game in which you try to figure out what you can add to an article that will stay put. The kinds of changes that tend to last longer are changes that improve the quality of the article, in the view of all the other users who read it. To get an idea of what you are aiming for, check out Wikipedia's featured articles (the articles rated as the best articles on Wikipedia). --Teratornis 02:08, 6 August 2007 (UTC)



When the speedy-deletion template is put up, it seems to take about a minute for it to get deleted, making it almost impossible to put the {{hangon}} thing on unless you put it on on ur 1st edit. OV

Cos all admins delete it as soon as they see it listed with speedy delete. I'm aware that Thats what speedy-delete means... its just there isn't enough time to put the {{hangon}} thing before it's deleted.OV
Well of course some pages are speedy deleted quicker than others, but if an admin sees what is an obvious candidate for speedy deletion, they aren't going to wait around and see if someone puts a {{hangon}} template on the page. That said, even if the page is deleted, it can easily be undeleted again so you are more than welcome to leave a message with the deleting admin to ask for further explanation. Will (aka Wimt) 22:50, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

Why can't we edit the Michael Vick page?[edit]


Thank you.

If you have a username, you can edit this page. -- GoDawgs 22:49, 5 August 2007 (UTC)
[EDIT CONFLICT] :Because the page is semi protected. This means that unregistered users can't edit it. In this case it is down to vandalism of the page. If you want to propose a change, go to the article's discussion page, next to the edit tab. AndrewJDTALK -- 22:52, 5 August 2007 (UTC)
User accounts must be 5 days old to edit semi-protected pages. PrimeHunter 22:54, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

Adding pages to your userpage?[edit]


How do you do that? I'm really confused. Megan :) 23:08, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

I believe you mean subpages? Just create a link to a page [[User:YOURUSERNAME/NAME OF SUBPAGE]] click it, and edit! i said 23:09, 5 August 2007 (UTC)
See: WP:USER and WP:UP#SUB for the guidelines about user pages and user sub-pages, respectively. I have written some user sub-pages, but nothing to boast about yet. For an example of a really impressive user sub-page, see:
--Teratornis 02:28, 6 August 2007 (UTC)

Oh.. THANK YOU SO MUCH!! Megan :) 05:35, 6 August 2007 (UTC)

american or british spelling preferred[edit]



Are we to use American or British spelling of words:

practice or practise? center or centre?

thanks, Renee --Renee 23:27, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

It depends on the article. If it is an article directed at Americans (ie: American Football), it should use common American spelling. If it is an article directed at British (ie: Football (soccer)), it should use common British spelling. If it is vague about the audience (ie: Hedgehog), use what you like. Just don't get into an edit war over color vs. colour. -- Kainaw(what?) 23:29, 5 August 2007 (UTC)
I asked the same thing a couple weeks back here and got a lot of good responses on the topic.CindyBotalk 23:33, 5 August 2007 (UTC)
Also, in addition to what Kainaw said, if there is no tie to a particulary country or version of English, you must follow the format in the original article. For instance, Orange (colour) must remain as colour, because it was originally written that way. i said 00:09, 6 August 2007 (UTC)

Stray square...[edit]


What's the deal with that little grey square at the bottom of Dale Smith (The Bill) (above the category box)? Can anyone else see it? --Kurt Shaped Box 23:35, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

Removed. There was a stray startbox template near the end. -- Kainaw(what?) 23:44, 5 August 2007 (UTC)
Great. Thanks very much. :) --Kurt Shaped Box 23:49, 5 August 2007 (UTC)



Hi I've reverted a user three times from edits on the page: (I didn't do the first revert)

With an explantion, but they are just re-editing it. What do I do now to stop this person? peterl 23:43, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

See WP:AIV. -- Kainaw(what?) 23:45, 5 August 2007 (UTC)