Wikipedia:In the news/Candidates/September 2008

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Archived discussion for September 2008 from Wikipedia:In the news section on the Main Page/Candidates.

September 30


ITN candidates for September 30

The death toll now stands at 113. But administrators here are fast asleep. --make a difference 06:12, 30 September 2008 (UTC)
Posting after waking up. --Tone 07:35, 30 September 2008 (UTC)

Results of Slovenian parliamentary election, 2008 are final and will be official on Friday with little chance to change. If anyone could dedicate 5 minutes to the article, it will be ok to go up. I can do this in the afternoon at first... --Tone 07:33, 30 September 2008 (UTC)

September 29


ITN candidates for September 29

Typhoon Hagupit
Support Article is updated.SpencerT♦C 22:22, 29 September 2008 (UTC)
Posted. --Tone 08:37, 30 September 2008 (UTC)
  • Hopefully my suggestion is slightly more positive. --Candlewicke (Talk) 21:13, 29 September 2008 (UTC)
  • (As soon as an article is found!) :) --Candlewicke (Talk) 21:15, 29 September 2008 (UTC)
The news item on Delhi can be merged into this. Possible alternative:
Three bombs detonate in Maharashtra and Gujarat, India killing 8 and injuring 80. The attack comes three days after a bomb blast in Delhi killed 3 and injured 30.
--make a difference 22:51, 29 September 2008 (UTC)
Posted. --Tone 08:37, 30 September 2008 (UTC)

September 28


ITN candidates for September 28

Marathon world record looks good. --Tone 10:31, 28 September 2008 (UTC)

Also, Image:MV Faina.jpg is uploaded on en.wikipedia, so you could possibly protect it and use it for the item. Thanks, SpencerT♦C 01:27, 29 September 2008 (UTC)
Not really a standard ITN item so I support it. However, I'd like some more opinions from the others before posting. Also, should we include tanks in the blurb? --Tone 09:45, 29 September 2008 (UTC)
support, but exclude tanks--TheFEARgod (Ч) 18:13, 29 September 2008 (UTC)
Is this going up? SpencerT♦C 13:43, 30 September 2008 (UTC)
Posting. Thanks for the image upload. --Tone 13:58, 30 September 2008 (UTC)
I am having some problems with internet, could someone post the item? Thanks. --Tone 19:19, 30 September 2008 (UTC)
While I support the inclusion of this item, I feel it was a mistake to ignore the weapons angle completely. Yes I know we need to be concise but as Piracy in Somalia demonstrates, these sort of attacks are hardly rare but we rarely have them on ITN. Is this simply because we don't have the articles or is it because this particular attack more noteable then most? From what I can tell, it's the later and the primary reason is because the pirates happened to get lucky and captured a ship with a large number arms which understandbly has caused extra concern Nil Einne (talk) 09:52, 1 October 2008 (UTC)
It's been added now by [1]. I forgot to mention, I don't have a preference for the specific wording, in fact the tanks part is not really that important. It's a bit headline grabbing but it seems likely to me (supported by sources[2]) that there is no chance in hell the pirates are going to be able to steal the tanks so they aren't whats bothering people. The smaller weapons are of great concern Nil Einne (talk) 16:03, 1 October 2008 (UTC)
The article is in good shape. Since there are no official results yet, the headline should maybe focus on the high percentage for right-wing parties? By the way, the results of Slovenian election are expected to be out today, we should post those as well. The article is updated. --Tone 09:45, 29 September 2008 (UTC)
  • Nominate Falcon rocket success. First privately developed space launch vehicle. Notable story and fairly well done article.--Cdogsimmons (talk) 04:58, 29 September 2008 (UTC)
Posted. --Tone 09:45, 29 September 2008 (UTC)

September 27


ITN candidates for September 27

This is a good proposal but I would prefer a better wording... Also, do we have an appropriate article for Turkmenistan item maybe? ITN worthy, IMO. --Tone 15:10, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
Support for Damascus story. Is quite a big event in the recent spate of bombings and the growth of global poltical insecurity. (+ something was supposed to have been added 6 hours ago) Lihaas (talk) 18:05, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
Answer to Tone: Politics of Turkmenistan has an update. Narayanese (talk) 20:15, 27 September 2008 (UTC)

For the 2008 Damascus car bomb, it needs to be improved. I'll see if I can help out here. SpencerT♦C 20:41, 27 September 2008 (UTC)

The article looks ok. Posting. --Tone 13:37, 28 September 2008 (UTC)
  • Support Delhi blast:
A bomb blast in Delhi, India kills two and injures 25. --128.211.201.161 (talk) 23:53, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
How about we feature both at once? SpencerT♦C 03:28, 28 September 2008 (UTC)
There is absolutely no connection between Damascus and Delhi blasts. Besides, this is the second attack in Delhi in the same month. So, that makes it all the more notable. Wonder what is taking so long to put it up? --128.211.201.161 (talk) 05:34, 28 September 2008 (UTC)
The article has been expanded now and features news inputs from various sources. So, ITN worthy. --128.211.201.161 (talk) 06:35, 28 September 2008 (UTC)
The pace at which people respond here is appalling. --128.211.201.161 (talk) 07:38, 28 September 2008 (UTC)
Not enough people on ITN, I can't handle it all. I'll have a look. --Tone 10:30, 28 September 2008 (UTC)
Posting. --Tone 13:37, 28 September 2008 (UTC)
  • Support. A nation which decides to join the family of democratic nations is definitely a noteworthy event. __meco (talk) 06:46, 28 September 2008 (UTC)
It's still short, the update. I'd like a couple of sentences more, then we can put this on. --Tone 10:30, 28 September 2008 (UTC)
Ok, posting. --Tone 13:37, 28 September 2008 (UTC)
Looking at the article, I'm not exactly seeing any updates, except a single sentence in the lead? Am I wrong? SpencerT♦C 17:15, 28 September 2008 (UTC)
Nevermind, found it. It could use some more res, though. SpencerT♦C 17:26, 28 September 2008 (UTC)

Nominate In Australian football, the Hawthorn Football Club defeats the Geelong Football Club in the 2008 AFL Grand Final by 26 points. c4v3m4n 05:23, 28 September 2008 (UTC)

Support as per the ITN sports guidelines, although article currently lacks references --Daviessimo (talk) 09:18, 28 September 2008 (UTC)
Let's wait for the ref. --Tone 13:37, 28 September 2008 (UTC)

September 26


ITN candidates for September 26

  • Nomination
In the continuing 2008 economic crisis, the United States Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation took over Washington Mutual Bank, and arranged the purchase of the bank's operations by J.P. Morgan Chase & Co.. This is the largest bank takeover in U.S. history.
I'll leave it to a reviewer to determine if the linked articles satisfy sufficiently. The official government source is the U.S. FDIC:
JPMorgan Chase Acquires Banking Operations of Washington Mutual FDIC Facilitates Transaction that Protects All Depositors and Comes at No Cost to the Deposit Insurance Fund
-- Yellowdesk (talk) 02:59, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
  • Support - here is my recommendation:

J.P. Morgan Chase & Co. purchases Washington Mutual after the bank is placed into conservatorship by the Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation. It is the largest bank failure in United States history. Cumulus Clouds (talk) 03:04, 26 September 2008 (UTC)

Strong support WaMu's assets are circa $307 billion. Ian3055 (talk) 03:06, 26 September 2008 (UTC)

Support Given that IndyMac was included here, it would follow that WaMu should be mentioned. In opposition to both the suggested wordings, though, I would suggest a link to Subprime mortgage crisis is given. ~ UBeR (talk) 04:52, 26 September 2008 (UTC)

Strong Support To be frank: This is absolutely insane that Wikipedia doesn't have something about this financial crisis on our news section. We are potentially on the verge of a global financial meltdown. In my opinion, it makes the encyclopedia appear to be written by high schoolers by not having something about this up there. I apologize for my frustration, but this adds to the perception that the encyclopedia is amateur, especially when it comes to financial matters. Stock markets in Asia are falling right now because the US Congress can't get a bailout plan written; tonight just had the largest bank failure in u.s. history.[3] We really need to look alive here. People from Michigan to Melbourne to Macau to Mumbai are going to feel the effects of what's happening, maybe for years. --JayHenry (talk) 05:09, 26 September 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for that. Several items have been placed prominently in ITN over the past three months, including the failures of IndyMac Bank, Fannie and Freddie, Lehman Brothers, Merrill Lynch and HBOS. Significant improvements have been made to each of those articles as a result of their postings on the main page. I'm sure this will get posted too, but believe me when I tell you that we're on top of it here. Cumulus Clouds (talk) 06:05, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
Note that we place items on ITN because they may be of interest to readers (which amongst other things means they must be of sufficient quality before we list them on ITN), not because they may be improved as a result of being shown (that's just an added bonus and doesn't come at all into consideration) Nil Einne (talk) 07:19, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
As Cumulus has said, we have already had several items on ITN and are probably going to have another here. Also, bear in mind that wikipedia is an encylopaedia not a news website (we have wikinews for that) and ITN despite the poor choice of name, is not intended to be a a news service. You should definitely not expect all breaking news headlines on ITN, no matter how important the events seem. Nil Einne (talk) 07:19, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
I'm not really sure that I understand the premises of your assertion here. I certainly would expect to see a correlation between the global importance of a breaking news story and its likelihood of being featured in the ITN section, not as a result of policy but as a result of Wikipedia editors placing focus on articles covered by the event. but perhaps that is the same as what you're saying? __meco (talk) 07:38, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
There should be no great correlation beyond that caused by editor interest. Provided the item is of international interest, then the only concern when it comes to ITN is the article is up to scratch. To use one infamous (IMHO anyway) example, if a meteor hits Detroit or someone called the Messiah appears in Los Angeles tomorrow, we won't have these items on ITN unless we have suitable articles, no matter how important the events may seem. That is because wikipedia is not a news site so we don't really care how important something is, provided it's important enough. Of course, these items are likely to have so much interest that their article will quickly get up to scratch, but if that doesn't happen, it's not a failure of ITN that we don't have these items. (Perhaps a wider failure in wikipedia but not ITN) Nil Einne (talk) 15:57, 1 October 2008 (UTC)

Support We should definitely post this as it evidences the unperturbed onslaught of the financial collapse juggernaut. __meco (talk) 06:42, 26 September 2008 (UTC)

weak support the story definitely seems to be ITN worthy. The article is a bit on the weak side, but probably good enough for ITN Nil Einne (talk) 07:19, 26 September 2008 (UTC)

Support. However, please expand the intro of the article and suggest a final headline. There are 3 options here at the moment, hard to decide. --Tone 07:56, 26 September 2008 (UTC)

Just a thought, since it's sleeping time currently in the US and these financial events center on Wall Street and the US financial system, some of the most active editors in this field (which is rather specialized) may be not be editing right now. I think we should not wait 6 hours before posting this even if the improvements which you request aren't made. __meco (talk) 08:20, 26 September 2008 (UTC)

Support The largest bank failure in U.S. history.... --Hapsala (talk) 09:52, 26 September 2008 (UTC)

Note: OTS is the regulator empowered to close/seize WaMu. Ordinarily the FDIC is then named by the OTS as the receiver (i.e. put in charge of winding down operations). It appears that the sale to JP Morgan Chase was concurrent with the seizure in this case, so I'm not technically sure whether OTS or FDIC (or both) is responsible for the sale. Our article currently attributes the sale to OTS, but at least one news report says FDIC was instrumental in arranging the sale. Dragons flight (talk) 10:55, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
Just a reminder, please only use bullet points for wording suggestions or nominations. SpencerT♦C 11:27, 26 September 2008 (UTC)

This is fairly big news; I've gone ahead and updated with the following text:

In the largest bank failure in U.S. history, Washington Mutual (headquarters pictured) is placed into receivership by the Office of Thrift Supervision. As receiver, the Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation sells the bank's accounts and operations to JPMorgan Chase.

This seems accurate and informative to me, after looking at the article and multiple news reports. I've also updated the image to Wamuseattle.jpg, with a border. There are a few different images available of WaMu Center, but the others seemed to me to clash somewhat with the page in terms of color or focus. In any case, you're of course welcome to suggest improvements, and any admin who wants to make changes, please go ahead. I'll try to monitor things for a bit, so just post on my talk page if you want to get my attention. —Slowking Man (talk) 11:29, 26 September 2008 (UTC)

In the interest of maintaining a pretense of brevity, can I suggest using FDIC rather than Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation? The acronym is widely recognized, the phrase "as receiver" already provides context, and the link can satisfy people who want more. Even with that contraction, this item would still be the longest on ITN at the moment. Dragons flight (talk) 12:14, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
The revised text is great, thanks to Slowking Man for apt revision, and others for helping to get this out when I was off line. Comment to Dragon's Flight on acronyms: It's preferable to spell out the first use of acronyms in any occasion, in preference to brevity, and its friendlier to an international audience. What South African or Brazilian knows what FDIC means?
-- Yellowdesk (talk) 13:16, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
I agree it is generally a benefit to spell things out, but in this case I believe it would be a greater benefit to shorten the blurb. In the alternative, you could drop FDIC entirely and reduce the second sentence to: "The bank's accounts and operations are sold to JPMorgan Chase." I just scanned through the last six weeks of ITN history, and this stands out as the longest blurb during that time period. One way or another I feel this should be pruned back. Dragons flight (talk) 15:40, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
Or this one. Cumulus Clouds (talk) 15:26, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
Belated support (and thanks, this was up before I read it in a newspaper). -SusanLesch (talk) 15:40, 26 September 2008 (UTC)

September 25


ITN candidates for September 25

  • Nominate New South African president. __meco (talk) 12:56, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
Posted, I updated the previous item. --Tone 13:01, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
Suggest using "crew members" instead of taikonauts. Some Chinese media sources use astronauts, some use taikonauts. Best to use a term that everyone will understand. --Joowwww (talk) 16:29, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
Posting. Taikonaut is becoming known so I will use it here. Feel free to change it later. --Tone 17:11, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
I took out the part about the spacewalk, as this has yet to happen. Pls feel free to put this back on ITN when this historic moment comes. --PFHLai (talk) 23:46, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
Support but Oppose the word taikonaut unless somebody can explain why it isn't in the article. -SusanLesch (talk) 06:25, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
Taikonaut is not the common English word, astronaut is. Can this be changed please. Ben (talk) 13:07, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
Ben I will copy a note to main page errors (no way to know when who will be available). -SusanLesch (talk) 15:44, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
As promised, I've just added a bit about Zhai Zhigang successfully performing his spacewalk. --PFHLai (talk) 21:32, 27 September 2008 (UTC)

September 24


ITN candidates for September 24

Typhoon Hagupit
And there's an image, too: Image:Typhoon Hagupit 23 September 2008.JPG
Any admins? SpencerT♦C 11:08, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
Posted. Don't forget to upload the image if you suggest it. --Tone 11:15, 25 September 2008 (UTC)
This is as important as an Antarctic ice shelf breaking off, but the information may need to be expanded (and an improvement to the blurb is needed). ~AH1(TCU) 23:02, 3 October 2008 (UTC)

September 23


ITN candidates for September 23

  • Nominate Finland school shooting. Pretty major for a Western European nation and all the more so because it took place at a school --Daviessimo (talk) 11:51, 23 September 2008 (UTC)
I added it but ITN isn't my area of expertise. Can anybody double check if it is correct? BJTalk 12:24, 23 September 2008 (UTC)
Support. But "people" should be changed to "students". --Hapsala (talk) 13:12, 23 September 2008 (UTC)
Why is it in passive (and lacking major point) shouldn't it be like: Student shot 10 people and himself and wounding some in a school shooting in Kauhajoki, Finland. --Usp (talk) 00:10, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
ITN items should be written in present tense. SpencerT♦C 23:50, 25 September 2008 (UTC)

September 22


ITN candidates for September 22

Taro Aso
Wait until he becomes PM, then it goes up. This is a standard procedure on ITN. --Tone 21:32, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
Yeah, I know. Just wanted to be the first one to mention "Taro Aso" here on ITN/C. :) --199.71.174.100 (talk) 14:21, 23 September 2008 (UTC)
Ham Lini
Does anyone remember if the Vanuatu election was on here? If not then support. Either way, no to the photo. Random89 04:19, 23 September 2008 (UTC)
What's wrong with the photo? It needs to be cropped but beyond that, I don't see why it shouldn't go upEr nevermind I just realised the photo is of the outgoing PM not the new one. In that case I agree, don't see any reason for it Nil Einne (talk) 07:06, 23 September 2008 (UTC)
Posting a shorter blurb. --Tone 07:10, 23 September 2008 (UTC)
I was wondering if it was possible for an editor to place some kind of editing protection on the Edward Natapei article if possible. Edward Natapei and the Prime Minister of Vanuatu have been repeatedly vandalized since they were posted on the front page, especially Natapei. Please take a look at the article history. This is very unusual for an article to be vandalized this much in such a short period of time. Thanks! Scanlan (talk) 02:35, 25 September 2008 (UTC)

September 21


ITN candidates for September 21

  • USA beat Europe in the 2008 Ryder Cup to win {{Insert score here - not yet finished}} - Nothing wrong here I think. It'll probably get added to the Portal:Current events for today shortly. D.M.N. (talk) 21:29, 21 September 2008 (UTC)
Hows that? Beat isn't the best word. -CWY2190(talkcontributions) 23:11, 21 September 2008 (UTC)
Already posted by Stephen. --PFHLai (talk) 23:28, 21 September 2008 (UTC)
I'm not thrilled about the linking of USA and Europe. First of all, Europe (as linked) is a geographical region, and has little to do with golfers. If there was a Team USA at the Ryder Cup aticle, that would be a good link, but right now I think both USA and Europe should be unlinked. Random89 16:55, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
No, hold on a sec., wait a day. There might be a ballot check. SpencerT♦C 00:55, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
Besides, the article is not in good shape either. I'll try to fix that in some days when more is known. --Tone 07:13, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
The results are currently unofficial and may change yet as there was such a small difference between SDS and SD. Some votes have not been counted yet. See [4] (Slovene) --Eleassar my talk 10:30, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
Updated. --PFHLai (talk) 04:43, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
  • Nominate Goldman and Morgan becoming bank-holding companies, could be included in the section already on the main page about the subprime crisis.--The Devil's Advocate (talk) 06:40, 22 September 2008 (UTC)

September 20


ITN candidates for September 20

Article okay...could be expanded, but an update is needed. BobAmnertiopsisChatMe! 18:49, 20 September 2008 (UTC)

Support. --Cdogsimmons (talk) 02:42, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
Thabo Mbeki - World Economic Forum on Africa 2008.jpg
Article needs more updates, but otherwise, it's a good candidate. SpencerT♦C 21:24, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
Support, but I would prefer an article about the current crisis/development in South African politics, how Mbeki was "sacked" etc. Polipopo (talk) 02:38, 21 September 2008 (UTC)
Posted. When we have a page on the current crisis, we can switch the bolded link on ITN to that page. --PFHLai (talk) 04:17, 21 September 2008 (UTC)
Belated support. -SusanLesch (talk) 21:02, 21 September 2008 (UTC)

September 19


ITN candidates for September 19

  • If someone created and article for the 2008 Nigerian Oil Crisis, I think we could have a good candidate...I've been seeing several stories in Portal:Current events days about related stuff. 00:36, 20 September 2008 (UTC)


September 18


ITN candidates for September 18

NominateForeign Minister of Israel Tzipi Livni is selected as the new leader of the Kadima party, putting her in line to become Prime Minister.

It's in the portal news under Sept. 17, but I think the full results weren't confirmed until today. —Josiah Rowe (talkcontribs) 04:42, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
Can we wait until she actually becomes the Prime Minister? - Mark 05:00, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
I was thinking that the change of party leadership in a parliamentary system was roughly equivalent to the nomination of the Presidential candidates in the US — Obama and McCain made ITN when they secured the leadership of their parties, so why shouldn't Livni? —Josiah Rowe (talkcontribs) 08:14, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
That was rather controversial and really only got through because of the level of international coverage the/this US election buildup is receiving. (Plus with Obama since he was the first African American.) Changes of leadership of parties in countries with parliamentry systems are not necessarily uncommon (for example one happened several days ago in Australia) and definitely are not usually ITN worthy in themselves (the change of leader of opposition for example is definitely not in itself of sufficient significance for ITN). If there is something special about this change (is she the first female leader of a major party in Israel?) then there may be a case, but if the only thing here is she may become the Prime Minister then we should wait until she becomes Prime Minister. If she doesn't become Prime Minister then really there's no reason it should have been there anyway. Nil Einne (talk) 13:23, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
I think this was discussed before. It is not for sure she will become PM, she's only the predisent of the party now. We can put this on when she becomes PM. --Tone 13:49, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
Support when the time comes. -SusanLesch (talk) 21:03, 21 September 2008 (UTC)

Nominate 'Lloyds TSB complete a £12.2bn takeover of rival HBOS, the United Kingdom's largest mortgage lender' -- Huge repecussion of current economic crisis and one not in the US! Also it will create one of the largest financial institutions in the world --Daviessimo (talk) 06:47, 18 September 2008 (UTC)

Support adding this to the current item on the subprime mortgage crisis and rewording accordingly. Perhaps something like "In the ongoing subprime mortgage crisis, Lloyds TSB purchases rival HBOS, the United States Federal Reserve bails out AIG, Lehman Brothers files for bankruptcy protection, and Bank of America purchases Merrill Lynch." —Josiah Rowe (talkcontribs) 07:01, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
This blurb is becoming longer and longer, maybe we should drop one or two events that happened a few days ago and focus on the latest? --Tone 13:49, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
Drop the Merrill Lynch-Bank of America story for this one. Or the AIG story since nothing really happened yet. –Howard the Duck 16:56, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
I do not support Lloyds news. Not as big as US corp news. --gppande «talk» 18:26, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
Oh so the rule is now that only US firms or banks going belly up are 'big' enough to get on ITN. £12.2bn is over $21Bn which is huge some of money. Also the newly merged firm will have over 35m customers and even with the expected 40,000 job losses will employ over 100,000 people (which is 4 times more than Lehmann brothers about 15,000 fewer than AIG). Oh but I forgot AIG 'nearly' collapsing is a bigger than this 'actual' development --Daviessimo (talk) 19:38, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
Posted, by dropping Merrill Lynch from the existing blurb, adding in the HBOS news and rejigging it a bit. The fourth and fifth biggest banks in the United Kingdom merging is definitely 'as big as US corp news'. And HBOS is bigger than Merrill Lynch anyway. - Mark 03:04, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
Suggestion Can the blurb be shortened down? -c4v3m4n 03:18, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
Yes, but the other side of the Main Page is unusually long today, so we'd end up having to add some old news back on the end to balance it out. - Mark 03:32, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
Okay, hopefully shortened down enough now. - Mark 03:44, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
  • I definitely support this news piece as well and I agree with the removal of Merrill Lynch since both AIG and Lehman supersede that item in terms of market impact. Given the condition of English financial markets, we definitely need more coverage of the subprime crisis in the UK too. Cumulus Clouds (talk) 04:18, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
Belated support. -SusanLesch (talk) 21:04, 21 September 2008 (UTC)
Support, we usually include such type of news. --Tone 13:49, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
Support. --gppande «talk» 18:26, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
Support. New national leaders are always newsworthy. Benjaminx (talk) 22:09, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
Posted. - Mark 03:04, 19 September 2008 (UTC)

September 17


ITN candidates for September 17

Posted. No one objects, eh? --PFHLai (talk) 03:05, 21 September 2008 (UTC)

I'd suggest an update to the lead Subprime Crisis item indicating that Lehman Brothers is to be partially acquired by Barclays plc. Radagast (talk) 21:06, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

  • Comment The 2008 unrest in Bolivia really needs to be mentioned, its been going on for days. Medvedenko (talk) 21:11, 17 September 2008 (UTC)
    Do you have any wording ideas in mind? SpencerT♦C 01:12, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
    The article doesn't seem to be updated enough for a story about the reported 'tentative agreement reached for talks to commence', really. - Mark 02:56, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
I posted at blurb near the bottom of ITN about the state of emergency and the arrest of the Governor of Pando. Please feel free to update the blurb as the story develops. --PFHLai (talk) 05:40, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
  • Nominate the Haumea classification. Nergaal (talk) 21:50, 17 September 2008 (UTC)
    Posted. - Mark 03:25, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
    I've taken this back off again, because there appear to be a lot of sourcing problems on the article which should be fixed. - Mark 05:13, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
  • More on the subprime crisis; the UK press are reporting that Lloyds TSB has agreed to take over HBOS to avoid the latter's collapse. --Kwekubo (talk) 22:12, 17 September 2008 (UTC)
    I haven't read that it was to avoid HBOS's collapse. We need to be careful what we say. Perhaps: "Lloyds TSB agrees to merge with HBOS amidst ongoing instability in global financial markets." - Mark 02:49, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
Done. Wording: 16 are killed in an attack on the American embassy in San‘a’, Yemen.
Should American embassy link to United States–Yemen relations? Thanks, SpencerT♦C 02:26, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
Posted. - Mark 03:25, 18 September 2008 (UTC)
Belated support. -SusanLesch (talk) 21:01, 21 September 2008 (UTC)

September 16


ITN candidates for September 16

  • Nominating 2008 Ukrainian political crisis since past situations tended to result in problems, greater attention will be given here following the conflict in Georgia, and it could lead to a major shift in Ukraine's political situation as well as impacting its potential NATO membership.--The Devil's Advocate (talk) 09:26, 16 September 2008 (UTC)
Support IF the parliament has officially been dissolved because snap elections are normally ITN material --Daviessimo (talk) 10:00, 16 September 2008 (UTC)
Snap elections announcement makes it to ITN. Otherwise... maybe, what would the headline be? Even the formation of different government would be ITN. Let's wait a day or two to see the development. --Tone 11:36, 16 September 2008 (UTC)
Coalition is down; posted.--chaser - t 03:06, 17 September 2008 (UTC)
Comment - as it is now - "related to the South Ossetia war" - it gives an wp:undue weight to South Ossetia war as a main reason of the crisis. This is disputable and sources like BBC doesn't even mention the war as a reason for the crisis. See also latest edits to the article and article talk page. --windyhead (talk) 17:39, 17 September 2008 (UTC)
  • Comment - The New York Times has reported that American International Group may file for bankruptcy protection as early as Wednesday, September 17. This would be the largest bankruptcy in United States history and possibly the largest bankruptcy in world history. AIG is the largest insurance company in the world and its collapse will, according to the Times, have far reaching global financial impact. This could be combined with the news on Lehman and Merrill Lynch, provided that it's reposted at the top to provide more updated coverage. Otherwise, it can stand by itself as a major news event. Cumulus Clouds (talk) 16:44, 16 September 2008 (UTC)
Support if this happens and if the article is updated properly. From natural didasters to bank disasters in a couple of days... --Tone 17:10, 16 September 2008 (UTC)
Gov't rescue added to the other news items.--chaser - t 03:06, 17 September 2008 (UTC)
The AIG item seems to be toing the line of WP:CRYSTALBALL... "The Federal Reserve rescues insurer AIG from likely bankruptcy"...yes, I know it was probably going to happen. Can we have a change of wording, say (?) "The Federal Reserve loans AIG $85 billion, ..." SpencerT♦C 11:04, 17 September 2008 (UTC)
Wording looks much better now. Thanks, SpencerT♦C 22:33, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

September 15

  • Six men have been found guilty of terrorism-related offences in Melbourne, Australia. Abdul Nacer Benbrika was found guilty of intentionally directing the activities of a terrorist organization while five other men were found guilty of being members of the same organisation. Four other men were acquitted and the jury is still considering its verdict on two men. (ABC News Australia)
  • Hurricane Ike (2008)
  • NASA scientists report that the Ozone hole over the Antarctic has reached its largest expanse, 27 million square kilometers vs 26 million square kilometers in 2006. (NASA) European Scientists at ESA concur. [5]


ITN candidates for September 15

  • Nominating Lehman Brothers bankruptcy. Very important development of the US banking crisis with international ramidications. Dovetails with the takeover of Fannie and Freddie, and shows that the crisis is far from over and that the entire US banking system is verging on collapse, a collapse which many assert would cause a meltdown of the global financial system. Very, very serious. __meco (talk) 06:56, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
We need a headline with no redlinks. Anyways, pls see on-going discussion on Subprime mortgage crisis and related wikiarticles at #ITN candidates for September 14 below. --199.71.174.100 (talk) 07:16, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
  • Suggest an update of the Zimbabwe power sharing deal to show it is official and that Tsvangarai in the now PM --Daviessimo (talk) 10:21, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
That sounds good to me. Although the emboldened link should be power-sharing agreement so it links to the 2008 Zimbabwean political negotiations article which has more info --Daviessimo (talk) 10:07, 16 September 2008 (UTC)
Upon further review, we can't put this on ITN yet. Tsvangirai has not yet taken office. The 'new' post has to be (re)created by a constitutional amendment, which won't be done till next month. --PFHLai (talk) 05:58, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
Posted at the bottom of ITN. --PFHLai (talk) 04:43, 21 September 2008 (UTC)

September 14


ITN candidates for September 14

Nominate Flight 821. Article's short, but definitely a notable topic. Maybe some new info will emerge overnight. BobAmnertiopsisChatMe! 03:47, 14 September 2008 (UTC)

Sure, but Aeroflot Flight 821 still needs to be de-stubbed. We'll wait. --PFHLai (talk) 04:49, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
The article is in better condition now, just do something about the image and check the death toll so that it is accurate. --Tone 11:04, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
Posted. --Tone 12:05, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
Radar image of Hurricane Ike at landfall
Landfall is not really descriptive, maybe you should formulate it in such a way that it mentions damage caused? --Tone 22:00, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
Try to include Effects of Hurricane Ike in Texas. --Tone 22:07, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
I deliberately left Effects of Hurricane Ike in Texas out to avoid the appearance of US-centrism on MainPage. Effects of Hurricane Ike in Haiti are much more lethal and severe, yet we don't even have a wikiarticle. I chose to focus on the landfall because the landfall pic appears to be the best pic available when midnight UTC comes. With a short TFA coming in, the LA train crash may have to come off ITN soon in order to balance MainPage. We need a new pic soon. --PFHLai (talk) 23:45, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
Support If we need an image, there's plenty of Ike. SpencerT♦C 00:21, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
Ok, try to include both articles, effects on Haiti and effects on Texas. ITN should also promote newly created articles and this is not too US-centric, if you include both. --Tone 09:37, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
The issue is, we don't have an article on the effects on Haiti. SpencerT♦C 11:10, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
Looks like Hurricane Ike won't make a second landfall at ITN till Wikipedia has a more balanced coverage of the hurricane damages. --199.71.174.100 (talk) 17:23, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
Sebastian Vettel

Nominate - Sebastian Vettel of Toro Rosso wins the 2008 Italian Grand Prix at Monza, becoming the youngest driver in history to win a Formula One grand prix. --- There are so many catastrophic pieces of news that I'd like to suggest something a tad optimistic. Hektor (talk) 21:38, 14 September 2008 (UTC)

Though unusual, I actually support this one because of the recent catastrophy-biased coverage. Good we still have CERN up there...--Tone 22:00, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
I agree. Depressing stuff. I support. BobAmnertiopsisChatMe! 22:02, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
2008 Italian Grand Prix needs more references. Otherwise it is good to go up. Or should the focus be on Vettel? There is not much update regarding the news there... --Tone 22:07, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
Oppose There are many auto races, and this isn't listed at WP:ITNSPORTS. However, Support if the focus is on the driver, who is the youngest to win an F1 race. SpencerT♦C 00:21, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
Sebastian Vettel#2008 needs footnotes and refs. --199.71.174.100 (talk) 03:28, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
I don't think ITNSPORTS is relevant here. ITNSPORTS makes it clear it's not intended to supercede normal discussion when there is an unusual event. Despite the perhaps confusing suggestion above, I don't think anyone is trying to suggest we put up this race because we should put up every F1 race or every Italian GP but rather because of the record here of Vettel being the youngest person ever to win an F1 race. Whether the reason is good enough is a relevant point of contention and the article clearly needs to be up to scratch but I think any discussion should be on the real issues here. I do agree the depressing part doesn't seem of great relevance to the discussion either Nil Einne (talk) 06:41, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
I've updated Vettel's article with a section devoted to the Grand Prix but its only small as its hard to maintain the focus on the Driver without wondering to much towards a race report. I definately think we can get this up as it is a very noteworthy event in sport -- Daviessimo (talk) 09:57, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
OK I've updated this a bit more now so that it is a decent size and contains several references. It can be updated with more imformation about the race (or specifically how Vettel did) but i'll only add that if its not considered ready to go up --Daviessimo (talk) 11:12, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
  • What is it with the lack of admins on ITN? Its over 24hrs since an update and the concensus is that this should go up --Daviessimo (talk) 12:21, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
Posting. The article looks ok now. --Tone 16:10, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
Unnecessary verbosity should be cut out: unless, of course "youngest driver in history" is needed to eliminate all those young motor racing drivers from pre-historical times. Kevin McE (talk) 16:00, 16 September 2008 (UTC)
Angolan legislative election, 2008, the first election there in 16 years, is not depressing. The official results came out on September 9th. Maybe we can stick this to the bottom of ITN. --199.71.174.100 (talk) 03:25, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
Actually the official results are not out yet, only the provisional results although the results are clear. And I would say it's at least a bit depressing, while it's good that they've finally held an election after such a long time and one that went off without major incident, the article suggests they've still far away from an ideal democracy Angolan legislative election, 2008#Observers and assessments of the election. Nil Einne (talk) 06:33, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
Look on the bright side -- things are improving there, just slowly. It's a significant moment in Angolan history anyhow. --199.71.174.100 (talk) 07:21, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
So what would the blurb here be? --Tone 09:37, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
I'd rather say majority instead of 82%. So is this official or still provisional? At least secure enough to put it on ITN? --Tone 17:37, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
Either way, the opposition has already conceded (See http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/7605454.stm or Ref.24 in the article.) It was a landslide victory for the MPLA. --199.71.174.100 (talk) 19:11, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
Posting. --Tone 21:48, 15 September 2008 (UTC)

Comment - It took a little longer than I thought (see my first suggestion further down this page) but I expect two things will happen tomorrow: 1. Lehman Brothers will be liquidated. All sources in that article indicate that this is the direction the company is headed in and this will make major news as it is the fourth largest investment bank 2. Bank of America will announce they have purchased Merrill Lynch. The talks there appear to be in very advanced stages and Bank of America has indicated they have already cemented the deal. Both articles have been updated accordingly and I feel that both of these items could be combined into one, though that may be rather long for the template. Otherwise they both qualify individually for listing at WP:ITN. I'll write the suggested wording if the news is announced tomorrow. Cumulus Clouds (talk) 22:38, 14 September 2008 (UTC)

  • AIG is also planning a major announcement tomorrow, which may prove to be equally important to those of the three banks mentioned above. Cumulus Clouds (talk) 23:14, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
Wait for the talks to be completed before this goes up. SpencerT♦C 00:21, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
  • I'd support this merged version. - Mark 02:26, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
Can the {{multipleissues}} at Merrill Lynch be taken care of before this shows up on the main page? --199.71.174.100 (talk) 03:26, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
  • I put it there, it seems that several editors have worked on correcting those issues so I'll go ahead and remove it. Cumulus Clouds (talk) 05:49, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
Posting, the merged blurb is fine. --Tone 09:37, 15 September 2008 (UTC)

(unindent)Okay, the Lehman brothers article looks okay, while a 2-sentence update for Merrill Lynch isn't good. If possible, please update further Merrill Lynch. SpencerT♦C 11:07, 15 September 2008 (UTC)

  • I'll put more information, but bear in mind that before Sunday afternoon, that article was missing any relevant history for Merrill from the past 10 years. I'll update it further at some point today. Also, American International Group and Washington Mutual are both on deck for big news in the next week, so I will work on those articles as well. Cumulus Clouds (talk) 15:04, 15 September 2008 (UTC)

September 13


ITN candidates for September 13

Nominate - At least 24 people are killed in a train collision in Los Angeles, California. Good article that is well updated and also includes possible pictures. BobAmnertiopsisChatMe! 23:20, 13 September 2008 (UTC)

This is already on ITN. SpencerT♦C 23:56, 13 September 2008 (UTC)
Whoops, tee-hee. Now I feel like an idiot. BobAmnertiopsisChatMe! 03:39, 14 September 2008 (UTC)

Nominate - There is an ongoing series of bomb blasts in New Delhi. So far at least 5 blasts have been reported and 12 people killed.

An article needs to be created for this, and as anon, I cannot create. --122.162.60.204 (talk) 14:25, 13 September 2008 (UTC)
The article is 2008 New Delhi bombings. Some more updates and I can put this up. Propose a good formulation. --Tone 15:29, 13 September 2008 (UTC)
A series of 7 bomb blasts rocks various sites in New Delhi, killing 20 people, and injuring 90.
--May the Force be with you! Shreshth91 16:31, 13 September 2008 (UTC)
Posting. Third new ITN item today. --Tone 16:34, 13 September 2008 (UTC)

Nominate - Hurricane Ike makes landfall over Galveston, Texas. Justice America (talk) 13:31, 13 September 2008 (UTC)

We had Ike before so in order to have it again, something more significant than landfall should happen. (hopefully it doesn't...) --Tone 13:34, 13 September 2008 (UTC)
Ike made a disaster. Maybe this should go up... Opinions on the wording? --Tone 12:26, 14 September 2008 (UTC)

Nominate - The All Blacks defeat Australia (28 - 24) to win the 2008 Tri Nations Series at the Suncorp Stadium in Brisbane, Australia.

From WP:ITNR#Football_(Rugby_Union), this should be in the ITN template as a recurring notable sporting series. MattWT (talk) 13:03, 13 September 2008 (UTC)

Posting, I will just change the wording to mention rugby and write New Zealand instead of All Blacks because not everyone is familiar with this term. --Tone 13:06, 13 September 2008 (UTC)
The teams name is officially (and colloquially) the All Blacks, unlike the other countires teams. How does this sound?

Alternative 1 - New Zealand team the All Blacks defeat Australia (28 - 24) to win the 2008 Rugby Union Tri Nations Series at the Suncorp Stadium in Brisbane, Australia. MattWT (talk) 13:14, 13 September 2008 (UTC)

Ok, better. Still, I have omitted the result as we usually don't include it. --Tone 13:18, 13 September 2008 (UTC)
Last thing, could you possibly change the "In rugby" to "In rugby union"? Rugby is a very broad term. Thank you, MattWT (talk) 13:21, 13 September 2008 (UTC)
Done. --Tone 13:23, 13 September 2008 (UTC)
Oppose. The All Blacks almost always win this tourney, it's not news anymore. –Howard the Duck 01:54, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
I've removed this news story. The article as it stands isn't updated enough to satisfy the updated content requirements of WP:ITNMP, namely "Updated content must be thoroughly referenced" (there is only one reference provided) and "while articles in topics such as sporting events ... lend themselves to tables of numbers, updates must be at least in part written in prose to qualify for ITN consideration". I couldn't find any prose in there which says that New Zealand won the series. - Mark 02:24, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
I've updated the article now, 4 citations and rewriten some of the prose to indicate All Blacks won. Could you either re-add it, or tell me what I need to do in addition to that? MattWT (talk) 04:32, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
Thanks for addressing my concerns. It's still a little low on the prose for my liking (why no match summaries or things like that?) but in any event I've restored it now. - Mark 09:17, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
Is there an article you had in mind to be bolded? SpencerT♦C 14:11, 13 September 2008 (UTC)
Support. Tell me when you're done with the article. --Tone 14:25, 13 September 2008 (UTC)
I think I'm done. Could you give the article a quick lookover? Wording (?): A mudslide caused by an illegal mine in Linfen, Shanxi province, China kills 178 people.
Posted. The article is fine. --Tone 16:02, 13 September 2008 (UTC)

A BIG thanks to Tone for his outstanding work in keeping ITN lighting fast... Keep up buddy. --gppande «talk» 20:20, 13 September 2008 (UTC)

 :-) I have realized that I am sometimes forgetting to add ITN banner on the talkpages of the articles featured and on the nominator's talk. Someone please add it when I forget (or I don't have time to do it). --Tone 20:58, 13 September 2008 (UTC)

September 12


ITN candidates for September 12

Prime Minister Helen Clark1.jpg
This is a scheduled election, not a snap election. The calling of the election was merely a procedural move. We should wait till we have the final results are in the article before we post this on ITN. --199.71.174.100 (talk) 06:39, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
Agreed. I still don't think we should have put the Canadian election, which while an early election was evidentally nothing unusual. But this one has even less reason. If we're going to put this, we might as well make it official policy to put every election when it's called if there is a suitable article Nil Einne (talk) 08:36, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
Canada's election was a snap election; it belongs up there. If this one is a regular election, which it is, then it does not. --Kitch (Talk : Contrib) 18:41, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
Support, but the article needs some expansion. SpencerT♦C 14:38, 13 September 2008 (UTC)
Much better now. Could be used with Image:Chatsworth Train Collision 20080913-022324.jpg. SpencerT♦C 18:50, 13 September 2008 (UTC)
Posting. 4th new ITN item today. --Tone 19:28, 13 September 2008 (UTC)

September 11


ITN candidates for September 11

No section in the article appears to mention the memorial's opening. SpencerT♦C 00:35, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
A new section has been added about the dedication ceremony. Plus, it's been almost two days since a story's been added to ITN. Benjaminx (talk) 02:58, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
Strong Oppose Does not qualify notability. Just an event. --gppande «talk» 13:56, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
  • Nominate. The Channel Tunnel fire . Major transport artery between UK and France (and longest undersea tunnel) is closed. Pretty noteworthy I'd say
Are there any deaths or ₤100000+ damage to the tunnel? Otherwise, it's not quite notable as it is. Just because it is closed doesn't exactly meet notability. SpencerT♦C 19:21, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
Well, I updated Eurotunnel and came here to nominate but Channel Tunnel was already updated. Then I found another new article Channel Tunnel fire (2008) is already written. Looks WP has recorded more than 1 fire :-D Which two would be extinguished??? --gppande «talk» 19:29, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
I support this. Good article, news, etc. Put 'er up! BobAmnertiopsisChatMe! 01:57, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
Query: The tunnel wasn't destroyed. There was no high death toll. What is the significance of this fire? --199.71.174.100 (talk) 06:43, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
The significance is because the tunnel is widely regarded as a huge feat of engineering (often seen as one of the seven modern wonders of the world), is a key transport artery in North Western Europe that could have far reaching consequences in hauliage etc given the current economic climate. Latest news i have seen suggests the fire is under control but still burning some 17 hours later which is longer than the 1996 fire. Obviously no one will know the damage as of yet but it could 10's of million of pounds
I support this. The tunnel is the longest under-sea tunnel in the world, and this is (apparently) only the second fire in its history. - Mark 07:33, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
  • What't the consensus on this going up. It now appears that this was a major fire destroying almost 30 lorries and damaging over 700m of tunnel. It is likely to cost several hundred million pounds to repair and will affect services through the tunnel for months to come -77.96.49.30 (talk) 21:17, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
  • If that's the case, then it should be in the article and sourced. Nil Einne (talk) 11:58, 13 September 2008 (UTC)
When will Politics of Zimbabwe get updated with info on the new political structure? Looking forward to seeing this on ITN. --199.71.174.100 (talk) 06:47, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
Strong support: The article 2008 Zimbabwean political negotiations is too much elaborate. I think this is great news to go up. Also the red banner on top of this page looks ugly. Some admin please update the ITN with above nominated blurb quickly. --gppande «talk» 07:02, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
WHERE ARE ADMINS???? SINCE 52 HOURS NO UPDATE. WHY IS THIS NOT GOING UP? --gppande «talk» 13:56, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
This seems to be the best of the recently proposed news, posting. --Tone 14:06, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
Thanks Tone --gppande «talk» 14:27, 12 September 2008 (UTC)

September 10


ITN candidates for September 10

September 9


ITN candidates for September 9

The new setup in CERN starts operating tomorrow. Make sure the article is in good condition so that it gets a place on ITN. Some good science news! --Tone 20:47, 9 September 2008 (UTC)

We should be looking at Large Hadron Collider instead of CERN as it speaks more of the Big Bang experiment. --gppande «talk» 21:00, 9 September 2008 (UTC)
I know, LHC. There is not much about tomorrow's test running in the article yet but no doubt there will be soon. No black holes, I hope :-) --Tone 21:18, 9 September 2008 (UTC)
This may be news for the mainstream media, but I don't see why we should put it on the main page yet. Sending the first beam around — which is what is supposedly happening tomorrow — is not that big of a deal. We should only be putting this on the main page when they do something that hasn't been done before (i.e., colliding at full speed, making some sort of discovery, etc). --- RockMFR 00:06, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
I sort of agree, sort of disagree. There's been a lot of build-up to this first test, but it will be far more noteworth if they find the Higgs boson. If nothing better, post this, I say. BobAmnertiopsisChatMe! 02:36, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
It's the largest science experiment ever, that alone makes it worthwhile. The conspiracy theories about Earth's destruction are just icing on the crazy cake. Besides, we so rarely have news that's something other than sports, elections or disasters. This would be nice for a change. --Hemlock Martinis (talk) 03:35, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
I agree, the news should be put up once the experiment begins today and later if there is a major discovery then the blurb can be updated accordingly or another blurb can be put up. What is the scenario at the time of discovery. But let's put it up for now --gppande «talk» 08:49, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
The first beam is successfully steered around the Large Hadron Collider accelerator ring at CERN, Switzerland. (ready to put this up when the formulation in the article changes to the fact that they did it.) --Tone 08:58, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
Article updated, posting. --Tone 09:40, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
  • Comment - There will be a major announcement tomorrow morning in New York on the fate of Lehman Brothers, the largest investment firm in the country. They are expected to release a report detailing a large quarterly loss and, after the collapse of today's takeover purchase from a South Korean investment firm, may send the bank into insolvency or bankruptcy. If that happens this item should definitely be covered in the template (concious, as we all are, of the news from Fannie & Freddie that was just placed there), possibly as early as tomorrow afternoon. If this happens, it will be the largest collapse of a Wall Street bank resulting from the current subprime mortgage crisis (larger still than Bear Stearns). I will update the article tomorrow and will nominate it for ITN if this happens. Cumulus Clouds (talk) 06:45, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
Although I have Google NEWS and see Lehman Brothers' current troubles it would be nice to have a cite to where you are getting your information. Otherwise, there is an appearance of speculation.--Cdogsimmons (talk) 03:29, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
  • I've been continuously updating the article and you can find references there. The financial crisis is also expanding to include Washington Mutual, whose stock lost 30 percent of its value yesterday. We may see two large national banks come down in the next few days, so I'll follow it carefully and update here accordingly. Cumulus Clouds (talk) 05:10, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
  • The Lehman article was apparently just mentioned on CNBC for some unsourced OR that was inserted earlier on the imminent sale of the company. There's a couple mentions on it here and here. Cumulus Clouds (talk) 22:19, 11 September 2008 (UTC)

September 8


ITN Candidates for September 8

Nominate. Serena Williams defeats Jelena Jankovic to win the US Open for the third time, regaining the number one ranking for the first time in five years. Benjaminx (talk) 04:41, 8 September 2008 (UTC)

Support. Serena Williams seems to be only updated article so it should be the bolded link. 2008 US Open should probably be linked to in the blurb as well. Hammer Raccoon (talk) 13:01, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
Oppose. Too little information present in Serena Williams article. Expand it first. --gppande «talk» 13:43, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
The better link to bold would be 2008 U.S. Open (tennis), which has been updated daily over the course of the tournament. --199.71.174.100 (talk) 23:02, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
Support. The information doesn't seem to be lacking now. Also, the result of the Murray-Federer match (Murray win) should be added to this, after it has finished in about 8-10 hours time. It should probably be bumped back up to the top at that point as well. Also, the 2008 US Open article has been updated. Yohan euan o4 (talk) 17:49, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
Support, and suggest the following wording:
In the 2008 US Open, Serena Williams wins the women's singles for the third time, regaining the number one ranking for the first time in five years.
I think that leaves more room for an update with the men's champion when that's known (and the relevant articles are updated). I'll also note that a crop of Image:Serena Williams.jpg would be (IMO) much more interesting on the front page than a shot of the Canadian House of Commons. —Josiah Rowe (talkcontribs) 22:07, 8 September 2008 (UTC)

Nominate. Serena Williams and Roger Federer win the 2008 U.S. Open. - c4v3m4n 23:24, 8 September 2008 (UTC)

Added, since there seems to be a consensus above. —Josiah Rowe (talkcontribs) 01:43, 9 September 2008 (UTC)
Pls fill out the results table first. --76.64.76.141 (talk) 17:30, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
Official results won't be released for another 5 days, though there are preliminary results. I'll see if I can make this update to the article later. SpencerT♦C 00:28, 11 September 2008 (UTC)

September 7


ITN Candidates for September 7

  • Nominating the Assam floods news. --gppande «talk» 10:21, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
Is there an article for the floods? SpencerT♦C 16:07, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
Again the floods? The section in the article is expanded, this is ok. --Tone 16:20, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
I had made the word bold in news line above but somehow it was reduced to normal text. The article is same 2008 Indian floods. Yes, again floods, this year India is dealing floods in one state after another. Even if Bihar flood waters have not receaded Assam is battering with floods now. So there is a need for the news should go to ITN. It's just like Americas see huricanes one after another. I have added a new section in the main article. Please post it to ITN. --gppande «talk» 19:24, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
Good. Propose a headline. --Tone 19:51, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
Brahmaputra river flood displaces 2.1 million people and cause 24 deaths in Assam. --gppande «talk» 21:37, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
Please post: The blurb has been suggested above and news qualifies to ITN. --gppande «talk» 10:06, 8 September 2008 (UTC)


Note: I am making this a color box to direct the admin attention. The box can be removed once the news is posted.--gppande «talk» 15:32, 8 September 2008 (UTC)

Done. --Tone 15:35, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
I don't usually edit politics, but doesn't saying someone should be arrested give Wikipedia a liability problem? 2008 Indian floods says "Nilendu Sanyal should have been booked under law for his past misdeeds ... " Art LaPella (talk) 22:40, 9 September 2008 (UTC)
Indeed, this part is bad. Someone please edit this (or add ref). --Tone 08:54, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
I'd put it on hold until something significant happens (so that there is a decent headline). Bad luck with the huricanes this year... (Anyone feels we are getting weather-centric recently? - check also the post above) --Tone 16:20, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
As well, this could be combined with the Hannah blurb for now. Any suggestions for formulation? --Tone 19:51, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
Hurricanes Hanna and Ike cause at least 584 deaths in Haiti, the United States, and the Dominican Republic. SpencerT♦C 00:51, 8 September 2008 (UTC)


Fannie Mae and Freddy Mac

  • Nom Fannie and Frankie going into conservatorship. Lead should mention that these two hold over 50% of all US mortgages, which gives the perspective of the magnitude of this action. __meco (talk) 17:20, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
This news I think could need a separate article. And conservatorship could also use some cleanup. SpencerT♦C 18:24, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
I'd suggest the following wording. "The United States Treasury Department seizes control of mortgage finance companies Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac." Benjaminx (talk) 18:33, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
Support. I would say "takes control" instead of "seizes control." -- Mwalcoff (talk) 18:40, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
Does it have international impact? Probably yes, considering the finance crisis. Conditional support, in order not to have only weather-related catastrophes on ITN. --Tone 19:51, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
I think "seizes" is quite appropriate. Also, I would very much like to have some flesh for the many users who haven't heard about these institutions and don't immediately grasp the magnitude of this. There are several factoids in this to conseptualize this, i.e.
  • "one of the most sweeping government interventions in private financial markets in decades" according to the Washington Post[6]
  • The fact I mentioned in nominating this story about these two companies holding over 50% of all US home mortgages.
  • 70-80% of new mortgages are held by F&F
  • They guarantee for more than $5.3 trillion.
__meco (talk) 20:00, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
I agree that this should become an article on its own. __meco (talk) 20:00, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
-The U.S. Treasury department did not seize control.
Yes it has tremendous international impact. As much as several trillion of dollars of Mortgage Backed Securities (MBS) , guaranteed by the two, and in addition, debt issued directly by the two entities in question are held by international financial entities, one very significant holder being the central bank of China, for which I don't have citations, but have read about. At the moment the article Federal Housing Finance Agency, gives a good brief on the conservatorship intents and actions, with citations, and the Fannie Mae#Conservatorship section and citations give fair background, mostly provided by me.
Some details:
-The director of the Federal Housing Finance Agency, James Lockhart III, placed the two government sponsored entities into a conservatorship, with the FHFA as the conservator, pursuant to the authority created in the Federal Housing Finance Regulatory Reform Act of 2008, which is a sub-part of the larger Housing and Economic Recovery Act of 2008, Public Law 110-289, signed into law July 30, 2008. The U.S. Treasury is only a financing body for the in-conservatorship enties.
In that conservatorship, the CEOs were dismissed, board and management authority is assumed by the conservator; the former CEOs agreed to stay on in a consultative capacity, and the rest of managment team is intended to be retained for the near term; dividends were suspended on common stock and preferred stock, normally payments amounting to US$ two billion annually; financing facilities were made available at the Treasury department; all political activity is ceased, especially lobbying activities, and capital requirements relating to MBEs are also suspended, The colloquial "seize" and "control" is not specific enough for the very particular actions that have taken place.
A quote from the Washington Post:
The action is "one of the most sweeping government interventions in private financial markets in decades".
Source: Goldfarb, Zachary A.; David Cho and Binyamin Appelbaum (2008-09-07). "Treasury to Rescue Fannie and Freddie: Regulators Seek to Keep Firms' Troubles From Setting Off Wave of Bank Failures". Washington Post. pp. A01. Retrieved 2008-09-07. 
-- Yellowdesk (talk) 20:56, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
Couldn't somebody start the article Federal takeover of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac? When the markets react to this and comments and commentary from various directions amass, this should all be organized in one article dealing only with this event. Right now I have to go. __meco (talk) 22:50, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
I created a stub for this article, using the suggested article title: Federal takeover of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac. After doing so, I suspect a more correct title would have been "U.S. Government takeover..." -- but any change will have to be handled later on after more editors are working on the article. N2e (talk) 00:27, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
I don't think anyone is going to disagree with this item, we just need to get the wording and article right. Nil Einne (talk) 04:14, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
- I'll attempt phrasing based on this example. It's not a failure though, but a regulatory action to prevent failure. - Yellowdesk (talk) 14:43, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
  • The New York Times this morning called it "one of the most expensive financial bailouts in history," so maybe you want to go with that phrasing. Cumulus Clouds (talk) 15:05, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
-I'm not sure which "that" you intend. This distinguishing charateristic is that this is NOT receivership, and there is no liquidation, and although stockholders will lose a lot of money, they're not completely out of the picture. I'll try a draft here:
How about:
-- Yellowdesk (talk) 17:09, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
  • Too long, and it introduces several terms which we cannot assume many readers are familiar with. It doesn't convey the gravity to the casual reader. __meco (talk) 17:03, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
  • I don't intend to stand in the way. My formulation by being more general encompasses the idea of bailout. You could take out the 1 billion sentence to shorten it. I'll be off line for two hours. Do what you can without me. -- Yellowdesk (talk) 17:12, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
  • Just a note to say per Nil Einne, support addition. Global story. 86.44.22.206 (talk) 17:29, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
  • This looks good, and there appears to be consensus on it. It's a bit late, but better late than never. I'll put it up. —Josiah Rowe (talkcontribs) 21:46, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
  • Stephen (talk · contribs) removed the sentence "It is one of the largest banking failures in United States history" for being "editorial". I understand that concern, but I think that without that sentence, the item lacks context and will be incomprehensible to many readers, especially outside the United States. Does anyone have further suggestions for better wording, to indicate the magnitude of this event? —Josiah Rowe (talkcontribs) 22:30, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
  • Oops — I should have read more carefully, and seen the correction about "banking interventions" as opposed to "banking failures". I'll put that wording up for now, but am happy to have a better context-providing wording provided later.. —Josiah Rowe (talkcontribs) 22:35, 8 September 2008 (UTC)


  • Nominate Canadian election call. Don't know how to word the blurb right. Big news from a (mostly) English-speaking country with lots of Wikipedia users. -- Mwalcoff (talk) 21:54, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
Just posted :) The Tom (talk) 22:01, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
Since when have we posted the calling of an election? We usually only post the result. Jmount (talk) 00:12, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
I think one of the big, English-speaking Westminster countries (UK, Can., Aus.) merits a blurb for the beginning and end of the election. -- Mwalcoff (talk) 02:42, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
Does that mean we should have stuff on China and India then? Each probably has more competent English speakers then Australia, Canada or possibly the UK (definitely for India, not sure about China). I personally see absolutely no reason for this, a lot of people feel we already have to much election stuff on ITN expanding our coverage to include news of an impending election just makes it worse for no good reason. If there were something unusual about it then maybe but according to the article it's not. Edit: According to this List of countries by English-speaking population we should be putting Germany and the Phillipines and Nigeria before Canada and Australia. The list is pretty crap since the definitions vary (for example, China's 2 million which only counts HK is absurdly low and is repeated twice) but is an interesting read. Okay you may argue there is a decent German wiki so there is less reason for German but the others there's that's not the case. Even if you want to start getting into number of English speaking internet users, which you didn't mention before, India surely must at least come close to Australia, probably Nigeria too Nil Einne (talk) 04:14, 8 September 2008 (UTC)
- The difference is that the calling of an election is an event in those countries. It's a non-event in countries with a lockstep election calendar. -- Yellowdesk (talk) 14:38, 8 September 2008 (UTC)

September 6


ITN Candidates for September 6

Wait until article is updated, though. SpencerT♦C 22:21, 6 September 2008 (UTC)
  • I am putting Zardari up. --Tone 12:44, 6 September 2008 (UTC)
Support: Good choice. SpencerT♦C 14:31, 6 September 2008 (UTC)
I added the link to Pakistani presidential election, 2008. Seems more relevant and well updated. --PFHLai (talk) 04:01, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
  • Nominating news of 45 nation NSG clearing the India US nuke deal. The news is prominent as NSG approved the deal after 3 days of hectic negotiations and ending India's 34 years of nuclear apartheid. --gppande «talk» 14:36, 6 September 2008 (UTC)
Strong support.
The Nuclear Suppliers Group grants India a waiver to carry out civilian nuclear commerce with the rest of the world. --Enigma Blues (talk) 17:07, 6 September 2008 (UTC)
Good topic but it is hard to find this event in the main article. Perhaps expanding the intro before? --Tone 18:30, 6 September 2008 (UTC)
Expanded. Have a look now. --Enigma Blues (talk) 19:01, 6 September 2008 (UTC)
Nice. Posting. --Tone 19:19, 6 September 2008 (UTC)
Thanks a lot! --gppande «talk» 19:32, 6 September 2008 (UTC)
From what? --Tone 18:30, 6 September 2008 (UTC)
Not listed at Portal:Current events. SpencerT♦C 20:33, 6 September 2008 (UTC)


Looks good. My support. --Tone 18:30, 6 September 2008 (UTC)
The article could use a bit more prose, but it's not enough to make me oppose. (Hey, it rhymes!) Support. SpencerT♦C 20:35, 6 September 2008 (UTC)
Posted. --BorgQueen (talk) 05:37, 7 September 2008 (UTC)

September 5


ITN Candidates for September 5

  • Asteroid news is good and has a nice blurb too - Add it to ITN. --gppande «talk» 08:18, 5 September 2008 (UTC)
I have added more information to it as I could get from latest news articles. I think this is good to go. --gppande «talk» 08:28, 5 September 2008 (UTC)
What is actually notable about the flyby...is it any different than other flybys? 76.205.76.204 (talk) 11:04, 5 September 2008 (UTC)
Steins is Rosetta's first scientific target & ultimate destination is the comet 67/P Churyumov-Gerasimenko in 2014. --gppande «talk» 11:30, 5 September 2008 (UTC)
I would prefer putting this on when it reaches its target. Though it is interesting, I don't find anything particularly special about this flyby. What about the two stories proposed one day ago? --Tone 13:10, 5 September 2008 (UTC)

September 4


ITN Candidates for September 4

A post about the new particle wuld be a nice refreshment to the ITN section, too bad the article is only a tiny stub. As well, I've read some news about rapid melting of the ice and Arctic becoming an island, do we have any update on that? --Tone 20:41, 4 September 2008 (UTC)

This one. --Tone 20:45, 4 September 2008 (UTC)
Article seems good, let's do it. ffm 21:31, 5 September 2008 (UTC)

September 3


ITN Candidates for September 3

I nominate Hurricane Hanna (2008), but I suppose people will complain of hurricane bias. SpencerT♦C 01:36, 4 September 2008 (UTC)

Hanna on September 1st, 2008
  • Gustav is no longer newsworthy. Let's switch to Hanna.
Tropical Storm Hanna (pictured) moves towards the U.S. South Atlantic coast after causing at least 25 deaths in Haiti. --199.71.174.100 (talk) 00:16, 4 September 2008 (UTC)--04:37, 4 September 2008 (UTC)
Support as per the above IP. naerii 07:22, 4 September 2008 (UTC)
Posting, replacing Gustav. Please, upload the picture. --Tone 07:27, 4 September 2008 (UTC)

Nominate: Angoor Ada raid. SpencerT♦C 02:08, 4 September 2008 (UTC)

Picture uploaded: Image:464px-Hanna 2008-09-01 over Bahamas.jpg. naerii 11:27, 4 September 2008 (UTC)
Support The article is fairly substantial and the material is noteworthy.--Cdogsimmons (talk) 03:40, 4 September 2008 (UTC)
Looks good. Propose a good headline. --Tone 07:27, 4 September 2008 (UTC)
US Special Forces attack Taliban fighters for the first time on Pakistani territory. --gppande «talk» 08:35, 4 September 2008 (UTC)
US Special Forces raid a village in Waziristan, Pakistan using three helicopter gunships, the first such ground incursion to take place in Pakistan in the War on Terrorism.--Cdogsimmons (talk) 16:05, 4 September 2008 (UTC)
Posting. --Tone 17:36, 4 September 2008 (UTC)
The article now says that 3 helicopters (not helicopter gunships) and 2 jets were involved in the operation. There seems to be disagreement among the sources over this (what I would call minor) point, but perhaps we should clear it up.--Cdogsimmons (talk) 23:01, 4 September 2008 (UTC)
I wrote the article, so I feel I should clarify. Most foreign sources (ABC, NBC) listed 2, while most Pakistani and several other international listed 3. Another ref also mentioned 2 jets. Look at the refs by the statements for the links. Thanks, SpencerT♦C 00:00, 5 September 2008 (UTC)

September 2


ITN Candidates for September 2

Support. Article has been cleaned up immensely in the last day or so. Random89 22:42, 2 September 2008 (UTC)
Looks nice, though an image would be good if we can find one. SpencerT♦C 22:50, 2 September 2008 (UTC)
Posted. --BorgQueen (talk) 01:46, 3 September 2008 (UTC)
I think it's better to bold "clashes" and link 2008 Thai political crisis from there, rather than "state of emergency", which should link to state of emergency instead. --199.71.174.100 (talk) 00:24, 4 September 2008 (UTC)
Let's see the reaction for the release before posting. SpencerT♦C 23:58, 2 September 2008 (UTC)
If there is any record or market effect or whatever notable we can consider this, otherwise it's just another launch of a new product. --Tone 09:09, 3 September 2008 (UTC)

September 1


ITN Candidates for September 1

The article needs MAJOR cleanup before going up. SpencerT♦C 00:04, 2 September 2008 (UTC)
I'm confused about the headline. Maoists claim what? Maoist claims a Hindu leadsr was killed? Maoists take responsibility for the killing? What? Nil Einne (talk) 05:53, 2 September 2008 (UTC)
Yasuo Fukuda
Posting. Please, upload the photo. --Tone 17:22, 1 September 2008 (UTC)
Suggest reword to "Japanese Prime Minister Yasuo Fukuda resigns, less than a year after succeeding prime minister Shinzo Abe" the existing wording does not make it clear that Abe was the previous PM, or that his resignation was a year ago, not a recent event. Random89 20:25, 1 September 2008 (UTC)
Suggest removal of any mention of Shinzo Abe. Japanese PMs have been abruptly leaving office after a year or two for the past decade or so. It's the norm now. Mentioning just the previous one isn't really meaningful. --199.71.174.100 (talk) 20:31, 1 September 2008 (UTC)
Don't think that's accurate. Koizumi was there for over 5 years. Mori was only there for only a year it's true but he took over from someone who suffered a stroke about 3 months before an expected general election. It's hardly uncommon that a person acts as a temporary leader in such situations. Keizō Obuchi suffered a stroke so he's irrelevant. Ryūtarō Hashimoto was there for nearly two and a half years. Not a long time, but not extremely short either. Nil Einne (talk) 06:02, 2 September 2008 (UTC)
Well, before Hashimoto, Sōsuke Uno, Toshiki Kaifu, Kiichi Miyazawa, Morihiro Hosokawa, Tsutomu Hata and Tomiichi Murayama all quit after less than two years in office. Hashimoto was there for two and a half years, but he indeed resigned. I wouldn't count Obuchi, either, but Mori after him wasn't a caretaker PM, and he indeed resigned, too. I consider Koizumi an anomaly, after which Abe and Fukuda kept the trend going again. As you can see, the trend actually started more than a decade ago. I under-estimated the length of time. --199.71.174.100 (talk) 23:00, 3 September 2008 (UTC)