Wikipedia:WikiProject Ice Hockey/Peer Review

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Peer review[edit]

WikiProject Ice Hockey articles that are in peer review.

They are still submitted at Wikipedia:Peer review, but placing them here is likely to ensure a greater and more detailed response from knowledgable editors.

Instructions[edit]

Follow the instructions at Wikipedia:Peer review, then edit this page here, pasting {{Wikipedia:Peer review/ARTICLE NAME}} at the top of the list of nominees.

Articles[edit]

List of Detroit Red Wings general managers[edit]

This peer review discussion has been closed.
I've listed this article for peer review because I would like to take the page to Featured List status and am seeking input from the community on how to get it there.

Regards and thanks, Rejectwater (talk) 03:03, 30 September 2013 (UTC)

  • I don't see any glaring issues. Which isn't to say there aren't any, but I don't see them. Good job. Anthony (talk) 16:52, 4 October 2013 (UTC)
  • Thank you for your kind words and for taking the time to look it over. Rejectwater (talk) 13:19, 5 October 2013 (UTC)

Quick comments

  • "11 men have" -> "Eleven men...
  • Link franchise appropriately.
  • "The first was Art Duncan for the 1926–27 season; Duncan also served " -> he also served... (no need to repeat his name)
  • Consider placing refs at the end of the sentence, it looks nicer.
  • "Adams served as coach" -> He served...
  • General Managers or General managers?

The Rambling Man (talk) 18:40, 8 October 2013 (UTC)

  • All done. Thank you once again for the excellent input. Rejectwater (talk) 23:44, 8 October 2013 (UTC)

List of Olympic men's ice hockey players for the United States[edit]

This peer review discussion has been closed.
I've listed this article for peer review because it is heavily based off two hockey FLs, List of Olympic men's ice hockey players for Canada and List of Men's World Ice Hockey Championship players for Canada (1977–present). Looking for any constructive criticism before I submit it to FLC.

Thanks, Anthony (talk) 14:24, 17 July 2013 (UTC)

Comments from Rejectwater

  • Problems with notes:
Note 8 has unknown parameter error
Note 20, 21, 25, 26, 29 are all dead links.
Note 18 and 22 are the same.
The Podnieks & Szemberg ref links don't seem to work the same as the USA Hockey 2010 link.
Note 24, 31, 32, 33, and 35-41 are all notes without a source.
  • Might it work better overall to combine notes and references into a single reference list? I'm not seeing, for instance, how Wallechinsky is used in the text. It isn't linked anywhere. Having a unified refs section would address at least a few of the problems listed above as well. Or maybe keep the notes and references as two sections, but only use notes for things like 35-41, with each note having a numbered reference using the reflist template? I just find how it is now to be confusing. Most of the notes are references, and most of the references are not referencing anything specific, at least not that I can tell.
  • LA84 Foundation external link is dead.
  • Redlinks- all these players are notable, just without Wiki articles yet?
  • Based on experience, I can guarantee this won't pass FLC unless it complies with MOS:DTT. Caption texts, scope=col, scope=row all pop out at me. I am not an expert in this by any means, however, so please don't consider that to be an exhaustive list. I know it goes for all the tables, however, including the key tables.
  • Alt text. Every single image has to have an alt text. See WP:ALT.

Rejectwater (talk) 20:31, 20 July 2013 (UTC)

List of Detroit Red Wings seasons[edit]

This peer review discussion has been closed.
I've listed this article for peer review because I want eventually to submit it as a Featured List Candidate and would like input from the community as to how to get it up to that standard. My concerns are as follows:

  • MOS:DTT, specifically the use of column headers in the middle of the table. "Do not place column headers in the middle of a table to visually separate the table."
  • There may be other requirements of MOS:DTT that the page in it's current form does not meet.
  • How to handle the cells from the 2004–05 season, cancelled by lockout. I prefer to use the mdash to signify "does not apply" in all cells and state "No playoffs due to lockout" in the playoff results cell, exactly the way it was done until very recently at List of New Jersey Devils seasons, List of New York Islanders seasons, List of Tampa Bay Lightning seasons, and List of New York Rangers seasons, to name a few (all are Featured Lists and were the templates I used to shape this list into it's current form). As it is now it is essentially a column header in the middle of the table, which once again I see as a violation of MOS:DTT.
  • The lead. I wrote the lead and don't consider writing leads to be my strong suit. Is it up to snuff?
  • Anything and everything you can think of.

Thanks, Rejectwater (talk) 19:42, 5 June 2013 (UTC)

Comments from Cirt
  1. Overall, both sourcing and table formulation and general structure looks very very good.
  2. See also - any chance there are additional relevant links that could be added here? Perhaps 3 or 4 or so?
  3. Notes - this sect would look better without the spaces between each individual entry.
  4. Portals - good use of {{Portal bar}}, however, could use some more portals, perhaps location ones, like Portal:Michigan, Portal:Metro Detroit, and Portal:United States.
  5. Further reading - sect missing. Perhaps consider adding a Further reading sect, with three or four books or journal articles of relevance to suggest to the reader.
  6. That's about all I can think of because it looks so good already.

Cirt (talk) 17:49, 10 June 2013 (UTC)

Responses from Rejectwater
  1. Thank you.
  2. I can't think of any. The relevant links besides that one are all included in the page or in the "NHL seasons by team" template at the bottom of the page. In fact, given that template includes a link to List of NHL seasons it could be argued the See Also section as used here is redundant.
  3. Done.
  4. Done.
  5. I will have to think on this one. The only thing that comes to mind is the league's annual NHL Official Guide & Record Book. Not exactly light reading for the average Joe.
  6. Thanks again.
—Regards, Rejectwater (talk) 11:14, 11 June 2013 (UTC)
2. I have deleted the "See Also" section as redundant. List of NHL seasons was already linked twice elsewhere on the page. At this time I don't believe there is other relevant content to link to that isn't already linked in the table, in the text, in the references, in the templates, etc.
5. I don't see this happening. All the sources, etc, are listed in the references section, with exception of the NHL Official Guide & Record Book which I will add as a reference. I cannot think of anything applicable to this topic filling out a "further reading" section.
—Regards, Rejectwater (talk) 11:50, 15 June 2013 (UTC)
Thanks very much for the responsiveness to my comments, above. Comments resolved and stricken. Cheers, — Cirt (talk) 15:28, 15 June 2013 (UTC)
Thanks again. Regards, Rejectwater (talk) 16:45, 15 June 2013 (UTC)

Comments - as Cirt said, it's looking very good already.

  • You "easter egg" link some season articles but not others. It's a little odd for me.
  • " The 2012–13 season is the 86th season of play for the Detroit franchise, and since their founding the Red Wings have won 2,735 regular season games..." season repeated three times in quick succession.
  • " a two games total goals series" somewhat odd phrasing for me.
  • "dating from 1967 until 1983" don't think you need "dating"
  • " at all in this time" during this time?
  • In the totals, I'm surprised you don't use commas for numbers larger than 999 as you have in the lead?

The Rambling Man (talk) 13:25, 15 June 2013 (UTC)

Responses from Rejectwater
  • I believe I have standardized all my easter eggs.
  • Modified the sentence.
  • "Two legged tie" is even weirder in my opinion, but I have changed the sentence in a way I hope makes it less so.
  • Removed.
  • Changed as recommended.
  • Good catch. Fixed.
Thank you for your kind words, your input, and for taking the time. Regards, Rejectwater (talk) 16:45, 15 June 2013 (UTC)
Comments from Shudde

I was asked to help out with this peer review. Have a few comments:

  • First thing that strikes me is that both images are of the team with George Bush – considering they have been around since 1926 could one of those be replaced with something a little bit different?
  • I found something. I would love to have old, old stuff, like a team picture from the first season. "Never stop looking". I'll have to make an image map for this one. Rejectwater (talk) 14:20, 16 June 2013 (UTC)
  • "Founded in 1926 as the Detroit Cougars, they were known as the Detroit Falcons from 1930 until 1932, finally changing their name to the Red Wings" – this doesn't read particularly well.
  • the 2012–13 season is still going, but it's over for the Red Wings, would it be better to changes the tense from present to past?
  • " in the Stanley Cup playoffs 61 times, and have won 11 Stanley Cup titles" maybe remove first Stanley Cup, avoids close repetition
  • Should the captions have a fullstop at the end?
  • I consider the captions as being grammatically complete sentences. Rejectwater (talk) 14:20, 16 June 2013 (UTC)
  • I'm not so sure about the alt-text descriptions: "A group of young to middle-aged men stand around an older man holding a red ice hockey jersey bearing the word "BUSH" and the number "41""
  • "winning the Stanley Cup in seven of those opportunities" -> "winning the Cup seven times" ?
  • I was trying not to use the word "times" too many times. Rejectwater (talk) 14:20, 16 June 2013 (UTC)
  • "Their last trip to the Finals in this era came in 1966 when they lost in six games to the Montreal Canadiens" -> "Their last Finals appearance of this era came in 1966 when they lost in six games to the Montreal Canadiens" ?
  • "playoffs only twice in 17 years" is "in 17 years" necessary immediately after specifying the time period?
  • "2012–13 NHL season is linked twice in the lead
  • " losing in the first round three games to one to the St. Louis Blues" not sure this reads well
  • "However, in both 1997 and 1998 they made it back to the Finals, themselves winning in four games to none sweeps, first over the Philadelphia Flyers and then against the Washington Capitals." not sure about this sentence either
  • "Their most recent championships have come in 2002 and 2008 with their most recent Finals appearance in 2009 where they lost to the Pittsburgh Penguins." maybe try something like "Their most recent championships were in 2002 and 2008, and their most recent Finals appearance a loss to the Pittsburgh Penguins in 2009."
  • Does clicking on the notes not do anything for other readers? Or is this just my browser?
  • The notes should provide a tooltip pop-up when you hover over them and should also take you down to the appropriate note if you click. Rejectwater (talk) 14:20, 16 June 2013 (UTC)
  • I'm not sure about some of the notes: "Before the 1967–68 season, the NHL split into East and West Divisions because of the addition of six expansion teams." – could this be ambiguous? Do you mean "Immediately before the 1967–68 season"?
  • Is it me, is this confusing? MOS:YEAR says "A closing CE or AD year is normally written with two digits (1881–86) unless it is in a different century from that of the opening year, in which case the full closing year is given (1881–1986)." — but technically centuries run from say 2001 to 2100. In this case, we would say "1999–00 NHL season" and "2000–2001 NHL season"? Should this section of the MoS be clarified? If you ask me, "1999–00 NHL season" reads better, and there is no chance of confusion (no one will think the season runs until 2100).

That is all I've got. Feel free to ignore any you don't agree with, but hopefully the comments are helpful. - Shudde talk 05:34, 16 June 2013 (UTC)

List of Detroit Red Wings draft picks[edit]

Previous peer review

This peer review discussion has been closed.
I've listed this article for peer review because I would like to nominate it for Featured List status. Please review the article and provide input as to how it can become good enough to be a Featured List. I would like to believe the article is complete and ready for FL but I am sure others will find issues to address.

Thank you, Rejectwater (talk) 19:21, 11 May 2013 (UTC)

Comments by Cirt
  1. Per WP:LEAD, the lede intro sect is not supposed to introduce its own sourced info, but rather have no citations and be a summary of the rest of the sourced page. Perhaps fix this by adding a Background sect, and moving the cites from the lede intro sect there?
    1. The lead has been separated out into a lead and a History section. All sources are in the History section. Both the lead and History require expansion. Rejectwater (talk) 11:49, 16 May 2013 (UTC)
    2. Done. Perhaps some feedback on the quality of the lead and the History section? Rejectwater (talk) 15:52, 19 May 2013 (UTC)
    3. After having reviewed this further I am not sure it is absolutely necessary to do this. See, for instance, List of Atlanta Thrashers draft picks. Also, WP:LEAD does not require that the lead be unsourced: "it should ideally contain no more than four paragraphs and be carefully sourced as appropriate." Rejectwater (talk) 16:57, 19 May 2013 (UTC)
  2. There are a total of twenty-one (21) images used on the page. That will presumably require an image review to make sure all the images check out alright.
    1. I am not familiar with the process of image review. Rejectwater (talk) 11:39, 15 May 2013 (UTC)
    2. I will go ahead and call the images done as all but one have been deleted by another user due to their getting in the way of the table. Agreed. Rejectwater (talk) 10:35, 19 May 2013 (UTC)
  3. Table. There is a huge table with no inline cites. Not clear to the reader where that information is sourced to? Appears to fail WP:V, at least at present time? Usually with these lists there is a column for "Notes" or "References" with an inline cite to confirm info. All six (6) cites are in the lede intro sect, which is a bit of a problem, both per WP:LEAD and per WP:V for the information in the table.
    1. I will address the Lead in responses to comment one, and the References in responses to comment five. Rejectwater (talk) 11:39, 15 May 2013 (UTC)
    2. Table is done.Rejectwater (talk) 13:36, 18 May 2013 (UTC)
    3. Table is now more done as it has no empty cells. Rejectwater (talk) 11:12, 19 May 2013 (UTC)
  4. Portals. Consider adding portals to the bottom of the page, using {{Portal bar}} ?
    1. Done. Rejectwater (talk) 11:39, 15 May 2013 (UTC)
  5. References. General. Perhaps if we could see more clearly which references are confirming what info in the table, that would be more helpful for the reader. Maybe adding them as part of the legend at the top, with set initials, and a column denoting which one was used?
    1. This has been partially addressed, although still at the bottom. A new column will need to be added for goaltenders with statistics as each will require an inline citation. Rejectwater (talk) 11:39, 15 May 2013 (UTC)
    2. The format for this is complete. I found that all players with NHL experience will need inline cites to verify the information in the table that goes beyond what is found in the general references such as "Played entire career with Red Wings", etc. Dionne and Yzerman are extra special and have been fully sourced, a few others are sourced, it's just a matter of adding the links for the rest. Rejectwater (talk) 11:00, 16 May 2013 (UTC)
    3. Done. Rejectwater (talk) 13:36, 18 May 2013 (UTC)
  6. Formatting. I really like the uniformity and standardization of the formatting throughout, including the tabular design.
    1. Thank you. Rejectwater (talk) 11:39, 15 May 2013 (UTC)

Overall, nice work so far. Thank you for your efforts in this quality improvement project, — Cirt (talk) 06:09, 14 May 2013 (UTC)

  • Thank you, Cirt, for your kind words and your input. I will be looking into your suggestions shortly. Rejectwater (talk) 10:28, 14 May 2013 (UTC)
Okay, sounds great, keep us posted here. Good luck with the quality improvement project, — Cirt (talk) 16:45, 14 May 2013 (UTC)


Old reviews[edit]

Roger Crozier, Los Angeles Kings, Phil Kessel, Centrum Arena (Prestwick), South Carolina Stingrays, Shea Weber, List of Olympic men's ice hockey players for Switzerland, Ron Hextall, Bobby Orr, Markus Naslund, List of Members of the IHHOF, Howie Morenz, Pavel Bure, Collen Howe, Luc Bourdon, British ice hockey league champions, Calgary Tigers, Joe Sakic, Gilbert Perreault, Nottingham Panthers, History of the National Hockey League (1942–1967), 2007–08 Pittsburgh Penguins season, Ottawa Senators (original)