Wikipedia talk:Revert only when necessary
|Threads older than 2 years may be archived by.|
Preventing degradation through entropy
I am concerned by the new section Preventing degradation through entropy, added by User:Boundlessly. It includes the quote "Don't make the edit in the first place unless it's necessary" in support of its position, but offers no link, only referring to this Talk page, which doesn't seem helpful for those who seek to understand the logic of the guideline. Most importantly, however, it seems to directly contradict the spirit of WP by discouraging contribution. It runs counter to Wikipedia:Be bold, Wikipedia:Wikipedia is a work in progress, and Wikipedia:Ownership of articles. I would further note the irony in Boundlessly having reverted an edit on this project page, Wikipedia:Revert only when necessary, and accomanying it with the comment "The link is intentional by an older wiser previous editor." This seems to betray a presumptuous superiority, which again seems counter to the ethos necessary for a vital WP. ENeville (talk) 02:19, 17 October 2012 (UTC)
This essay does not seem to conform to its title. The title states what sounds to me like good advice: revert only when necessary. But the body of the essay never actually gives that advice. I think it ought to, and in somewhat more detail than the title. The current lead makes it an article about how editors tend to avoid edit wars. The current body then strays from that to advise against edit warring and to give reasons one might avoid reverting.
My observation is mostly one about the need for a better lead and better organization, but there's a substantial issue as well: is reverting only to be avoided in the context of an edit war, or should one avoid the very first revert, giving deference to another editor who has taken the time to make an affirmative edit? Is it OK to revert an edit one finds unnecessary, even if one doesn't find it harmful?
I'd be happy to take a run at making the essay have a clear point, but I wonder whether that point should be 1) revert only when necessary; 2) don't create an edit war; or 3) here are some ideas on the use of reversion in Wikipedia. The current article seems to straddle these three.
- OK, I did it. There's a lot more work to do than I thought to make all the essays on reverting consistent and readable, but I hope at least to make this the center of advice on when reversion are and are not appropriate.
- I plan to keep working on the reversion essays, a section or two at a time.
Difference between Zero-revert rule and Don't re-revert
What is the distinction intended to be? Is it specifically the lack of an exception for "obvious vandalism" in the latter? (Existing discussions on this talk page weren't of much help.) --SoledadKabocha (talk) 23:13, 26 January 2014 (UTC)
- The distinction is that the zero revert rule applies to all reversions whereas "don't re-revert" applies only to re-reversions. Example: The Israel article says the capital is Jerusalem. John edits it to say Tel Aviv. Mary considers changing it back to Jerusalem, which would be a reversion. 0RR says Mary should not do that without discussing it first. Don't re-revert doesn't apply because John's edit is not a reversion. But let's assume Mary is not following 0RR, so she goes ahead and changes it back to Jerusalem, thus reverting John's edit. John now is faced with the decision of whether to change it to Tel Aviv again. Such an edit would be a re-revert, so both 0RR and "don't re-revert" are relevant. John would refrain if he is following either of the two policies.
- Probably the reason vandalism isn't mentioned in "don't re-revert" is that it would be next to impossible for a reversion to be obvious vandalism. Hmm, I suppose a vandal might revert someone's reversion of obvious vandalism, and that reversion would be obvious vandalism. Maybe that should be covered, but maybe it's just common sense and shouldn't muddy up an essay.
- Bryan Henderson (giraffedata) (talk) 04:03, 27 January 2014 (UTC)
- If you made an effort and still didn't get the point, the essay has to take some of the blame.
- I don't know exactly where the text lost you, but I guessed and made a small change to the section that will possibly make the point less missable in the future. I classified the 3 rules by total number of reversions: 0 (zero-revert rule), 1 (don't re-revert) and 2 (one-revert rule). Bryan Henderson (giraffedata) (talk) 16:50, 29 January 2014 (UTC)