# Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Council

(Redirected from Wikipedia talk:WikiProject)
WikiProject Council
This page relates to the WikiProject Council, a collaborative effort regarding WikiProjects in general. If you would like to participate, please visit the project discussion page.
Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ) edit What's a WikiProject? A WikiProject is a group of people who want to work together. It is not a subject area, a collection of pages, or a list of articles tagged by the group. How many WikiProjects are there? Nobody knows, because groups of people may start working without creating pages or may stop working without notifying anyone. As of 2014, about 2,200 were participating in article assessments for the Version 1.0 Editorial Team. There is a manually maintained list of WikiProjects at Wikipedia:WikiProject Council/Directory. What's the biggest WikiProject? Nobody knows, because not all participants add their names to a membership list, and membership lists are almost always out of date. You can find out which projects' main pages are being watched by the most users at Wikipedia:Database reports/WikiProject watchers. Which WikiProject has tagged the most articles as being within their scope? WikiProject Biography has tagged about 1.2 million articles, making it more than three times the size of the second largest WikiProject. About ten groups have tagged more than 100,000 articles. You can see a list of projects and the number of articles they have assessed here. Which WikiProject's pages get changed the most? See Wikipedia:Database reports/WikiProjects by changes. These changes may have been made by anyone, not just by participants in the WikiProject. Who gets to decide whether a WikiProject is permitted to tag an article? That is the exclusive right of the participants of the WikiProject. Editors at an article may neither force the group to tag an article nor refuse to permit them to tag an article. See WP:PROJGUIDE#OWN. I think a couple of WikiProjects should be merged. Is that okay? You must ask the people who belong to those groups, even if the groups appear to be inactive. It's okay for different groups of people to be working on similar articles. WikiProjects are people, not lists of articles. If you identify and explain clear, practical benefits of a merger to all of the affected groups, they are likely to agree to combining into a larger group. However, if they object, then you may not merge the pages. For less-active groups, you may need to wait a month or more to make sure that no one objects.

## Joining wikiprojects

How do you join wikiprojects? Do you just add the userbox to your user page, or is it more complicated than that? Also how do I fix the formatting of this text? UserJDalek 23:57, 16 July 2014 (UTC)

1. Just show up and start working. You may add a userbox if you want. You may add your name to the list of participants if you want (most WikiProjects have one somewhere; they're usually seriously out of date). The important thing is to read the WikiProject's talk page and work with the other people there to improve articles. Tell them what you're doing, and ask them what they're doing. If it's quiet, then try to WP:REVIVE it.
2. Don't put any spaces at the start of the line. I've fixed it for you. WhatamIdoing (talk) 00:05, 17 July 2014 (UTC)
The location of the signup sheet varies between WikiProjects, sometimes it's not obvious. For example, the main page of WikiProject Doctor Who begins with a "Welcome!" box; in that you will find the text "If you would like to help, please inquire on the talk page, sign up on our list of participants, or just start editing." The second link there takes you to a page containing three lists and some instructions. One of those instructions reads "If you're interested in joining the project, please add your name to the list of participants." and the link in that takes you to the actual list. It may be edited: just put your login ID in alphabetical order, observing the existing pattern, like this. --Redrose64 (talk) 00:21, 17 July 2014 (UTC)

## FAQ

What is a wiki pedia? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 182.64.76.174 (talk) 15:19, 1 August 2014 (UTC)

A Wikipedia is an encyclopedia written using wiki software. You might want to ask questions like this at the WP:Reference desk. WhatamIdoing (talk) 16:30, 1 August 2014 (UTC)

## Article assessment screening

Anyone who assesses articles very often knows how often the assessments get out of date, and how tedious it is to re-check them manually.

Nettrom and Aaron Halfaker have analyzed all 9,000+ plus of the WP:MED stubs and found about 750 that they figured had at least a 50% chance of not being a stub. The list has been posted at m:Research:Ideas/Screening WikiProject Medicine articles for quality/Prediction table. The next step is to manually re-screen the pages on the list, to see how accurate their algorithm is. If anyone's interested, please feel free to have a look. WhatamIdoing (talk) 18:02, 7 August 2014 (UTC)

## {{COTWs}}

has been nominated for deletion; this template interlinks wikiproject collaboration areas -- 65.94.169.222 (talk) 07:12, 11 August 2014 (UTC)

## How to deal with disruption of a project?

Even before working up infrustructure and deciding on priorities, Wikiproject Countering systemic bias/Gender gap task force already is having problem with disruption via some individuals. They have wikihounded women to the task force (causing two to quit already, leaving long disgruntled posts), imposing unwanted agendas through constant argumentation, and made repeated accusatory and nasty comments on anything they disagree with. One past and probably future poster already admitted elsewhere he wanted the task force gone.

At this point those actually interested in an effective project have been a bit reluctant to quickly remove/hat/close/archive disruptive comments/threads, though I think that will change. There already has been a warning that Men's Right's community sanctions could be invoked should individuals have a definitive history on men's rights-related articles. Some problems, should they continue, also may be dealt with via the sexology arbitration. But other issues are not yet covered by any general sanctions and aren't always dealt with well at ANI, though that may have to be the next step. (I assume WP:Dispute resolution noticeboard would not deal with them.)

Are there any other steps well-meaning members of the project can take to deal with chronic disruption? Thanks for your help. Carolmooredc (Talkie-Talkie) 14:49, 11 August 2014 (UTC)

I'm sorry. There really aren't any specific procedures to deal with this. Serious disruption of WikiProjects has historically been rare, although it can be extremely harmful when it happens. You can pursue IBANs and TBANs for individuals, but getting bans approved can be politically challenging. WhatamIdoing (talk) 16:26, 11 August 2014 (UTC)
TBANs or page bans probably the best request at ANI; always helps to have a specific request!
(Also, for the record, to avoid nitpicking from my "followers", the phrase "(causing two to quit already, etc...)" should have been at the end of the list, not after first example.)
Now, one editor did seem to think we could "appoint" one or two individuals as moderators to do the archiving and now that I think of it this was done for a couple years at a less controversial Wikiproject. So I guess that is a possibility if one has sufficient support from the members who have not been disruptive. But I guess that's something that can be done after current disruptions dealt with. Carolmooredc (Talkie-Talkie) 19:39, 11 August 2014 (UTC)

### WP:ANI on “disruption of Wikiproject”

Per discussion above, Here is an ANI posting regarding problems at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Countering systemic bias/Gender gap task force. Carolmooredc (Talkie-Talkie) 19:06, 4 September 2014 (UTC)

## Project-level admins and dispute assistance

I'm just a bit curious. Is it heard of to have admins listing their names in wikiprojects officially as a way of saying that they're "on call" for issues affecting articles in the project? Beyond this, is it heard of for projects to have lists of members who pledge to help with disputes that come up with articles in the project? Thanks for any thoughts. Stevie is the man! TalkWork 17:25, 12 August 2014 (UTC)

Wikiprojects are simply collaborations, what authority they can leverage comes from being a sort of "voting bloc" rather than any sanctioned role in the administration of Wikipedia. There aren't project administrators in a sense other than there being subject-interested editors who also have general admin rights, and there aren't project-specific mediators. That said, if you are trying to find a court of first resort for a content dispute, an affiliated project is often the best choice if the talk page isn't working. --erachima talk 22:28, 16 August 2014 (UTC)
At larger projects, it's not unusual to see people post requests for minor admin assistance (moves over redirects, semi-protection for vandalism) rather than taking it to the general boards. It's not significantly different from posting a request on an individual admin's talk page. WhatamIdoing (talk) 00:17, 17 August 2014 (UTC)
(replying to both) Thanks for your responses. I'm not suggesting that a wikiproject is anything more than a collaboration. Having started one in 2006, and pretty much administering it most of the time (essentially due to lack of anyone else indicating interest in such), I understand its limits. I was thinking of something rather basic, like admins who are also editors interested in the project's subject area would simply note somehow that they are admins, so people can more easily contact admins who are more interested or familiar with the articles included in the project. These would not be official admins for the project -- they wouldn't be asked to do the project's bidding, but just be "on call" for admin requests related to the project. In the case of the project I work on, I would ask above the list for members to indicate if they are admins or not (e.g., "Please note if you are an admin by bolding your username -- in doing so, you may be contacted for assistance with project-included pages.").
As for project-specific mediators, is there any policy/guideline against having people list themselves as those interested in helping with disputes in project-included pages? I realize that in some cases, editors will go to the project talk page to ask for various kinds of help, and that's fine. But also, in some cases, there's a dispute on the article's talk page, and what they want/need is someone to play neutral and advise the disputants as they work through their dispute. I was just thinking of possibly having members who list themselves as those interested in helping with these matters. Stevie is the man! TalkWork 11:00, 17 August 2014 (UTC)
...wow. Has the rules creep really gotten THAT bad, that people feel the need to ask if there's a rule against volunteering to be helpful? --erachima talk 11:34, 17 August 2014 (UTC)
Yes, it's okay for people to volunteer to help. It would be best if the volunteers remembered that they had zero extra authority and zero official status. WhatamIdoing (talk) 16:18, 21 August 2014 (UTC)
Thanks. Lack of official status is totally understood. And erachima, yes, there are so many rules now that it's overwhelming and I didn't want to take any steps that would be seen as crossing a line. Stevie is the man! TalkWork 17:13, 23 August 2014 (UTC)

## help out

I'm new but am interested in getting in on one of these projects. Does anyone know of a good place to read? Want to understand what I'm doing before diving in. Thanks!Jordanrolsen (talk) 23:20, 12 August 2014 (UTC)

Hello. A WikiProject is a group of editors who work together and edit a peticular theme. For example I am a member of Wikiproject videogames and we edit and discuss articles related to videogames. You don't need to apply to join a WikiProject you can just join. If you want to read more about Wikiprojects Wikipedia:WikiProject Council/Guide will probably be worth reading. --BarsofGold (talk) 03:55, 13 August 2014 (UTC)

## revive a project

I try to revive the inactive project WP:ECONOMICS, but I can't because some administrators that have never participated in the project take all sorts of offenses. Don't remove your project banner from my site, don't clean up the project page etc. What can I do so they just leave me alone? Recreate the project under a new name? NotYetAnotherEconomist (talk) 20:05, 16 August 2014 (UTC)

The key thing is you need to realize that you do not own the project, or the articles, and people all accross the encyclopedia expect certain things of Wikiprojects. The question of project scope, what page belongs there, etc... is typically understood as "articles related to, or with some tangible connection to, the scope" as well as "pages that would be of interest to typical readers of that subject". Scopes tend to be broad, rather than narrow. The question never is "Is this topic economics?" but rather "Is this related to economics in some tangible way?".
For instance, Ernest Rutherford was not a chemist, yet he is tagged with WikiProject Chemistry's banner because a lot of his research dealt with elements, and chemists will have valuable input on this.
Likewise, Warren Buffet may not be an economist proper, but his sphere of influence overlaps with several topics in macroeconomy, market analysis, etc. If Warren Buffet is to become a Featured Article in the future, having the input of someone who knows something about economy will be most beneficial, if not required. That alone warrants the {{WP Economics}} tag. 00:18, 17 August 2014 (UTC)
I think the key thing is for the handful of admins who also don't own that project, or even pretend to participate in it, to leave it up to the (so far) two people are long-standing participants. The recent discussions have involved >50% people who aren't participants, and deciding things like whether the WikiProject's main page really needs to have a banner at the top that announces what the article for collaboration was in 2008(!) is a pretty much a members-only issue. WhatamIdoing (talk) 00:33, 17 August 2014 (UTC)
Concerning that issue, for sure that's definitely no one else's business. But here NYAE's was also talking about the removal of banners from the talk pages of articles (which affects articles like The Economist, and I'm very much interested in the proper maintenance of articles related to periodicals and other publications, i.e. if a discussion pops up on that article, I want WP Economics to be notified of it via WP:AALERTS or similar). The ownership issue I raised because language like "What can I do so they just leave me alone?" is extremely worrisome, as is the associated attitude. 01:06, 17 August 2014 (UTC)
Do you aspire to become the deputy sheriff? NotYetAnotherEconomist (talk) 01:10, 17 August 2014 (UTC)
Headbomb, I'm sympathetic to your concern, but the fact is that if WikiProject Economics (a group of editors that does not include either you or me, right?) does not want that article to appear in their AALERTS page, then it is their right (NB: not NYAE's right) to remove the banner. It's up to them. What we need is a discussion between the two old participants and the one new one about what the three of them want. I suspect that the two old hands (and any others who might turn up) are fully capable of handling that discussion without half a dozen outsiders like us telling them which articles we think that group should care about. WhatamIdoing (talk) 07:14, 17 August 2014 (UTC)
As I said elsewhere, I don't care about some banners on some talk pages. The main issue are completely unrelated administrators that don't have anything to do with the project and only obstruct my efforts to make the project more active. For example the long-standing participants replied only because I asked them to support the project on their talk page. If the administrators would at least be constructive, give arguments or help in any freakin way I really wouldn't mind. The only thing they do is revert my edits and threaten me. NotYetAnotherEconomist (talk) 00:54, 17 August 2014 (UTC)
With all respect, NYAE, the way you get people involved with a WikiProject is generally not by getting in fights with people over organizational minutia. --erachima talk 01:13, 17 August 2014 (UTC)
I agree that is why I want them to leave me alone. NotYetAnotherEconomist (talk) 01:14, 17 August 2014 (UTC)
You're not listening. Take a break, make yourself a cup of tea, play cards with friends, and come back when you're calmer. 01:21, 17 August 2014 (UTC)
If you want to be left alone, you have no business trying to take a management role in a WikiProject. It is literally the defining trait of WikiProjects that you are trying to solicit the help and opinions of other editors. Not just the ones you agree with either. --erachima talk 01:22, 17 August 2014 (UTC)
I'm one of those administrators. I didn't threaten to block. I started new sections on the project's talk page discussing the scope of the project and the need for consensus. NotYetAnotherEconomist is calling editors who disagree with him "wikilawyers", saying "Oh wow. Now the third musketeer arrives, being sarcasatic (" I am surprised how much psychological pain a removal of a project banner in the talk page has on some people. I sincerely hope your pain will vanish with time". It's great he wants to help, it's not great that he attacks other editors. Projects are collaborative enterprises and acting this way can obviously damage that collaboration. Dougweller (talk) 06:26, 17 August 2014 (UTC)
Joining a project one day then proceeding to make changes to its structure without any consensus the next is, on a common sense level, disruptive and demonstrating poor etiquette. Also, joining a project for the sake of trying to win an argument about project inclusion is indeed wikilawyering, or what I'd rather called game-playing. Last, the disrespect shown to people with far greater experience is disconcerting. If I were new (and especially new to a project), I would try to figure out the ropes before swinging on them like Tarzan. Stevie is the man! TalkWork 10:08, 17 August 2014 (UTC)
There were no changes to the structure and I didn't show disrespect to anyone. Also the constant arguments of seniority don't have any value, with your far greater experience you should know better. NotYetAnotherEconomist (talk) 13:11, 17 August 2014 (UTC)

## Inclusion proposal for indie dance charts (Goa, Progressive, Psy etc)

There is currently a proposal for the inclusion of the major digital music distributors, in regards to very specific music charts, which are not yet covered by Wikipedia. Input and the discussion can be found here. prokaryotes (talk) 23:42, 17 August 2014 (UTC)

## WP:DISCOGSTYLE dormant

Hi there, I am member of the Discography WikiProject and while I edit discography projects I always turn to this, however it has became dormant. I beliebe this should not by any means be dormant and should be an active guideline, discographies should be similar so as they are easily recognised from article to article. Can someone help me make this active again and also help me make it more of a guideline or standard for other discography pages? I have no idea how to make it active again and since hardly anyone patrols/watches this page I got no response there. SilentDan (talk) 20:36, 28 August 2014 (UTC)

## Merge proposal for WikiProject Latinos and WikiProject Mexican-American

Last month, Mercurywoodrose and I discussed on the possibility of merging WikiProjects Latinos and Mexican-Americans with WikiProject United States and turning the Mexican-American project into a task force for the Latinos project. This been brought on all three WikiProjects last month and there has been no discussion since then. Erick (talk) 11:07, 2 September 2014 (UTC)

If it helps the process, i am also open to having WP:LATINOS become a task force of WPUSA, either along with, or as a "parent" task force of the [[Mexican-Americans|Mexican-American task force]]. there seems to be some precedent for having a task force within a task force. I will note that we have an active and useful portal now, Portal:Hispanic and Latino Americans, which can be supported by both of these projects.Mercurywoodrose (talk) 13:04, 2 September 2014 (UTC)
If you have given people a good chance to object (weeks and weeks, maybe multiple announcements), and you've gotten no response or no objections, then you may proceed to merge with a clear conscience. Merges can always be reverted if necessary (it's happened at least once, and it was very unpleasant), but it's usually okay if there's been a clear effort to get feedback over time.
I see that this idea was first floated at the small projects back in April, so that's good. I see one current note at WPUS from two weeks ago. If there were no other announcements at WPUS, then you might make one more effort to make sure that the parent project won't object, just to be on the safe side. For practical help, see Wikipedia:WikiProject Medicine/Task forces's checklist. WhatamIdoing (talk) 15:24, 2 September 2014 (UTC)

## Draft-class

I have started a discussion on possibly making Draft-class one of the default assessment classes used by WikiProjects. Any comments welcome at Wikipedia:Village pump (proposals)#Widen usage of Draft-class. Thank you — Martin (MSGJ · talk) 13:31, 3 September 2014 (UTC)

## How to help new editors

I know that some of you deal with new users, and I thought that you might like to look at the ideas posted here: Sixty ways to help new editors. It has a lot of ideas, and it would be easy for anyone to find one or two things to try out for a while. If your WikiProject wants to increase the number of good-faith editors working in your area, then trying to support and collaborate with new, good-faith editors is one of the most effective things that you can do. WhatamIdoing (talk) 22:14, 7 September 2014 (UTC)

## National and other archives

Can I suggest that there is drive to improve 'articles on national and other archives' - too many are not present, or are one sentence (with no links to the relevant websites/other sources).

I am looking after/developing the Wikia archives wiki [1] - which can be made use of if appropriate. Jackiespeel (talk) 15:24, 9 September 2014 (UTC)

Jackiespeel It is a major problem that Wikipedia is unable to cover archives and libraries very well. One reason for this is that libraries and archives often are not themselves covered well in any publications that Wikipedia can cite as a reference. If you have big ideas to share information about lots of archives then that could be a community project here and something very aligned with what we all want to do. I might suggest that if you have a good idea, post it to meta:Grants:IdeaLab so that others can try to match your needs with work that has already been done. Blue Rasberry (talk) 16:55, 16 September 2014 (UTC)

## Focused Random Feature

Hello, I just wanted to suggest a feature. I have no idea of this is the right place, but it's the closest I could find. The Random Article funciton on wiki is very alluring, but it's always leading to people and places. It would be neat if there were a feature that allowed you include/exclude categories when loading a random wiki article. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 129.97.89.57 (talk) 15:50, 16 September 2014 (UTC)

That is a good idea. Lots of people ask for better tours of Wikipedia's content.
The biggest problem we have is lack of people to make ideas like this happen. If you know how to do this or know any software developers, consider going to meta:Grants:IdeaLab, proposing the idea, and asking for funds to make it happen. This seems like the kind of project that could be funded. I would like to see a feature in which WikiProjects could queue what they are doing and ask for people to check it. Blue Rasberry (talk) 16:55, 16 September 2014 (UTC)

## Moving a WikiProject

In this discussion, I basically have the idea of moving WP:WikiProject Emo, which is inactive, to WP:WikiProject Post-hardcore (possibly as a child project of WP:WikiProject Punk music). This is for a couple of reasons:

• this would expand the scope of the WikiProject, encouraging more users to contribute
• there is a significant amount of music that falls under the label of post-hardcore or related genres (like emo) that is understandably ignored by WP:WikiProject Punk music, but there is still some overlap
• this will make it clear that WikiProject Post-hardcore is an umbrella covering several related, underserved genres of punk- and alternative rock-derived music; notable acts that would fall under this category (to demonstrate the range of this WikiProject):
• I have to re-emphasize this point: WikiProject Punk music (and WP:WikiProject Alternative music and WP:WikiProject Metal) doesn't (and shouldn't) prioritize many of the above acts

Hopefully this justifies the creation of a broader WikiProject that is also distinct from WikiProjects for punk and alternative rock music. It seems like I'm getting some ok consensus both on Wikipedia discussion and meat space discussion.

My questions and concerns: What are the steps I need to take to do this? Is this similar to merging two WikiProjects? What is the easiest way to move all subpages of WikiProject Emo to the new WikiProject's namespace?

$|$ ozhu (talk·contribs) 01:54, 18 September 2014 (UTC)

To change a project's scope (and/or its name), you just need to have a discussion with the participants of the WikiProject. Post a note, see if anyone objects, and then change your scope (and/or WP:MOVE the page) to whatever people prefer. The scope (and, if related, the name) of a WikiProject is entirely up to the participants in the project. You don't need any sort of support or permission from anyone outside it to support whatever articles the group wants.
You might find some ideas for how to help re-energize the group at WP:REVIVE. If you can get an enthusiastic partner to help, (maybe User:Natt the Hatt would be interested?), then so much the better. People like to join and post at projects if they see other people already talking there. WhatamIdoing (talk) 04:45, 18 September 2014 (UTC)