Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Novels

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GA review[edit]

The Sword of Shannara, an article that you or your project may be interested in, has been nominated for a community good article reassessment. If you are interested in the discussion, please participate by adding your comments to the reassessment page. If concerns are not addressed during the review period, the good article status may be removed from the article. — Preceding unsigned comment added by N2e (talkcontribs) 20:25, 3 February 2014‎ (UTC)

Organize a Light Novel task force?[edit]

Hi. I'm wondering if its possible to organize yet another task force or a WikiProject to improve Wikipedia's coverage of topics related to light novels, as I did with WP:GHIBLI. The task force will be a descendant of WP:ANIME and WP:NOVEL and WP:JAPAN. I've started it in my sandbox. Thoughts or objections? Lord Sjones23 (talk - contributions) 04:31, 11 December 2014 (UTC)

As a follow-up, I've already started the project here. If anyone wants to help with the project, please do so. Thanks, Lord Sjones23 (talk - contributions) 05:38, 17 December 2014 (UTC)

Novel and other keyword articles[edit]

Hours ago one anonymous visitor remarked at length concerning 'novel' and 'romance'; novel as content genre and as form genre; etc (my crude summary). See Talk:Novel#Inconsistency in use of term "genre".

I replied at length but in general regarding terms such as 'children's writer' and many others as well as 'novel' that appear routinely, and commonly linked, in the lead sections and infoboxes of writer and book articles. In closing, I asked:

"For instance, should this page [ novel ] include a section, or a lead observation, or nothing at all that describes or explains how EN.Wikipedia --especially its WikiProject WP:NOVELS, i suppose in this case-- uses the terms novel and novelist in descriptions and labels?
"Let me extend these remarks to WP:CATegories, the subcats of Category:Novels in this case. If articles are cat under {Novels} in a broad sense, should this page somehow feature that broad sense?"

--P64 (talk) 18:19, 7 January 2015 (UTC)

I didn't fully understand the original criticism, but Is the root problem here a confusion between the term romance as defined, say by Walter Scott, or more recently by Margaret Anne Doody,[1] and a recent genre fiction usage for a "love story" (see lede: Romance, as defined here, should not be confused with the genre fiction love romance or romance novel. Other European languages do not distinguish between romance and novel: "a novel is le roman, der Roman, il romanzo."[2]). See also my comments on the Novel Talk page, re the problem with this article.Rwood128 (talk) 17:52, 8 January 2015 (UTC)

Perhaps we aren't really discussing two distinct types of romance and that the only real difference between say Wuthering Heights and a genre fiction romance is that WH is better written and has better developed characters.

Also maybe the Wuthering Heights type of romance needs to be better defined as a sub-genre of the novel, from which the different kinds of genre fiction romance have subsequently evolved --and not just the love romance. At the moment romance, as defined by Scott and Doody, may be treated in the Novel article too much as a parallel genre and this has led to the confusion voiced recently? I'd suggest that while a romance is always also a novel, a novel isn't always a romance. Rwood128 (talk) 21:14, 8 January 2015 (UTC)

  1. ^ "The True Story of the Novel", The True Story of the Novel. New Brunswick, NJ: Rutgers University Press, 1996, rept. 1997)
  2. ^ Doody (1996), p. 15.

WikiProject X is live![edit]

WikiProject X icon.svg

Hello everyone!

You may have received a message from me earlier asking you to comment on my WikiProject X proposal. The good news is that WikiProject X is now live! In our first phase, we are focusing on research. At this time, we are looking for people to share their experiences with WikiProjects: good, bad, or neutral. We are also looking for WikiProjects that may be interested in trying out new tools and layouts that will make participating easier and projects easier to maintain. If you or your WikiProject are interested, check us out! Note that this is an opt-in program; no WikiProject will be required to change anything against its wishes. Please let me know if you have any questions. Thank you!

Note: To receive additional notifications about WikiProject X on this talk page, please add this page to Wikipedia:WikiProject X/Newsletter. Otherwise, this will be the last notification sent about WikiProject X.

Harej (talk) 16:57, 14 January 2015 (UTC)

Category definition[edit]

The instructions for Category:Child characters in literature (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs) state "As with real children, the term refers to characters who are understood to be biologically and/or chronologically under age 21 during the course of a film in which they are depicted." The age of 20 is far beyond the age of childhood for science and numerous religions. The sourced info in our article child states "is generally a human between the stages of birth and puberty" and the sourced info in the puberty article gives the ages of 10-11 for girls and 11-12 for boys. I propose that we change the wording in the instructions to give the age of 12 as the cutoff for this category. Now if we want to use 13 or even 14 to error on the side of caution that would be okay but IMO this cat should not be in articles where the young characters are older than 14. Any and all input on this will be appreciated. When a consensus is reached we should add the new instructions to the cat page and to any appropriate MOS's. I am cross posting this at the books project as well. If there is a better place to centralize this discussion let me know and I will move it there. MarnetteD|Talk 20:15, 26 January 2015 (UTC)

True, but. One follow-up question and some observations:
  1. Do you suggest a new category Teen characters in literature or Young adult characters in literature?
  2. Almost all of our Child writers were teens/YA when they wrote their published works. Right?
  3. Our Children's writers are defined comprehensively, with Writers of young adult literature a subset. Same for Children's magazines. Same for Series of children's books. Children's non-fiction books is simply comprehensive --without any teen/YA subset. Offhand I suppose that is generally true under Children's fiction books where the category tree is too big to examine now. At Children's literary awards we imply that Young adult literature awards are distinct, but too many awards are comprehensive or multiple regarding audience ages.
--P64 (talk) 21:29, 12 March 2015 (UTC)
Thanks for the reply. The reason I brought it here was due to child cats being added to A Clockwork Orange related articles. I was referring to fictional characters so some of your points go beyond that situation. Here is a link to the discussion at the film project about this Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Film/Archive 55#Child category definition. Of course this project is not obligated to follow anything that was decided there. I do like the "child" "teen" separation. I would avoid "young adult" as that is such a subjective term but that is just me. If there is reliable sourcing for it in an article then I guess it might be part of the mix. I guess this is just a "get the conversation started" kind of thing. Anything that this project decides will be fine with me. MarnetteD|Talk 22:02, 12 March 2015 (UTC)
I realize that this is splayed out over several projects P64. Please feel free to move this to wherever you feel is best for centralizing things. Thanks again for picking up on this. MarnetteD|Talk 22:07, 12 March 2015 (UTC)
Everyone: I posted notice of MarnetteD's double-post to a third project at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Children's literature#Children are pre-teens, right? and notice of both that action and my reply here at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Books#Category definition (where the same six weeks have passed with no reply). In the latter location I added that WP Children's lit may be the best place in principle, but not in practice because that project is nearly dead. --P64 (talk) 22:54, 12 March 2015 (UTC)
I'm not in favour of having a separate teen category. There is already a recognized problem with characters maturing to adulthood during the book or book series; having to sort out exactly how old a young character is and whether he or she is more "child" or more "teen" on the whole – it would just be silly. Child characters in literature isn't even a very big category. I don't like the wording as it is, though. It should be simpler, even if it means people interpret it variably. Robina Fox (talk) 06:19, 20 March 2015 (UTC)

New Wikipedia Library Donations[edit]

Hello all, there are two recent donations available through The Wikipedia Library that are relevant to this project: WP:Women Writers Online and WP:Project MUSE. Please sign up for the accounts if you think you can use them. Enjoy! Nikkimaria (talk) 04:15, 7 March 2015 (UTC)