Wikipedia talk:WikiProject South Africa

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WikiProject South Africa (Rated Project-class)
WikiProject icon This page is within the scope of WikiProject South Africa, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of South Africa on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.
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Wikipedia in local news[edit]

Afrikaner identity politics[edit]

I have moved a draft from my sandbox to Draft-space, I don't have enough time to do the topic justice by myself. Please feel free to help write Draft:Afrikaner identity politics. -- Roger (Dodger67) (talk) 13:34, 21 February 2014 (UTC)

Anybody? Please... Roger (Dodger67) (talk) 17:58, 20 March 2014 (UTC)
I would love to but have no knowledge of the subject Gbawden (talk) 11:51, 21 March 2014 (UTC)

Upcoming general election[edit]

Should we start getting various ducks in a row for the election? There is always a large pile of work to do after the results are reported but I'm wondering if we could start getting some "scaffolding" in place so that adding the data later is easier. Perhaps Wikidata can be used to semi-automate the process? Roger (Dodger67) (talk) 09:32, 17 March 2014 (UTC)

The List of political parties in South Africa could do with an update, some of the parties have dissolved and other new ones have been established. Roger (Dodger67) (talk) 09:56, 17 March 2014 (UTC)
I was wondering if there was a way to put templates in all the articles that require party data such as seats in parliament. Then the template could be updated instead of each article individually. Nathan121212 (talk) 14:43, 13 April 2014 (UTC)
If anyone here knows how to program bots, perhaps they could create on that replaces outdated election data with the latest stats entered in a central location. Nathan121212 (talk) 15:01, 13 April 2014 (UTC)
Feel free to ping me if you would like election seat diagrams: I wrote a web-based tool to do the layouts, so you can do it yourself, but I'm also happy to run it. --Slashme (talk) 09:08, 28 April 2014 (UTC)

Template for political parties' number of seats in parliament.[edit]

{{User:Nathan121212/Template:Parties with seats in the South African parliament|ANC}} shows: 264

{{User:Nathan121212/Template:Parties with seats in the South African parliament|FF(plus)}} shows: 4

{{User:Nathan121212/Template:Parties with seats in the South African parliament|DA}} shows: 67

They can be used to replace the numbers in the various articles that mention them. Then we can just update the numbers at the main template. If anyone thinks it's a good idea, you can move it into the main template space. Nathan121212 (talk) 17:41, 16 April 2014 (UTC)

As this is generally something that only changes once every five years, is a system of templates actually necessary? - htonl (talk) 18:32, 16 April 2014 (UTC)

You're right, ignore these. Nathan121212 (talk) 12:17, 19 April 2014 (UTC)

Archiving web sources[edit]

It's something I recently started doing and encourage all Wikipedians to do to. Linkrot is affecting many South African articles and many articles in general, please make it a habit to use [1] or The Wayback Machine to ensure there is always a copy of your reference available. Thanks Nathan121212 (talk) 12:20, 19 April 2014 (UTC)

I agree although it is time consuming. I have been trying to do it for important sources, especially for Business Day which is one of our most reliable sources for politics and only allows limited page views per 30 day period which I use up fast. HelenOnline 08:08, 2 May 2014 (UTC)

Expansion request[edit]

It would be great if anybody could expand the stub of Freedom Day (South Africa). Its going to get a lot of views when it appears on the front page on Sunday. Nathan121212 (talk) 12:25, 25 April 2014 (UTC)

Ok, leave it for now, we'll work on it in my namespace at User:Nathan121212/Freedom_Day and I'll move it into the mainspace next year so it can appear on the front page. Any help on this would be appreciated. Nathan121212 (talk) 16:00, 3 May 2014 (UTC)

National honours[edit]

Do we list each year's national honours recipients somewhere? Source -- Roger (Dodger67) (talk) 08:35, 28 April 2014 (UTC)

Congratulations to Wikimedia Mexico![edit]

Some of you will probably know that Cape Town bid to host Wikimania in 2015. It was a close-run thing, but in the end Mexico City was successful. We definitely plan to bid again next year. --Slashme (talk) 09:14, 28 April 2014 (UTC)

Close one, it appears CT was one of the three remaining candidates. Can you please post a link to the page where the announcement was made. Thanks Nathan121212 (talk) 18:24, 28 April 2014 (UTC)
Here is a relevant mailing list posting. Not sure where else it was announced. --Slashme (talk) 13:21, 29 April 2014 (UTC)

Nkandlagate article needs work[edit]

I've split the article Nkandla (homestead) from the article about the town (Nkandla, KwaZulu-Natal), since they're two separate things. I'm busy sorting out all the links that need disambiguation, but in the meantime the homestead article really needs a lot of work to bring it up to date with all the developments of the last few months, if anyone's interested in doing that. - htonl (talk) 11:29, 28 April 2014 (UTC)

I have made a few drive by changes, primarily due to overlap with the South African general election, 2014 which is where my priorities lie at the moment. I don't have time to adopt it per se at the moment. HelenOnline 11:48, 1 May 2014 (UTC)

WikiProject animated ad[edit]

I though WikiProject SA could do with one of these. I made this gif image and used this Wikipedia:Wikipedia ads to link it to our page. This code: {{Wikipedia ads|ad=249}}

Generates this:

Nathan121212 (talk) 18:00, 28 April 2014 (UTC)

Support: it's certainly visible, and I think it would help. --Slashme (talk) 15:57, 29 April 2014 (UTC)

Can I add a link to this on the WikiProject South Africa template page (along with the userboxxes etc.)?Nathan121212 (talk) 09:00, 4 May 2014 (UTC)

I don't see why not. I appreciate your effort but personally find it too bright and distracting, and it might actually be problematic for epileptics. I hope you take that as constructive criticism. :) HelenOnline 09:46, 4 May 2014 (UTC)
Thanks Helen. I understand.Nathan121212 (talk) 17:04, 4 May 2014 (UTC)

Sources in Wikipedia talk:Articles for creation/Skylight (band)[edit]

I'd appreciate a second opinion on Wikipedia talk:Articles for creation/Skylight (band) -- sources look ok to me for establishing notability. Are they decent sources from the POV of somebody who knows South Africa's media? Thanks! Jodi.a.schneider (talk) 14:10, 2 May 2014 (UTC)

Yes I would say so. HelenOnline 14:27, 2 May 2014 (UTC)
Yes, among the cites are two mainstream national newspapers and a music television channel. Roger (Dodger67) (talk) 15:55, 2 May 2014 (UTC)
Thanks Roger and Helen! It's now in mainspace: Skylight (band). Jodi.a.schneider (talk) 21:32, 11 May 2014 (UTC)

Horse racing[edit]

South African horses have been making quite a splash on the international circuit recently, but are under-represented on WP. I would like to correct this. Does SA racing have a good, reliable source for results, the equivalent of the Racing Post in Europe or Equibase in North America? Tigerboy1966  12:38, 4 May 2014 (UTC)

I have asked a friend who works in the industry, will let you know. HelenOnline 13:00, 4 May 2014 (UTC)
The National Horseracing Authority is the legally mandated regulatory body - their website seems to contain a lot of information. I also found the Sporting Post which claims to be the only horseracing newspaper in the country. Most of the mainstream press also regularly publish results and reports. Roger (Dodger67) (talk) 13:53, 4 May 2014 (UTC)
My friend says Independent Newspapers or Computaform (not a newspaper per se), but I'm not sure if any of that is online (not for free anyway). HelenOnline 16:02, 4 May 2014 (UTC)
Thanks for the suggestions. I will see what I can do. Tigerboy1966  22:28, 12 May 2014 (UTC)

Edit warring at Afrikaner[edit]

Please take a look at the edits over the last few days - it looks rather lame and pointless to me. Roger (Dodger67) (talk) 13:41, 4 May 2014 (UTC)

Chris Hani / Janusz Waluś merge[edit]

Hi. In May 2013 it was proposed to merge the Janusz Waluś article into the Chris Hani article. Can anyone who has opinion on this join the discussion on the Talk page of Walus? Thanks Gbawden (talk) 09:01, 9 May 2014 (UTC)

Consensus needed at ITN[edit]

An ITN nomination regarding the election has been posted by User:htonl, please help to reach a consensus here Nathan121212 (talk) 15:32, 11 May 2014 (UTC)

Should a Paseka Motsoeneng articles be created[edit]

Paseka Motsoeneng does anyone think an article should be created as he seems like a pretty noteworthy person in South Africa. Dwanyewest (talk) 23:54, 11 May 2014 (UTC)

I have just removed a large unsourced hagiographic block of text from the article, per WP:BLP. Roger (Dodger67) (talk) 15:46, 26 May 2014 (UTC)

AfC submission - 12/05[edit]

Wikipedia talk:Articles for creation/Olivia Forsyth. FoCuSandLeArN (talk) 02:02, 13 May 2014 (UTC)


Tons of South African articles need to be assessed at Category:Unassessed South Africa articles. Any assistance here will be appreciated. Nathan121212 (talk) 12:03, 24 May 2014 (UTC)

New Cabinet[edit]

Provided a link to the new cabinet for updating SA Government pages - - Conlinp (talk) 04:28, 26 May 2014 (UTC)

Wikipedia in the news: May 2014[edit]

eNCA noted that clicking on the SA elections Google Doodle took users to a Wikipedia "collaboration" on the elections. Nathan121212 (talk) 14:37, 26 May 2014 (UTC)

Did anyone click on it? Did it go to South African general election, 2014? HelenOnline 15:31, 26 May 2014 (UTC)
@HelenOnline, Htonl, Dodger67:, I'm thinking of trying to get South African general election, 2014 to GA status. Do you think there is enough material to work with? Any assistance would be appreciated. Nathan121212 (talk) 16:32, 4 June 2014 (UTC)
Count me in, but only from next week, my workload is a bit full until then. Roger (Dodger67) (talk) 16:43, 4 June 2014 (UTC)
@Dodger67: I've created all the sections that articles in Category:GA-Class Elections and Referendums articles have. We can work on expanding them as soon as you have time. Thanks for your decision to help. Nathan121212 (talk) 10:22, 7 June 2014 (UTC)


I have raised a question at Talk:Roggeveld about which province the Roggeveld is in. Nurg (talk) 22:54, 30 May 2014 (UTC)

Nowhere near the Eastern Cape. The Roggeveld (plateau) is in the Northern Cape, north of the Tankwa National Park towards Calvinia. The boundary between the Western Cape and the Northern Cape runs through the Roggeveld mountains. Roger (Dodger67) (talk) 16:55, 4 June 2014 (UTC)

Wiki Loves Pride 2014[edit]

You are invited to participate in Wiki Loves Pride 2014, a campaign to create and improve LGBT-related content at Wikipedia and its sister projects. The campaign will take place throughout the month of June, culminating with a multinational edit-a-thon on June 21. Meetups are being held in some cities, or you can participate remotely. All constructive edits are welcome in order to contribute to Wikipedia's mission of providing quality, accurate information. Articles within Category:LGBT in Africa may be of particular interest. You can also upload LGBT-related images by participating in Wikimedia Commons' LGBT-related photo challenge. You are encouraged to share the results of your work here. Happy editing! --Another Believer (Talk) 02:06, 5 June 2014 (UTC)

I am coordinating the June and July photo challenges so you would be helping a WPSA member too! Face-smile.svg HelenOnline 08:19, 6 June 2014 (UTC)

FYI I created Wikipedia:Meetup/South Africa/Wiki Loves Pride 2014 and have started uploading some images I took this month there. Please feel free to contribute. Face-smile.svg HelenOnline 18:02, 23 June 2014 (UTC)

FYI the SA results have been added to Wikipedia:Meetup/South Africa/Wiki Loves Pride 2014. HelenOnline 10:18, 1 July 2014 (UTC)

National Key Points Act, 1980[edit]

I was told to stop taking photographs of a railway station by security guards, which led to me expanding this article from a stub (in case anyone was wondering). There is a section on Nkandla (homestead) which may be useful elsewhere, but specifically with reference to the act. HelenOnline 09:48, 10 June 2014 (UTC)

POV balancing at Boerehaat (hatred of Boers)[edit]

This draft at AFC looked very interesting, and a glance at GoogleBooks shows the term Boerehaat has been used since at least the 1970s, and the concept is "a thing" (whether accurately applied or no). So on those grounds I approved it for publication, but I have concerns that the article may muddle the issues of genuine xenophobia to the Boer, versus legitimate socio-political critique of Boer society. Further, the article broadly describes anti-Boer opinions, but needs to stick more closely to specifically that which is labeled Boerehaat. Can someone take a squint and see how we can best ensure Neutrality on this new article? MatthewVanitas (talk) 16:01, 11 June 2014 (UTC)

Yes, and any other issues considered. Let us know if and when it'd be ready for acceptance. Cheers, FoCuSandLeArN (talk) 17:20, 11 June 2014 (UTC)
In order to hate something, there must be a reason. The article will need to discuss the origin of this "hate". I don't believe it does that at the moment. Conlinp (talk) 03:34, 13 June 2014 (UTC)
I removed a lot of unsourced original research and wikified it somewhat. I will try find some reliable sources to flesh it out. My impression is that it is primarily the sort of propaganda promoted by right-wing Afrikaner nationalists such as those in the Front Nasionaal political party. I previously came across quite a bit of unsourced material on Wikipedia promoting an imaginary contemporary English-Afrikaans antagonism, which to my horror foreign journalists were repeating without question, and have cleaned some of it up. White-black antagonism is more complex in practice, but in my opinon it does not justify the alleged Afrikaner persecution painted in some places such as this article. HelenOnline 12:20, 13 June 2014 (UTC)
In my opinion (unless I can find a source for it), the term is used as a form of race cardism. HelenOnline 12:28, 13 June 2014 (UTC)
I have addressed the issues to the best of my ability. I would prefer if someone else removed the tags (if they are satisfied that the issues have been addressed). HelenOnline 08:52, 15 June 2014 (UTC)
I went ahead and removed the tags myself. If anyone objects, please let me know. HelenOnline 08:01, 19 June 2014 (UTC)

Leaflet For Wikiproject South Africa At Wikimania 2014[edit]

Hi all,

My name is Adi Khajuria and I am helping out with Wikimania 2014 in London.

One of our initiatives is to create leaflets to increase the discoverability of various wikimedia projects, and showcase the breadth of activity within wikimedia. Any kind of project can have a physical paper leaflet designed - for free - as a tool to help recruit new contributors. These leaflets will be printed at Wikimania 2014, and the designs can be re-used in the future at other events and locations.

This is particularly aimed at highlighting less discoverable but successful projects, e.g:

• Active Wikiprojects: Wikiproject Medicine, WikiProject Video Games, Wikiproject Film

• Tech projects/Tools, which may be looking for either users or developers.

• Less known major projects: Wikinews, Wikidata, Wikivoyage, etc.

• Wiki Loves Parliaments, Wiki Loves Monuments, Wiki Loves ____

• Wikimedia thematic organisations, Wikiwomen’s Collaborative, The Signpost

For more information or to sign up for one for your project, go to:
Project leaflets
Adikhajuria (talk) 17:29, 12 June 2014 (UTC)

  • Note I have put in a booklet request on behalf of the WikiProject. If anybody has any objections, please post them here. The request can be seen at Project leaflets. There are still some details to fill in and any help would be appreciated. Nathan121212 (talk) 09:09, 15 June 2014 (UTC)
Nathan121212, there appears to be a grammar error - should be notable South Africans, i.e. not plural. Should I make the change or will you? Thanks. --Elinor.Dashwood (talk) 10:26, 15 June 2014 (UTC)
I have made some edits, removing some information I believe is not applicable and warrants further discussion here. The Wikimedia ZA chapter promotes WPSA among other things, but it is not the same thing as WPSA. HelenOnline 11:16, 15 June 2014 (UTC)
The flag-map is already on Commons at commons:File:Flag-map_of_South_Africa.svg, but I don't think we can lay claim to it as our logo per se. It is already used more widely, so we would have to customise it or develop a completely new one. HelenOnline 12:52, 15 June 2014 (UTC)
Hi Adi, many appoligies for not helping out on my side. I told Ed I would try to help out with putting together these pamphlets but have just been taken over by Wiki Loves Monuments and edit-a-thon preparations instead.  :-( --Discott (talk) 17:35, 18 June 2014 (UTC)

Hatfield Christian Church[edit]

I happened on the Hatfield Christian Church page— by "Random article", I think— and shuddered. I did a good deal of editing, which I have summarized thus on the Talk page:

The page read like a publication of the church, full of "we" and "The Lord sent", plus Biblical quotations as section epigraphs: not at all like the neutral point of view that is expected in an encyclopedia and that Wikipedia requires. I've tried to apply that policy to this article.

Not being a member of this project, I have not ventured to remove the C-class template, but I mention this here so that someone in WPSA can review it. --Thnidu (talk) 04:24, 15 June 2014 (UTC)

Thank you for your efforts. Unfortunately our resources are very limited. HelenOnline 13:35, 15 June 2014 (UTC)
I have AFDed it as a Vanispamcruftisement - Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Hatfield Christian Church. -- Roger (Dodger67) (talk) 11:35, 22 June 2014 (UTC)

Majuba Day[edit]

I have AfD'd this article. Anyone care to comment? Gbawden (talk) 14:37, 15 June 2014 (UTC)


WikiProject RSA logo.svg

I don't think the free flag map image we use in our banner is a logo per se. I looked to see if there are any guidelines for Wikiproject logos. So far I found two interesting Signpost articles:

HelenOnline 07:38, 18 June 2014 (UTC)

I created an emergency WP:RSA logo for the Wikimania 2014 brochure. I won't be offended if anyone else can do better. The flag map was too difficult for me to resize. Face-smile.svg HelenOnline 15:45, 22 June 2014 (UTC)

Hi Helen, after processing through various online editors, I managed to resize flagmap. What do you think? Nathan121212 (talk) 19:22, 23 June 2014 (UTC)

I think it is fine thanks Nathan. Can you overwrite the one I uploaded so we don't have to change all the links? HelenOnline 20:14, 23 June 2014 (UTC)
I like it! Roger (Dodger67) (talk) 20:54, 23 June 2014 (UTC)
Face-smile.svg thanks guys, there seems to be problems with the transparency. It was transparent when I edited, will keep trying. Nathan121212 (talk) 12:38, 24 June 2014 (UTC)
Maybe User:Htonl could assist with transparency? Nathan121212 (talk) 12:54, 24 June 2014 (UTC)

I put in a request at Wikipedia Graphics Lab. Nathan121212 (talk) 14:45, 24 June 2014 (UTC)

Thanks Nathan, it looks great! HelenOnline 15:18, 24 June 2014 (UTC)

Need some help with a draft article[edit]

I started Draft:South African Defence Review 2012 a while ago but due to various meat-world and on-WP circumstances I have not had the time or energy to work on in much lately. The Defence Review has far-reaching consequences for SA, not only in defence policy but also for the country's economy, foreign relations and other socio-economic aspects, thus I believe it is a topic we should cover in significant depth. I have listed a few possible sources on the Talk page and the draft already has a fairly well developed structure in terms of proposed section headings. I realize there are not many defence specialists among ZA-pedians (off the top of my head I can think of User:Darren Olivier and User:Gbawden) but given the broader social, economic and political significance of the topic, I hope to get maybe two or three interested editors to join me in this draft writing effort. Roger (Dodger67) (talk) 11:23, 22 June 2014 (UTC)


I think that most people go onto wiki to find information and wouldn't it be great if you could find a page about your local school, especially really good schools like Edenvale High School. Tatedareader (talk) 13:03, 1 July 2014 (UTC)

It would be even better if we had more volunteers to write such articles. Face-smile.svg HelenOnline 13:14, 1 July 2014 (UTC)

Split of Category:Bantu people[edit]

Please bear with me while I split Category:Bantu people per Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2014 May 24#Category:Bantu people. If you have any concerns about my edits, please discuss with me rather than revert. It is a heck of a job and trying to figure it all out while someone else is reverting me without my knowledge, which happened to me on another Wiki site, is more than my brain can handle. Face-smile.svg HelenOnline 17:09, 4 July 2014 (UTC)

Yes check.svg Done Please talk to me if you have any queries about my edits in this regard. HelenOnline 12:21, 10 July 2014 (UTC)

Deletion requests[edit]

Can someone please weigh in on the deletion requests of South African Education and Environment Project and NeoGen: Kerk vir 'n Nuwe Generasie? Thanks Gbawden (talk) 13:15, 25 July 2014 (UTC)

Yair Shimansky[edit]

Can someone give me a second opinion before I reassess this article? This article is rated as a B but looks more like a stub/start to me. Gbawden (talk) 07:56, 28 July 2014 (UTC)

It was longer when it was assessed, but still too short and should have been assessed as a stub. HelenOnline 09:06, 28 July 2014 (UTC)
Thanks, thought so. Didn't want to tread on any toes Gbawden (talk) 09:18, 28 July 2014 (UTC)

Languages in censuses and Race and ethnicity in censuses[edit]

Pleas add information about this country to this articles--Kaiyr (talk) 13:03, 28 July 2014 (UTC)