Talk:Main Page

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Administrators: Clear all reports

Errors in the summary of the featured article

Please do not remove this invisible timestamp. See WT:ERRORS and WP:SUBSCRIBE. - Dank (push to talk) 01:24, 29 September 2022 (UTC)

Errors with "In the news"

I pulled the Lebanon airstrikes item out, since it's been tagged for POV for more than 24 hours. A glance at the talk page suggests there's active discussion about multiple POV disputes. Firefangledfeathers (talk / contribs) 16:36, 26 September 2024 (UTC)

Errors in "Did you know ..."

Current DYK

• ... that Sophie Scamps decided to enter politics after a survey from her local member of Parliament failed to mention climate change?. In Australian English, "member of parliament" is all lowercase: in British usage, both Member and Parliament are capitalised. Would advise the former per WP:TIES. UndercoverClassicist ^T·C 11:11, 27 September 2024 (UTC)

Errors in the summary of the featured list

Friday's FL

(September 27, today)

Monday's FL

(September 30)

Errors in the summary of the featured picture

Notice to administrators: When fixing POTD errors, please update the corresponding regular version (i.e. without "protected" in the page title) in addition to the Main Page version linked below.

General discussion

2009 Nobel Peace Prize

Please add a link to 2009 Nobel Peace Prize to that section. — goethean ॐ 16:03, 9 October 2009 (UTC)

Its already there. wins links to 2009 Nobel Peace Prize. -- Ashish-g55 16:07, 9 October 2009 (UTC)

I changed that 8 minutes before you suggested it (based on a suggestion at WP:ERRORS). Master of Puppets - _{Call me MoP! :D} 16:14, 9 October 2009 (UTC)

2009 Presidents Cup

Hello, Admins of the Main Page, I think this needs to be included!98.240.44.215 (talk) 00:43, 12 October 2009 (UTC)

Where? Here? --candle•wicke 00:48, 12 October 2009 (UTC)

I agree this does need to be include because eight Presidents Cups have now been played, and the Internationals have won just once, along with the tie in 2003. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 174.101.113.162 (talk) 16:32, 15 October 2009 (UTC)

STEPHEN GATEY IS DEAD

put on front page

from betty —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.40.111.24 (talk) 07:38, 12 October 2009 (UTC)

For those unaware, the IP is talking about Stephen Gately, Boyzone singer, who died on Saturday. Dreaded Walrus ^{t c} 08:42, 12 October 2009 (UTC)

Take it to WP:ITN/C please.  GARDEN  08:44, 12 October 2009 (UTC)

Actually, don't; it has already been suggested and opposed vigorously due to his failing of the death criteria - that is, he wasn't a key figure in his field. A member of a very famous band but individually not all that important unfortunately. A great loss however.  GARDEN  08:47, 12 October 2009 (UTC)

Whoever he is, he's more important than the silly unimportant video game that is featured - Wikipedia is being drowned in trivia-fiction. 78.149.255.35 (talk) 22:18, 13 October 2009 (UTC)

Well he's not fictional!!! And he's been everywhere this past few days. Barack Obama is still there for flip sake. And some deal between Armenia and Turkey. And now there's another european battle. If nothing else is happening include him. Makes sense? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 140.203.12.240 (talk) 18:53, 14 October 2009 (UTC)

No, not really. Modest Genius ^talk 01:46, 15 October 2009 (UTC)

Smash Bros. "Logo"

I assume that god-awful excuse for a FA image isn't actually the logo for Super Smash Brothers, or else you wouldn't let it be on the Main Page. So I ask you why it is there at all? How is a MSPaint-generated (by the looks of it) image purporting to be the logo of the FA, but not actually the logo, on the Main Page? What an idotic attempt at skirting the fair use rule. Just get rid of that rule finally, for Christ's sake. --118.208.15.108 (talk) 06:41, 13 October 2009 (UTC)

Sorry but that simply isn't going to happen. That symbol is instantly recognisable as representative of the series and Wikipedia is copyright-aware and therefore will not be showing the actual logo on the main page any time soon.  GARDEN  09:10, 13 October 2009 (UTC)

If you see here, the symbol is pretty much an exact copy of a major symbol of the franchise (right proportions, etc...) Cheers! Scapler (talk) 10:29, 13 October 2009 (UTC)

I wasn't arguing w/ it being recognisable. By "not actually the logo" I meant, taken from an offical source as opposed to made from scratch. --118.208.15.108 (talk) 14:04, 13 October 2009 (UTC)

As I explained below, many of our logos are not simply taken from an 'official source' (whatever that means) because amongst they are often of poor quality and are generally unlikely to be SVG which is preferred when the logo is simple and accurately representable as this one Nil Einne (talk) 15:02, 13 October 2009 (UTC)

For clarification, quite a number of official logos are either made or extensively modified by our contributors since the available logos may be of poor quality, JPG files with artifacting, etc. Some may be made in MSPaint, but many are not. It is rather unlikely this example was made in MSPaint since it is an SVG file and Paint isn't a vector program not can it save to any vector format including SVG. Ultimately of course we don't care what program contributors use (although vector graphics are usually preferred). Quite a number of logos are available for use under free licenses and available on the Wikimedia commons because they are simple enough to be ineligible for copyright in the US which includes this example and other stuff which many people would recognise, e.g. File:Google.png or File:Colgate logo.svg or File:CD logo.png. (These examples are text and I couldn't find any other good non text example, that's probably because text logos are common & also the most likely & clearcut examples of being ineligible for copyright.) These logos will still be protected by trademark in many jurisdictions including the US but that's a different thing from being non free which policies and guidelines recognise Wikipedia:Manual of Style (trademarks)#Graphics logos, Wikipedia:Don't confuse Trademarks with Copyrights & Wikipedia:Logos. Note that is an image is protected by copyright, getting a wikipedian to reproduce it is unlikely to be of any use since it's likely to be a derived work and therefore not-free. Given this and the above, while there are examples where we use images many may regard as significantly inferior that we wouldn't have otherwise used, this doesn't seem to be a good example to me. P.S. The logo is visible in the background of the image Scapler is referring to for those who aren't seeing it, like me for a long while Nil Einne (talk) 13:25, 13 October 2009 (UTC)

"[If] an image is protected by copyright, getting a wikipedian to reproduce it is unlikely to be of any use since it's likely to be a derived work and therefore not-free." Exactly. So what is the point of reproducing the logo at all? Either you would use the real logo - which isn't allowed for all the reasons you cited - or you would use a differnt image altogether. --118.208.15.108 (talk) 14:04, 13 October 2009 (UTC)

As I stated, the image is not protected by copyright in the US. And as has been explained by others, this is the real logo. I didn't cite any reason why the real logo isn't allowed BTW. Nil Einne (talk) 14:57, 13 October 2009 (UTC)

I see what you were syaing now. As far as I could find on the web, I do not believe that Nintendo has ever published anything with this logo as a seperate image not superimposed over a background. Thus, an image from an official source would, at best, be less clear and obscurred and, at worst, no longer be public domain, because it would include other, less simple, aspects of a cover. Cheers! Scapler (talk) 15:29, 13 October 2009 (UTC)

As far as I can tell, there's no mention in the article summary of what this image is or what it has to do with the article's subject. The featured article itself doesn't even contain the image. All other issues of copyright aside, having a picture that, to an unfamiliar reader, has no apparent connection to the game and no explanation for its presence other than this talk page seems less desirable than having no image at all. -- 208.123.162.2 (talk) 20:28, 13 October 2009 (UTC)

I agree. Unless the image depicts the very topic of the FA, there really needs to be a (pictured) somewhere. And if there is no such place because whatever the image contains is not mentioned, that is a very clear indication that it is not a good choice of image./Coffeeshivers (talk) 21:10, 13 October 2009 (UTC)

This is a fairly common problem regardless of the topic or availability of free images. One of the issues is main articles don't really have a simple way to depict them and the small size of the thumbnails means they're usually not really that clear. For example, from looking at Wikipedia:Today's featured article/October 2009 with about half a months worth of FAs. Byzantine navy, Chinese classifier, Plymouth Colony, Ununoctium, War of the Fifth Coalition all lack "pictured" and it's likely to be clear to many readers unfamiliar with the topic precisely what is being pictured. However Chinese classifier and "War of the Fifth Coalition" are probably the only cases where it's likely the reader will significantly understand what is being pictured with the addition of a "pictured" or in the WotTC case with something like "painting depicting Napoléon at Wagram pictured". Perhaps "Ununoctium" as well but I'm not sure how many of our readers will understand what "radioactive decay pathway pictured" means. I suspect most of those who do will like me already have guessed it. Note in none of these cases are better NFCC images used in the article AFAIK. In other words this is a wide-ranging issue which is probably difficult to 'fix' and only in some instances has to do with disallowing NFCC images on the main page and if you want to change this, you need to raise it on the TFA talk page. Nil Einne (talk) 08:02, 14 October 2009 (UTC)

Why so many games?

Hi all... Just wondering why so many video games are featured in "Today's featured article"? They're starting to get obvious favoritism as a regular topic and that may not be fair to everyone involved in creating and reading Wikipedia. -Just one man's opinion...Paradise coyote (talk) 18:59, 13 October 2009 (UTC)

It's all about the quality of the article, not the subject matter. Cheers! Scapler (talk) 19:26, 13 October 2009 (UTC)

Plus, this month, only one video game was featured, and only two last month. That is out of an entire FA category. Cheers! Scapler (talk) 19:29, 13 October 2009 (UTC)

That is a disproportionate amount, when one considers the massive number of subjects we should and do cover. It just so happens that an awful lot of Wikipedians are gamers. J Milburn (talk) 21:36, 13 October 2009 (UTC)

I was going to say that a video game is not important enough to be the main article on the front page. Its just a video game - trivia! froth! nothing important! Will be forgotten in a few months! The problem with Wikipedia is that it is corrupted and spoilt by all the big volume of stuff from the fictional realm. I think Wikipedia ought to be split into two seperate halves - factWikipedia, and fictionWikipedia. 78.149.255.35 (talk) 22:15, 13 October 2009 (UTC)

Yeah, what kind of an encyclopedia would possibly cover literature? We need to get this Charles Dickens nonsense out of here. J Milburn (talk) 22:21, 13 October 2009 (UTC)

Just because video games are newer does not make then not notable. They are a unique form of cultural media, and can be compared to literature or film. Like it or not, they are a large part of modern culture, and influence the life of many people. As far as being forgotten in a few months, the Super Smash Bros. series has been around since, and is still remembered from, 1999. Cheers! Scapler (talk) 23:37, 13 October 2009 (UTC)

Sure they can be compared to film, but they can only be compared to literature of a highly collaborative nature, not literature in the sense of an individual composition.Paradise coyote (talk) 23:47, 13 October 2009 (UTC)

Good call, we should not allow any main page articles on anything of a collaborative nature. God forbid the Iliad ever make it to the main page. And if it did, it would probably be just from footnotes... Random89 05:06, 14 October 2009 (UTC)

I meant it, not in terms of method of production, but purely in terms of it being a media outlet that is a form of culture, and thus is now a notable part of history. Cheers! Scapler (talk) 00:08, 14 October 2009 (UTC)

The problem is Wikipedia uses the "featured article criteria" which are basically a measure of how many footnotes the article has, as a stand-in for its quality or importance. So any article with enough footnotes (including a few I won't name that are basically product advertisements) eventually gets to the front page. 66.127.53.204 (talk) 02:44, 14 October 2009 (UTC)

Guys, if you don't like the topic, pick an article in a topic that you find appropriate / interesting and hen work it up to FA quality. Start typing and stop complaining! --74.13.130.90 (talk) 04:21, 14 October 2009 (UTC)

Note that FA requires "brilliant prose", good writing, and good footnotes as well of course, because that is what makes an article RELIABLE, which is the most important part. As for importance, any attempt to declare what is most important would be the essence of original research. Cheers! Scapler (talk) 06:23, 14 October 2009 (UTC)

That part about importance is of course incorrect, as Wikipedia editorial processes can and do assess importance of article subjects just as they assess reliability of particular sources and in principle assess neutrality of articles (though they are often weakest at the last of those). See for example:

• Wikipedia:WikiProject_Biography/Assessment#Priority_scale
• Category:Chemistry articles by importance
• Wikipedia:Version_1.0_Editorial_Team/Release_Version_Criteria#Importance_of_topic
• Wikipedia:WikiProject Mathematics/Wikipedia 1.0/Importance
• Wikipedia:Vital articles
• etc.

The taint of original research is actually with the opposite view, i.e. that articles about video games or sitcom characters are of equal importance to the main topics of history, science, etc. Unfortunately, WP's larger scale (cross-subject) editing policies are built around exactly that original and bogus concept of equality, to the detriment of the actually important subjects. 66.127.53.204 (talk) 10:02, 14 October 2009 (UTC)

I agree. And many Wikipedia articles are spoilt by enormously long lists of fictional references - for example in an article about Something you get a few paragraphs regarding the facts about Something, and then pages and pages of lists detailing where Something has briefly appeared in movies, tv shows, video games, comics, and so on. I think Wikipedia ought to have a policy of in addition to having the standard something article, having a mandatory Something (in fiction) article where all the (to my mind) worthless fictional dross can be swept. 78.146.56.252 (talk) 15:00, 14 October 2009 (UTC)

All those importance assessments are solely for internal usage and prioritising efforts of those who choose to use them. I have remarked before in other places that you can be assured they will have major problems if anyone ever attempts to use them for other purposes like deciding what to place on the main page. We do consider some degree of importance for ITN and SA/OTD but only in a general way. I actually agree with you that there are a whole load of other articles more important then nearly all video game and sitcom character articles. However it's a moot point as we never claim that they are of equal importance. In fact, I'm not aware if even the most rabid of video game article supporters has ever claimed all video game articles are of equal importance to every other article. (Many may not agree with their assessment of the importance of video game articles but that's a different thing) Nil Einne (talk) 10:48, 14 October 2009 (UTC)

Plus, articles on video games and the like are useful in that we are most certainly (or at least in a very small minority) of encyclopedia that provide in-depth coverage of these topics. I cannot think of a more definitive reference for many games than here. But, as this argument is really not accomplishing anything, I shall leave for article building. Hazzah! Cheers! Scapler (talk) 11:56, 14 October 2009 (UTC)

You forget that few people actually searching for video game articles are doing anything close to scholarly research. No disrespect to pop culture articles (look at some of the rubbish I've written) but I'm not going to sit here and pretend there isn't an issue. J Milburn (talk) 12:16, 14 October 2009 (UTC)

Fabulous discussion. Thanks very much folks.Paradise coyote (talk) 15:25, 14 October 2009 (UTC)

thats all folks —Preceding unsigned comment added by 140.203.12.240 (talk) 18:55, 14 October 2009 (UTC)

Today's featured article (October 15)

Today's featured article violates both the first and the second rule of Fight Club. Lovelac7 05:51, 15 October 2009 (UTC)

Cleaver :) ♠ B.s.n. ♥R.N.contribs 08:03, 15 October 2009 (UTC)

WP:IAR. AlmostReadytoFly (talk) 12:41, 15 October 2009 (UTC)

Nudity in Wikipedia

dear madam (i refuse to speak to men in case they have no clothes either). there are naked men all over the wikipedia. this is an outrageous use of the word 'hole' and to work in 'treatment of buttocks', 'swimming naked' (more than one use) and 'boxers' means the wikipedia is going downhill very fast. a hidden link to skinny dipping is included as well which is a cheap and cynical way to encourage the disgusting removal of clothes by children who know no better. 'homoeroticism' is obviously pushing some sort of gay agenda or something what with all these pieces of genitalia flying around and buttocks wiggling across the screen but nobody thinks of children here anyway and i'm frightened they might grow up and think they are women or men or something. i will be urging my pupils to close the wikipedia today and pick up the bible instead. i've already wasted an entire week telling them to put down their computer games and films and now this monstrosity is put in a position before their eyes where they will obviously see it and develop a new addiction designed to annoy all good thinking people of this world. i will not be responsible for my actions when i leave the room if children start removing their clothes. i am fed up of the wikipedia's encouragement of this behaviour. i will not be renewing my wikipedia subscription as a result and am strongly considering learning spanish or french or german as i'm sure they don't have this filth on their wikipedias. i will never swim again now that i know men are carrying out this disgusting lewd act without covering their privates and looking at one anothers naked bits at the same time. yours sincerely, disgusted person in position of authority who has young children of their own. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.40.222.128 (talk) 00:37, 16 October 2009 (UTC)

The Wikimedia Foundation's vision statement is: "Imagine a world in which every single human being can freely share in the sum of all knowledge. That's our commitment."[1] While The Swimming Hole may deserve its Featured Article status, featuring it on the main page and including links to the articles on homoeroticism, depictions of nudity, etc. will undoubtedly counteract this vision. Let me explain. Wikipedia is not censored, which is good, but many readers of Wikipedia operate in censored environments, e.g. workplaces, schools, homes and even nations. Currently, most content filters block specific articles on Wikipedia. If the Main Page continues to feature near-pornographic content, however, it is likely that many users will find Wikipedia blocked altogether. At the very least, this will further lower Wikipedia's reputation.

If someone wants to read about "swimming naked" or "buttocks", they should be allowed to; Wikipedia is not censored. However, this type of content, which many readers may find offensive, should not be forced in front of anyone's face. Why should an elementary school student going to Wikipedia to look up Mahatma Ghandi's birthday be greeted by naked men and vocabulary such as "homoeroticism"? Just because Wikipedia is supposed to feature all human knowledge doesn't mean it should place in front of readers information that is offensive to them. After all, Wikipedia is written for its readers, not to achieve some abstract goal.

It is my opinion that overtly pornographic or "adult" Featured Articles should not be summarized on the Main Page. Thanks for reading my ramblings, if you got this far. 24.62.217.160 (talk) 02:55, 16 October 2009 (UTC)

Please see WP:NOTCENSORED. –Juliancolton | ^Talk 03:04, 16 October 2009 (UTC)

The Main Page is obviously censored (or whatever word you want to use to describe the lack of outright porn or vomit). I'm told that it's not a contradiction because of some (invalid, in my opinion) Wikilawyering about the definition of an article; in any case, the Main Page does have a line whether we have crossed it this time or not, and whether or not you call it censoring. WP:CENSORMAIN Art LaPella (talk) 03:34, 16 October 2009 (UTC)

This is not pornographical or adult at all. This describes a famous painting by a famous artist, Thomas Eakins, with comparisons to his other works. Depictions of nudity in art have been around since antiquity. This is art, not porn. This is not mass distributed to get people off. This is a work of art by one of the most influential American artists (sourced on the Eakins page). And for the "homoeroticism" part, its a literary term (see Homoeroticism). Does having this word on the main page mean we are promoting a gay agenda? No more than having "pathetic fallacy" would mean that we're trying to implement weather control. Its a literary and artistic term. --Patar knight - ^chat/_{contributions} 03:21, 16 October 2009 (UTC)

On a related note, who else eagerly awaits the day when a video game with homoerotic nudity is featured on the main page? Now that would make things interesting. Nufy8 (talk) 03:24, 16 October 2009 (UTC)

Folks, I'm pretty sure this guy is joking. Calm down. --Lokentaren (talk) 03:48, 16 October 2009 (UTC)