Talk:Blue Tail Fly

I would venture a guess on what "Jimmy crack corn" means. "Jim" as in Jim Crow law, as in a popular name for poor rural black in the 19th century. Corn as in white man, as in "white". "Crack" as in kill. Stbalbach 22:59, 13 September 2005 (UTC)[reply]

afaik, "Jim Crow Laws" didn't come about until after the Civil War, and the song is from the 1840's, so I doubt there would be any overt connection... Codex Sinaiticus 15:06, 14 September 2005 (UTC)[reply]

"Jim Crow" was a popular name for poor rural blacks in the 19th century, it didnt originate with the "Jim Crow law", other way around.Stbalbach 15:48, 14 September 2005 (UTC)[reply]

My speculation is that it alluded to both Jump Jim Crow and Old Corn Meal, possibly with a wordplay on one or more of the other interpretations. dsws 23:42, 8 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]

My speculation is that this is the story of a murder. The slave who has the task to "... follow after with a hickory broom. Pass the bottle when he gets dry and brush away the blue-tail fly." keeps his master feeling a bit loose with the booze, then flicks the horse, stinging him with the hickory broom. This results in:

"The horse he run, he jump, he pitch. He throws my master in a ditch. He died and the jury wondered why. The verdict was the blue-tail fly."

No evidence of the wrong doing, so the murder goes undiscovered and unpunished. I never noticed this as a kid singing the song but it now seems obvious. EverettH 00:38, 14 September 2005 (UTC)[reply]

An alternate explanation from The Straight Dope: [1]--BAW 00:41, 14 September 2005 (UTC)[reply]

The story I remember hearing was that the lyrics were originally "Gimme cracked corn", meaning that he didn't care about the bad food because he had freedom. I don't have a cite for this, so I'm mentioning it here. -- Samuel Wantman 05:51, 14 September 2005 (UTC)[reply]

I've always been told "cracking corn" means snoring. This might have been a bit of bowdlerization, but at least one site back this interpretation up. [2] -- 14:43, 14 September 2005 (UTC)

lyrics?

If the song is that old, it's definitely in the public domain. That being the case, there's really no point to this article unless it includes the lyrics (cf. Yankee Doodle, etc.). I was going to do so myself, but got bogged down trying to find the best variant to include — the one with the best mix of brevity, clarity, and antiquity. Is there somebody out there less obsessive than I? Doops | talk 03:19, 14 September 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Wikisource is a good place to find a lasting home for the various versions. Typically encyclopedias are not source documents, it makes sense if its very short, or sections are quoted with annotations. Thus the creation of Wikisource. Stbalbach 03:46, 14 September 2005 (UTC)[reply]

True, for great length or multiple versions. But a basic text — brief, clear, and authentic — is necessary so we know what the rest of the article is about. You have to know what something is before you can discuss it. Right now the article is very confusing, as it seems to assume that the reader knows the song. Doops | talk 03:52, 14 September 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Some of the versions are long. Should we present a version based only on its brevity? I had no trouble finding the sources in external links, it wasnt confusing. A Wikisource banner at the head of the article would be even better and more in line with best practices. Stbalbach 04:04, 14 September 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Yeah, antiquity is more important than brevity. I guess just one stanza would do, just to give the reader a flavor. I added one, using the Emmet example from the links — making a few typographical formatting decisions but not regularizing the spelling. Doops | talk 05:24, 14 September 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Isn't there a second refrain that goes "Shoo fly, don't bother me" in place of "Jimmy crack corn, and I don't care"...? In fact, when I was about 5-7 years old, I think I knew the name of the song as "Shoo fly, don't bother me"...! Codex Sinaiticus 13:55, 14 September 2005 (UTC)[reply]

I kind of thought that that was a different song. --BDD 18:10, 14 September 2005 (UTC)[reply]

That is an entirely different song. -- Jmabel | Talk 18:46, 14 September 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Actually, a lot of people learned it as a medley. I think Pete Seeger was one of the sources for this. We certainly sang "Shoo Fly" as a sort of bridge to the song when I was in elementary school. --Dhartung | Talk 21:02, 14 September 2005 (UTC)[reply]

The article definitely needs enough of the lyrics to demonstrate the alleged subtext rather than simply asserting it. Cdixon 18:48, 14 September 2005 (UTC)[reply]

I agree. There are no copyright issues with adding them. They are all available on one or the other of the mudcat threads linked from the article. If someone else wants to take this on, great, if not I'll try to get to it this weekend. -- Jmabel | Talk 23:30, 15 September 2005 (UTC)[reply]

I added enough to discuss the main points of the song, but I don't think more is needed -- not because of copyright issues (which usually apply to lyrics questions) but because of encyclopedic necessity. I do, however, fully support adding multiple full versions to Wikisource and appropriately linking that here. --Dhartung | Talk 05:08, 16 September 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Should there be a link to "Uncle Tom"?

There is a good discussion there about "tomming". In fact it was that article that made me think of this song and then to look here. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 12.145.60.10 (talk • contribs)

I'm not sure where you are suggesting a link be made, but go ahead and add it if you want. See WP:BOLD. — BrianSmithson 18:48, 11 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

"Deliberate negligence"

What's "deliberate negligence"? Surely if you do something deliberately you intend to do it and therefore can't have done it by accident?