Talk:Egotism

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Egotism is not egoism[edit]

As noted by Ayn Rand in her 1968 introduction to The Fountainhead, there is a difference between egoism and egotism.

The difference is that egoism is equal trade in values, while egotism – exactly like altruism – belongs to the realm of disconnection between what a person gives and what he recieves. -A.R. 18:15, 16 December 2005

-- Since when is Ayn Rand a respected authority on mental illness?

An excellent point, anonymous person! 75.152.155.22 15:36, 13 November 2007 (UTC)
Ayn Rand was a respected authority on most things so why ever not? --86.174.20.35 (talk) 12:06, 25 December 2010 (UTC)
Name one thing. Really. One. And "respected by Objectivists" and "considered an authority by Objectivists" don't count. 174.17.197.170 (talk) 11:35, 31 May 2011 (UTC)

Famous egotists[edit]

There should be a list of famous egotists, egomaniacs etc.--Percussion

No, it shouldn't. Rursus dixit. (mbork3!) 09:38, 9 February 2012 (UTC)

Sigmund Freud[edit]

Id, ego and super-ego

From Freud: The 'psychological-mind' consists of 3 parts. The Id, Ego and Super-ego. Lets start at the top. The Super-ego is the nag in the mind..."We'll you could have done THAT better" he said to himself. The Ego is normally the survival self. The bit that complains when I'm hungry as a baby. "Where's my milk!!!" - This bit is trained later in life which I will get to shortly. The Id is the existing psychological state we are born with. It has no voice and only 'tweaks' the Ego or Super-Ego with some sort of signal (guilt, shame...all the right stuff you should feel if you steal or hurt someone on purpose or rush to help someone who has fallen over. These are instantly felt and if not noticed, will completely consume the psyche), but this can be forced out of 'awareness' by the ego and for this reason, we are educated together in 'tribes'. We select our different groups (tribes) automatically at school, depending on who we think we will get less abuse from or are most alike.

This group then suppresses the ego fear by me having the group as a 'backup' (might is right for the egoist). This comparison and self-interest is further tweaked and trained by other infants and teenagers as we progress through school, but where you may normally have time to contemplate all this self-interest and see it as wrong with the Id, you are distracted by lessons and TV. TV and entertainment in general are also ego activities, because they are done when the ego is developing. This overlays information over the psychosis (see wikipedia:Psychosis), which causes loss of contact with reality. The ego makes up a character during youth and starts to believe any incoming information based on the fact it is being taught constantly and the assumption is that it is all correct, but this can be rejected by the group-psychology if that is required by the group. "My tribe knows best!"

Alongside this. When we are very young, we are taught archetypes. The King, Knight, Wizard for example. We assume ideals from that into the false-identity created by the ego. If someone steps on the false-self to the degree that it shrinks (general ego failure), it must be appeased. My ego will pick on someone weaker, or if thet fails I will buy or eat something or just dish out verbal abuse when I can finally release it. (Consumerism bolstered and greed born in the ego). The archetypes are in fact a trap. The psyche reacts to these archetypes in the same way in everyone. It doesn't take long for a psycho-analyst to quickly pick up on which of the trained archetypes one has assumed, and can plan what methods to take to ensure the ego remains intact and in control, despite fixing the 'issue'. The 'issue' was always there and it has just risen to the surface.

As we see others wearing different types of clothes as a group (trending), the ego thinks 'you can have that/why can't you have that!'. You go out to buy the jacket. Consumerism is born in the ego. The Id looks on and shakes its (imaginary) head. This trending continues later in life with news, entertainment, politics, further education and greed.

The dilemma - The ego actually overrides the will to learn in so many, that people are created with a rainbow of education levels. Shelf-stackers and scientists, purely based around the will to learn as decided by the ego, so this serves the system of classes very well. It means some will earn more by default, while others scurry around picking up tins and boxes for them. But the training of the ego opens interfaces of ignorance later in life. This is the class system 'by design'.

- If the state actually taught people without the screwing up of psychology at the same time, we would all be Astrophysics and that would be no good. There would be no servants or consumers of junk.

Meditation techniques where the inner voices are stilled (ego chatter on multiple levels), allow the original psyche to re-emerge. The Id, which doesn't think in words or access memory so is not affected by false emotions based on fear of the future, or memories of the past, and is the desired state for meditators. Wise voiceless contemplation. The intuition (Id) makes the decisions, and the ego picks them up and puts words and stories of the past events to current events. If my expectations are not met, I get angry or must appease the ego by purchasing or receiving something. Perhaps even drinking the thoughts out of my head with alcohol. As long as I think of something in words, I have the opportunity to distort it for my own good. This is ego activity.

So we are trained to be ignorant, consumers, rude and war lovers based on indoctination and 'education', but the result is a semi-tranced state of ignorance brought on by the circumstances of the educational system. In reality, Ego and Id should be in balance. The ego taking care of any memory access that may be necessary, but the Id having the final 'instinct' if only you could hear it.81.155.214.186 (talk) 21:48, 16 February 2014 (UTC)

Bad heading[edit]

The heading tells us what characterizes egotism but not what egotism is ! Is it a behaviour, a psychological trait, a type of philosophy ...? Jotamar (talk) 15:01, 20 October 2011 (UTC)

What's the difference? If it is a characteristic behavior, then it is defined by a number of characteristics. Or maybe you're out for a reason, a psychiatric mechanism causing egotism? Then I suspect the problem is that it is not a defined psychiatric syndrom. Rursus dixit. (mbork3!) 09:43, 9 February 2012 (UTC)

These articles need a lot of work... as do likely our societies[edit]

Right now, there seems to be little difference made between "egoism", "egotism", "egocentrism" and even "narcissism", which is very unfortunate. Philosophical egoism should not be confused with a dissorder, and nor do we need narcissisim to be excused as "intellectual" --78.69.217.113 (talk) 12:38, 23 May 2016 (UTC) /Thomas