Talk:116 Clique

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Fair use rationale for Image:13L.jpg[edit]

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Image:13L.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot 01:29, 24 July 2007 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:116.jpg[edit]

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Image:116.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot 01:30, 24 July 2007 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:116 Clique C&S.jpg[edit]

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Image:116 Clique C&S.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot 01:30, 24 July 2007 (UTC)

Tour dates information[edit]

Since the seasons occur at different times for the Northern and Southern Hemispheres, seasons should not be used to tell the relative dates of the tours.  When it is Summer in the Northern Hemisphere (which includes North America and Europe), it is Winter in the Southern Hemisphere (which includes Australia and much of South America).  Someone reading 'Summer' in New York, US may think of July and August, while someone reading the same thing in Sydney, Australia may think of something more like December and January.  In that way, seasons are relative.  I removed the seasons.

I am faced with a dilemma when attempting to include the specific dates at which each tour officially starts and ends.  One web site says a tour starts on 2 October, another says 1 October, and yet another says 15 August.  Not only that, but I am not sure if any of those sources are even reliable enough for a Wikipedia article.  Can anyone please help?  If you know of any reliable web sites with correct information about these tours, then please at least post the URLs here to be added to the article.

Thank you! Casdmo (talk) 04:19, 1 January 2011 (UTC)

Distinguish template[edit]

The group 116 Clique should be distinguished from the group 196 Clique of a similar name. Per Template:Distinguish2#Distinguish 71.82.119.141 (talk) 07:09, 22 January 2015 (UTC)

The 196 Clique would need an article. Walter Görlitz (talk) 07:15, 22 January 2015 (UTC)
I don't think it would. Is there a Wikipedia guideline or policy anywhere stating that the Template:Distinguish2 hatnote needs linkage to an article to be implemented? Contrary to your claim, I see an option for the text alone to be distinguished: See {{Template:Distinguish2|TEXT}} 71.82.119.141 (talk) 07:24, 22 January 2015 (UTC)
They need articles. There are no cases where it's for a subject without an article even though the documentation shows a case. I'll ask for clarification there. Walter Görlitz (talk) 07:40, 22 January 2015 (UTC)
Please be more specific about this: Where in the Wikipedia guidelines does it state that the Template:Distinguish2 class of templates is to be used for redirects only? Where does Wikipedia policy state that this text hatnote: {{Template:Distinguish2|TEXT}} needs article linkage in order to distinguish the two apart from each other? I don't think it needs an article. Reason/clarification: I still see an option for the text alone to be distinguished: See {{Template:Distinguish2|TEXT}} 71.82.119.141 (talk) 07:56, 22 January 2015 (UTC)
  • Side note: Please prove that there are "no cases" of a subject itself ever being distinguished using a hatnote on Wikipedia. I find that hard to believe. The documentation clearly shows evidence of the case. 71.82.119.141 (talk) 08:01, 22 January 2015 (UTC)
I'm currently discussing it at the template for clarification. Walter Görlitz (talk) 15:15, 22 January 2015 (UTC)
I choose not to participate in that discussion. There is nothing wrong with the template per se. 71.82.119.141 (talk) 15:21, 22 January 2015 (UTC)

I don't see why this article needs to distinguish. 196 Clique is a different name than 116 Clique, and doesn't have an article. If someone types "196 Clique" into the search bar, they won't get anything. The Distinguish template is meant for help in cases like Sunday's Child and Phil Keaggy and Sunday's Child, where you have two articles with essentially the same name (I use this case because I recently typed in "Sunday's Child" as a short-hand for the Phil Keaggy album, thinking it would redirect to that article, but I found that there was a different article titled just "Sunday's Child."--3family6 (Talk to me | See what I have done) 16:23, 22 January 2015 (UTC)

I don't see why not. As explicitly stated in Template talk:Distinguish, the template just serves to help people. The template has the purpose of stopping people from thinking that the information in the article concerns their sought topic, be it the other topic. This template is not destructive; it is supposed to be helpful to other users to distinguish the two apart from each other. Please do not claim the template is "unconstructive" (see my talk page edit history). Please see WP:HATNOTE#Distinguish for Wikipedia guidelines surrounding the {{Template:Distinguish2|TEXT}} hatnote. {{Template:Distinguish2|TEXT}} is listed there among all other Distinguish hatnotes, and should be usable here. Can either of you two provide a valid reason why not (or how adding this template used to help ppl distinguish 2 very similar names could be considered WP:Destructive editing)? Thanks 71.82.119.141 (talk) 22:08, 22 January 2015 (UTC)
The issue is, how is this template helpful? As an editor brought up on the discussion page, "While there might be some hypothetical possibility where a non-article link might be warranted as IAR, in general, the purpose of hatnotes is to help readers locate other articles. A non-article hatnote would be subject to verifiability and I don't think anyone would want to see a footnote in a hatnote." Since the two groups in question, 116 Clique and 196 Clique have different names, albeit similar ones, I don't see confusion occurring that often. It's possible that someone could type in "116 Clique" when looking for 196 Clique, but they would very quickly realize that they are different groups. However, there isn't a 196 Clique article to direct them to, and from my web search, the group doesn't seem that notable and thus won't, in the near future at least, have an article. I could see putting in a note if the group was called 116 Clique, or 16 Clique, or something like that, but as is I don't see a strong enough case to go against established consensus.--3family6 (Talk to me | See what I have done) 22:36, 22 January 2015 (UTC)
71.82.119.141, did you try to search for this group on Wikipedia yourself and came across 116 Clique instead? Because that would strengthen your case. Concrete examples are much more solid than hypothetical ones.--3family6 (Talk to me | See what I have done) 22:42, 22 January 2015 (UTC)
If you don't think the Distinguish2|TEXT template is helpful in itself, there is another discussion going on over at Template talk:Distinguish. Please do not discuss it here. This is not a "hypothetical" case for this template to be used, nor should it concern you how I personally found the article. Their similar names confused me at first when I found it, so I added the template to distinguish the two similar names to help other readers distinguish between the two as well. 71.82.119.141 (talk) 23:13, 22 January 2015 (UTC)
The discussion is not over whether Distinguish template is helpful, but whether it should list subjects for which there are no article. The relevant guideline is WP:NOARTICLE which explicitly states "hatnotes are intended to help users navigate to another article they may have intended to find." The discussion on the template is entirely about the issue being discussed on this page. Thank for providing your personal example, as that helps determine if the guideline should be adapted.--3family6 (Talk to me | See what I have done) 23:56, 22 January 2015 (UTC)
You need to stop citing Wikipedia policies where irrelevant. Clearly WP:NOARTICLE refers only to the usage of RED LINK hatnotes and has absolutely nothing to do with the Distinguish2|Text template being used to distinguish the text itself. Please see WP:HATNOTE#Distinguish for the relevant Wikipedia guidelines surrounding the {{Template:Distinguish2|TEXT}} hatnote. It is listed there among all other Distinguish hatnotes, and should be usable/helpful here to avoid any future confusion between the two. Thanks 71.82.119.141 (talk) 01:46, 23 January 2015 (UTC)
Again, the guideline states that "hatnotes are intended to help users navigate to another article they may have intended to find." The reason that redlinks are mentioned is because those are links to articles that don't exist. The reason that it doesn't address unlinked articles is that it is not intended for those articles to be included, which is what the discussion that Walter started on the template talk page found. The editors there held out the possibility that there might be instances where it is best to ignore the rules and include a listing for which there is no article. However, those would require extraordinary circumstances, and neither I nor Walter are convinced that the circumstances in this case are extraordinary. The editors in the other discussion have not commented on this particular usage here, only in generalities, so I don't know their opinion on this particular case.--3family6 (Talk to me | See what I have done) 03:04, 23 January 2015 (UTC)
Extraordinary or not; you admitted it yourself above, the two names are similar and they are not to be confused. 71.82.119.141 (talk) 03:13, 23 January 2015 (UTC)