Talk:5th Combined Arms Army

1st and 2nd formation

From Craig's spreadsheet of Perecheni (dates in Operational Army):

5 Army

I Formation 22 June 1941 - 25 September 1941 Disbanded

II Formation 11 October 1941 - 19 April 1945; 9 August 1945 - 3 September 1945

Perechen No.2, General Staff, p.21, 1970 ed.--mrg3105mrg3105 If you're not taking any flack, you're not over the target. 07:11, 6 February 2008 (UTC)

Potapov

This commander had an interesting life. I think you can translate the short bio from here http://mechcorps.rkka.ru/files/mechcorps/pages/biograf_p.htm He actually came back to command the 5th Army in the 50s. The circumstances of his capture are somewhat covered by Operation Barbarossa: Strategy and Tactics on the Eastern Front 1941 by Bryan Fugate. A less used but very fine book on the early 1941 period usually overlooked.--mrg3105mrg3105 If you're not taking any flack, you're not over the target. 03:45, 8 February 2008 (UTC) Fugate says that "Guderian notes that Potapov, the commander of the Russian Fifth Army, was captured and that he himself had the opportunity to question him. When asked why his army had made no attempt to abandon Kiev until it was too late, the Russian general answered that such an order had been issued but later rescinded (presumably on September 11) and his forces were ordered to defend Kiev at all cost." p.270, Operation Barbarossa: Strategy and Tactics on the Eastern Front 1941 by Bryan Fugate --mrg3105mrg3105 If you're not taking any flack, you're not over the target. 03:52, 8 February 2008 (UTC)

standard Soviet encyclopaedic entry

5th Army 1st formation The 5th Army of the 1st formation was formed in 1939 in the Kiev Special military district. On the eve of the war the Army comprised of the 15th and 27th rifle, 9th and 22nd mechanized corps, Kovelskiy and Vladimir-Volynskiy fortified regions, two fortified areas of the Strumilinsky fortified areas, and other smaller units.

Since the beginning of the war the 5th army within the Southwestern Front conducted combat operations in the Kovel, Lutsk and Sokal (north of Chervonograd) directions, then in the Kovel fords regions (over Turja river), Dubno, Rovno, and also in the positions of the [[Korosten] fortified area on the northwestern approaches to Kiev. From 11 July through 20 September it participated in the defensive battles with the superior enemy forces in the Kiev direction, in course of which its troops sustained heavy losses. On September 25, 1941 the field administration of the 5th army is disbanded, its formations and units are transferred to staffing of other armies of the Southwestern Front. Commanding General Major of the tank troops Potapov M.I. (June September 1941). Members of the military council: brigade commissar Serdyuk Z.T. (June August 1941); Nikishev M.S. (August 1941. - September 1941). Chief of staff General Major Pisarevsky D.S. (March- September 1941) 2nd formation The 5th army of the second formation it was formed on 11 October 1941 on the directive of Stavka VGK from October 9, 1941 on the basis of the troops of the Mozhaisk fortified area. Into it were included 32nd and 133rd rifle divisions, 18, 19, the 20th tank brigades and a number of artillery, engineering and other units. From 12 October the Army entered into the composition of the Western Front (Soviet Union) and until 4 December conducted defensive actions in the regions of Mozhaisk, Dorokhov, and Zvenigorod. The troops of Army in the course of war’s fighting displayed high endurance and perseverance. For five days parts of 32nd rifle division (commander is the Colonel V.I. Polosukhin) repulsed furious attacks by the enemy troops on the Borodino field. At the end of November the 5th Army made it possible to stop an offensive by the German troops at the boundary west of Zvenigorod, Kubinki, and Akulovo. At the beginning of December the Army’s troops were reinforced by the reserves of Stavka VGK and the Front (19, 329, 336th rifle divisions, 2nd guard cavalry Corps, two rifle and five battalions of rocket artillery). In interaction with the 16th and 33rd Armies of the Western Front the 5th Army executed counter-attacks against the enemy in the Istrin and Zvenigorod directions, and then it participated in the counter-attack, in the course of which Tuchkov, Dorokhov and other populated areas (149 in all) were liberated. Continuing the offensive, the formations of the 5th Army freed Mozhaisk (on 20 January 1942) and advanced to the approaches to Gzhatsk (now Gagarin), where they met with organized enemy opposition. Subsequently the 5th Army held a defensive line in the central section of Western Front. During March 1943 the Army participated in the Rzhev-Vyaz'ma operation, in the course of which it freed Gzhatsk (6 March) and Vyaz’ma (12 March). In the course of August- September the Army participated in the Smolensk operation and the liberation of Smolensk (on 25 September) in the course of the Smolensk- Roslavl operation. After a short stay in the reserve of Western Front the troops of the 5th Army continued to conduct offensive combat in the direction on Lyubavichi and by October 11 arrived at the boundary of the rivers of Chernitsa and Verkhita (southwest of Rudnya), where they went over to the defensive. From 14 November the army conducted offensive combat in the Orsha direction and towards the end of December reached Rossasenka river. At the beginning January 1944 the 5th Army was regrouped into region southeast of Vitebsk and took over the defense zone from 33rd Army. In January - June its formations conducted offensive combat in the direction of Bogushevsk. On April 24 the Army was transferred to the 3rd Belorussian Front. Its participation in the Belorussian operation was an outstanding event in the history of the 5th army. Acting as part of the breakthrough group of the 3rd Belorussian Front, its troops successfully conducted the offensive in the course of Vitebsk-Orsha, Minsk, Vilnius and Kaunas operations. During August the troops of the Army were the first to cross the border of East Prussia. On the 13 January 1945 the Army participated in the East Prussian strategic operation, in the course of which in interaction with other armies of front it destroyed the Tilsit-Insterburg and Khalchberg] enemy groups and on January 23 occupied Insterbur In the completing stage of war it participated in the liquidation of the Samland peninsula enemy group.

On April 20, is 5th Army of was brought out of the reserve of Stavka VGK and was moved to the Far East composition of the Seaside Group of Forces, transformed on August 5, 1945 into the 1st Far Eastern Front. From the beginning of the Soviet-Japanese war the Army (17, 45, 65 72nd rifle Corps, 105th Fortified Area, tank, artillery brigades and other units) participated in Harbin -Girin operation. Its troops, acting in the direction of the main attack of the 1st Far Eastern Front, broke through Volynskiy area of resistance by the Japanese troops and advanced to the eastern spurs of Taypinliy ridge. Beginning under the difficult conditions of mountain taiga locality, the formations of the 5th army overcame the large road center – Pogranichnaya station area, the cities Mulin, Mutanchiang, Girin, assault crossed the Mulinkhe and Mutanchiang rivers, and played an important role in the crushing defeat of a number of Kwantung Army formations. At the end September 1945 the 5th Army was disbanded. Commanding officers: General Major Lelyushenko D.D. (October 1941); General Major of artillery, November 1941. the general lieutenant of the artillery Govorov L.A. (October 1941 - April 1942); Major General, since June 1942 general lieutenant Fedyuninskiy I.I. (April- October of 1942); General colonel Cherevichenko YA.T. (October 1942 - February 1943.); general lieutenant Polenov OF V.S. (February- October of 1943 ); General lieutenant, since July 1944. general colonel Krylov N.I. (October 1943. - October 1944. December 1944. - to the end of the Soviet-Japanese war); General lieutenant of Shafranov P. G (October- December of 1944 ). Members of the military council: brigade commissar, December 1941. Major General Ivanov P.F. (October 1941. - November 1943.); Colonel, March 1944. General Major, since September 1945. general lieutenant Ponomarev I.M. (November 1943. - to the end of the Soviet-Japanese war). Chiefs of staff: Colonel Khotimskiy Z.I. (October 1941 ); General Major Filatov OF A.A. (October 1941. - January 1942.); Major General Pigarevich B.A. (January 1942. - June 1943.); general lieutenant Sukhomlin A.V. (July August 1943 ); Colonel Pochem F.E. (August October 1943.); General Major, since May 1945. general lieutenant Prikhidko N.YA. (October 1943 - to the end of the Soviet-Japanese war). —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mrg3105 (talk • contribs) 03:18, 18 February 2008 (UTC)

Can we get some publishing & author details for this? Otherwise, without proper references, it's unusable. Buckshot06 (talk) 06:59, 19 February 2008 (UTC)

Крылов Н.И., Алексеев Н.И., Драган И.Г. Навстречу победе: Боевой путь 5-й армии. – М., 1970. – С. 117-145.

Krilov N.I., Alekseyev N.I., Dragan I.G., Towards victory: Combat road of the 5th Army, Moscow, 1970.--mrg3105 (comms) If you're not taking any flak, you're not over the target. 07:10, 19 February 2008 (UTC)

I also added some detail from Владимирский А. В. На киевском направлении. По опыту ведения боевых действий войсками 5-й армии Юго-Западного фронта в июне—сентябре 1941 г. — М.: Воениздат, 1989.

Vladimirsky A.V., On the Kiev direction. From lessons of conduct of combat forces of the 5th Army, South-Western Front during June - September 1941, Moscow, Voyenizdat, 1989. Haven't really read ut yet though.--mrg3105 (comms) If you're not taking any flak, you're not over the target. 07:16, 19 February 2008 (UTC)

127th Machine-Gun Artillery Division

Source: http://www.soldat.ru/forum/?gb=3&id=61960, 7 April 2008 All seaside newspapers have written the following >--------------------------------------------------- > The main task of the new commander 127 пулад Sergey Ryzhkov will be restoration of battle readiness of a division. Now into it instead of кадрированных cadre parts/elements have arrived ill-starred shelfs/regiment from Сергеевки Sergeyevka and two army shelf/regiments of constant readiness from the Stone-fisher Kamen-Rybolov and Ussuriisk. >---------------------------------------------------- > > Who has an information on former structure 127 пулад and these(it) 2 army shelfs of constant readiness > > Thanks, > > Sergey

127 пулад - 114, 130 пулап, 314 мсп, 218 тп, 872 ап, 1172 зрп

Камня-Рыболова (Stone-fisher) - 438 мсп Ussuriisk - 231 мсп

пулад - пулемётно-артиллерийская дивизия (machine-gun artillery division) shelfs in Russian same as regiments in plural полки Камня-Рыболова is Kamen-Rybolov place of dislocation (barracks) (western shore of Lake Chanka (were two vilages Kamen (lit. stone) and Rybolov (lit. fishermam), now merged as one Ussuriisk -> Ussuriysk (Ussurijsk) as above, major city north of Vladivostok

The disusson in the forum was around the recent announcement of transfer of some regiments between various divisions in the MD that effectively made the 127th an MRD although its designation is that of a static defence unit. Feskov responded that he doesn't have all the information regarding the transfers and designations yet.

Yes, I gathered most of that. Would you be able to ask in the forum which newspapers they are referring to? Then we can list it here, as forum discussions alone are not WP:RS reliable sources. Buckshot06 (talk) 23:36, 2 May 2008 (UTC)

127th Order of Kutuzov Second Degree Machine-Gun Artillery Division

The division was generated on May 14, 1932 in village Lutkovka-medical Veditsky Shmakovsky area of Ussuriisk area ДВО, as the 1st Krasnoarmejsky collective-farm division. Дивизия сформирована 14 мая 1932 года в селе Лутковка-Медведицкое Шмаковского района Уссурийской области ДВО, как 1-я Красноармейская колхозная дивизия.

In 1945 the division as a part of 2nd Far East front participated in war on defeat of militaristic Japan. В 1945 году дивизия в составе 2-го Дальневосточного фронта участвовала в войне по разгрому милитаристской Японии.

For exemplary performance of tasks of command against the Japanese armies in the Far East at river Ussuri speeding up, break Hotunsky, Mishansky, Boundary, Duninsky Ur, mastering by the cities of Mishan, Girin, Jantszy, Harbin, the valour shown thus and courage on September, 19th, 1945 66th shooting division is awarded the order KUTUZOV of II degree. За образцовое выполнение заданий командования против японских войск на Дальнем Востоке при форсировании реки Уссури, прорыве Хотунского, Мишаньского, Пограничного, Дунинского УР, овладении городами Мишань, Гирин, Яньцзы, Харбин, проявленные при этом доблесть и мужество 19 сентября 1945 года 66-я стрелковая дивизия награждена ОРДЕНОМ КУТУЗОВА II степени.

In May, 1981 division management is relocated in with. Сергеевка. Since July, 1st, 1990 277 МСД it is reformed in 127 pulemetno-artillery division. В мае 1981 года управление дивизии передислоцировано в с. Сергеевка. С 1 июля 1990 года 277 МСД переформирована в 127 пулеметно-артиллерийскую дивизию.

In division parts are awarded: 3 heroes of Soviet Union; 1266 persons - awards, 2838 - medals.

Listings for 1990

Below is a complete listing for the 1990 period, though you probably have this already--mrg3105 (comms) ♠♥♦♣ 13:43, 2 May 2008 (UTC)

Краснознаменный Дальневосточный военный округ (штаб - Хабаровск) По состоянию на 1988 г. Округ подчинялся Главкому Дальнего Востока. На его территории дислоцировались 4 общевойсковые армии (5, 15, 35, 51), 25-й и 43-й армейские корпуса, соединения центрального и окружного подчинения. Авиационную поддержку ДВО осуществляла 1-я ВА, а воздушное прикрытие- 11-я армия ПВО.

• 5 краснознаменная общевойсковая армия (Уссурийск):
  • 29 МСД (Камень-Рыболов): 185 тп (Троицкое), 402 мсп (Платоновка), 438 мсп (Духовское), 436 мсп, 77 ап (Платоновка), 1040 зрп (Троицкое)
  • 40 МСД (Смоляниново): 141 гв. тп, 3 мсп, 231 мсп, 411 мсп, 173 гв. ап, 1170 зрп
  • 77 ТД (Ляличи): 72 тп, 210 тп, 259 тп, мсп, ап, зрп
  • 81 гвардейская МСД (Бикин): 296 тп, 238 гв. мсп (Вяземское), 233 гв мсп, 235 гв. мсп, 91 ап (Розенгардовка), 1169 зрп
  • 123 гвардейская МСД (Барабаш): 248 тп (Занадворовка), 45 гв. мсп (Уссурийск), 290 гв. мсп (Краскино), 52 гв. мсп, 26 гв. ап, 1173 зрп (Уссурийск)
  • 199 МСД (Красный Кут): 71 тп, 526 мсп, 594 мсп, 610 мсп, 2183 ап, 426 зенап
  • 277 МСД (Сергеевка): 218 тп(Липовцы), 114 мсп (Новогеоргиевка), 314 мсп (Пограничный), 394 мсп, 872 ап (Барано-Оренбургский), 1171 зрп

• Соединения и части армейского подчинения:
  • 180 зенитно-ракетная бригада (Барабаш)
  • 17 УР; 650 понтонно-мостовой полк (Дальнереченск)
  • 13 УР (Краскино), 15 УР (Новогеоргиевка)
  • 305 гаубичная артиллерийская бригада; 719 реактивный полк, 958 противотанковый полк; 304 отдельный полк РЭБ (Покровка)
  • 4 ракетная бригада, 8 зенитно-ракетная бригада, 224 ордена Кутузова инженерно-саперная бригада, 58 инженерно-саперный полк, 314 понтонно-мостовой полк (Раздольное)
  • 20 гвардейская ракетная бригада (Спасск -Дальний)
  • 317 отдельный радиотехнический полк ОСНАЗ (Сергеевка)
  • 44 бригада материального обеспечения; 86 Невский краснознаменный отдельный полк связи; 612 отдельный батальон ОСНАЗ, 94 радиотехнические батальон, 122 батальон химзащиты; 32 отдельная вертолетная эскадрилья (Уссурийск)
  • 20-й УР (с 11.12.89 - 250-й пулеметно-артиллерийский полк) (Хасан)
  • 319 краснознаменный вертолетный полк им. В.И. Ленина; 319 отдельная вертолетная эскадрилья (Черниговка)

• 15 общевойсковая армия (Хабаровск):
  • 73 мсд (Новое): 394 тп, 392 мсп, 413 мсп, 471 мсп, 11 ап, зрп
  • 135 мсд (Лесозаводск): 122 тп (Кольцевое), 199 мсп (Лазо), 469 мсп (Филино), 472 мсп, 378 ап и 1135 зрп (Пантелеймоновка)

- 194 мсд (Хабаровск) - 270 (Комсомольск-на-Амуре): 509 тп, 102 мсп, 478 мсп, 882 мсп, ап, 470 зрп

Соединения и части армейского подчинения: - 2 УР (переформирован в 348-ю мотострелковую бригаду) (о. Большой Уссурийский) - реактивный артполк (Обор) - зенитно-ракетная бригада (470 полк); 13 отдельный гвардейский краснознаменный полк связи; 786 реактивный артполк; 635 отдельный десантно-штурмовой батальон; 826 батальон РЭБ (Хабаровск (Красная Речка)

• removed 35th Army information to 35th Army (Soviet Union)

• REmoved 51st Army information to 51st Army (Soviet Union)

• 43 армейский корпус (Биробиджан):

- 118 МСД (Биробиджан): 199 тп, мсп, мсп, мсп, ап, зрп - 272 МСД (Бабстово): 289 тп, 159 мсп, 209 мсп (Ленинское), 424 мсп (Биджан), ап, зрп (Биджан)

Соединения и части корпусного подчинения: - зенитно-ракетная бригада; 688 отдельный батальон связи (Биробиджан) - 3 УР (Новое)

Соединения и части окружного подчинения - 27 учебная ТД (Завитинск) - 121 учебная МСД (Сибирцево): 136 тп (Троицкое), 386 мсп, 476 мсп, 656 мсп (Ляличи), 1220 ап (Ляличи), 1136 зрап (Троицкое) - 129 учебная МСД (Князе-Волконка): 240 тп (Анастасьевка), 494 мсп (Хабаровск), 384 мсп, мсп, 32 ап, 1226 зрап (Анастасьевка) - артиллерийская бригада, 180 зенитно-ракетная бригада (Анастасьевка) - 105 бригада связи (Белогорск) - реактивная артиллерийская бригада (Бикин) - транспортный вертолетный полк (Бирофельд) - 825 вертолетный полк, отдельный полк связи (Гаровка) - 16 бригада химзащиты (Галкино) - 106 ордена Красного Знамени бригада связи (Дальнереченск) - 104 Клужская орденов Суворова, Кутузова, бригада связи (Князе-Волконка) - 8 бригада связи ВГК; 76 радиотехническая бригада (Комсомольск-на-Амуре) - 15 гвардейская артиллерийская дивизия в составе 5 бригад и полков (в т.ч. 607-й гаубичный артполк) (Красная Речка- Хабаровск) - 83 десантно-штурмовая бригада (Магдагачи); (from 25 February 1990 from Central Group of Forces) - 23 ракетная бригада (Новосысоевка) - 102 ракетная бригада (Семисточный) - 14 бригада спецназа; 13 десантно-штурмовая бригада; 206 бронетанковый ремонтный завод (Уссурийск) - зенитно-ракетный полк, 3 краснознаменный понтонно-мостовой полк, 158 учебный полк связи, 38 радиотехнический полк; 104 отдельный батальон связи и 135 отдельный батальон химзащиты ( (Хабаровск) - 91 артиллерийская бригада (Шкотово)

Move from 5th Army (Russia)

I have not been able to find any reference to this formation being referred to as the "5th Red Banner Army". The original name on the file was 5th Army (Russia) which is accurate as it is a current formation of the Russian military. An alternate name would be 5th Army (Soviet Union), the name it served under the longest. I don't think this should have been moved to the new name and should be moved back to it's previous title. Ryan.opel (talk) 14:55, 13 July 2014 (UTC)

Ryan, it appears that User:Filiep is correct. Feskov et al 2004, p.42, clearly lists this army as '5-я краснознаменная общевойсковая армия (5 ОА)' (and you'll see it in the 'Listing for 1990' above). We just haven't been closely enough examining the sources. Filiep, can you give us a date and in what circumstances the award of the Order of the Red Banner was made? Buckshot06 (talk) 09:24, 15 July 2014 (UTC)

Previous Milhist ACR

G'day, this article has no article history for having undergone a Milhist ACR, yet has an "A-Class=fail" field in the Milhist banner. Any ideas why? Thanks, Peacemaker67 (send... over) 08:21, 18 July 2014 (UTC)

Found the review and added the article history. Pls see above. Anotherclown (talk) 06:09, 20 July 2014 (UTC)

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