|This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Adult article.
This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject.
|Adult has been listed as a level-3 vital article in Life. If you can improve it, please do. This article has been rated as Start-Class.|
|This article is of interest to the following WikiProjects:|
- 1 Social Status of Adulthood
- 2 Sources
- 3 Let's get pictures for this article!!!
- 4 Fix UK limits, vandalism, 3RR
- 5 to experience the world from a first-person standpoint instead of through the parents.
- 6 unsourced section and fix up
- 7 This is a dumb article....
- 8 Age of Consent in the Vatican
- 9 Skeletal adulthood
- 10 "Social Construct"
- 11 Biological adult?
Social Status of Adulthood
I'm no expert, but this section seems very POV to me, accusing adults of adultism and holding a double standard, as well as accusing them of immature behavior. 188.8.131.52 21:01, 29 July 2007 (UTC)
- accusing adults of adultism and holding a double standard, as well as accusing them of immature behavior. Well, that is not Wikipedianly-POVed/NPOVed, that is simply a truthful statement. KSM-2501ZX, IP address:= 184.108.40.206 17:27, 6 September 2007 (UTC)
I think that adults do think there better then others and do hold a double standard. I admit to doing this myself although I do think it's wrong. Those who don't do this are in the very very small minority and the majority of people do this but are ignorant to there actions. There should however be double standards as not having double standards would mean that all people would be able to do things like consuming alcohol. If a child was to make his own decision to drink alcohol when they are only small and the body isn't mature they would suffer from consequences they didn't know exist. This is why double standards do need to exist but they shouldn't exist in age. Using the same alcohol example a person is able to make a informed decision to drink alcohol at lots of different ages to restrict people because of age on this issue is very wrong as many other issues. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 220.127.116.11 (talk) 05:50, 6 October 2007 (UTC)
This is about tag cleanup. As all of the tags are more than a year old, there is no current discussion relating to them, and there is a great deal of editing done since the tags were placed, they will be removed. This is not a judgement of content. If there is cause to re-tag, then that of course may be done, with the necessary posting of a discussion as to why, and what improvements could be made. This is only an effort to clean out old tags, and permit them to be updated with current issues if warranted.Jjdon (talk) 22:09, 28 April 2008 (UTC)
The legal age section contains the following:
15: Iran (21) 16: Scotland (21) 17: Indonesia (20) 18: South Africa (18)
Which one is the age - the number in parenthesis or the number before the colon? Either way, what's the other number? Tompagenet 13:57, 23 March 2007 (UTC)
This article only talks about legal adulthood, and only touches on biological adulthood. I think it should be expanded to include human biological adulthood.
- I agree--biological and legal adulthood were the same in many societies, but are virtually unrelated in many modern societies. I added a bit about that, but it could use more. Adam Newton 03:30, 25 June 2006 (UTC)
- I created a section for it, but it could still use some expanding. KPalicz 16:24, 30 November 2006 (UTC)
"Some propose that moving into adulthood involves an emotional structuring of denial. This process becomes necessary to cope with one's own behaviour, especially in uncomfortable situations, and also the behaviour of others."
Err WTF is this psychobabble, it's either scientology or some kind of mumbo jumbo religion nonsense of some kind. Not quite NPOV. Some propose that it's deleted. Someone should try to change this article so it doesn't look like a definition of who gets admitted to an over 18s porn flick.--SeanONE
- As this comment has been here almost two months and no one has explained it, I'm removing it from the article. Adam Newton 03:30, 25 June 2006 (UTC)
I added a couple of sources for some of this, but this article still needs sources. I'll try to work on adding more, but anyone else is free to beat me to it! Adam Newton 03:30, 25 June 2006 (UTC)
Let's get pictures for this article!!!
Can we get more pictures? Can we have a photo of a middle aged and old people? The child article has tons of pictures. Why can't this article have some pictures? We need to show some diversity. Is it that hard for people to go out to take some pictures. It's not that hard. (18.104.22.168 - Talk)
What's stopping you then? --Brideshead 21:51, 17 December 2006 (UTC)
Fix UK limits, vandalism, 3RR
I've been tracking edits of a potential vandalism account of which has edited this page, and I think I've confused myself a little on the reverting. I can't revert any more as per 3RR (I never like to go beyond 2), so can somebody please repair or revert my edits to remove the vandalism? Many thanks /Marbles 18:05, 8 October 2007 (UTC)
to experience the world from a first-person standpoint instead of through the parents.
This is fairly vague, but if I understand its meaning correctly, a good portion of the human population - and nearly its entire population preceding the modern era - never truly reaches adulthood. I've been given the impression that prior to the spread of western individualism, personal identity was inseparable from the identity and welfare of the family, past and future. I may be wrong though. Closest thing I can think of to cite is Origins of English Individualism by Alan Macfarlane. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 22.214.171.124 (talk) 05:53, 25 October 2007 (UTC)
unsourced section and fix up
This article could use some actual science. It seems to go towards the popular conception of adulthood and then ignores neurological and psychological conceptions of adulthood. In the neurological sense adulthood occurs in bursts throughout the teenage years and the early 20s. Why not mention it? YVNP (talk) 11:20, 18 November 2008 (UTC)
This is a dumb article....
First of all, you are not still growing or just finished growing at the age of 25!! Hello!!!
Secondly, the characteristics that define an adult in the "graph" down below is absurd. I've seen some very mature kids and teens that meet these criteria very well and some unstable adults (whether by a fault of their own or not) living in this world.
Age of Consent in the Vatican
Where is the reference for the claim that "the age of consent for sexual relations in the Vatican is 12"?
What about skeletal maturity? The Wikipedia page on bones states that longitudinal growth stops around age 18-25. So there is when we are literally "all grown-up". Aldo L (talk) 01:46, 29 August 2010 (UTC)
Why is adolescence referred to as a "social construct" that was "created"? Isn't it a culturally, psychologically and biologically acknowledged stage in a person's life? On the Wiki page for adolescence, it is not defined as a social construct. I think there is some internal inconsistency here, with someone writing in a deliberate point of view because they have it out for teenagers. 23:30, 12 September 2011 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 126.96.36.199 (talk)
- It is defined as a social construct in the Adolescence article, though not directly called one. See the Adolescence#History section, which can certainly be expanded. Just the fact that there is inconsistency in how to define adolescence (as the lead of the Adolescence article shows) tells us that it is a social construct. It overlaps with the definition of preadolescence, and the complications come from whether or not to mark adolescence as the start of puberty or the start of the teenage stage. Puberty and the teenage stage used to occur at about the same time, but they typically do not any longer. And both aspects can be considered "the start of adolescence." And let's not forget that the age of majority (age that one is legally considered an adult) varies. So, yes, taking all that into account, adolescence is definitely socially-constructed. It has nothing to do with "having it out for teenagers." Ask yourself, "Do people generally assign 'adolescence' to non-human animals and other such living beings?" If the answer is no, which is the correct answer, then that should tell you "definite social construct." No matter how culturally, psychologically and biologically recognized. Biologically, people are either children or adults, unless (as the article notes) one's definition of "adult" is a person who is finished with puberty. But then again, people are usually finished with puberty before or by the time they turn 16. Flyer22 (talk) 15:28, 16 September 2011 (UTC)
I can't seem to find many references beyond this article that use "biological adult" as a key distinction - would I be stepping on anyone's toes if I reworked that section to focus less on terminology and more on the different ways societies have defined adulthood based on biological features? --Lunar Jesters (talk) 22:04, 29 September 2013 (UTC)
- I'm not completely sure what you mean; do you mean that the term biological adult is used significantly less than the term legal adult? If so, I'm sure that the section headings are titled by those names not as indicators that the sources use those exact terms, but rather because there is nothing better to title those sections. Titling the first one Biological status of adulthood, for example, is long-winded, as is Legal status of adulthood. By contrast, Biological adulthood and Legal adulthood are concise. As for reworking that section, as you can see, that section (and the entire article) needs reworking. I don't mind you reworking it, but I would rather something stay there in that section about the distinction (including pubertal time frames/aspects), considering that legal adulthood is a social construct that some societies do not follow. Flyer22 (talk) 22:26, 29 September 2013 (UTC)
This whole article is terrible. I was surprised to read that biological adulthood BEGINS at the onset of puberty (rather than say menarche and ejaculative competence (or whatever)). So, a 9 year old is a biological adult if she has breast buds??? I don't believe it! If this nonsense is in fact the medical and/or biological communities' definition, which I challenge to be fact, then a good valid citation is needed. The New York Times is certainly NOT adequate here. I guarantee you that a 9 year old is seeing a pediatrician and NOT an OB/Gyn (in the USA). Seems to me the whole article is in desperate need of a rewrite. The space allocated to pornography is ridiculous. The use of the phrases "the Christian Bible" (as if there is only one) and "Cannon" law (as if there is only one) is profoundly in error. I could go on, each section contains significant flaws. Adulthood has biological, social, legal, psychological/behavioral, and religious meanings. The lede's concentration on the biological and legal meaning and its ignoring the fact (imho) that the SOCIAL meaning (context dependent) is THE one most often intended is NOT the best way to proceed, imho. Please note that an 18 year old in a combat platoon is regarded (generally) as an adult, while that same person on a college campus might be considered an adolescent. (is educational adulthood another category?).188.8.131.52 (talk) 22:03, 12 October 2013 (UTC)
- As you can see above, I agree that the article is terrible. And despite currently being billed as the editor who has made the most edits to it, I didn't add most of the material in this article; the significant majority of my edits to it have been tweaks or reverts of vandalism. Flyer22 (talk) 22:12, 12 October 2013 (UTC)
- As for puberty, I have seen enough dictionaries, encyclopedias and some very good scholarly texts define a child as "between birth and puberty"; so there are definitely WP:Reliable sources that imply or outright state something along the lines of "once a child hits puberty, they are no longer a child in the biological sense" or "no longer a complete biological child." As for the legal aspect, that obviously falls under the social aspect. But you are correct that there are other social aspects, which the lead briefly addresses. Flyer22 (talk) 22:22, 12 October 2013 (UTC)