Talk:Amouli

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Requested move 12 November 2016[edit]

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: Not moved – Clear consensus against the global renaming. Some individual moves may be discussed separately. — JFG talk 15:13, 19 November 2016 (UTC)


– I propose appending "American Samoa" to the titles of articles about populated places in the US territory of American Samoa. Example: 'Aoa'Aoa, American Samoa.

Eleven American Samoa articles already follow this form, including Tafuna, American Samoa, the territory's largest settlement; this proposal is to consistently apply the convention to all populated place articles within and below the AS category. This form would be consistent with the great majority of our other US territorial populated place articles (>80% of which append the territory name), as well as with US populated place articles overall (>99% of which follow the convention).

Over the years there've been occasional moves to individual AS articles each way, with a couple removing the territory name[1][2] and some others adding it.[3][4][5] Consistently applying a single pattern is better — and if we do agree to apply a single pattern, then including the territory name is the preferable one since it squares with the majority of other US territorial articles, with the great majority of US placename articles in general, and with various reliable sources like the US Census Bureau[6][7][8], local sources[9][10][11], etc. (And of course many assorted general sites, e.g. [12][13][14][15][16][17][18], etc.) ╠╣uw [talk] 12:53, 12 November 2016 (UTC)

Thanks, but I think the idea of applying consistent naming patterns still remains. Note that one important goal here is to achieve some degree of title consistency, both within the AS category and also with the overwhelming majority of both state and territorial US articles (many of which follow the convention for reasons other than just disambiguation). ╠╣uw [talk] 14:24, 13 November 2016 (UTC)
  • Oppose group nomination as excessive disambiguation. USPLACE is a problem that should not be spread further per ignore all rules. If individual articles specifically need disambiguation they should be discussed on a case by case basis. Timrollpickering (talk) 12:42, 14 November 2016 (UTC)
  • Suppport per WP:USPLACE as these are places within the United States. Imzadi 1979  19:55, 14 November 2016 (UTC)
  • Oppose, especially when disambiguation is unnecessary. American Samoa is not part of the official names, and doubtfully is part of the common names. For ones where disambiguation is needed, perhaps it may be useful, although "(village)" adds a deal of information as well. CMD (talk) 06:05, 15 November 2016 (UTC)
  • Oppose American Samoa is not part of the United States, and WP:USPLACE does not apply. It is a possession of the United States, but shares its culture (and language) with Samoa and has more in common with Samoa than the United States. There is no need to import a usage which is familiar in the U.S. but is out of place in the Samoan Islands.--Mhockey (talk) 22:28, 15 November 2016 (UTC)
American Samoa is indeed part of the United States, as affirmed by recent RfCs and mediation — please see the update at Talk:United States, as well as our articles on the the US, its geography, etc. ╠╣uw [talk] 00:39, 16 November 2016 (UTC)
Well it depends on who you ask. Without wishing to reopen last year's RfC, which was about how to define the United States in the WP article on the United States, the Supreme Court (report here) has recently confirmed that those born in AS are not US citizens by birth, because they were not born in the US. The Internal Revenue Code (s.7701) defines the United States as the States and DC. The AS government controls immigration under rules which are quite different from those in the US. The point is, American Samoa is different. If you have been there you will know that it is more Samoan than American.--Mhockey (talk) 01:54, 16 November 2016 (UTC)
Who we ask are many reliable sources; the US mediation and RfC recently did that in very great depth, and did consider immigration, the IRS, and many other factors. The result was a geographical definition of the United States that explicitly includes both states and territories, based on the preponderance of reliable sources. I won't re-debate all of that here; I'll simply say that in the context of a discussion on geographic features, it's best if we stick to our own agreed-upon geographic definitions and geographic guidelines. ╠╣uw [talk] 11:42, 16 November 2016 (UTC)
  • Oppose. Totally pointless and unnecessary. Why add more words than we need? -- Necrothesp (talk) 14:07, 16 November 2016 (UTC)
Because they are needed – to make titles in this category consistent with each other, to make them consistent with the form followed by nearly all our other 40,000+ US state and territorial articles, to follow reliable sources, to reflect common US usage... basically for all the various reasons we've repeatedly affirmed USPLACE as our guideline for US places. Thanks, ╠╣uw [talk] 17:32, 16 November 2016 (UTC)
  • Support as a reasonable application of WP:USPLACE and precision more generally. Dicklyon (talk) 05:51, 18 November 2016 (UTC)
  • Oppose. Completely unnecessary. Neodop (talk) 11:25, 18 November 2016 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.