Talk:Apache (instrumental)

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I can't fix this right now, but the Sugar Hill Gang's song "Apache" -- which I found on several different pages -- links here. I don't know exactly what the problem is, but if someoe could fix it that'd be great.


I changed this article as you can see, becouse it seems that most of music-related articles are edited by some people aged about 20 that are used to get information only from very old or very recent sources, maybe their 60 y/o parents and their college friends. So, in the definitions of facts, the experience of 1970s, 1980s, 1990s are missing at all. This is a sort of POV.Brian Wilson 00:17, 26 May 2006 (UTC)

dance moves[edit]

no talk about the hip-dancing thing?Spencerk 03:40, 5 June 2006 (UTC)

Feel frree to reference any further cover version that you are aware of in section 4 Brian W 11:13, 5 June 2006 (UTC)

The dance is iconic in popular culture, I think there should be at least one sentence mentioning it. I do not know where it originated, does anybody else? RealFerrari (talk) 08:46, 23 November 2007 (UTC)

Jump on It[edit]

Jump on It is more than a "minor hit." It has been featured in several movies. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 66.214.200.130 (talkcontribs) .

Chronology of Apache[edit]

The main article would be improved if it included a chronology of rock bands playing it.

For instance, which years did the following groups release their versions of Apache?

The Aces
Dave Allan and the Arrows
The Ventures
Dick Dale and the Dell-Tones

And that, I think, just touches the tip of the iceberg.

Matos[edit]

I grabbed a few notes from Michaelangelo Matos's abstract for All Roads Lead to “Apache”, but now I see that the paper itself is online. Should be a goldmine for anyone who wants to work seriously on this article. - Jmabel | Talk 08:35, 5 March 2007 (UTC)

Shadows’ version[edit]

“Considered revolutionary for its twangy use of guitar?” What about Duane Eddy? —Wiki Wikardo 08:37, 13 January 2008 (UTC)

Article name/move[edit]

Why isn’t this just at Apache (song)? —Wiki Wikardo 20:11, 13 January 2008 (UTC)

Looking at this history, it was moved from Apache (song) to Apache (single) in 2005, following brief discussion here and the conclusion that, as it has no vocals, it is not a "song". It was moved again to Apache (instrumental) in 2006, and then again to Apache (The Shadows song) in 2008. Given that the Shadows version is mainly known to older UK readers, and that US and/or younger readers are more likely to encounter the Ingmann or Incredible Bongo Band versions, there is a case for it to be moved again to a less band-specific title (especially as they did not write it). But, what to? Ghmyrtle (talk) 16:56, 27 August 2009 (UTC)
PS: After some thought, my view is that it should be moved back to Apache (instrumental). I've raised this at User talk:TenPoundHammer, who moved it to its current title. Ghmyrtle (talk) 10:24, 28 August 2009 (UTC)
PPS: Moved back to Apache (instrumental). Ghmyrtle (talk) 19:42, 28 August 2009 (UTC)

Sugarhill Apache[edit]

Sugarhill Gang's Apache wasnt really a cover. Vastly different delivery, different lyrics, different genre, parts which do not line up evenly. I think it needs its own article, with a link to this one. The phrase "Jump on It" originated there (Therefore the Sir Mix-a-Lot version needs a page too). Add that to the Fresh Prince reference, and the two songs have completely different auras.

Besides, this page is pretty cluttered and unorganized. I say, new page(s) for at least the two aformentioned songs, with credit going back to this one. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Atari2 (talkcontribs) 01:38, 24 June 2010 (UTC)

Now that I think about it, wouldn't the page "Apache (song)" be an appropriate idea? "Song" is for those with lyrics, "Instrumental" only instruments. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Atari2 (talkcontribs) 01:39, 24 June 2010 (UTC)

This article has gone through various titles - see thread above. It's a complicated story - the original recordings were instrumentals not "songs", as was the Incredible Bongo Band version from which the beats for the later versions came, and which itself (in terms of melody etc.) was clearly derived from the original Shadows version (or the Ingmann version which was better known in the US). I don't know the Sugarhill Gang version, but it seems as though it was only a minor hit and therefore probably not notable enough for its own article. The same comments apply, in my view, to the Sir Mix-a-lot song. So, on balance, I think the current title is best, and the article should reflect all the versions, as it currently does. But I agree that the article itself needs to be greatly improved - far too many lists, and not enough clarity as to which version covered or sampled which other version. Ghmyrtle (talk) 08:06, 24 June 2010 (UTC)

You sure it's not musically signifigant? Like I said, Fresh Prince did a bit on it, Evolution of dance (with its almost 150 million views) referenced it others sampled the sugarhill version, a google search yields about 5.8 million hits, a youtube search around 7 million views on relevant videos. That's almost 200 million reasons for an article. Atari2 (talk) 21:02, 25 June 2010 (UTC)

Are charts always the only indicator? If you go with charts, then Jimi Hedrix, Gath Brooks and Public Enemy only deserve one page. Plus, it was the flagship track on a top-15 R&B album I'm just saying that there's other things that seperate that version from the instrumental enough that they could be two articles (I.E. Apache (song)/Apache (Jump on It) and Apache (instrumental)) where the latter is mentioned heavily in the former as an example. I'm not saying give every song that ever sampled Apache an article, but Sugarhill some seperate credit for starting it and for having some cultural relevance. The songs that sampled the Incredible Bongo band could be listed here or put in a seperate category, and the five that sampled sugarhill on that other page. Atari2 (talk) 21:02, 25 June 2010 (UTC)

I didn't say anything about any version not being musically significant - I said it might not be notable in terms of Wikipedia's guidance on the notability of songs, which is here. If you want to go ahead and write separate articles on the different songs, go ahead, but it may be that other editors will take the view that they are not sufficiently notable to justify standalone articles. Ghmyrtle (talk) 21:15, 25 June 2010 (UTC)

Other cover versions[edit]

For years, when I listened to Lumpy Gravy, I knew that the riff that Zappa works off of had to come from somewhere else. Tonight I finally tracked it down to Apache. I'm not sure how to express that in the article, but it needs to be mentioned in some fashion. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Rpking (talkcontribs) 05:16, 5 June 2015 (UTC)

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Traffic load differences[edit]

Today, Google has made reference to this song in an achievement in its Google Doodle. This may increase the amount of people viewing this article.10:22, 11 August 2017 (UTC)2602:306:C559:8860:B0F6:A897:6DB9:977E (talk)

Sonny James version with lyrics[edit]

just heard a version with lyrics credited to Sonny James on internet radio station the OldiesProject,

according to discogs his version is from or at least released in 1961 https://www.discogs.com/Sonny-James-Apache-Magnetism/release/9802043 It's mentioned (linking back to here) in his discography but not mentioning that his version has Native American themed lyrics - discogs credits it to "Jerry Lordan" & "Johnny Flamingo" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sonny_James_discography 109.144.211.138 (talk) 15:18, 17 October 2017 (UTC)

This is very interesting. "Johnny Flamingo" was a stage name of Melvin Moore, and there is much background information in this article. I shall delve into this further when I have a moment. Ghmyrtle (talk) 15:32, 17 October 2017 (UTC)