Talk:Brigham Young University

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Good article Brigham Young University has been listed as one of the Social sciences and society good articles under the good article criteria. If you can improve it further, please do so. If it no longer meets these criteria, you can reassess it.
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Incorrect attribution[edit]

Philo Taylor Farnsworth is not an alumnus of BYU and did not receive a B.S. from the institution. (As stated in the longer, more detailed list of alumni.) I do not know what your source for such a claim would be. He may have received an honorary Doctorate degree from BYU in 1968, just a few years before his death, but back when he was first living in Provo in 1923-24, and doing his early work on television, he attended Brigham Young High School. He did enroll at BYU later, but the professors at BYU would not allow him to attend the university advanced courses he wanted to, and they did not recognise his previous course work. (He had already attended high school in Idaho, and done correspondence classes at the University of Utah) In fact, he had such a low regard for his professors, and they paid so little attention to him, that he soon became impatient with his whole setup at BYU, and he joined the Navy on a whim. This decision was short-lived, because he worried over patent rights to his inventions. He later returned to BYU again, but left after attending the university for only a single year, without graduating. Of course, after his reputation grew, BYU was more than happy to turn around and claim him.

As for the softer claim in the wiki article (under "notable research & awards") that he "received his education at BYU," this too is misleading, for the reasons stated above. He may have been at the university for a year, but he already established his television theories in high school in Idaho, and his first university course work was "correspondence," at the University of Utah. If anything (if they bothered to listen to him) he would have educated his BYU professors.

I say this without any malice toward BYU. I am a BYU alumnus myself. But the representation of Philo Farnsworth as a BYU alumnus is simply not true and I believe the site should be edited to reflect that. I know this as not only a Farnsworth biographer, but also a member of his family (his grand-nephew). The information I have on his life is from his wife's biography and summarized here: ( Playerpage (talk) 21:40, 24 April 2015 (UTC)

My understanding of the word "alumnus" could mean either graduate or former student. According to the American Heritage Dictionary, an alumnus or alumna is either someone who has attended the school (or a "former student of a school") or someone who has graduated from the school. ( Wikipedia has similar definition. "An alumnus (masculine, plural alumni) or alumna (feminine, plural alumnae) is a former student or pupil of a school, college, or university. Commonly, but not always, the word refers to a graduate of the educational institute in question. An alumnus can also be a former member, employee, contributor, or inmate, as well as a former student. ( As such, using the term alumnus in reference to Philo Farnsworth is technically correct. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jurisdicta (talkcontribs) 23:29, 30 July 2015 (UTC)

Conflict with "Harold B Lee Library" wiki[edit]

I posted this on the Harold B Lee Library wiki talk page but I'll put it here too... On this page it states in the first paragraph that BYU is the "third-largest private university in the U.S.", however on the Harold B Lee library Wiki it states that BYU is the "second largest private university in the U.S.". This is my second post on WIKI (after the post on the HBL library page, made approx. five minutes ago) so IDK where to take it from here, I just noticed the discrepancy and wanted to point it out. thx --mike (talk) 02:52, 30 January 2014 (UTC)

There seems to be some disagreement about this on other websites as well. Some say second, some say third. (They are probably all copying from Wikipedia...) USC and NYU definitely have more students than BYU, so I would think it is the third largest. If University of Phoenix were counted, BYU would be fourth largest, though. I will change to third in the HBLL article and add references to—SuperRad! 07:10, 5 February 2014 (UTC)
There is no way that BYU is the third-largest private university in the U.S. Even a quick glance at our own article on this topic shows how implausible it is that an institution of this size can come close to comparing with the larger for-profit institutions and I question the quality of any source that says otherwise. You can continue to narrow the scope of the comparison (e.g., most populous not-for-profit private physical campus by headcount) until BYU comes out in the top __ but at a certain point that becomes a silly fishing expedition once the list of qualifiers becomes laughably long. ElKevbo (talk) 17:13, 5 February 2014 (UTC)
First The Wiki page for the Harlod B. Lee libary is not reliable and should be thrown out.
The key word is PRIVATE university. The confusion is understandable. The statement was originally linked to List of the largest United States colleges and universities by enrollment. That page should never have been linked, since it is of ALL universities, not just private. Also, just to answer the question I know is coming a For-Profit university is not that same a private university. A university can be both or only one, For-Profit or private. I went to a For-Profit pubic university. No I don't know what made it that, but it is irrelevant.
Wikipedia is about Verifiability, not truth and since the cited source is reliable ("Brigham Young University, Provo". 2013. Retrieved 2014-02-05. ) and it reads

It is owned and operated by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, also known as the Mormon Church. It is the third largest private university in the United States.

the statement is verifiable and cited, it doesn't matter if it's true or not. --ARTEST4ECHO (talk/contribs) 17:52, 5 February 2014 (UTC)
That list does include private and public institutions but it's trivial to focus only on the private ones to see that BYU still doesn't make the cut.
With all due respect, it seems like you're very confused on a number of fundamental issues. First, you're completely incorrect about the distinctions between public/private and for-profit/not-for-profit. All public institutions are de jure not-for-profit institutions. Private institutions can be for-profit or not-for-profit.
Second, it's clear to anyone with some knowledge of U.S. higher education that an institution with only 35,000 students isn't going to be at or near the top of any national enrollment chart unless that chart has some very significant constraints or narrow criteria. BYU is a large institution but it simply can't compare with the largest public universities or the largest private, for-profit universities especially if we're looking at headcount and not FTE. A quick dump from IPEDS as a sanity check shows that BYU comes up sixth in 2012 Fall FTE enrollment behind Liberty (72,904), NYU (44,516), Western Governors (40,320), USC (39,958), and Excelsior (34,563) with BYU reporting 34,409. That's FTE so the story might change if we could look at headcount (which I don't see immediately available but I'm not spending any more time looking) but I'd be very surprised if that changed things much since BYU appears to have mostly full-time students.
That you've found one source that has an obviously incorrect statement doesn't mean that we have to repeat that incorrect statement. In fact, it raises questions about the reliability of that source if it can get such a basic fact so obviously wrong. (In fairness, the statement is probably meant to focus only on not-for-profit institutions and it may also be intended to focus on headcount enrollment at a single, physical campus. But that leads us back to the point above that if we continue to make increasingly narrow parameters we can certainly find some list of universities where BYU comes out on or near the top but such a list may not be useful or meaningful if it's especially narrow or convoluted.)
Will you now please remove the obviously incorrect statement from this article? Thanks! ElKevbo (talk) 18:59, 5 February 2014 (UTC)

Given the abundance of evidence that this claim is incorrect, that another editor has agreed (at WP:RSN) that the cited source doesn't appear to be very reliable, and ARTEST4ECHO's lack of response, I've removed the problematic claim from the article. Please find a more reliable source if you plan to restore this information.

I also removed the claim about BYU being the largest religious university in the U.S. Liberty University enrolls over twice as many students so this claim is also wildly inaccurate. ElKevbo (talk) 17:52, 8 February 2014 (UTC)

I know I'm coming into this post over a year late, but I've restored the wording in the introduction to read that BYU is indeed the third largest private and largest religious university in the U.S. For backing up the claim of "Third Largest," I went with the original source link, which had never been removed, but which previous post-ers here questioned as "obviously incorrect." But that statement itself is obviously incorrect. "" makes clear on their page outlinging their methodology ( that they get their data by compiling it from an array of major sources. These sources are:

US News & World Report,

Princeton Review,


Washington Monthly,

Wall Street Journal,

Business Week, and

If that isn't a reliable list, then I don't know what else could possibly be reliable or relevant. For the claim that BYU is the largest religious institution, I think we need to understand that EVERY University is playing by their own rules. ElKevbo cited Liberty University as being bigger, but a cursory glance at their page shows that they include online enrollment in their statistics--something that BYU and many other institutions do not do. I actually called the BYU stats department to find out why this was, and was told that it was because it is not a Federal requirement. Not to say that it is against the guidelines, but it is not required either. So those other religious institutions are (fairly) gaming the system. Boots on the ground, BYU is far larger. I did go back and make reference to BYU's online program in general, because there are places where its programs are spoken of in broad terms. From what I can tell, if BYU were to take the time to publish the numbers, it might very well blow its competition out of the water in the Virtual Realm as well. Playerpage (talk) 21:17, 20 April 2015 (UTC)

marriage average isn't updated and probably wrong[edit]

1)It doesn't make much sense that the women's national marriage average is 27 and the men average is 25, That should be double checked.

2) aside of that it is unclear if the national maiden age is talking about the US or just Utah. It is also not mentioned when this servery was done. The average probably changes all the time, so you should put the date this research was done.

3) There are plenty of different respectable sources that give different ages and I'm not sure Wikipedia has the right facts.

please take care of this issue. thank you anyway. — Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 07:49, 23 April 2014 (UTC)

Merge proposal: Inscape (journal) to Brigham Young University[edit]

Inscape (journal) has been tagged for notability for over six years and is likely to be deleted. However, it could be potentially useful as a merge and redirect. Boleyn (talk) 13:27, 24 August 2014 (UTC)

As there has been no objection, I will merge now. Boleyn (talk) 13:28, 7 January 2015 (UTC)

Well, 10 hours later it was deemed not notable enough and removed. Then why hasn't the original article, which now is a useless redirect, been deleted? --Xario (talk) 17:58, 9 July 2015 (UTC)

External links modified[edit]

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N Archived sources still need to be checked

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