Talk:Al-Masih ad-Dajjal

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Pronunciation of the name is incorrect[edit]

The name is Arabic derived and it should be spelled as Al-Dajjal and not Ad-Dajjal. Ad-Dajjal is an absolute wrong pronunciation for the name. The name in Arabic is الدجال , first letters are A and L which compares to "The" in English. Then دجال which consist of D, G, A, L. Pronounced Dajjal. The first A and L would make it equivalent to "The Dajjal" , the Arabic equivalent of Al-Dajjal. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.224.39.159 (talk) 02:32, 23 December 2010 (UTC)

  • There are different accepted ways to transliterate Arabic. The Arabic definite article or lam taʿrīf is assimilated before so-called 'solar consonants', that is dentals and alveolars. Hence

the pronunciation is actually ad-daǧǧāl. However, to more easily identify the morphology of the word, some transcribers prefer to always write the def. article as al-.--Simha (talk) 13:01, 29 December 2010 (UTC)

Spelling[edit]

Should be unified throughout the article. Either dajjal or daǧǧāl, the latter is preferable. Especially the eschatology section is a mess. Mistakes include grammar "ḥadīth ... give". Ḥadīth is singular, so *gives* or use the plural, either anglicized as ḥadīths or Arabic aḥadīth. Length is sometimes indicated as in nūrī, sometimes not as in kafir read kāfir etc.--Simha (talk) 13:01, 29 December 2010 (UTC)

place where ad-dajjal will appear?[edit]

it is written in the article: between syria and iraq. the place is sometimes named as sebbiah (or equal). more information needed to add to article, please help! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 180.222.136.15 (talk) 23:11, 31 March 2011 (UTC)

source: bouhari, fayzailu'l medina 9, muslim, feetan 123: Mohammad (S.A.W.) said: except mekka and madina there will be no land dajjal wont trample down. All gateways to mekka and madina will be each guarded by angels, who protect this places. (dajjal) will appear at the place named as-sabbeeha. then it will shake the community of madi...na with three quakes. on the verge of this, all unbelievers and hypocriticals (who stay in the city) will come (leave the city for dajjal).194.98.43.12 (talk) 18:32, 1 April 2011 (UTC)

The prophet (S.A.W),mentioned in a hadeeth that al-dajjal will appear from Esfahan,in Iran.Alhanuty (talk) 02:16, 14 February 2014 (UTC)

not true, some of his followers are Jews from Isfahan as mentioned in the hadith, please don't write before you have checked your sources and please give proof for your statement. --Şahrazade (talk) 16:33, 5 July 2016 (UTC)

Reference[edit]

I have given the reference of Ahmadiyya beliefs. Admins. see the reference please don' the edit. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Nokhaiz Kaunpal (talkcontribs) 12:09, 22 April 2011 (UTC)

shia[edit]

shias do not believe the dajjal will kill madhi, leave it blank i dont know what they believe but I am sure it is not that — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ambelland (talkcontribs) 22:36, 16 October 2011 (UTC)

Signs[edit]

There is a big problem..after every 2 to 3 months, the signs of Dajjal are being changed by some people, there should be some reference to these signs other wise I suggest the senior users to remove them as after years these "fake" signs would become true.. HunterZone (talk) 18:39, 5 November 2011 (UTC)

There is way more signs into it.Alhanuty (talk) 04:21, 14 February 2014 (UTC)

Ahmadiyya Belief[edit]

I have taken down Ahmadiyya belief from this page, this page represents the Islamic View Of False Masih where as Ahamdi's are declared as non muslims in Pakistan this is the state from where ahamdiyya's originated see Mirza_Ghulam_Ahmad and Ahmadiyya. Please refain from adding this section back. Best way to represent Ahamdi's point of view is to create a new page with Ahamdi belief. I removed ahamdis view as par WP:MOSISLAM. Thanks — Preceding unsigned comment added by Virgininfatuation (talkcontribs) 10:40, 14 September 2013 (UTC)

The fact that the Government of Pakistan has declared that the Ahmadiyya are not Muslim has nothing to do with Wikipedia. We are not bound by their dictates. The Ahmadiyya say they are Muslim and Wikipedia reflects that. Also there is nothing in WP:MOSISLAM that suggests removing their views from any article. In fact Wikipedia:Manual of Style/Islam-related articles#Sunni, Shi'a, Sufi and Ahmadiyya Islam states the an Islamic sect. Also if you had read the guideline properly you would have seen that adding Peace Be Upon Him is incorrect. CambridgeBayWeather (talk) 19:11, 14 September 2013 (UTC)

Ahmadiyah are not Muslims,they have conflicting beliefs way different that other Muslims,as Sunnis or Shias,even different that Sufis,so my arguement,put it in another article,as the Christians belief in the anti-Christ.Alhanuty (talk) 16:43, 14 February 2014 (UTC)

Warren Ellis' Supergod[edit]

The comic book series Supergod includes a character named Dajjal, based on this idea. Perhaps this should be included? ComicVine Reference 198.255.175.17 (talk) 19:21, 24 January 2014 (UTC)

This article is about an evil-person that both Christians and Muslims believe will wreak havoc and trials on the entire planet,this article is not about a comic thing,this is about something very serious.Alhanuty (talk) 02:19, 14 February 2014 (UTC)

(This article is about an evil-person that only Muslims believe...)* From the Christian perspective your Mahdi is identical to our antichrist. Your version of Jesus is identical to our false prophet, and most importantly Isa son of Mary comes holding on to the wings of two fallen angels, NOT RIDING A WHITE HORSE DESTROYING FILTH. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.65.213.70 (talk) 06:06, 25 February 2014 (UTC)

Description of ad Dajjaal[edit]

he will be red im complexion,short,one eyed,with thick curly hair,pigeon toed,hunch backed,with a large forehead — Preceding unsigned comment added by 197.157.0.5 (talkcontribs)

Please cite a reliable source for new statements. Ian.thomson (talk) 16:02, 8 May 2014 (UTC)

Requested move 11 January 2016[edit]

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: not moved. Number 57 00:26, 20 January 2016 (UTC)


Masih ad-DajjalImposter Messiah – The current title "al-Masih ad-Dajjal" is no more than a transliteration of the Arabic title "المسيح الدجال". Since the English Wikipedia is supposed to have the titles of its articles in the English language instead of having them transliterated from other languages, I think it will be better to rename it. Religions Explorer (talk) 06:29, 11 January 2016 (UTC)

Please note that the nominator was blocked indefinitely for contentious, disruptive editing and block evasion. - HyperGaruda (talk) 12:17, 13 January 2016 (UTC)
@In ictu oculi: The Arabic word (الدجال) roughly translates to (Imposter). It doesn't translate to the word (false) under any circumstances. One more thing you need to notice is that the suggested new title is (Imposter Messiah "with capital M"). This is different from (imposter messiah "with small m"). The one with "M" capital letter is a name, not an adjective, and it refers to the specific figure in the books of hadiths.--Explorer999 (talk) 09:36, 11 January 2016 (UTC)
  • Comment I think Religions Explorer/Explorer999 (apparently same user) has a valid point in saying that English titles are preferable. In ictu oculi also has a valid point; no matter if we say "false" or "imposter", it's not unique to Islam as such. I'd be okay with moving to Imposter Messiah (Islam) to make it clear for the reader. Jeppiz (talk) 10:27, 11 January 2016 (UTC)
  • Comment I think the closest (not necessarily literal) translation is "Antichrist". What about Antichrist in Islam? False Messiah, Imposter Messiah has connotations outside the concept of Dajjal, i.e. people claiming to be the return of Isa (Jesus), and they are describes as false messiah by certain groups and individuals. The lede itself makes a comparison with Antichrist.--Peaceworld 10:43, 11 January 2016 (UTC)
That is a very good point, I'd support Antichrist in Islam if it conforms to usage in Islam. Jeppiz (talk) 11:24, 11 January 2016 (UTC)
I disagree. "Antichrist" is a Christian term. It refers to the figure opposed to their Christ. Muslims don't use these Christian terms. In Islam, we say (Messiah/Imposter Messiah), we don't say (Christ/Antichrist).--Explorer999 (talk) 11:37, 11 January 2016 (UTC)
According to Christ, "Christ" is synonymous to Jesus, and in fact is a translations of the word "Messiah". In fact Google translate, translates "المسيح الدجّال‎" (transliteration: al-Masih ad-Dajjal) as "Antichrist". "Christ" is as much 'Christian' as the word "Messiah".--Peaceworld 17:49, 11 January 2016 (UTC)
  • Oppose. If the current title is incorrect, and the case has yet to be made that it is, then I agree that the rename could be to "False messiah (Islam)" or "Imposter messiah (Islam)". "False messiah" and "Imposter messiah" are generic terms that should continue to redirect to an article covering all religions so that the reader can get a general idea of the concept and then branch out in whichever direction they choose to go, not be sent in one direction which may not be what they want. Those generic names should not be usurped for an article that only covers one religion. Also, there is more to this than just the concept of the Dajjal and Antichrist. Many of the would-be messiahs, who failed to live up to their billing, were not intentional imposters. Many were just delusional people who believed their own hype. Redirecting "False Messiah" and "Imposter messiah" to an article which covers all these things seems the best way to give people the complete story. --DanielRigal (talk) 20:49, 11 January 2016 (UTC)
  • Oppose. While on its own dajjal might mean "imposter", translating combinations of words requires a different approach. I agree with In ictu oculi that "False messiah" is a better vernacular and more recognisable translation of Masih ad-Dajjal. I wouldn't oppose a move to False messiah (Islam) or something similar. - HyperGaruda (talk) 12:17, 13 January 2016 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

No Koran section???[edit]

I feel like there should first be a section just sumerizing what The Koran says about him before getting into the Hadiths and stuff.--JaredMithrandir (talk) 14:13, 21 February 2016 (UTC)

Grammar[edit]

I hate to be a grammar nazi; but if the grammar is so warped that I can't figure out what is being said, then the passage has to be deleted. So I deleted this, from the lede: "He will be an anti-messiah figure, Muslims consider him to be the Antichrist, and to Armilus, in Christian and medieval Jewish eschatology, respectively." He will what to Armilus?

MrDemeanour (talk) 12:54, 28 March 2016 (UTC)

Root of Dajjal[edit]

Hi the root of Dajjal is دجل (d-j-l) not da-j-l as written. Arabic roots most commonly are three radicals or sometimes four, but for sure not in this case. Just x-out the a please, the article is blocked unfortunately --Şahrazade (talk) 16:27, 5 July 2016 (UTC)

Proof: Hans Wehr I, p. 272 — Preceding unsigned comment added by Şahrazade (talkcontribs) 16:37, 5 July 2016 (UTC)