Talk:Darth Vader

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Former good article Darth Vader was one of the Media and drama good articles, but it has been removed from the list. There are suggestions below for improving the article to meet the good article criteria. Once these issues have been addressed, the article can be renominated. Editors may also seek a reassessment of the decision if they believe there was a mistake.
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Edit Request[edit]

Under occupation in the information box it says "Anakin Skywalker: Jedi Master", that should be jedi knight as Vader never obtained the master rank. 2A02:181F:0:80A7:B89D:6E67:EF3C:2679 (talk) 16:33, 10 December 2015 (UTC)

This still hasn't been fixed. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 166.171.184.123 (talk) 15:53, 4 March 2016 (UTC)

AwesomenessOfJedi[edit]

This is want it should look like:

First Appearance: Star Wars

Last Appearance: Anakin Skywalker: Revenge of the Sith Darth Vader: Star Wars Rebels — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.27.83.32 (talk) 20:53, 17 February 2016 (UTC)

Appearances section[edit]

I'm probably pulling myself out of a rabbit hole and try to go ahead and trim the appearances section down to a manageable size, so we can possibly nominate this for GA or FA again, using Jabba the Hutt or Jason Voorhees (both FAs) as references. Really, I think we can cut down some of the minor parts and trivia and unnecessary plot detail, I think it would work fine. I already trimmed down the animation section, but I'm opening a discussion on the talk page and see if we can get any thoughts on this matter regarding the trilogies. Thoughts? Lord Sjones23 (talk - contributions) 14:06, 27 May 2016 (UTC)

First thought is they look a little exhaustive, almost scene-by-scene of what he does. If we're wedded to the idea that his major story arc is his rise, fall, and redemption, most of the appearances stuff should anchor itself pretty closely to that plot thread. I'll take a more deliberate look this afternoon and try to bounce some ideas for trims or cuts back here. --EEMIV (talk) 14:17, 27 May 2016 (UTC)
Yep, I would agree that a scene-by-scene description is a little too much. Lord Sjones23 (talk - contributions) 21:30, 27 May 2016 (UTC)
A bit late, but took a copyediting swing at the OT. I'll do likewise for the prequels, but OT looks pretty tight -- more more trimming and the prose becomes pretty stale and difficult to read. --EEMIV (talk) 15:23, 2 June 2016 (UTC)
I removed a couple of lines about Skywalker being appointed to the Council, spying on Palpy, not getting the title, etc. They're a bit trivial with regard to the overall arch. That said, I'm pretty sure this is in Chris Taylor's book about Star Wars: RotS went through some rewrites that muddled Anakin's motivations. His despondency with the Jedi was initially a stronger motivator for his fall, and his frustrations re. title, spying, etc. are vestiges of that. It could be those plot details are worth retaining, but in that case it'd probably be good (and more illustrative) to explain his e.g. frustration with the Jedi and sense of torn allegiances. --EEMIV (talk) 15:51, 2 June 2016 (UTC)
While I'm still trying to get the depiction section trimmed down to size, I'm using the Star Wars databank as reliable sources. I think we should also include some more information from different RS as well as with Ahsoka Tano. Does anyone have thoughts about this?
Also, are there any thoughts about the following proposals as possible paragraphs for the prequel trilogy section:
Anakin first appears in the prequel trilogy as a slave living on the planet Tatooine in The Phantom Menace, which takes place 32 years before Star Wars. Owned by the junk dealer Watto and living with his single mother Shmi, Anakin is a pilot and mechanic, and is the creator of a robotic protocol droid, C-3PO. When Jedi Master Qui-Gon Jinn meets Anakin, he discovers that Anakin's blood has a unusually high level of midi-chlorians and is convinced that he is the "Chosen One" of Jedi prophecy who will bring balance to the Force. Qui-Gon wagers Anakin's freedom with Watto in a podrace, which Anakin wins. Anakin joins the group to be trained as a Jedi and befriends Padmé Amidala, the young ruler of Naboo, in the process. After Anakin is escorted to Coruscant, Qui-Gon asks the Jedi Council for permission to train Anakin, but they refuse out of concern for the boy's vulnerability to the dark side. When the Trade Federation invades Naboo, Anakin inadvertently joins the battle against the Federation droid control ship in space. Anakin ventures into the ship and destroys it from within, deactivating the droid army. After the Trade Federation is defeated, the Jedi Council reluctantly accepts Obi-Wan's request to train Anakin as a Padawan apprentice.
In Attack of the Clones, which takes place 10 years after The Phantom Menace concludes, Chancellor Palpatine assigns Obi-Wan and Anakin to investigate an assassination attempt on Padmé. Anakin travels with her to Naboo, where they eventually fall in love. When Anakin has a vision of Shmi in pain, however, he travels to Tatooine to rescue her. While at the Lars homestead, Anakin discovers that his mother was captured by Tusken Raiders. Although he locates Shmi at the Tusken campsite, she dies in his arms. Anakin, enraged, massacres the Tuskens and returns to the Lars homestead to bury Shmi. Anakin and Padmé travel to Geonosis to rescue Obi-Wan from the Sith Lord Count Dooku, only to end up being captured and sentenced to death along with Obi-Wan. As Anakin and Padmé profess their love for each other, they and Obi-Wan are rescued by an army of Clone Troopers and the Jedi. Anakin and Obi-Wan eventually confront Dooku, but they are subdued and Anakin loses his arm. Eventually, Anakin marries Padmé in secret.
In Revenge of the Sith, which takes place during the conclusion of The Clone Wars. Anakin and Obi-Wan rescue Palpatine in a space battle over Coruscant. When the Jedi encounter Dooku, Anakin subdues and kills Dooku on Palpatine's orders. After returning to Coruscant, Anakin learns that Padmé is pregnant with his child. However, Anakin has visions of Padmé dying during childbirth, and is determined to prevent them from coming true. Palpatine tells Anakin using the dark side of the Force, including the ability to help save a dying person. Although Anakin tells Jedi Master Mace Windu about Palpatine's true identity as Darth Sidious, he inadvertently helps Palpatine kill Windu. In a desperate attempt to save Padmé's life, Anakin pledges himself to the dark side and becomes Palpatine's apprentice, Darth Vader. During the Great Jedi Purge, Vader leads a legion of clones to kill everyone at the Jedi Temple. After Vader massacres the remaining Separatist leaders hiding on Mustafar, he meets up with Padmé, who implores Vader to leave the dark side. Vader refuses, and when he sees Obi-Wan, he chokes Padmé into unconsciousness. Obi-Wan duels and subdues Vader, leaving him for dead on the bank of a lava river. Palpatine recovers the badly burnt Vader and takes him back to Coruscant, where Vader's body is rebuilt and fitted with a black armored suit. Subsequently, Palpatine tells Vader that he killed Padmé in his anger. As the film concludes, Vader supervises the construction of the first Death Star along with Palpatine and Wilhuff Tarkin.
I think that this will benefit the prequel trilogy section if we try to simply de-fluff the section's scene-by-scene detail (we don't need to know everything that is going on when writing a character biography but only the crucial information; the detailed fictional information can be sent to a Wikia page) and just focus on Anakin's fall to the dark side in this manner. I'll see what I can do to do a complete rewrite of the original trilogy section of the article as well if it is necessary. For the creation section, we should include the writing and voice acting as well. If there are any other ideas, please feel free to add to it. Thanks, Lord Sjones23 (talk - contributions) 01:42, 24 September 2016 (UTC)
I think it looks good overall. But (and you knew there was one). From a real-world perspective, ROTS is not Anakin's final film appearance, as the Clone Wars film, despite taking place earlier, was released after. While not a main saga film, and really just the pilot for the tv series, it was theatrically released, and matters of canon, importance, etc. are too INUNIVERSE for Wikipedia. oknazevad (talk) 17:17, 24 September 2016 (UTC)
I agree that matters of canon, importance and so on are too WP:INUNIVERSE to be included. Information like this would have to be sent to another wiki like Wookieepedia for example. Unfortunately, while I mostly agree with the recent copyediting and rewording efforts by others such as this one, I think we still need to continue discussion on how we should reword the prequel trilogy and the original trilogy so we can get a fair consensus and get this up to GA or FA. In the meantime, I've reworded the proposals above. Lord Sjones23 (talk - contributions) 01:31, 25 September 2016 (UTC)
The draft above and the current article language seem apt to me. My own approach to this type of content has been, and same as Sjones23 mentions, is to pull out scene-by-scene plot summary and keep the focus on the character itself; anyone interested in the bigger storyline picture can go to the article about the film, series, etc. In that regard, the Prequel appearances section seems apt. --EEMIV (talk) 15:50, 25 September 2016 (UTC)

Potentially useful references for animation/character development[edit]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AaMo-Z-ofcc and https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=slwtHYyKMbY have a panel discussion with Dave Filoni, Henry Gilroy and Kilian Plunkett. I was listening for nuggets to use with The Force (Star Wars), and just heard a neat bit in the second video, starting ~10 or 11-minute mark, about Anakin and his skill development relative to e.g. Obi-Wan. Didn't have my Anakin/Vader filters on when I started at it, so could be there're some other useful things in there, too. --EEMIV (talk) 14:59, 27 May 2016 (UTC)