Talk:Date format by country

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Kenya?[edit]

The map shows Kenya as "DMY, YMD" but the chart shows Kenya as "DMY, MDY, YMD." Which is correct? Kamusisto (talk) 07:10, 5 February 2017 (UTC)

Untitled[edit]

There is at least one mistake in the section with map. Table says that both YMD and DMY systems (green) are used by 10 mln people. At the same time on the map Poland is marked green (not sure if this is correct BTW - I mean people have no problem understanding YMD but they almost exclusively use DMY; also the next table says that Poland is DMY-only, so there's inconsistency) and population of Poland alone is 38 mln. Also I added all values in the table and I got 5170 mln. Are the unmarked territories (mostly in Africa) really account for the remaining ~1730 mln? (edit: just checked in the Demographics of Africa article - the whole Africa population is estimated at 1 billion) Sadi (talk) 18:26, 1 March 2011 (UTC)

Yeah, I also came across this article recently and find the numbers full of mistakes. I guess the only thing we can do now is just fix the numbers as best as we can, however crudely! Shreevatsa (talk) 19:45, 1 March 2011 (UTC)

What are the separators used in specific countries? For some countries this information is given in the details column of the listing. But for many countries, that column is empty. Are any of the separators and formats acceptable in these countries? Surely most of the people who live there will have particular preferences? Shouldn't we try to add inforamtion on seperators and formats for all countries in the listing? Otherwise, could someone add a note that states what separators and formats to use where none are given?

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Poland and EU vs DMY + YMD[edit]

Both DMY and YMD are being used, the first one is still common in written language, however the latter one is getting more and more popular, especially for computer generated papers and younger people. Both formats are fully acceptable and readable. The following page proves that the YMD is accepted and even suggested format: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Date_and_time_notation_in_Poland

So, I would opt to update a map and table to state that Poland has 2 formats. I would even say that whole European Union should be marked this way: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ISO_8601 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 95.155.115.46 (talk) 12:30, 20 February 2016 (UTC)

Map mistakes[edit]

Thailand should be colored cyan —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.85.113.117 (talkcontribs) 16:43, 26 March 2011

As of January 10, 2012, Sweden is not correctly colored in the map and is not colored according to the table below. As I don't have a SVG editor I cannot correct it. TobiasPersson (talk) 12:26, 10 January 2012 (UTC)

Switched Sweden back to green, and the tool thats needed is a texteditor --Puggan (talk) 15:49, 27 March 2012 (UTC)
Talking about Sweden, I do think that most people uses ISO 1802 format "yyyy-mm-dd" in written papers, as the social security number "personnummer" uses the form "yyyymmdd-rrrc", where rrr is random and c is check sum digit. But when spoken causually I think the most common forms are "d mmmm yyyy" or "d mmmm". In causally written form you can find the older forms "d/m yyyy" or "d/m -yy". But I do think that the old formats are getting more rare and more people uses "yyyy-mm-dd". Andjack (talk) 23:50, 9 May 2012 (UTC)
As a Swede myself - I, along with people I know, uses D/MMMM-YYYY. I think it's due to the fact that the current date is more important than the current year - plus that computers and phones writes DD MM YYYY. 83.183.68.183 (talk) 18:15, 23 January 2015 (UTC)

Portugal is coloured incorrectly. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.158.90.2 (talk) 10:31, 28 February 2013 (UTC)

You have the information for Belize wrong. Belize has the Day/Month/Year format, not the USA style Month/Day/Year format as you've outlined on this page. It would be great if you could correct it. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 190.197.113.52 (talk) 11 December 2013

Croatia is DMY-only, please change the colour on map from green to cyan. Merkhet (talk) 09:28, 14 May 2015 (UTC)

I see no map! I see the table, but is there supposed to be an actual map? G6JPG (talk) 08:03, 17 June 2015 (UTC)


Kraibekovc (talk) 06:42, 11 July 2015 (UTC) Kazakhstan use two order styles (the relevant governmental Rule http://adilet.zan.kz/rus/docs/P1100001570/compare (section 25): when you are writing in Kazakh the order is YDM. when you are writing in Russian the order is DMY. so, Kazakhstan should be different coloured.

The map does not reflect the graph, at least for Malaysia, I did not look at other countries, but it seems the whole thing needs to be changed by this page. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.189.132.221 (talk) 19:42, 29 November 2017 (UTC)

Latvia and Parenthesis[edit]

Why are there two entries for Latvia? Why is every entry in the "Details" column bracketed? The frequent reference links right before closing parenthesis looks really bad. --Kitsunegami (talk) 04:27, 27 June 2011 (UTC)

The whole "green" section of the map needs to be checked e.g. Denamrk, Norway should be green (or alternatively the table should be fixed). — Preceding unsigned comment added by 193.134.170.35 (talk) 16:27, 12 June 2012 (UTC)

Table is a complete mess[edit]

Speaking of this version: http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Date_format_by_country&oldid=482145563

I think we can get rid of B, L, M concept and just stick with writing YMD, DMY, MDY. I think it's clearer and less redundant if we got rid of the endian notations.

I second this. It is really confusing to use both notations. I also think the definition should be based on official date format standards instead of having different colors for countries with differences between official and actual usage. -- Osram (talk) 20:32, 7 March 2013 (UTC)

Why is "JIS X 0301-2002" listed under "ISO 8601" column? Sounds like this column should be renamed to "Standards", but some of the cells say "some use", which won't mean the same without the "ISO 8601" column title. This column is a mess.

Why do we have a references column with only four cells? Can't we just get rid of this column? It looks like all other rows add references in the "Details" column. --JBrown23 (talk) 01:12, 18 March 2012 (UTC)

Endianness is not even an appropriate convention to describe these date formats. It's a force-fit, at best, and therefore seems like a case of "trying to sound smart". 72.209.211.71 (talk) 19:58, 23 February 2014 (UTC)

I have removed the endianness column as it serves no purpose in the context of date formats. --Matthiaspaul (talk) 14:27, 28 July 2015 (UTC)

Most of the problems discussed above appear at a quick glance to have been resolved in the current list, however it is still a mess! The format columns use DMY to indicate order, but that doesn't work as the order may vary depending on the format - for example the British short format 10/03/2017 has day/month/year but in the long form, although 10th March 2017 is possibly more common, I have also seen March 10th 2017. Data storage systems are something else too. I don't think those columns are helpful unless they state which form is referred to. The first paragraph which starts "Basic components..." might then be redundant.

The 2nd paragraph which starts "Order of the basic components" uses computer terminology which I believe is normally only used to express the order in which bytes are stored, I do not understand how this can helpfully be used to describe dates.

I'm sorry to say that after reading this article I came away more confused than I started! If noone else wants to sort it out, I will try to. Chris.Bristol (talk) 07:36, 10 March 2017 (UTC)


United Kingdom[edit]

Can anyone provide a source for the UK information on this page? The cited reference link is broken, and the information given here conflicts with the Oxford Style Manual (page 179) which states that the UK format is '2.11.93', using dots rather than slashes. Somnolentsurfer (talk) 18:17, 3 April 2013 (UTC)

Regarding dots v. slashes, I was taught slashes; and the comment above is the first that I've seen to indicate that it should be otherwise. The text gives the impression that MM/DD/YYYY (numeric) may be used, but I've never seen that (in purely British context) – where month precedes day number, it's always named. Personally, I'm pushing for YYYY-MM-DD everywhere. Dsalt (talk) 22:16, 5 July 2017 (UTC)

Is it okay to edit this?[edit]

In Malaysian English, I think DMY and MDY both used, but DMY is mostly used.

But is it a vandalism if I edit this?

In Malaysian English, however, the American-style MDY is also sometimes used, example includes New Straits Times, The Sun and The Edge. The Malay Mail originally uses MDY before it changed to DMY due to the change of ownership.

I am a reader of NST, and the date that was notified was in MDY rather than DMY. And the link given from years ago is so a dead link. --MrFawwaz (talk) 08:50, 27 January 2014 (UTC)

Exceptional (eg MDY or YMD) formats, eg. Saudi Arabia.[edit]

Saudi Arabia: "(dd/mm/yyyy in Islamic and Gregorian calendar systems,[128][129] except for major companies, which conventionally use the American mm/dd/yyyy format[citation needed])". Only DMY is listed in table but both in map. I think the map should in all cases agree with the listing. However meaning what the columns say. That is here DMY only (if really true). Listing what (multinational?) companies do I would think would be an ok addition if widespread but shouldn't change the columns? Similarly if the US military uses YMD, say that but not in the column and in map. What ordinary people (ethnic groups?) should matter. comp.arch (talk) 13:17, 14 February 2014 (UTC)

Right date format in Wikipedia for YMD countries (eg. Japan, China)[edit]

I refer to this page for the right date format, but YMD is usually frowned upon in Wikipedia. Please see question and answer under Wikipedia talk:Manual of Style/Dates and numbers/Archive 145#"Right" date format in Wikipedia for YMD format countries (eg. Japan, China) comp.arch (talk) 12:21, 24 February 2014 (UTC)

This page tells us what format people in a country use when in that country. Which can be quite different to what English speaking people from other countries use when talking about that country. When using English, we need to use a date format understood by English readers.  Stepho  talk  22:27, 24 February 2014 (UTC)

Source for formats, and the issue of language vs. country[edit]

One place the industrious editor might look for date format information is the National Language Support (NLS) API Reference at [1] (you may have to sign on to read the page). The Department of Commerce provides information for doing business in various countries, and I have found some date formatting information there. An index of these guides appears at [2]

There are many dead links used as sources for this article and without them there is no context, and without context there is confusion. The general concern I have is that the article doesn't say what it's about. When one says that a date format is used in a country, are they saying that its an official usage by law, or common usage, regional usage or what? Is it a commerce page, or a computer software development reference? The Microsoft reference page is organized by language, and not country, and perhaps that makes more sense. Dr. Conspiracy (talk) 17:56, 1 April 2014 (UTC)

Date format to use in the Wikipedia[edit]

Take a look at this edit to the article: [3] one of the things done in this edit is to replace the access date of "1 April 2014" with "2014-04-01" and a descriptive comment "Oh, the irony of getting the reference date format wrong in a date format article."

I ask the reader to look around this page, at the dates that the Wikipedia automatically inserts, for example, in this signature here Dr. Conspiracy (talk) 16:14, 2 April 2014 (UTC) and you will see it as 2 April 2014 NOT 2014-04-02.

So is there some Wikipedia rule for formatting accessdate that I am not aware of, or was the edit mentioned above spurious?

The rule is at WP:DATEFORMAT. yyyy-mm-dd is allowed in references. Also, out of 178 references, 177 of them used yyyy-mm-dd dates and only yours used dd mmm yyyy. Inconsistency within an article looks very unprofessional.  Stepho  talk  13:58, 3 April 2014 (UTC)

Danish standard[edit]

I am not able to find an official Danish standard without paying 500 DKK (not gonna happen). However I see in this article mention of dd-mm-(yy)yy as the traditional format while another article (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Date_and_time_notation_in_Denmark) claims that "the official (and traditionally used) standard is D.MM.YYYY (e.g., 24.12.2006 for Christmas Eve, or 1.05.2006 for Labour Day)." Which is it? Dashes (-) or dots (.)? Signed 9 April 2014 192.71.76.2 (talk · contribs)

That article only gives http://dsn.dk/sproghjaelp/ofte-stillede-spoergsmaal/datoer/ as a reference and that requires an account and password to access it. WP:Denmark has nothing to say about it either. So all we can do is tag it with {{cn}} and maybe ask at WP:Denmark.  Stepho  talk  05:27, 10 April 2014 (UTC)
The official rules of writing are given by Dansk Sprognævn (DSN). Their rules for writing days are give in the mentioned article (moved to: http://sproget.dk/raad-og-regler/artikler-mv/svarbase/SV00000046 ):
Day-month-year
  • d. mmmm (yy)yy, i.e. 3. januar 2003 or 3. januar 03
  • d. mmm. (yy)yy, i.e. 3. jan. 2003 or 3. jan. 03 — Preceding unsigned comment added by Benadikt (talkcontribs) 10:44, 28 May 2017 (UTC)
  • d.m.(yy)yy, i.e. 3.1.2003 or 3.1.03
  • d/m (yy)yy, i.e. 3/1 2003 or 3/1 03
  • d/m-yy, i.e. 3/1-03
Year-month-day
According to ISO 8601 (and Dansk Standard DS/ISO 8601:2005); but, unfortunately, DSN also accept two-digit years.
  • (yy)yy-mm-dd, i.e. 2003-01-03
  • yyyymmdd, i.e. 20030103
Note that the format dd-mm-yyyy that is used in enwikis article is NOT official in Denmark! Benadikt (talk) 10:37, 28 May 2017 (UTC)

Numbers in brackets[edit]

What does "China (1360) or "Hungary (10)" mean? --79.68.233.76 (talk) 12:01, 17 April 2014 (UTC)

Populations in millions, apparently. Though it's not very clear, and looks to be verging on original research, unless the same aggregations have been done by a reliable source. W. P. Uzer (talk) 12:13, 17 April 2014 (UTC)
Yes, according to the legend of the table, millions in population. Of course, this is a moving target, so these figures need to be checked and synchronized against those found in the articles about the various countries regularly (ideally, we should copy references found there into here as well). --Matthiaspaul (talk) 16:41, 28 July 2015 (UTC)

What qualifies as multiple formats to a country?[edit]

As someone with a technical background I've been trying to support the ISO 8601 (YMD) standard in the United States for almost a decade now. I use it on checks, legal documents, bills, the IRS, virtually every document that was involved in purchasing my home, etc...except in rare instances where the document itself enforced an MDY standard. Never once has it caused me grief. While not all that mainstream it's definitely legally and culturally recognized. Sarysa (talk) 13:56, 11 July 2014 (UTC)

It depends on what is legally binding, what is culturally preferred and what people will over look. I suspect that for most of the cheques and forms the people at the other end simply didn't care enough to make an issue of it - as long as they could decipher it. I know that here in Australia the government official uses 12-07-2014 (short) and 12 July 2014 (long) but plenty of newspapers, personal websites, etc still use the traditional form of July 12, 2014 (as used by the British a century ago and still used by the Americans today). I used to live in Hong Kong where they used the Chinese system of 2014-07-12 (Chinese documents), the modern British system of 12/07/2014 (government English documents and some commercial usage) and the US system of 7/12/2014 (some commercial usage). Very confusing.  Stepho  talk  02:31, 12 July 2014 (UTC)

Month abbreviation[edit]

There is no mention of the two letter abbreviations for months, sometimes one letter when that can be done unambiguously. I have seen it used that way in library indexing. To be strictly unambiguous "JE" is used there for June. I have also seen something similar in expiry dates for perishable products. There, the use of "MA" for May and "JU" for June remains ambiguous. Eclecticology (talk) 11:39, 14 December 2014 (UTC)


Pakistan[edit]

There is a error in the table or map regarding date format used in Pakistani. They don't match

Errors in map[edit]

1. Nepal should be green in color in the map. It's yellow.
2. India should be gray in color in the map. It's cyan. (also I think all of the countries in the table which are in the dark gray box are wrongly colored or labeled. for instance Sweden and South Africa. This map and the table associated with it needs serious correction.

Singapore and Japan[edit]

I've been using references from Singapore and Japan lately, and they're predominantly using MDY, but in the table it says they don't use it. Can anybody take a look? –HTD 07:22, 2 May 2015 (UTC)

Most English media (movies, TV, magazines) tend to come from the US and people in Asian countries tend to just copy what they see in the English materials they see. Also, Windows and MAC-OS programs typically default to the US format, even when the operating system is set up to use something different. Most people just give in (usually without a fight) and use whatever format the software throws at them. Singapore traditionally uses either yyyy-mm-dd (Chinese heritage) or dd-mm-yyyy (British heritage) but since Britain also used mm-dd-yyyy in ye-olde-days, that also gets some use. Japan uses yyyy-mm-dd (Gregorian years) or yy-mm-dd (years since coronation of current emperor) but also tends to copy both US and British habits. Imagine the fun I had sorting out Y2K for EFTPOS software in the Asian region :(  Stepho  talk  09:00, 2 May 2015 (UTC)
I'm referring to things such as newspapers. I'll perhaps add informal usage such as websites and announcements. MDY seems to be more common than the table says it is. Even newspapers may use the DMY in mastheads, but use MDY in actual article prose. I've even saw Japanese twitter users use "MM-DD". –HTD 09:58, 2 May 2015 (UTC)

Norway[edit]

I updated the line for Norway, and that included not only updated sources, but also a factual change in that ISO dates are allowed for "technical" purposes (data exchange, lists to be sorted etc.) I am not sure if the latter has a wide enough scope to justify a "yes" in the YMD box, so that change could be up to discussion. (2016-02-10)


Australia[edit]

All of the references for Australia supporting MDY are either dead or show the opposite. As an Australian, I can assure you that Australia does not support MDY in any way, shape, or form. YMD is not too bad, even has some advantages over DMY, and would be understood here. I do not have the skills to correct this. Regards Tim (16/02/2016) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.12.194.242 (talk) 23:00, 15 February 2016 (UTC)

I agree wholeheartedly and made that change, but someone has just reverted it. As a result this page still misleads people into thinking that MDY might be generally accepted in Australia making "3/4/16" a valid encoding for the 4th of March, which would never be the case; Australians would always read that as the 3rd of April. The thesis of the reverter is that some newspapers write "March 4, 2016" in their mastheads and this makes MDY a generally accepted format, a claim that is an overreach and misleads the reader. The truth is that mmmmDY and mmmDY occur, but never numeric MDY. I have made another change that will, hopefully, satisfy all constraints. Inopinatus (talk) 23:38, 4 December 2016 (UTC)
I have removed the bit about 9/11. A moment's research revealed that the use of "9/11" as a US cultural import is a global phenomenon (e.g. I found it in Belgian and Russian news articles) and not limited to Australia. I'm asserting that it is not an illustration of a date format rule, but rather the globally accepted name of an exceptional event that is simply showing its US origins. Inopinatus (talk) 23:42, 4 December 2016 (UTC)
I'm probably the 'someone' you are referring to. Your phrase "MDY is never used in Australia" covers both "3/4/16" and "March 4, 2016" style dates. As both of us have said, newspaper mast heads routinely use "March 4, 2016". Nearly all movie trailers in Australia also use the dreaded "March 4, 2016" style. Obviously your blanket statement doesn't hold true. However, your revised statement "The numeric MDY is never used in Australia" is quite true. I would amend it slightly to say "The all numeric MDY is never used in Australia' (adding the word "all") but otherwise I have no problem with it. As an aside, I did some work on EFTPOS terminals for American Express in Hong Kong. They insisted on using "3/4/16" to mean "March 4, 2016", even though the two common local numeric formats were D-M-YYYY (English) and YYYY-M-D (Chinese). Thankfully Australians reject "3/4/2016" as a date in March.  Stepho  talk  01:27, 5 December 2016 (UTC)

On the map, it's colored gray (as for Canada) for DMY/MDY/YMD, but in the table it's shown as DMY which ought to be cyan. One or t'other is wrong. Sethdecastro1 (talk) 13:26, 18 May 2017 (UTC)

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Readability of month placeholders[edit]

Hello. I think we should revise the legends representing named months. Repeating the <m> glyph 3x to represent {Jan, Feb, Mar ...} or 5x to represent {January, February, March ...} is unsightly and possibly misleading-- <m> and <mm> are numerical values, unlike <mmm> and <mmmmm>. I suggest we use {<Mon>, <MON>} to represent an abbreviated month in different letter cases and <Month> to represent the full written name of the month. 74.70.110.148 (talk) 17:49, 10 May 2016 (UTC)

<m>, <mm>, <mmm> and <mmmmm> with the definitions you just mentioned has been the standard terminology within the computer industry for decades. It also matches the size of the resultant text quite well (single digit, 2 digit, 3 letters, many letters).  Stepho  talk  23:13, 10 May 2016 (UTC)

Belize[edit]

On the map, it's coloured red (as for Saudi Arabia and the Philippines) for DMY/MDY, but in the table it's shown as DMY which ought to be cyan. One or t'other is wrong. Peridon (talk) 10:35, 12 September 2016 (UTC)

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Order or format[edit]

I think the second column should have the headline Order or Succession in stead of format. The formats are explained in the third column. Benadikt (talk) 10:49, 28 May 2017 (UTC)

Israel[edit]

On the map, it's colored magenta (as for American Samoa, Guam, Marshall Islands, Micronesia, Northern Mariana Islands, the United States, the United States Minor Outlying Islands and the United States Virgin Islands) for MDY, but in the table it's shown as DMY/MDY which ought to be red. Sethdecastro1 (talk) 01:09, 10 June 2017 (UTC)

Please stop changing in table below of Israel to M/D/YYYY. The Hebrew format is DD/MM/YYYY and English format M/D/YYYY although DD/MM/YYYY also used, albeit rarely and more for English language. Sethdecastro1 (talk) 08:17, 12 June 2017 (UTC)

Colour Blind[edit]

Coloured charts are a real nuisance to the 5% of the male population that is colour-blind, like me. Very few women are colour-blind. Cross-hatching works even in monochrome.


Sebmelmoth (talk) 16:15, 6 August 2017 (UTC)

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Map[edit]

SVG version

Hi Typhoon2013 and Sethdecastro1,

The map seems quite similar to File:Date_format_by_country.svg. Is there a reason you made a PNG version instead of editing the SVG version which is easier to maintain. It seems that there are now two files which makes it difficult to keep them in sync with other articles. Is it OK to use the SVG version instead?

The colours also start out logical e.g. cyan + yellow = green, but cyan + magenta != red i.e. red and blue are swapped. Moreover, it's not really colour-blind-friendly. Would it be better to use hatching with more consistent colour addition?

Thanks,
cmɢʟeeτaʟκ 19:32, 10 September 2017 (UTC)