Talk:Deborah O'Neill

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Elected?[edit]

This article was created within 24 hours of Anthony Green's announcement that, in all likelihood, she had won the seat. But she is yet to be declared the winner. Like John Alexander in Bennelong, the AEC hasn't actually declared a result (though his article has also be changed to reflect the assumed result).

It's not factually accurate to say she is a current Member of the House of Representatives when the AEC hasn't declared a result, she hasn't claimed victory and she hasn't been sworn in.

Though the article does reflect the most likely outcome of ongoing counting, Wikipedia is not a crystal ball. I'm all for people being keen to update Wikipedia with information as it happens but that is not what has happened in this instance.

I'm in no way suggesting that without a formal result the subject of the article is not notable - my assumption would be that within days the article will have to be updated to reflect the formal announcement that she is an elected member. But prior to her swearing-in (which could be weeks while everything is sorted out) it is not accurate to include her in the list of House of Reps members or to say that she is.

Stalwart111 (talk) 03:03, 27 August 2010 (UTC)

For clarity, I've seen the discussion @ WT:AUP and my issue is not about whether or not they should be considered elected (as in 90% of cases it's a formality anyway) but whether or not they should be referred to as a sitting member of the House of Representatives. I understand the Parl Handbook considers them elected from polling day (as this was when the electors' votes were cast, even if it takes a week to count them) but are we simply letting the lack of a formal swearing in slide in the interim? I have no considerable objection if that is the case, as long as we are clear and consistent.
I suppose my issue with this article is that she (unlike others where the 2010 result has been listed) hasn't actually claimed victory - that is, she doesn't consider herself to have yet been elected. A good number of "new MPs" don't even have pages yet and that may well be what we should be focusing on instead. Thanks, Stalwart111 (talk) 03:27, 27 August 2010 (UTC).
We don't need her to claim victory, as it were; it is statistically impossible for her to lose. In fact we're only counting three seats as still in doubt (Denison, Hasluck and Brisbane), and we're being fairly generous with the first two. The fact is that if O'Neill died tomorrow, she would still be considered to have been an MP. Hopefully we are consistent with this across the board. (As far as I'm aware only two definite new MPs - Karen Andrews and Scott Buchholz - and three Senators - Matt Thistlethwaite, Anne Urquhart and Bridget McKenzie - are still without articles.) Frickeg (talk) 03:50, 27 August 2010 (UTC)
Well, it might be a long shot but to say it's statistically impossible for her to lose isn't quite right. Belinda Neal was well ahead on the night but after postal and absentee votes she only beat Jim Lloyd by a very small number of votes. In fact, the story has been covered in some of the media detailing O'Neill's current position. While the ABC might suggest only three seats are still in doubt, both major parties will keep scrutineers at Divisional Returning Offices until the result is declared, where the electorate's progressive margin is less than 2000-3000 votes. That's because some electorates can have up to 20% of the vote still to be counted (pre-poll, absentee, postal and institutional votes) after the close of polls at 6:00pm on polling day. Most electorates are "called" on the night after about 40% of the votes are counted. Some closer ones need to get to 80% before Anthony Green will call it. But in Robertson they had to count about 98% of the vote, last time, before a definitive result was known.
Anyway, I suppose this discussion is more comprehensive than any qualifying statement we could hope to include in the article itself. I might try and work on those missing five if I get time - and I think John Alexander's page needs work... and possible a move away from "John Alexander (tennis)". Keep up the good work! Stalwart111 (talk) 06:12, 27 August 2010 (UTC)

Second Carr replacement - quirky questions[edit]

Please see Talk:Bob Carr#Quirky questions which has remained unanswered since 10 July.

Any assistance would be appreciated. -- Jack of Oz [pleasantries] 11:38, 23 July 2014 (UTC)

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