Talk:Dinu Lipatti

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Untitled[edit]

Should add a "References in popular culture" subhed for The Mountain Goats' "Dinu Lipatti's Bones" off of The Sunset Tree album. (4/14/06)

Please create a redirection from "Lipatti" or even from "Dinu".

Hodgkin's / Leukemia[edit]

I placed the 'Category:Deaths from leukemia' in the Article because Hodgkin's lymphoma is a form of leukemia. Michael David 22:19, 4 May 2006 (UTC)

Date of birth[edit]

Most references give 19 March 1917, without any commentary.

Nicolas Slonimsky used to say 17 March 1917 (5th edition of Baker's Dictionary), which date also appeared in Lipatti's mother Anna's biography(*) of him (La Vie du Pianiste Dinu Lipatti, Anna Lipatti, Editions du Vieux Colombier), as quoted on Everest Records LP 3166 (containing Lipatti's recording of his Rumanian Dances and Concertino, Op. 3).

But Slonimsky revised the date for the 8th ed of Bakers (which I don't have but have taken notes from in a library) to 1 April 1917, and that date also appears in Webster's New World Dictionary of Music (1998, ed. Slonimsky and Richard Kassel; which I do have). The rationale seems to be that Romania was still using the Old Style (Julian) calendar in 1917, which was by then 13 days behind the Gregorian calendar. (They didn't adopt the Gregorian for civil use until 1919.)

Sunday 19 March 1917 (Julian) equates to Sunday 1 April 1917 (Gregorian). I believe we should show his birthdate as 1 April 1917, with a note about it also appearing as 19 March in the Julian calendar.

(*) Anna's biography says (I quote from the quote on the record sleeve): "Our dream came true one Monday on the stroke of midnight, March 17th 1917, when our beloved Dinu quietly arrived on the scene at our villa in Bucharest". Trouble is, 17 March 1917 was not a Monday but a Saturday (if she was basing it on the Gregorian calendar; it was a Friday in the Julian calendar). And then there's the question of what "Monday at the stroke of midnight" even means - was it the Monday just ending, or the Monday just starting? So, if she reported the date accurately, he was born on Friday 17 March (Julian) = Friday 30 March (Gregorian). And if she reported the day of the week accurately, he was born on Monday 20 March 1917 (Julian) = Monday 2 April 1917 (Gregorian). But she seems to have gotten both the date and the day of the week wrong. While she may have regarded the birth as occurring on a Monday, the evidence suggests it was recorded as having occurred on a Sunday. To be charitable, maybe there was a typographical error of someone else's doing. What a mess. All this means is that Anna's evidence is unreliable and should be dismissed out of hand. -- JackofOz (talk) 23:16, 7 March 2009 (UTC)

Well, saying that his mother's account of Lipatti's birth is "unreliable and should be dismissed out of hand" is pretty ridiculous, although I grant that a typo may have crept into her book. Lipatti's wife Madeleine gave March 19, 1917 as his birthdate in her writings after his death so if that's when they celebrated it, that ought to be good enough. I've never understood this obsession with "correcting" dates in the Julian calendar anyway - we don't do it for dates earlier than 1582 which are just as out of sync. Shakespeare, it is universally accepted, was born and died on April 23rd even though his birth occurred on the Julian calendar and his death on the Gregorian. The bugaboo seems to be confined to the Christian Orthodox countries which kept the Julian into the beginning of the 20th century. It's confusing, annoying and completely unnecessary. Gillartsny (talk) 18:33, 1 December 2011 (UTC)
By "his mother's account", I meant the part of her biography that was quoted on the back of an old LP in my collection. I did suggest she may have been misquoted; but all we know for sure at the end of the day is that the details that appear there do not square with reputable reference sources, nor with his wife's biography (thanks for that source), and it should not be relied upon.
Prior to 15 October 1582 there was universal agreement (at least in European countries) about which calendar to use, because there was only one to choose from - the Julian. There was a 10-day disconjunct when the Gregorian was introduced, 4 October Julian being immediately followed by 15 October Gregorian. There was never any intention to go back and retrospectively revise all earlier Julian dates to Gregorian, and anyone who does this is just wrong. However, from 15 October 1582 right up until about 1923, there was NOT universal agreement about which calendar to use, diferent countries adopting the Gregorian at different times. (See Gregorian calendar#Adoption)
So, we have cases like Shakespeare and Miguel de Cervantes dying on the same date (23 April 1616), but not the same day. Cervantes actually died 10 days earlier than Shakespeare in real time. Cervantes's death on 23 April 1616 was according to the Gregorian calendar, which Spain was then using; while Shakespeare's death on 23 April 1616 was according to the Julian calendar, which England was still using. If the Gregorian calendar had been in use in England at that time, Shakespeare's death would have been recorded as 3 May 1616, not 23 April 1616. According to the calendar we now use, he did die on 3 May and properly that date should figure in the literature much more than it does. But there's a romance attached to him dying on his supposed birthday, which would be lost if we showed him as born 23 April and dying 3 May. That's my theory, anyway.
Russia did not adopt the Gregorian calendar until 1918. Nobody has any difficulty with showing events that occurred in Russia between 1582 and 1918 under 2 dates, Julian and Gregorian, so that everyone's clear about exactly when they happened and miscalculations do not occur. See any Russian notable you care to think of (Tchaikovsky, Rachmaninoff, Dostoyevsky, Pushkin, Tolstoy, Catherine the Great, Lenin, Stalin, Mendeleyev, ...the list is endless), and you'll be, or should be, given both dates. We also do it for some anglophone people born before 1752 - George Washington and other early US presidents, British monarchs, James Cook, various others - but not universally. Why the hit-and-miss approach for English speakers? Your guess is as good as mine. -- Jack of Oz [your turn] 19:29, 1 December 2011 (UTC)

Vienna's Music contests 1933[edit]

Tokyo University of the Arts (Tokyo Geijyutsu Daigaku)'s University Library has a primary source document. "Musical Courier" dated July 15,1933 New York.

We can see the names of Lipatti and Japanese Sonoko Inoue. The headline wrote :

Vienna's Music Contests Bring Dazzling Display of Technic(sic)

The prize winner's names appear in it. First prize went to Boleslaw Kon[1], a Polish, who had studied at Moscow Conservatory; second prize to Taras Mykyscha, a Russian, who was really a Ukrainian ; third prize to Mlle.Perin, French ; fourth prize to Sofia Gurewitch, a Latvian, who was really a Russian.

The Jury added names to second and third prize winners. Reporter did complicated way of writing about the second prize winner's Lipatti :

"The second and third prizes had to be duplicated and the duplicates given to Constantin Lipatti, Roumanian, and Therese Troster, Austrian, respectively, because their technic(sic) was too colossal to pass unrewarded."

This article reminds me of Cortot's episode.


Musical Courier Jury 15,1933 → http://blog.livedoor.jp/bookshell/archives/1286524.html

Why has this error happened → http://blog.livedoor.jp/bookshell/archives/1286527.html

Widely appreciated by critics[edit]

Dinu Lipatti's concert recordings of classical music were, and are, widely appreciated by numerous critics and musicians; such truthful appreciations cannot be considered in any way as "advertisments", especially when he is, unfortunately, no longer among the quick! This article about him can be however improved in several ways.

I agree[edit]

Not only today is Lipatti considered one of the greatest pianists of the XXth century thanks to his recordings, he was already held into the highest esteem by musicians of his time, as so many quotes by famous artists about him testify. Also, his costly cortisone treatment was paid by admiring musicians like Münch, Stravinsky, Karajan, Menuhin, Cortot, Enescu, etc. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.236.2.163 (talk) 21:02, 14 May 2011 (UTC)

removal of "advert" tag[edit]

I see nothing whatever in this article that could be construed as an advertisement, either in the bio or discography. If ArthurBot wants to reinstate the tag, please first point to some specific problem. I should add that I never before made any edits to this page, nor even seen it before today. Milkunderwood (talk) 22:09, 19 October 2011 (UTC)

Name[edit]

Wasn't "Dinu" a diminutive for "Constantinu," his given name? I seem to remember seeing this in some old vinyl record cover notes, but I don't have a real reference, and I'm not sure it's true. If so, though, his correct name should be mentioned.98.170.214.134 (talk) 23:09, 23 October 2012 (UTC)

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