Talk:Ernest Hemingway

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Hemingway's Guns[edit]

I was listening to a podcast recently, entitled Ernest Hemingway's Guns, and the author of the book of the same title was discussing with the host the controversial subject of the gun that Hemingway shot himself with. He stated that he met with a local blacksmith who claimed to have been asked by Hemingway's wife to destroy the gun, so that it wouldn't be passed around as a morbid curio. Apparently he kept a small box of receiver parts, and they were identified as, not the Boss shotgun of lore, but a W.C Scott shotgun. I'll include a link to the page including a transcript of the podcast. Hemingway's Guns Can anyone who owns the book confirm this and, as I have not yet ten edits, update the page with the information suitably? Chalysseus (talk) 21:20, 29 May 2015 (UTC)

Hi Chalysseus, I'm not sure if the book you mean is this one? If it is, I'd probably need to spend some time having a look at it before adding to this article, which is in a fairly stable condition. Currently the bit about the gun is sourced to Jeffrey Meyers and he used the coroner's report as his source (as did Carlos Baker), so I feel fairly confident in terms of verifiability with those sources. I see that we used Michael Reynolds in that section too. I'll dig out all those books and take a look again, and at the one you suggest, and then report back. Might take a few days. Victoria (tk) 00:38, 30 May 2015 (UTC)

Yes, the very same. According to the book, or at least the podcast, there is no evidence that Hemingway ever owned a Boss shotgun. As for the coroner, I'm sure a mistake could be made. After all, all these shotguns look the same!Chalysseus (talk) 08:46, 30 May 2015 (UTC)

Yes, I see that, having read it. The book also cites Wikipedia, which is a problem, and frankly adds more fuel to the fodder. I've checked Michael Reynolds' Hemingway: The Final Years, [1], the most recent scholarly biography, and he concurs on page 358. I've checked that the Meyer's quote is transcribed properly and it is; I also checked that Meyers got his info from the coroner - who was the first person there. It might be wrong, but on Wikipedia, and particularly for featured articles we cite the most scholarly sources, so I wouldn't be comfortable changing it to a source that cites Wikipedia. Victoria (tk) 13:33, 30 May 2015 (UTC)
Adding: that quote probably should have been attributed to Meyers, but I've swapped it out for Mellow's version in this edit. Mellow is a reliable source and he doesn't specify that it was a Boss gun. Thanks, by the way, for bringing this up. Victoria (tk) 15:28, 30 May 2015 (UTC)

Thank you, I appreciate your help. As a firearms buff and a Hemingway fan, I was probably a bit quick to jump on the W&C Scott bandwagon. I haven't read the book, but I will try and get my hands on it. Chalysseus (talk) 12:57, 5 June 2015 (UTC)

Hemingways "confession" regarding a war crime[edit]

Please check the yellow marked sections at the end of this document (the beginning is German, at the end it's original E.H.): Relevant text passages regarding war crime(s)

There are two incidents E.H. writes about, that are discussed here and in the internet elsewhere. Perhaps someone can transform this into one or two sentences in the main article (the part about WW2 would be most fitting).

Summary of the two incidents:

  • Hemingway shoots a German uniform wearing soldier who is very young, which he discovers after closer examination. He is still alive, E.H. gives him of his own morphine tablets. No war crime at all, soldiers in uniform sadly are targets in a war. Furthermore, Hemingway deeply regretted this incident, because the young man was the in age of his own son.
  • E.H. tells the story of killing an SS-soldier (who actually were called "Armed SS", primarily forming elite fighting units, usually not involved in "SS special operations" atrocities, from which the image of the "evil SS super nazis" is contrived of). The SS-soldier is prisoner of war, is supposed to tell military secrets, which he insolently refuses to do, saying something about E.H. being a coward, belonging to a degenerate mongrel race and that the Geneva convention forbids E.H. to do harm to him. Hemingway describes himself killing the man, shedding a lot of blood. If this story was true, E.H. executed a prisoner of war, which is a war crime by all known standards (even if the war criminal would be an evil super nazi).
    • Conclusion: E.H. was famous for bragging, especially for describing himself as an ultra tough macho type of guy. And he was a talented writer. The passage he writes actually could be used in a Hollywood film, including the dialogue, where a good and brave Rambo style US soldier kills a dirty nazi pig after giving him the chance to repent for his many terrible sins by telling secrets, that would save countless lives of fellow GIs. The scene continues with another evil super nazi seeing this and, being a coward if he isn't standing armed against women and children, hastily tells every war secret he knows to the brave GI. I don't believe that E.H. is telling the truth here, he is inventing a film scene. This goes along with the opinion of the professor who writes the expertise in the above linked document ("Gutachterliche Stellungnahme" in German).

Ernest Hemingway is in all probability no war criminal. --143.164.102.13 (talk) 11:47, 5 June 2015 (UTC)

    • Yes, I have access to the letters but generally we don't use them to bolster his own stories. I also have access to the two biographies cited and will take a look at the relevant pages. Nonetheless, the material cited here in this article is based on other biographers who are clearly reliable sources and so it has to be reported that the charges were brought. What actually happened, whether or not he left his weapon in his room, we can never really know. On a side note, I'm a bit concerned that this pdf contains personally identifiable information. Maybe not such a good idea to link it on WP? Or perhaps consider removing the info from the pdf? Victoria (tk) 22:17, 6 June 2015 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 27 July 2015[edit]

Not done, no request made. — Neonorange (talk) 01:18, 27 July 2015 (UTC)

Influence and legacy[edit]

Statue of Hemingway by José Villa Soberón, El Floridita bar in Havana

Hemingway's legacy to American literature is his style: writers who came after him emulated it or avoided it.[1] After his reputation was established with the publication of The Sun Also Rises, he became the spokesperson for the post–World War I generation, having established a style to follow.[2] His books were burned in Berlin in 1933, "as being a monument of modern decadence", and disavowed by his parents as "filth".[3] Reynolds asserts the legacy is that "he left stories and novels so starkly moving that some have become part of our cultural heritage."[4] In a 2004 speech at the John F. Kennedy Library, Russell Banks declared that he, like many male writers of his generation, was influenced by Hemingway's writing philosophy, style, and public image.[5] Müller reports that Hemingway "has the highest recognition value of all writers worldwide".[6]

Benson believes the details of Hemingway's life have become a "prime vehicle for exploitation", resulting in a Hemingway industry.[7] Hemingway scholar Hallengren believes the "hard boiled style" and the machismo must be separated from the author himself.[3] Benson agrees, describing him as introverted and private as J. D. Salinger, although Hemingway masked his nature with braggadocio.[8] In fact, during World War II, Salinger met and corresponded with Hemingway, whom he acknowledged as an influence. In a letter to Hemingway, Salinger claimed their talks "had given him his only hopeful minutes of the entire war" and jokingly "named himself national chairman of the Hemingway Fan Clubs."[9]

The extent of Hemingway's influence is seen in the tributes and echoes of his fiction in popular culture. A minor planet, discovered in 1978 by Soviet astronomer Nikolai Chernykh, was named for him (3656 Hemingway);[10] Ray Bradbury wrote The Kilimanjaro Device, with Hemingway transported to the top of Mount Kilimanjaro;[11] the 1993 motion picture Wrestling Ernest Hemingway, about the friendship of two retired men, Irish and Cuban, in a seaside town in Florida, starred Robert Duvall, Richard Harris, Shirley MacLaine, Sandra Bullock, and Piper Laurie.[12] The influence is evident with the many restaurants named "Hemingway"; and the proliferation of bars called "Harry's" (a nod to the bar in Across the River and Into the Trees).[13] A line of Hemingway furniture, promoted by Hemingway's son Jack (Bumby), has pieces such as the "Kilimanjaro" bedside table, and a "Catherine" slip-covered sofa. Montblanc offers a Hemingway fountain pen, and a line of Hemingway safari clothes has been created.[14] The International Imitation Hemingway Competition was created in 1977 to publicly acknowledge his influence and the comically misplaced efforts of lesser authors to imitate his style. Entrants are encouraged to submit one "really good page of really bad Hemingway" and winners are flown to Italy to Harry's Bar.[15] Since its introduction in 2004 Blizzard Entertainment's MMORPG Word of Warcraft includes a NPC quest giver named "Hemet Nesingwary" (an anagram) whose interests include big game hunting. He has appeared in multiple locations throughout the game's evolution.

In 1965, Mary Hemingway established the Hemingway Foundation and in the 1970s she donated her husband's papers to the John F. Kennedy Library. In 1980, a group of Hemingway scholars gathered to assess the donated papers, subsequently forming the Hemingway Society, "committed to supporting and fostering Hemingway scholarship."[16]

Almost exactly 35 years after Hemingway's death, on July 1, 1996, his granddaughter Margaux Hemingway died in Santa Monica, California. Margaux was a supermodel and actress, co-starring with her sister Mariel in the 1976 movie Lipstick.[17] Her death was later ruled a suicide, making her "the fifth person in four generations of her family to commit suicide."[18]

References

  1. ^ Oliver (1999), 140–141
  2. ^ Cite error: The named reference Nagel_1996_87 was invoked but never defined (see the help page).
  3. ^ a b Hallengren, Anders. "A Case of Identity: Ernest Hemingway". Nobelprize.org. Retrieved 30 November 2011.
  4. ^ Reynolds (2000), 15
  5. ^ Banks (2004), 54
  6. ^ Müller (2010), 30
  7. ^ Benson (1989), 347
  8. ^ Benson (1989), 349
  9. ^ Baker (1969), 420
  10. ^ Schmadel, Lutz D. (2003) Dictionary of Minor Planet Names. New York: Springer Verlag. ISBN 3-540-00238-3, 307
  11. ^ Cite error: The named reference Oliver144 was invoked but never defined (see the help page).
  12. ^ Oliver (1999), 360
  13. ^ Oliver (1999), 142
  14. ^ Hoffman, Jan. "A Line of Hemingway Furniture, With a Veneer of Taste". (June 15, 1999).The New York Times. Retrieved September 3, 2009.
  15. ^ Smith, Jack. Wanted: One Really Good Page of Really Bad Hemingway.(March 15, 1993). Los Angeles Times. Retrieved March 7, 2010.
  16. ^ Miller (2006), 78–80
  17. ^ "Margaux Hemingway Is Dead; Model and Actress Was 41". (July 3, 1996). The New York Times. Retrieved May 14, 2010
  18. ^ "Coroner Says Death of Actress Was Suicide". (August 21, 1996). The New York Times. Retrieved May 14, 2010.

Aeberbach (talk) 00:15, 27 July 2015 (UTC)

Not done (if this post is a request, the material is already in the article). Almost word for word. — Neonorange (talk) 01:22, 27 July 2015 (UTC)
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Please also cite reliable sources to back up your request, without which no information should be added to, or changed in, any article. - Arjayay (talk) 09:18, 27 July 2015 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 7 August 2015[edit]

Please add this reference to "External Links"

Ernest Hemingway's journalism at {http://www.historicjournalism.com/ernest-hemingway-1.html The Archive of American Journalism] 71.215.199.53 (talk) 00:48, 7 August 2015 (UTC)

Yes check.svg Done TrueCRaysball | #RaysUp 01:22, 7 August 2015 (UTC)