Talk:Flag of Estonia

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WikiProject Heraldry and vexillology (Rated C-class)
WikiProject icon Flag of Estonia is within the scope of the Heraldry and vexillology WikiProject, a collaborative effort to improve Wikipedia's coverage of heraldry and vexillology. If you would like to participate, you can visit the project page, where you can join the project and see a list of open tasks.
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This flag was not banned immediately after the Soviet invasion. When the Soviet army invaded Tallinn (September 1944) after the German occupation, the blue-black-white flag was hoisted in the tower of Pikk Hermann along with the red flag. Andres 20:40, 2 Sep 2003 (UTC)

This actually happened in June 1940 after the Soviet coup when the Estonian flag was hoisted along with the red flag for a few days before the Estonian flag was removed altogether. In 1944, the Estonian flag was hoisted as the Germans fled, but was removed by the invading Soviet army three days later.

The nordic alternative version[edit]

Any updates if this might still happen or if it's been dropped? Daniel 18:01, 26 May 2006 (UTC)

Alternative version[edit]

I removed this section because I believe the "cross flag" proposal is too unimportant in the context of this article. I live in Estonia and I've heard about it, but it was never widespread enough to be taken seriously. This section made it seem as if half of Estonians would like to change the flag, which is far from the truth. If someone wants to include it, please provide citations and don't exxagerate ("public debate" and "some Estonians resent the flag" is inaccurate/misleading language). --Rain74 15:09, 18 June 2006 (UTC)

Could you put the information back in, but in a corrected form, reflecting the actual debate? According to FOTW, there *was* a debate -- in 2001, not after independence. I still think it's notable, but would prefer it if *you* entered the information, as you're more likely to omit possible errors... ;) —Nightstallion (?) 11:19, 20 June 2006 (UTC)
I'm afraid I don't know very much about this proposal, other that it existed and was discussed in media a few years ago, but was never taken too seriously. I'll try to reword the paragraph a bit, though. Rain74 15:10, 4 July 2006 (UTC)
I found the original proposal in an Estonian newspaper, and added a link. Although it was proposed by a notable politician, I still don't think this belongs to this article, as there has been no political debate to change the flag, nor has anyone ever considered an actual change likely. I'm keping it for the time being, though. Rain74 15:34, 4 July 2006 (UTC)
Removed it again. I agree with Rain that the proposal is not noteworthy. If the article would cover detailed history of the flag in great length, then it should probably be mentioned, but for now it just confuses. The caveat at the end of the section is not enough to clarify that it was proposed in a newspaper article by a regular columnist. No steps were taken, almost no discussion ensued and there are no sources to claim that it received considerable support. Mieczyslaw 17:43, 10 September 2006 (UTC)
If you want to remove it, it should be put to a formal vote. Wikipedia doesn't only provide information that is 'widespread.' And I maintain that the point is noteworthy to anyone interested in the history of the flag. I agree that when it popped up in Eesti Päevaleht recently it wasn't exactly a national debate, but the subject has been brought up a number of times, even as early as the first republic (remember the flag illustrated is only one of the proposals), and is part of the ongoing debate on Estonia's image (Nordic vs. Baltic/Eastern European). The fact that it is not detailed enough isn't reason to delete it. If you want more detail, add some more - that's how Wikipedia is meant to work, innit :) kieron 02:41, 14 September 2006 (UTC)

Granted, the nordic cross flag didn't gain much popularity, but this idea has been around since pretty much the beginning of Estonian independence and some Estonians still consider this seriously. I occasionally hoist the cross flag on my house in stead of the tricolor and I've seen some other examples of it in use as well.

Whether it was taken seriously or not at the time it is certainly of interest to those who like to engage in such things. It is certainly encyclopedic, especially as it does show that there is a question in some people's minds whether the country should be associated as nordic or ot and also whether being associated would mean changing the flag or if changing the flag would automatically associate.Hackerjack 14:56, 28 December 2006 (UTC)
Plus, here is the page were all of the designs are listed: [1]. User:Zscout370 (Return Fire) 04:47, 1 January 2007 (UTC)
Also, here are the various flag ideas proposed during independence [2]. This includes the cross flag mentioned on here. User:Zscout370 (Return Fire) 04:56, 1 January 2007 (UTC)

Should the Flag of the President, the Naval ensign and the Naval jack really be included in this article? Seems like not relevant and I'd rather use the space for some photos about the subject.--Termer (talk) 08:28, 21 November 2007 (UTC)

Other Flag of Country articles like eg Flag of Finland have these too, so in my opinion they should stay. But a good photo would be definitely nice. Oth (talk) 11:59, 21 November 2007 (UTC)

I can't see this as a standard on WP, even though Flag of Finland has flags that are not relevant to the article, it shouldn't be a reason for keeping the Flag of the President and Navy etc included in the article. It would make sense if the article was called Flags of Estonia perhaps.--Termer (talk) 22:15, 22 November 2007 (UTC)

I think it's okay to have othe other versions like the naval ensign and the Presidential flags, since they are still representative of Estonia. Most "Flag of xxxx" articles include other versions, see Flag of Germany for example. Martintg (talk) 22:39, 22 November 2007 (UTC)

The point was that it would be good to include some photos but the current not relevant flags really take up all the space. --Termer (talk) 22:57, 22 November 2007 (UTC)

The other flags are still relevant. When an Estonian naval ship or the President visits a country, they fly either the naval ensign or the presidential flag, which is still an official flag of Estonia. I don't think the article is so big that you need to start deleting other images to fit your photos. Martintg (talk) 23:55, 22 November 2007 (UTC)

Its up to you guys.--Termer (talk) 23:57, 22 November 2007 (UTC)

Flag of Estonia on top of Tall Hermann tower, Toompea castle, Tallinn Estonia
Flag of Estonia on top of Suur Munamagi watch tower, the highest point in Estonia and Baltic states, at 318m above sea level

I prefer the image with the Tall Hermann tower, as being more iconic. Martintg (talk) 00:08, 23 November 2007 (UTC)

Meaning of the white color in Lipp's lyrics[edit]

The lyrics of the Estonian flag song of Martin Lipp is following:

Valges ehtes Eesti kased / Kaunistavad kodumaad, / Puhtalt eesti neiu põsed / Roosi-ilul lehkavad. / Puhas vanemate viisi, / Ära lõpe iial sa, / Istutades õrnu õisi: / Eesti, Eesti, ela sa!

Estonian birch-trees in a white adornment / Decorate the homeland / Cleanly the cheeks of an Estonian maiden / Smell with the beauty of a rose / "A clean one" (???) like the ancestors / May you never end / Planting fragile blossoms / Estonia, may you live

To be perfectly honest, nothing in that verse makes any sense. Not even birch trees. There are birch trees in Estonia but most Estonian forests are coniferous and birch is much more common is areas south and east from Estonia. "A clean one, may you never end" is not even a meaningful or grammatically correct sentence. "May the cleanliness never end" would be but that is not what the lyrics says (cleanliness would be "puhtus" in Estonian, not "puhas"). And what has the smell of a rose to do with a white color or Estonia ? Or planting beautiful flowers ("blossoms") ?

Modern versions of the song have completely left out that verse, together with any explanation about the white color. The obvious reason is that the awkward wording of the Lipp's lyrics was too embarrassing for Estonians to sing in a song with so high significance. So saying that Martin Lipp interpretation of white is "hard work, commitment, and white sails of ships" is absolutely wrong. Martin Lipp lyrics does not say a single word about these things. It should be replaced with "white: the color of birch trees and clean cheeks of Estonian maidens", at least when we are talking about the interpretation of Martin Lipp. Warbola (talk) 16:31, 15 January 2012 (UTC)

Suggested merge of Estonian SSR flag[edit]

  • Never a legal flag of Estonia, merger not supported. Same if proposed for Latvia and Lithuania. PЄTЄRS J V TALK 02:07, 28 January 2012 (UTC)
  • oppose merge. Other entity. Indiana State (talk) 04:19, 19 June 2012 (UTC)

Blue colours do not match[edit]

According to the 'colors' section of this page, the RBG for blue should be: 18, 145, 255. But, taking the blue from the images used in this article, this corresponds to 72, 145, 217. Quite a significant difference. Which is the right one? - Jetro (talk) 00:05, 16 December 2012 (UTC)

I've always been told that there's no true one-to-one matching between Pantone colors and computer display colors, because every display is different and even the most modern computer monitors have trouble getting relative brightnesses to match up. See Pantone_Matching_System#Pantone_Color_Matching_System. In that sense there is no correct answer for which blue to use on the Estonian flag in a Wikipedia article. The 18/145/255 value seems to me to be an attempt to get it to be as bright as possible while still maintaining the same hue as the flag we currently have shows, but I'm betting that if you looked at the Estonian flag in real life the blue wouldn't seem very bright. (I've never been there so I can't pull on real-life experience for this). Soap 02:11, 17 December 2012 (UTC)


Eistland in Icelandic. .. the land in the east? — Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 02:05, 10 August 2014 (UTC)