Talk:Frederick Roberts, 1st Earl Roberts

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Post-nominal[edit]

Charles Hardinge also had eight. William Avery 21:10, 18 October 2006 (UTC)

Lord Kitchener has 9 according to his article. He was as "royal" as Roberts. Peter1968 22:53, 9 January 2007 (UTC)
Lord Mountbatten of Burma also had eight (though he could possibly be considered royalty, having been born as a German noble but relinquishing his titles as a teenager), and I'm sure there are others who have as many; the factoid should really be removed from the article. By the way, Peter1968, you should really pipe your links on talk pages; Lord Kitchener takes you to a dab page. TysK 20:29, 15 January 2007 (UTC)
Removed. William Avery 13:43, 24 January 2007 (UTC)

New file File:Frederick Sleigh Roberts, 1st Earl Roberts by George Frederic Watts.jpg[edit]

Frederick Sleigh Roberts, 1st Earl Roberts by George Frederic Watts.jpg

Recently the file File:Frederick Sleigh Roberts, 1st Earl Roberts by George Frederic Watts.jpg (right) was uploaded and it appears to be relevant to this article and not currently used by it. If you're interested and think it would be a useful addition, please feel free to include it. Dcoetzee 07:31, 8 April 2009 (UTC)

Now used in the article. Dormskirk (talk) 17:11, 25 February 2012 (UTC)

Robertsganj[edit]

I presume Robertsganj in India is named after him. If so, this should be noted. Intelligent Mr Toad (talk) 01:13, 22 September 2009 (UTC)

Now noted and referenced. Dormskirk (talk) 17:12, 25 February 2012 (UTC)

WP:SAFRICA assessment[edit]

As a broad outline this article is an excellent introduction, but much is left out that could be included in a biography. Not everything need be left to the article on the South African War. The death of his son trying to rescue British guns from capture at Colenso was an important part of his motivation in travelling to South Africa and deeply affected him. Captain Congreve reported him bursting into tears -- which field marshals did not do in those days, if ever -- when Congreve described his son's heroic death. South African historians, Nasson, Scholtz and especially Wessels have written of his brilliant strategy of deception at the outset of his campaign in February, 1900. The capture of 4000 Boers under Cronje at Paardeberg, nearly a tenth of Boer strength then mobilised, was the major turning point of the war. On the relief of Kimberley the Daily Mail crowed, 'There is no one like Bobs!' [Roberts was known as Bobs throughout his career.] I hope it might be possible for the editors to include some of this detail to bring Roberts to life. ----

Assessed as C-Class. Just weak referencing letting it down. Ron2K (talk) 14:38, 29 December 2009 (UTC)

Referencing now improved and some additional colour added. Dormskirk (talk) 17:13, 25 February 2012 (UTC)

Roberts' titles and post-nomnals[edit]

I think that the order in which Roberts' post-nominals is stated is incorrect. My understanding is that KG takes precedence over all others. Also, at some point he is referred to as "Lord Frederick," which he was not -- surprising to see here ignorance about the difference between a courtesy title and the title of a peer. 71.146.92.124 (talk) 19:05, 9 July 2011 (UTC)

VC takes precedence over all others, it is the highest honour/award/decoration in the British system. I don't think Baronet (Bt) should be before them both though. Woody (talk) 22:53, 9 July 2011 (UTC)

Stature[edit]

mention could, I suggest, be made of Lord Roberts' diminutive stature [As I Understand]/ .Nurse Eleonora Pemberton apparently saw his 'little coffin' brought down to the quay at Boulogne. Autochthony wrote - 2255z 18 December 2011. 109.154.0.195 (talk) 22:54, 18 December 2011 (UTC) sorry - missed his!

He was a very old man. (92.7.9.228 (talk) 14:43, 8 February 2012 (UTC))

I think he always was short though - OTOH to the point where he might not have met height requirements to join the army in other eras, unless I've misremembered that - even before, like most very old people, he shrank. There's a drawing of him visiting Kitchener at the War Office in 1914 - a wizened old man perched on the edge of big chair, while K leans forward solicitously to listen to what his old boss has to say.Paulturtle (talk) 12:01, 13 August 2012 (UTC)

I read somewhere that his nickname in India was "wee Bobs".Southdevonian (talk) 19:33, 9 December 2012 (UTC)

Ribbons[edit]

I earlier put a visual display of Roberts's ribbon bar on the page, and had it removed for reasons of "historical nonsense". I have noted several other articles on British general officers with their respective ribbon bars displayed; if someone could provide a good reason for not including a ribbon bar on this page, do let me know. Aumnamahashiva (talk) 22:12, 10 June 2012 (UTC)

there is some discussion on the subject here: Talk:David Richards (British Army officer). There seems to be a consensus that such ribbons are not helpful. Please note that the article has recently been re-assesed as B class. Dormskirk (talk) 22:18, 10 June 2012 (UTC)

Victorian Ranks[edit]

Might be worth adding a footnote or a link to another article to explain what "second captain" and "supernumerary general" were. It's non-obvious even to someone (me) with a reasonable knowledge of military history.Paulturtle (talk) 12:01, 13 August 2012 (UTC)

Intro[edit]

I have removed a few words, a link and a footnote from the intro. Here is why. I don't think you need to say he was distinguished since being commander in chief speaks for itself. Anglo-Indian is confusing because nowadays it is usually used to refer to someone with both British and Indian ancestors and I can't see any evidence that either of Roberts' parents had any Indian ancestors. On the Kipling page which is used as a source (unpublished?) it does say he came from an Anglo-Indian family but the author may be using the term with its other meaning - British but born in India. It is clear from the next section that he was born in Cawnpore. Southdevonian (talk) 19:15, 9 December 2012 (UTC)

Agreed. The Anglo-Indian comment does not add anything. Better removed. Dormskirk (talk) 19:19, 9 December 2012 (UTC)

What about the Anglo-Irish bit as well? I would go for removing that as well. The source is a note in a book about something else, and the only explanation that the author gives is that Roberts chose Waterford in his title. It looks odd to start the footnotes off with a passing mention in a book about something else. It is clear from the next section that his family was Irish.Southdevonian (talk) 19:28, 9 December 2012 (UTC)

Also agreed. The article lead should really be a summary of the article and should not introduce any new material. In my view no footnoted material should appear in the lead. Dormskirk (talk) 19:35, 9 December 2012 (UTC)

I will go for it then.Southdevonian (talk) 20:21, 9 December 2012 (UTC)

VC[edit]

Didn't Roberts win a VC? One would hardly know it reading this article. Perhaps those with a proprietory concern for this page really should remedy the situation. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.100.213.3 (talk) 15:03, 16 August 2013 (UTC)

There is already a whole section on the Indian Rebellion of 1857 and Roberts' VC. Dormskirk (talk) 21:31, 16 August 2013 (UTC)