Talk:Hazaras

This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Hazaras article.
This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject.

Put new text under old text. Click here to start a new topic.
New to Wikipedia? Welcome! Learn to edit; get help.

Article policies

Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL

Hazaras was a good articles nominee, but did not meet the good article criteria at the time. There may be suggestions below for improving the article. Once these issues have been addressed, the article can be renominated. Editors may also seek a reassessment of the decision if they believe there was a mistake.

Article milestones
Date	Process	Result
November 25, 2009	Good article nominee	Not listed

Hazara C‑class (inactive)

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject Hazara, a project which is currently considered to be inactive.HazaraWikipedia:WikiProject HazaraTemplate:WikiProject HazaraHazara articles
C	This article has been given a rating which conflicts with the project-independent quality rating in the banner shell. Please resolve this conflict if possible.

Ethnic groups High‑importance

This article is within the scope of WikiProject Ethnic groups, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of articles relating to ethnic groups, nationalities, and other cultural identities on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.Ethnic groupsWikipedia:WikiProject Ethnic groupsTemplate:WikiProject Ethnic groupsEthnic groups articles

High

This article has been rated as High-importance on the project's importance scale.

WikiProject Ethnic groups open tasks:

Here are some open WikiProject Ethnic groups tasks:

Meta-tasks:
- Place the {{Ethnic groups}} template on the talk page of articles within the scope of this project.
- Resolve the disparity in importance rankings among different ethnic groups
Articles about ethnic groups that currently have issues needing resolution:
Start an article:
- Wikipedia:WikiProject Ethnic groups/Article requests

Feel free to edit this list or discuss these tasks.

Afghanistan Top‑importance

	Afghanistan portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Afghanistan, a project to maintain and expand Afghanistan-related subjects on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, you can edit the article attached to this page, or visit the project page, where you can join the project and/or contribute to the discussion.AfghanistanWikipedia:WikiProject AfghanistanTemplate:WikiProject AfghanistanAfghanistan articles
Top	This article has been rated as Top-importance on the project's importance scale.

Central Asia High‑importance

	Asia portal Hazaras is part of WikiProject Central Asia, a project to improve all Central Asia-related articles. This includes but is not limited to Afghanistan, Kazakhstan, Kyrgyzstan, Mongolia, Tajikistan, Tibet, Turkmenistan, Uzbekistan, Xinjiang and Central Asian portions of Iran, Pakistan and Russia, region-specific topics, and anything else related to Central Asia. If you would like to help improve this and other Central Asia-related articles, please join the project. All interested editors are welcome.Central AsiaWikipedia:WikiProject Central AsiaTemplate:WikiProject Central AsiaCentral Asia articles
High	This article has been rated as High-importance on the project's importance scale.

Iran C‑class Low‑importance

	Iran portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Iran, an attempt to build a comprehensive and detailed guide to articles related to Iran on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please join the project where you can contribute to the discussions and help with our open tasks.IranWikipedia:WikiProject IranTemplate:WikiProject IranIran articles
C	This article has been given a rating which conflicts with the project-independent quality rating in the banner shell. Please resolve this conflict if possible.
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

Pakistan High‑importance

	Pakistan portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Pakistan, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Pakistan on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.PakistanWikipedia:WikiProject PakistanTemplate:WikiProject PakistanPakistan articles
High	This article has been rated as High-importance on the project's importance scale.
	This article is within the scope of WikiProject Balochistan, Pakistan, a project which is currently considered to be inactive.

Asia: Mongols C‑class Mid‑importance

	Asia portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Asia, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Asia on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.AsiaWikipedia:WikiProject AsiaTemplate:WikiProject AsiaAsia articles
C	This article has been given a rating which conflicts with the project-independent quality rating in the banner shell. Please resolve this conflict if possible.
Mid	This article has been rated as Mid-importance on the project's importance scale.
	This article is supported by WikiProject Mongols (assessed as Mid-importance).

The contentious topics procedure applies to this page. This page is related to India, Pakistan, and Afghanistan, which has been designated as a contentious topic.

Editors who repeatedly or seriously fail to adhere to the purpose of Wikipedia, any expected standards of behaviour, or any normal editorial process may be blocked or restricted by an administrator. Editors are advised to familiarise themselves with the contentious topics procedures before editing this page.

The Wikimedia Foundation's Terms of Use require that editors disclose their "employer, client, and affiliation" with respect to any paid contribution; see WP:PAID. For advice about reviewing paid contributions, see WP:COIRESPONSE.

Stability Information East 2 (talk · contribs) has been paid by Stability Operations Information Center (SOIC-East). Their editing has included contributions to this article. role accounts as disclosed in user page

Archives

Index 1, 2, 3

This page has archives. Sections older than 150 days may be automatically archived by when more than 5 sections are present.

Provide a source[edit]

@Jadidjw The number given is from already established sources give proof otherwise you will be reported. Barbardo (talk) 02:16, 31 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Dear user, you must provide a reliable source. Thanks! Jadidjw (talk) 02:42, 31 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I agree but the number I gave is from sources mentioned by country In the infobox. Barbardo (talk) 03:06, 31 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you! The number should not be estimated based on countries because some countries where Hazaras live are not available in the infobox and the number I restored is higher than your estimate. Jadidjw (talk) 03:42, 31 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

If you find any source then use it but so far these are the only sources so it ehould be based on these numbers. Barbardo (talk) 07:40, 31 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

What you are dling counts as vandalism if you do it again I will report you I have given you many chances find a source that proves you claims. @Jadidjw Barbardo (talk) 18:15, 31 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Dear @Barbardo: Based on which source did you make changes to the article? If you consider my edits to be vandalism, then you are doing vandalism yourself. I have also given you chances to provide reliable sources to prove your claim. Jadidjw (talk) 18:40, 31 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Are you being serious? You are messing with the sources given and claiming its 10 to 14 million find a source to prove it even the changes you made only made 8 million if you dont provide a source to prove your claim and revert the edit you will be reported. I already told you I got the numbers from the countries mentioned in the userbox lets see whp they will agree with if you think I am the vandal. @Jadidjw Barbardo (talk) 19:06, 31 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

You may not change the figure provided based on the source that the total Hazara population are "more than 8 million". Thanks! Jadidjw (talk) 20:09, 31 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

But its not hazara largerly only live in pakistan, afghanistan and iran there population number is given while the rest is diaspora in europe and northen america and they are not in the millions and their numbers are already given @Jadidjw Barbardo (talk) 20:15, 31 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Ignore what I said you gave a source now my bad @Jadidjw Barbardo (talk) 20:24, 31 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you! Jadidjw (talk) 21:15, 31 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

What is even going on here. You two are still reverting each other (WP:3RR and WP:EDITWARRING). HistoryofIran (talk) 22:29, 31 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I think we settled it now so its fine. Barbardo (talk) 22:34, 31 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Non-existent and wrong source[edit]

The Great Russian Encyclopedia did not say anything about the language and history of the Hazara people. The information in the Hazaras article was added based on this false and non-existent source. Please see[1] Jadidjw (talk) 23:48, 1 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 4 December 2023[edit]

This edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request.

Add a few famous people in the article. 203.171.96.53 (talk) 15:36, 4 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. Cannolis (talk) 18:07, 4 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 30 December 2023[edit]

This edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request.

I would like to add Pakistani Hazara jurist Qazi Faez Isa to the article. 203.171.100.57 (talk) 17:01, 30 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. Mattdaviesfsic (talk) 17:05, 30 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Population[edit]

@HistoryofIran: If the source I added is not WP:RS, then the previous source [2] is still not WP:RS. It was previously removed because it was not WP:RS. Thank you! Jadidjw (talk) 16:06, 23 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Just because x is unreliable doesn't mean that y also is. However, since the consensus was that Minahan is not WP:RS, I removed it and thus its numbers too. HistoryofIran (talk) 16:11, 23 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks! Jadidjw (talk) 16:22, 23 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Reverting reasons[edit]

@HistoryofIran: Hi, I don't know why you reverted my edit as I explained it. There is a tribe called Moghols, who are descendants of the Mongol Empire's soldiers led by Genghis Khan in Afghanistan. And what I removed was inaccurate information that did not pertain to the Hazara people. Jadidjw (talk) 18:20, 4 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I still don't understand. Are you trying to refute scholars by stating your own deduction? Or are you stating that the sources don't even mention the Hazara? The former is obviously not acceptable. HistoryofIran (talk) 18:55, 4 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

As I said in the editing summary, Moghols are not Hazaras, this is a clear truth. First: the information that I removed was said based on the Afghan Moghols about the Hazara people. Second: that content doesn't help much for the Wikipedia article, it's better not to have it. Jadidjw (talk) 19:29, 4 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

So the former then. That is not acceptable, Wiki is based on WP:RS, not our personal opinions. Please dont do this again. Ill later do a check and see if you removed more sourced info in this article in the past. It looks like you have resumed your past edits of removing sources info about the Mongol aspect of the Hazaras, which will not be further tolerated. HistoryofIran (talk) 20:20, 4 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Dear HistoryofIran: Wikipedia should be based on facts, information that is unlikely to be true should not be found here. Jadidjw (talk) 20:36, 4 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, and it's currently based on facts. It would likely not be based on facts if we added your opinion. Why? Because Wikipedia is based on WP:RS, not your personal opinion. You've been around since 2021, you should know this. HistoryofIran (talk) 21:57, 4 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

For those interested, I've taken this to WP:ANI [3]. HistoryofIran (talk) 23:30, 4 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Transliteration[edit]

@Jadidjw can you show where "Həzārə" was "agreed upon"? I can't find anything on the talk page(s) and there's nothing in the edit log to suggest there was a consensus. NorthTension (talk) 23:02, 4 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Hi! It "Həzārə" was a minor edit that doesn't need to be discussed, you can make changes to it if you wish. Jadidjw (talk) 23:20, 4 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Oh my bad, I didn't look at the edit log correctly, sorry about that! NorthTension (talk) 23:48, 4 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Hazaras[edit]

Hazaras are not native to Pakistan and Iran. They are merely inhabitants of said countries.

They are native to the Hazarajat region. 2A02:A44B:A664:0:ADE4:47E4:8AE9:B2C6 (talk) 21:19, 12 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 18 April 2024[edit]

This edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request.

I would like to restore some recently deleted reliable sourced information. Bravehm (talk) 18:24, 18 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. Jamedeus (talk) 18:31, 18 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 18 April 2024 (2)[edit]

This edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request.

A user named KoizumiBS has recently removed several reliable sourced content supported from Encyclopaedia of Islam and Encyclopædia Iranica, and made inappropriate changes in the article. See [4] I hereby request to participate in the editing of the article and edit and restore those authentic sourced materials. Bravehm (talk) 20:52, 18 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Actually, KoizumiBS restored sourced information that was removed by the now indeffed user Jadidjw who kept attempting to remove the Mongol aspect of the Hazara, and who also made incorrect claims like you. You wouldn't happen to know Jadidjw? --HistoryofIran (talk) 22:34, 18 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

There is reason to believe that Bravehm is a sockpuppet of the blocked Iampharzad and Jadidjw. See Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/Iampharzad KoizumiBS (talk) 23:25, 18 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The current changes in the article are biased and tasteful by one person. They edit the article according to their will, not from all aspects, they changed the correct and stable contents under the pretext of reverting some information. Bravehm (talk) 23:39, 18 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

You misleadingly claimed that KoizumiBS removed sourced information, when they literally did the opposite. And yet you're calling KoizumiBS biased and distasteful? That is rich. HistoryofIran (talk) 23:44, 18 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

So what is the reason for changing the article information and this type editing of KoizumiBS[5]. See all KoizumiBS contributions, they are only for one purpose in Wikipedia [6] Bravehm (talk) 00:04, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

This sounds like WP:JDLI. HistoryofIran (talk) 00:09, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Don't get it wrong. Any subversive editing should not be liked. Bravehm (talk) 00:31, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

You're still yet to explain why its "subversive", and as long as you haven't done that, this is WP:ASPERSIONS. HistoryofIran (talk) 00:33, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Under the guise of restored sourced info, KoizumiBS has changed sourced info that previously had nothing wrong with it, and this is a subversive edit. Bravehm (talk) 00:51, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Not good enough, this is quite vague. Please come with examples. HistoryofIran (talk) 00:53, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

For example, KoizumiBS changed sourced info from Encyclopaedia of Islam "The Hazara people speak the Hazaragi dialect of Persian, which is infused with many Turkic and a few Mongolic words." to "According to Britannica, The Hazara speak an eastern variety of Persian called Hazaragi with many Mongolian and Turkic words."

Changed sourced info from Encyclopaedia Iranica "In the 16th-century, some Hazaras spoke a Mongolian language." to "According to a number of sources, in the 16th century the Mongolian language was widespread among the Hazaras."

Others see for yourself.[7] Bravehm (talk) 01:10, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

This is poor, the two examples you came up with are more and less the same before and after, KoizumiBS literally just restored the information removed by Jadidjw. So much for the "subversive edit". I'm outta here. HistoryofIran (talk) 01:27, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I have left the others for you to check because there are too many of them and it would be difficult to describe them here. Bravehm (talk) 01:30, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Not how it works. HistoryofIran (talk) 23:15, 19 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]