Talk:Henrik, Prince Consort of Denmark

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Jump to: navigation, search

Untitled[edit]

Renamed page per Wiki stylebook re form for royal consorts, male or female. Mowens35 13:15, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)

This just sounds very weird now! Prince Consort Henrik… huh? His name in Denmark is “Henrik, Hans Kongelige Højhed Prinsen”, which translates “Henrik, His Royal highness The Prince”. He might be a consort, but nobody calls him a consort. This is just plain weird now I think. Prince Henrik of Denmark is much more correct, as he actually goes in the public as “Prince Henrik”

At Her Majesty's birthday on April 16 2005, The Queen gave to Prince Henrik the title of His Royal Highness The Prince Consort of Denmark, which in Danish translates to Hans Kongelige Højhed Prinsgemalen. So there is nothing wrong with the article.

Fluent Chinese[edit]

The article (as well as Henrik's official biography at kongehuset.dk) claims that Henrik speaks fluent "Chinese". Though Chinese has a unified written language, its various spoken forms/variants/dialects/sublanguages are said to mutually incomprehensible. Does it makes sense to say that somebody speaks Chinese in general, then? –Henning Makholm 04:58, 22 August 2007 (UTC)

Possibly not. I presume it is Mandarin Chinese. --Thathánka Íyotake (talk) 01:38, 29 May 2008 (UTC)

Count de Laborde de Monpezat[edit]

Is he still "Count de Laborde de Monpezat" too? Demophon (talk) 14:31, 30 April 2008 (UTC)

I cannot see any reason for him to lose any French titles upon gaining Danish ones. Of course, this is assuming that he was Count de Laborde de Monpezat to begin with (see footnote 1). -- Jao (talk) 15:46, 30 April 2008 (UTC)
Ghehe, you are right, I didn't see the footnote ;-) By-the-way, his children did get the Danish noble title "Count of Monpezat", as I can see on their Wikipedia websites. Is the title also given to Prince Henrik? I can not read Danish. Demophon (talk) 15:55, 30 April 2008 (UTC)
You are more up to date than me, I had no idea about the "Count of Monpezat" thing. According to the press release (which was released today) this new title is bestowed upon Frederik and Joachim and their spouses and descendants, in the common Danish variants (greve for male descendants, grevinde for their spouses, and komtesse for female descendants). Henrik's titles are not changed by this. -- Jao (talk) 16:07, 30 April 2008 (UTC)
Perhaps this is a sign of a to-be-reigning House of Monpezat rather than a sham House of Glücksburg after Margrethe II. Charles 16:09, 30 April 2008 (UTC)
Henrik's French titles are 'personal titles', I assume (since France, is a Republic). GoodDay (talk) 22:04, 30 April 2008 (UTC)
The name of the house can't be changed every time there happens to be a queen rather than a king. I find the male-line "Count of Monpezat" nonsense amusing because if Christian has an eldest daughter she'll be queen and her descendants won't be counts of Monpezat. Henrik's self-centeredness can be washed out of the Danish royal family that easily.67.100.203.179 (talk) 17:52, 30 April 2009 (UTC)
The reigning house of Denmark is the House of Schleswig-Holstein-Sonderburg-Glücksburg. The House of Laborde de Monpezat does not exist in Denmark. The Princes, their wives and their children have recently been given the Danish additional titles of Count/Countess of Montpezat in honour of Prince Henrik, but the name of the reigning House is not affected.In an era of gender equality it is normal that the House name should not change. The Royal web-site makes the position clear: http://kongehuset.dk/publish.php?dogtag=k_dk_familien Harlay (talk) 19:12, 24 August 2009 (UTC)
That may be how you translate the Danish version of the website, but the English version says nothing about the future name of the dynasty beyond Queen Margrethe II: all it does is confirm that the present Royal Family "descends" from the House of Glucksborg (just as the House of Glucksborg "descends" from the House of Oldenburg). Following Margrethe II a new situation occurrs: the male-line of Oldenburg will no longer reign in Denmark. Nothing has been stated officially about the name of the dynasty that will accede when Margrethe ceases to reign. The fact that she is considered a "Glucksborg" is simply traditional: in Europe, an heiress to a throne has always been considered to reign as a member of her father's dynasty. But when her child or descendant succeeds to the throne, sometimes the dynasty becomes known by the father's surname (e.g. Vasa {Poland}), Bourbon (Navarre), Tudor, Stuart, Hanover and Saxe-Coburg {Britain}, Bourbon {Spain}); sometimes the dynasty keeps the name of the maternal line (Romanov (Russia), Nassau (Netherlands), Grimaldi (Monaco); sometimes a combination is used (Habsburg-Lorraine (Austria); Austria-Este (Modena). Until an official declaration is issued, we don't know to what dynasty Denmark's next monarch will belong. Horledi (talk) 18:35, 19 September 2009 (UTC)

Validity of the "Count de Laborde de Monpezat" title[edit]

it may be useful to indicate in this article that the Laborde family has never belonged to French nobility under any governements, and, as such, cannot claim any title from this country (with no offense to the Danish royal family) : Henri's father was no count, neither was the Prince Consort before his marriage. if such title exists today, it is a Danish one as it was conferred by the Queen to both of her sons. CMP —Preceding unsigned comment added by 132.168.9.147 (talk) 12:04, 26 January 2009 (UTC)

Have you read the Count controversy section? -- Jao (talk) 13:20, 26 January 2009 (UTC)
ok so maybe the title should not be mentionned before his father's name, as well as in the "titles" section of Prince Henrik ? I understand that he used to be known under the count title for a while (1934-1967) but that's no justification of his rights. French translation of this article has the same problem. CMP —Preceding unsigned comment added by 132.168.9.147 (talk) 13:16, 27 January 2009 (UTC)

Dubious[edit]

Why is the source for the Vatican's agreement to his conversion marked as dubious? It looks OK to me. Nutiketaiel (talk) 17:34, 28 October 2009 (UTC)

The claim that Vatican agreed to his conversion was marked as dubious by another user. I inserted the source and I too can't understand how Vatican allowed someone to cease practicing Roman Catholicism? Surtsicna (talk) 20:19, 28 October 2009 (UTC)
I find it odd as well, but stranger things have happened, and we have a suitable source for it now. Shouldn't the dubious tag be removed? Nutiketaiel (talk) 16:43, 29 October 2009 (UTC)
If you think that it should be removed, go ahead. If I remove it, one could say that I did it because I inserted the source :) Surtsicna (talk) 17:04, 30 October 2009 (UTC)
I have removed it. The source you added seems to be perfectly adequate. Nutiketaiel (talk) 17:22, 30 October 2009 (UTC)
I disagree. First, Wikipedia's Verifiability rule requires "exceptional" not merely "adequate" substantiation for in-credible or virtually unprecedented assertions: the Pope's consent that a Roman Catholic should abandon his faith in order to take up another is an extraordinary -- perhaps (except under duress) altogether unheard of -- event (whereas marriages between Catholics and non-Catholic royalty have been well-documented, and in none has permission ever been granted to the Catholic to abandon the faith -- indeed, in some cases (Princess Anne of Bourbon-Parma, Princess Giovanna of Savoy) the Pope refused permission for any of the future children to be raised as non-Catholic -- including the heir to Orthodox thrones -- let alone conversion to Orthodoxy of the already-Catholic fiancée. Multiple reliable sources would be needed to justify inclusion of this claim, especially in a WP:BLP article. Secondly, the source does not say that the Pope approved Henri's conversion to Protestantism, rather it says that the Vatican "gave its consent for him to settle his personal religious situation". That could mean no more than that he managed to obtain a letter from a Vatican prelate recognising that, as a free citizen of a European nation, he had the right to take up membership in any church of his choice. The wording is insufficient to justify an allegation of Catholic authorization for his conversion from Catholicism. Therefore, I am restoring the dubious tag. Horledi (talk) 16:35, 31 October 2009 (UTC)
Ah. Well, that seems reasonable. OK then. Nutiketaiel (talk) 19:57, 6 November 2009 (UTC)

It's clear that he converted from Catholicism to Lutheranism[1]. Henrik writes in his autobiography Skæbne forpligter that his father was sceptical to his conversion.[2] Garn Svend (talk) 14:09, 1 May 2011 (UTC)

I removed the tag since the specific statement present in the article (as of today) does not appear in doubt. What the pope, the Vatican or the catholic church think of it all is perhaps more dubious but the text does not mention it one way or the other. GL (talk) 10:19, 11 January 2013 (UTC) 

Ancestry[edit]

I am not sure how having an ancestry chart will help readers understand that the Prince's family was not titled. Mere names would not do it, because anyone can, at any time, add the word "Count" to their names or remove it. Besides, the text of the article refers to his father as count. The chart, therefore, doesn't help solve the case. There must be more efficient ways to prove that his family wasn't noble - such as a simple sentence with a reference. The chart is utterly useless, as nobody would be interested in the name of his maternal grandfather's paternal grandmother. Wikipedia is not a directory of genealogical entries. Surtsicna (talk) 23:24, 19 June 2010 (UTC)

I don't agree. While it's true that anyone can vandalize anything in Wikipedia, the chart correctly shows that Henrik's ancestors aren't identified as counts, and it's up to Wikipedians to keep it accurate -- I'll help. No one's arguing that the family tree proves the Labordes were untitled, merely that it helps illustrate that fact. Precisely because other aspects of the article remain ambiguous (since Henrik used the title of comte with his name prior to marriage, Wiki rules don't permit us to retroactively deprive him of it merely because we now know the usage was both legally & socially unjustified), it's important to keep in information which adds context. Since the article acknowledges that the family nearly became noble, and that they repeatedly changed their surname to appear noble, I consider that the family tree helps illustrate that those efforts weren't altogether effective (of course, they were effective with respect to the Danish court since, as the article notes, Margrethe's cousin lost his succession rights for marrying a commoner after Margrethe married comte Henrik. All the more reason for this encyclopedia to shine light on the truth). As for excess genealogy, there's an argument that any at all is too much, so it's a judgment call. Some will, I think, be interested in seeing a few generations of the paternity of future King Frederik X, although that's not the primary reason for inclusion. FactStraight (talk) 01:41, 20 June 2010 (UTC)

External links modified[edit]

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just added archive links to 2 external links on Henrik, Prince Consort of Denmark. Please take a moment to review my edit. If necessary, add {{cbignore}} after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add {{nobots|deny=InternetArchiveBot}} to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:

When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true to let others know.

You may set the |checked=, on this template, to true or failed to let other editors know you reviewed the change. If you find any errors, please use the tools below to fix them or call an editor by setting |needhelp= to your help request.

  • If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
  • If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

If you are unable to use these tools, you may set |needhelp=<your help request> on this template to request help from an experienced user. Please include details about your problem, to help other editors.

Cheers. —cyberbot IITalk to my owner:Online 00:39, 30 August 2015 (UTC)

External links modified[edit]

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified 2 external links on Henrik, Prince Consort of Denmark. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

You may set the |checked=, on this template, to true or failed to let other editors know you reviewed the change. If you find any errors, please use the tools below to fix them or call an editor by setting |needhelp= to your help request.

  • If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
  • If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

If you are unable to use these tools, you may set |needhelp=<your help request> on this template to request help from an experienced user. Please include details about your problem, to help other editors.

Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 20:47, 31 March 2017 (UTC)

External links modified[edit]

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified 2 external links on Henrik, Prince Consort of Denmark. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

You may set the |checked=, on this template, to true or failed to let other editors know you reviewed the change. If you find any errors, please use the tools below to fix them or call an editor by setting |needhelp= to your help request.

  • If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
  • If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

If you are unable to use these tools, you may set |needhelp=<your help request> on this template to request help from an experienced user. Please include details about your problem, to help other editors.

Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 16:53, 27 July 2017 (UTC)