Talk:List of founders of religious traditions
|This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the List of founders of religious traditions article.
This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject.
|This article is of interest to the following WikiProjects:|
Surely the inclusion of Pastafarianism is not a valid entry, as it is a satirical/spoof religion designed to draw attention to flaws in other faiths? Isn't the defining factor that Pastafarianism is not designed to be followed sincerely - nobody actually REALLY believes in the Flying Spaghetti Monster, do they? If it's not a religion, it's (at best) a philosophy, and therefore should it be here? Any thoughts? User:JulesVerne (User talk:JulesVerne) 10:55, 18 December 2008 (GMT)
Dates of Vedas and Puranas, and the Authors
VEDAS : The Vedas are among the oldest sacred texts. The Samhitas date to roughly 1500–1000 BCE, and the "circum-Vedic" texts, as well as the redaction of the Samhitas, date to c. 1000-500 BCE, resulting in a Vedic period, spanning the mid 2nd to mid 1st millennium BCE, or the Late Bronze Age and the Iron Age.
Michael Witzel gives a time span of c. 1500 BCE to c. 500-400 BCE. Witzel makes special reference to the Near Eastern Mitanni material of the 14th c. BCE the only epigraphic record of Indo-Aryan contemporary to the Rigvedic period. He gives 150 BCE (Patañjali) as a terminus ante quem for all Vedic Sanskrit literature, and 1200 BCE (the early Iron Age) as terminus post quem for the Atharvaveda.
Transmission of texts in the Vedic period was by oral tradition alone, preserved with precision with the help of elaborate mnemonic techniques. A literary tradition set in only in post-Vedic times, after the rise of Buddhism in the Maurya period, perhaps earliest in the Kanva recension of the Yajurveda about the 1st century BCE; however oral tradition predominated until c. 1000 CE.
Rig Veda manuscripts have been selected for inscription in UNESCO's "Memory of the World" Register 2007.
PURANAS : Vyasa, the narrator of the Mahabharata, is traditionally considered the compiler of the Puranas. However, the earliest written versions date from the time of the Gupta Empire (third-fifth century CE) and much material may be dated, through historical references and other means, to this period and the succeeding centuries.
The date of the production of the written texts does not define the date of origin of the Puranas. On one hand, they existed in some oral form before being written while at the same time, they have been incrementally modified well into the 16th century.
- Gavin Flood sums up mainstream estimates, according to which the Rigveda was compiled from as early as 1500 BCE over a period of several centuries. Flood 1996, p. 37
- Witzel, Michael, "Vedas and Upaniṣads", in: Flood 2003, p. 68
- For the possibility of written texts during the first century BCE see: Witzel, Michael, "Vedas and Upaniṣads", in: Flood 2003, p. 69; For oral composition and oral transmission for "many hundreds of years" before being written down, see: Avari 2007, p. 76.
- The Puranas by Swami Sivananda
- Johnson 2009, p. 247
- Singh 1997, p. 2324
Cult to Yahweh in the 13th century B.C.?
Canaan existed from 2500 to 1000 B.C., and Israel, the Hebrew language and the Yahwism emerged after the collapse of canaan, It is impossible for there existed before 1000 B.C., although Yahweh comes from El does not mean that already existed worship Yahweh. Already it existed worship Allah (Islam), jehova (Christianity) or Baha (Baha'i Faith)? Even the supreme god of the pagan Arab religion was called allah, an association of names is not relevant. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 220.127.116.11 (talk) 15:58, 4 October 2016 (UTC)
- I agree with 18.104.22.168 contribution . Link between "Cult to Yahweh" and judaism is not relevant. No common aspect in any subject ! If you really want to give an ancester to Judaism , Zoroastrism, the first monotheism discovered by jewish people during babylon exil is the closest ancester. Michel1961 (talk) 13:28, 14 November 2016 (UTC)
- @Michel1961: The IP is confused and wrong. Canaan didn't collapse as it wasn't a political entity, it was the name of a region. "Hebrew developed during the latter half of the second millennium BCE between the Jordan and the Mediterranean Sea, an area known as Canaan." according to our article Hebrew. But you are also confused, although right about the removal. This is a list of founders. The section 'Yahwists' didn't mention a founder and no one suggests Yahweh founded anything. It is certainly not an article about how Judaism developed out of other religions. Doug Weller talk 15:19, 14 November 2016 (UTC)
The opening sentence of the article reads "This article lists historical figures credited with founding religions…" (my emphasis). The subsection "Ancient (before AD 500)" has a note reading "only add HISTORICAL INDIVIDUALS" (not my emphasis). "Yahwists" is not a historical figure or a historical individual, it is the equivalent of listing "Ancient Celts" as the founder of Wicca or "Indo-Aryans" as the founder of Hinduism – pointless and redundant. User:BedrockPerson, your claim that your edits are "staff approved" is laughable, and the above discussion clearly shows no other editors are in favour of your addition. 22.214.171.124 (talk) 06:36, 31 December 2016 (UTC)
- User:BedrockPerson Judging by your edit summaries, I think you're a little bit confused about some of the terminology on Wikipedia. The people on article talkpages aren't "staff", they are just called editors. "Staff" generally refers to the staff of the Wikimedia Foundation. That is why I was a bit snippy in an edit summary, because it sounded like you were claiming your reversion was approved by high-level management (which is hardly ever required). But please actually respond to the criticisms people are making about this edit. I notice the last three sections in the article archive (from July 2016) are also about whether Judaism has a "founder" that can be included in this article. 126.96.36.199 (talk) 18:10, 1 January 2017 (UTC)
IP protection maybe needed?
The edit warring/content dispute is getting out of hand. I have fully protected this page for 48 hours. Settle this here on the talk page. If there is an issue with one or more editors inability to abide by consensus take it to ANI. Remember there are multiple avenues open for resolving content disputes. -Ad Orientem (talk) 23:41, 3 January 2017 (UTC)