Talk:List of languages by number of native speakers

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Jump to: navigation, search
WikiProject Languages (Rated List-class, Low-importance)
WikiProject icon This article is within the scope of WikiProject Languages, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of standardized, informative and easy-to-use resources about languages on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.
 List  This article has been rated as List-Class on the project's quality scale.
 Low  This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

This article has comments here.

Link to old version[edit]

with the disputed Ethnologue or what ever sources, before someone decided to delete the smaller languages out of the list:

Swahili (140 million+) is missing, should be No. 9 in the list[edit]


No it says native speakers. — Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 14:06, 27 October 2015 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 17 October 2015[edit]

The Hindi language is spoken by 1200 million people worldwide and is the most spoken language in the world.Source : It is spoken by at least 422 million people in India alone vide 2001 census data of Govt. Of India. I quote source (talk) 11:20, 22 October 2015 (UTC) Rajatbindalbly (talk) 09:53, 17 October 2015 (UTC)

  • X mark.svg Not done The figure you repeatedly try to add to Hindi, 1,200 million (not 1,200 as stated above...), and now also want to add here, is from a self-published "report" by a self-proclaimed "linguist", and is nothing but pure fantasy. Thomas.W talk 11:58, 17 October 2015 (UTC)

Sir, My question is not replied. If you dont believe the source of data from 2011 census of Govt. of India , wihich is certainly not a homemade data or a hobbyists data then what source would you believe.People on wikipedia are frequently editing pages without any authentic data. I feel disgusted and take an impression that the data on wikipedia encyclopedia is not authentic and is written by people having the the thinking of colonial times claiming their supremacy to source of knowledge. And I end this discussion frustrated by your mean approach.--Rajatbindalbly (talk) 16:59, 18 October 2015 (UTC)

The censusdata you're referring to has nothing to do with your claim about Hindi being spoken by 1.2 billion people, unless you're trying to claim that everyone in India speaks Hindi, which of course isn't true (for further reading see this). Thomas.W talk 17:09, 18 October 2015 (UTC)

O.K. if 1200 billion people speaking hindi cannot be believed because as per you it is a research by an individual( though this is a research paper and I do not agree with you) then the official census 2001 of Govt. Of India says that 422 million people speak hindi. It automatically gives hindi the status of second largest spoken language in the world but you are repeatedly undoning my edits which is incorrect and strongly protested. I wish to know under what authority you are trying to undone my edits with verifyble source?? I will report it to central administration of Wikipedia. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Rajatbindalbly (talkcontribs)

You have already been given an answer to that question, including by SpacemanSpiff, so why do you keep asking the same question? Thomas.W talk 17:37, 18 October 2015 (UTC)

I have replied to SpacemaSpiff too. There is no language in the world called as Hindustani. Neither it is taught in India. Hindi means hindi and that is it. Hindi is having different accents and slangs but it do not undone the basic language as Hindi. Please discuss it at length with professors of Hindi in India as in Britain it is impossible to understand the spread of hindi worldwide.Rajatbindalbly (talk) 13:49, 19 October 2015 (UTC)

Please also check Rajatbindalbly (talk) 14:32, 19 October 2015 (UTC)

Stabila,,, I have read the policy. The census data of 2001 by Govt. Of India is an authentic data and cannot be ignored. It says 422 million people speak in Hindi in India alone. If someone has doubt over this data I personally invite him/her to visit India and find the correctness of truth. People in Pakistan, Nepal, Saudi Arabia and immigrants to U.S., U.K., U.A.E. and other countries also speak hindi which data is not included in the above.Rajatbindalbly (talk) 10:57, 22 October 2015 (UTC) Getting recognition internationally is also the job of PMO. Our P.M. Sri Narendra Modi is very particular on that. Also he will never ignore the request of a lawyer who speak only after doing original research.Rajatbindalbly (talk) 11:56, 22 October 2015 (UTC)

I quote (talk) 11:03, 22 October 2015 (UTC)

I changed to template to "yes" again. Your edits are becoming more and more disruptive since you're still going on about it, even though multiple editors have told you why you can't add those numbers to the article. Thomas.W talk 11:06, 22 October 2015 (UTC)

If my request for updating the status of hindi language to at least 2nd position worldwide is not accepted I will ask The Prime Minister Office of Indian Govt. to take up the issue with Wikipedia and if Wikipedia dont agree to update I will also request The Prime Minister Office to Ban wikipedia in India for circulating false and scandalous material.Rajatbindalbly (talk) 11:20, 22 October 2015 (UTC)

Don't be silly, I'm sure the Prime Minister of India has more important matters to deal with than to support you and your original research on Wikipedia... Thomas.W talk 11:35, 22 October 2015 (UTC)
First time I've seen a PM brought into a legal threat before. UltraExactZZ Said ~ Did 14:48, 22 October 2015 (UTC)

Rajatbindalbly, your question has been answered. Whether you like the answer or not is, frankly, not relevant. You are now being purely disruptive by your refusal to WP:HEAR. Consider this a warning that you may be blocked if you continue in the same way. Jeppiz (talk) 12:44, 22 October 2015 (UTC)

The question here is whether Nationalencyklopedin is the best source of information for global language use or are there better sources of information for this article.
For List of languages by number of native speakers in India, there is also this 2001 Census statement that confirms the 422M figure. As soon as Census India releases data from the 2011, that page can be updated which is just what other editors are saying. Wikipedia can't use self-published papers as reliable sources, especially ones that don't disclose the methodology of the study. Liz Read! Talk! 15:25, 22 October 2015 (UTC)

@Liz: The page you linked to has confused Hindi with Hindustani languages, a whole group of related languages, when compiling the report. If you check the list there you'll find that 48 other languages, including Bhojpuri and Rajasthani, are included in the 422 million (if you look closely at the very confusing report you'll find the number of actual Hindi speakers listed as 257 million...). It's as if someone confused German and Germanic languages, and included speakers of Dutch, the Scandinavian languages and all other Germanic languages in a figure for the number of German speakers. An error that people here on en_WP have tried to make Rajatbindalbly understand, but that he either can't understand or won't accept. Thomas.W talk 15:52, 22 October 2015 (UTC)
@Liz: We have discussed this for years, literally, and Nationalencyklopedin is the best available source for now. Please understand that what a census in one country or another reports is irrelevant to this article, as a list of this kind only makes sense if all data comes from the same source. This is why the article is permanently semi-protected, as we've seen years of IPs coming with a source claiming their language is larger. I'm sure everybody would be interested to hear about another possible source for the list of languages, but a source for only one language is and remains irrelevant here, no matter how WP:RS it is for the article on that individual language. Jeppiz (talk) 16:56, 22 October 2015 (UTC)
Okay, okay, I was just raising the question about the primary source, I'm not trying to be contentious.
I'm sorry if this issue has been discussed for years but I will predict in three months weeks/days or so, another editor who is new to the subject will raise similar questions. I don't know why this subject is such a lightening rod but if you are right that the figures are frequently contested, you can expect continued challenges from editors who believe they have a source that is superior to Nationalencyklopedin. Liz Read! Talk! 17:09, 22 October 2015 (UTC)
Yup, we're very used to it. Some of the sources probably are superior, but only for one language. What many users don't understand is that a list of this kind only makes sense if the source is the same for all the data, otherwise ranking becomes meaningless. The archives are full of explanations about this, but you're right that we'll continue to see a steady stream of users unaware of it, and 99% convinced that their language should be higher ranked. Jeppiz (talk) 20:59, 22 October 2015 (UTC)

Please see this, here research is made for all the languages together and hindi is ranked on no. 2 with 588 million speakers.Rajatbindalbly (talk) 13:25, 24 October 2015 (UTC) Please see this here chinese is shown to have a group of 13 languages.Arabic is a language grouping 19 languages.Malay as a group of 9 languages.Even if we take english it is spoken differently in U.K. and U.S..Rajatbindalbly (talk) 13:31, 24 October 2015 (UTC)

Washington Post use a wider definition of "Hindi" than professional linguists and Wikipedia do, so it's of no relevance here. Thomas.W talk 13:34, 24 October 2015 (UTC)

Please also see this (talk) 14:19, 24 October 2015 (UTC)

Please also see this is on wikipedia itself.Rajatbindalbly (talk) 14:27, 24 October 2015 (UTC)

A language is a combination of dialect and script spoken in large area having its own text and literature for a large period of time. It has its own grammer and other technical aspects to make it perfect. Sub language is a dialect which is developed through main language and having literature, script and grammer in developing stage. As soon as it will mature it may have a separate status of independent language. A dialect is a speech or speaking language originated from main language having no text, literature or script of its own. Dialect, sub language are all clubbed under language when we speak about term language. Kindly see Bhojpuri, magadhi, avadhi and other are the dialects of hindi having no independent status. These have originated from hindi as main language. So whenever you will ask a person speaking bhojpuri he will tell you hindi as his native language. Please see Please see this here chinese is shown to have a group of 13 languages.Arabic is a language grouping 19 languages.Malay as a group of 9 languages.Even if we take english it is spoken differently in U.K. and U.S.Please also see this in census 2001 is shown as a group of several dialects recognizing hindi as main language.Rajatbindalbly (talk) 06:28, 25 October 2015 (UTC)

You are extremely disruptive. This edit request has been answered. You may not like the answer, and we frankly could not care less. The source you're citing is ridiculous, Jayanti Prasad Nautiyal is not a real researcher, his so-called "research" is complete nonsense. Your constant treats of having the Indian Prime Minister ban Wikipedia not only violates WP:LEGAL, it's as ridiculous as the rest. You've been disrupting this page for over a week now, and you've refused to WP:HEAR all other users. Stop now! Jeppiz (talk) 10:49, 25 October 2015 (UTC)
Iam not citing Mr. Nautiyal as source. I am citing Britanica, Washington Post, Ethnologue, Indian Census 2001 as source. Trying humbly to bring correct fact on record to make wikipedia more strong and authentic.Some editors says that Hindustani is a language. If it is recognized as language then it may be given a first place or second place in  the list .Rajatbindalbly (talk) 13:29, 25 October 2015 (UTC)

Multiple sources[edit]

This used to have mutliple sources. Is it not possible for this still to be the case? Munci (talk) 06:54, 7 December 2015 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 5 January 2016[edit]

Values in Total row at the end of table are not in correct columns. (talk) 19:41, 5 January 2016 (UTC)

Yes check.svg Done Thanks for pointing it out! Mz7 (talk) 05:40, 6 January 2016 (UTC)