Talk:Main Page/Archive 34

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Catalan Edition arrived 10.000 articles 5 months ago!

And still not reflected here. [Catalan Vikipedia] -- 14:00, 7 Apr 2005 (UTC)

The Military History of the Soviet Union

Discussion has been moved to Talk:Military history of the Soviet Union. --Fangz 02:20, 7 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Why does this site till think it's April 1st

What's going on? It's really bugging me. Of course we're to expect windups on April Fools day but I can't stand looking at the history of toilet roll holders or the (presumably) erroneous stories about Britannia taking over this site.

It's not displaying like that to me, at least. Try clearing your browser's cache; it sounds like you're still seeing an old version of the page. —Korath (Talk) 02:49, Apr 3, 2005 (UTC)
Who's scewin around with my stuff well cal nick a fine peice of ass (comment by User:Movieman56)

Printer Friendly Version

I often want to print Wikipedia's Main Page or many of its articles. Is there a printer friendly mode I could use to achieve this? --Exigentsky

Actually, all the pages of Wikipedia are printer friendly. When you print, pretty much everything by way of formatting is taken away from the page. Try File > Print Preview to see the difference. If you have any suggestions on how to make this Print Friendly format even better, please suggest. -- user:zanimum
Still there's a lot of external links to other projects which mess up the layout as they show the full link in printing. I suggest you just select the text you want before printing and print your selection. Mgm|(talk) 00:35, Mar 26, 2005 (UTC)
In the Classic, Cologne Blue, and Nostalgia skins, there's a "Printable version" link. I don't know why it isn't in Monobook (the default). —Korath (Talk) 00:57, Mar 26, 2005 (UTC)
Something about skinning issues: the way that this skin is set up makes it nigh impossible to add "Printer Friendly" functionality without majorly rearranging the page. I'd like to see this sort of feature added in the future though. Ambush Commander 19:03, Mar 26, 2005 (UTC)
Yep--you don't need to click "printer friendly" to get it. Just click (hide) on the TOC and go into print preview. that's printer friendly. 00:11, 29 Mar 2005 (UTC)

MP Discussion Archive

I think a good chunk of this page ought to be archived soon. It's getting unwieldy. Feel free to erase this message when (if) that gets done. :D Cigarette 22:10, 25 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Genus, species are italic

Make that Helicobacter pylori; the article has it correct. Gene Nygaard 01:03, 26 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Done, thanks for catching that. — Knowledge Seeker 07:19, 26 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Categories link is wrong at bottom right (english)

Starts at l0...

Redirect in "In the News"

The little summary of the political situation in Kyrgyzstan has a link to Kurmanbek Bakiev, this should be changed to Kurmanbek Bakiyev. Dralwik 02:29, 26 Mar 2005 (UTC)

When have we done enough?

After looking at all the articles we have I am starting to wonder is there is much more knowledge we can contribute. While i'm sure there is someone out there looking for the current statistics on the bearded lady beer chugging contest, I think there is no more knowledge we can contribute. I know that this is not a static world, we have covered losts of VERY obscure subjects. Oh well, i know this won't change much, but it's my two cents.

  • Well it may look like we've got enough down, but I've noticed large gaps in the coverage of chemistry, magic, and forensics to name a few fields. We're not done yet! - Mgm|(talk) 15:39, Mar 26, 2005 (UTC)
  • the coverage on lots of major topics is appalling. We have every tidbit on J.R.R. Tolkien, but whole nations, epochs and sciences are covered by a little stub of two or three sentences. I wish people would invest as much energy into filling stubs as they do into endless disputes on Creationism / Israel / Sex acts / G. W. Bush etc. :o( 16:17, 26 Mar 2005 (UTC)
When have we done enough? Not today. -- Cyrius| 16:32, 26 Mar 2005 (UTC)
Didn't the chief of the American patent office quit in 1900 because he thought pretty much everything had been invented? ;) Cigarette 16:57, 26 Mar 2005 (UTC)
Or "Physics, as we know it, will be over in six months." -Max Born (1928). I personally think Wikipedia will not be finished until there are no stubs. Nickptar 18:27, 26 Mar 2005 (UTC)
When there are no more stubs there will be a legion of articles that don't even exist! When the Bearded Lady Beerchugging Contest Results have reached Featured status, where will that leave the Human Cannonball Polevault? Or the regional Furtune Telling Lady Crystal Bowling Leugue winners? Wikipedia is not a mountain, static and intimidating, Wikipedia is a living, breating monster of an encyclopedia. It will forever evolve. Gkhan 21:45, Mar 26, 2005 (UTC)
  • to the original (anonymous) note poster: Are you making a joke? Or are you serious? Courtland 22:51, 2005 Mar 26 (UTC)

I'm megan189, i just didn't log in. What i meant to say is that when we look at this database, and compare it to the wiktionary, or the wikibooks, this is HUGE! I was just going to suggest that we try to expand the other wikis a bit to. I'm sorry if this is not the place to discuss this.

  • Contributors will work on those subjects in which they are interested. Perhaps some topics have gaps bacause there are not enough Wikipedians with an expertise in those areas. I don't think Wiktionary grabs one's imagination in quite the same way as Wikipedia. Wikibooks just seems like a dilution of effort. Nelson Ricardo 15:37, Mar 28, 2005 (UTC)
It is a problem of organization: I think that Wikipedia may only have "too much information" when that information is un-navigatable, when one is not able to find the information they are looking for. I have not, however, noticed this to be a problem (and I have yet to come across the bearded lady beer chugging contest). Also, sometimes one contributor or reader's excess trivia is another contributor or reader's wealth of information (maybe a bearded lady was sitting around one day thinking, "I don't have any skills except chugging bear... I wish there was some way of using that, maybe in a contest..."). In articles with actual trivia sections, the sections tend to get created as a place to put information which doesn't yet fit in the article, then they grow until they are unsightly and someone integrates or deletes the factoids. I believe they are generally avoided, as labelling something trivial is against Wikipedia:NPOV. Hyacinth 05:11, 4 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Marburg outbreak in Angola

Looks like the outbreak of Ebola-like Marburg virus is heating up in Angola. Might want to keep an eye on this one for the news as it appears to be spreading, and there's an incubation period which means an explosion of cases could be imminent. The Marburg and filovirus articles could use some work, as could the (I think improperly named -- somebody check capitalization of "province") Uige Province article; I've done what I can. Neurophyre 04:42, 27 Mar 2005 (UTC)

circulatory system

what would be a good game to teach a 9th grade class about the circulatory system?

Wikipedia graphic

hey what does the sphere puzzle above the wikipedia title represent?

That Wikipedia is an always-unfinished work in progress, with a strong international component.-gadfium 09:33, 28 Mar 2005 (UTC)
It's also made up of little pieces put together one by one. -- Cyrius| 13:41, 28 Mar 2005 (UTC)
Also, the symbols are letters and words in different language scripts. -- user:zanimum
Also, the symbols are letters and words in different language scripts. -- user:zanimum

Title of 'Main page'

The title of the main page should be 'Main page'. Or perhaps it should be 'Home page'. Bobblewik  (talk) 18:18, 28 Mar 2005 (UTC)

This has been suggested before at Wikipedia:Requested moves. (Unforunately, there are no decent indices that will allow me to look up the proper revision for you.) Consensus was that the Main Page is not subject to the naming policies on capitalization, that "Main Page" is the historical name, and that only a very small minority of users advocate moving it to a new title. You are free to rekindle the discussion, of course, but it's not likely to go anywhere. JRM 18:39, 2005 Mar 28 (UTC)
Thanks for the response. Bobblewik  (talk) 18:52, 28 Mar 2005 (UTC)

logic of websphere

we need to understand the logic of websphere

Do you mean the Wikipedia logo ? Try this: Also, see above section #Wikipedia graphic.
  • That is an interesting bit of history. Thanks for the link. I do like the logo that's currently up better than the others I saw exposed on the history page. — Courtland 01:44, 2005 Mar 29 (UTC)
U R welcome. ... I like the current logo, too.  :-)

Picture of the day?

Just look at this:

Wikipedia:Picture of the day/March 26, 2017

Now I'd love to give this better visibility. The easiest way to do that would be to put it in between the existing selected content boxes and the other language box. The width would need to scale the same as the rest of the Main Page though. A less easy option would be to miniaturize the FP box and have it cycle with the 'Did you know?' item - only one of the other would be displayed each day. For an example see (and please try to improve!) Main Page/Temp. What does everybody else think? --mav 03:06, 29 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Do you mean every day, or just this picture? Filiocht | Talk 08:32, Mar 29, 2005 (UTC)
Every day a different picture will display - automatically. --mav 13:49, 29 Mar 2005 (UTC)
I like this idea a lot. Filiocht | Talk 13:54, Mar 29, 2005 (UTC)
But will the picture be automatically protected for that period? -- BRIAN0918  17:43, 29 Mar 2005 (UTC)
I like the idea of putting the POD on the front page, as a lot of people put a lot of work into maintaining that, and it would be nice to recognize that on the front page (also there are some really cool photos in our collection). However, The layout of Main Page/Temp is a little weird; why don't we move the template around a bit and put it in the same colored box as "selected anniversaries" and "featured article"? It kind of makes sense that the left hand box has content that rotates daily and the right hand box has content that changes throughout the day. -- DropDeadGorgias (talk) 17:54, Mar 29, 2005 (UTC)

Do we have enough pictures to not get repetitive? Or do we not limit ourselves to "Featured Pictures"? -- user:zanimum

There are currently 211 featured images according to Wikipedia:Featured pictures thumbs, which seems to be plenty, even setting aside the fact that they've been being promoted at a fairly rapid rate lately. —Korath (Talk) 23:58, Mar 29, 2005 (UTC)

I don't know.....If we were to put the POD on the frontpage it would be the largest thing on there (even though you'd have to scroll down to see it) and the POD doesn't really represent any content. I mean, all the other sections represent somewhere on the site with good content, be it new, current, really good, or an something special to the day (DYK, ITN, FA, SA incase somebody missed that :P). Plus, Main Page/temp screws up the symmetry of the main page (and would do even more so if it where put in one of the boxes). Another idea of would be, as mav say, to reduce the picture in size and cycle it with DYK. Thats better, but doesn't the whole idea of having a featured picture kinda get diminished if the picture is just a thumbnail? Don't you want that grand feeling you get from the original size? There is also the question of suitability of some of the pictures for the main page. Personally, I think this featured picture is beutiful, but not everyone might agree. And these two might be a little boring (no offence meant to Grendelkhan, Prisonblues or JWSchmidt, i think the pictures are beutiful). All in all (that and I'm opposed to feep on principal grounds :P), I'd vote no. Gkhan 10:32, Mar 30, 2005 (UTC)

Wikipedia:POTD/March 26, 2017
That's a good point. Also, just looking at the POD archive, the pictures are all of different widths. Until the template could be standardized to a fixed size, I don't think we want to put it on the MP yet. --DropDeadGorgias (talk) 22:28, Mar 30, 2005 (UTC)
A while back, I fixed the smaller POTD template so that it can be scaled to an arbitrary size. See image at riht; or see my talk page for another example (code: {{POTD-width|150px}}). A featured-image inset at a width of 150 or 200px is large enough to convey its beauty, and people can click through for the full image. +sj + 00:33, 3 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Well now we've a could of template to help format the POTD entries, it would be only a mild headache to add a third style of POTD specifically for the main page. -- Solipsist 18:27, 3 Apr 2005 (UTC)
I've thought about putting POTD on the front page a couple of times previously, and my objections to it are beginning to disappear. The rate of promoting Featured Pictures has increased over the last couple of months, but I am not sure that we are consistently promoting seven new pictures a week. Until we are, we might not be able to maintain a fresh POTD every day (on the other hand, putting the POTD on the front page will increase traffic on WP:FPC so this could be a chicken and egg argument).
The real point is we do want more pictures and illustrations for Wikipedia, and putting POTD on the front page could be a good way of encouraging that — much as the featured article encourages improved standards in writing arcticles, and DYK encourages new articles. My main concern is that the voting on WP:FPC is still somewhat biased towards a visually attractive pictures with technically perfect execution, rather than pictures which neatly illustrate an article. In particular, drawings and diagrams tend to be given a hard time, which may be discouraging people from drawing new illustrations. I'm thinking about some changes for the policies on WP:FPC to try and ensure that we do our best to encourage good new pictures in a wider range of categories, without putting contributors off with overly harsh critism.
So I suspect we are getting close to the day when POTD should be on the front page, but perhaps we are not quite there yet. -- Solipsist 18:27, 3 Apr 2005 (UTC)

I think having POTD on the Main Page would completely break the page's layout. The four subsections not counting languages etc. are all paired--this would need a partner also to work. 119 18:00, 8 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Other languages

Welcome to Wikipedia, the free-content encyclopedia that anyone can edit.

In this English version, started in 2001, we are currently working on 5,368,702 articles.

Culture | Geography | History | Life | Mathematics | Science | Society | Technology

Browse Wikipedia · Article overviews · Alphabetical index · Other category schemes

Today's featured article

Interstate 8 in San Diego

Interstate 8 (I-8) is an Interstate Highway in the southwestern United States. From the southern edge of Mission Bay in San Diego, California, it runs eastward across the Cuyamaca Mountains and the Imperial Valley. Crossing the Colorado River into Arizona, it continues through the city of Yuma across the Sonoran Desert, to the junction with I-10, between Phoenix and Tucson. The first route over the Cuyamaca Mountains was dedicated in 1912, and a plank road served as the first road across the Imperial Valley to Yuma; east of there, the Gila Trail continued east to Gila Bend. Several controversies erupted during I-8's construction process; questionable labor practices in Imperial County led to the federal conviction of mobster Jimmy Fratianno, and the Arizona government was found to have mismanaged financial resources by a U.S. House of Representatives subcommittee. The route was completed in 1975 through California, and by 1977 through Arizona, though the bridge over the Colorado River was not completed until 1978. A portion of the freeway in Imperial County had to be rebuilt following damage by the remnants of Hurricane Kathleen. (Full article...)

Selected anniversaries

March 26: Independence Day in Bangladesh (1971)

"The Gerry-Mander", as printed in the Boston Gazette
"The Gerry-Mander"

'Adud al-Dawla (d. 983) · Richard Dawkins (b. 1941)

More anniversaries:

Wikipedia:Picture of the day/March 26, 2017

In the news

Volutus cloud formation
Volutus cloud formation

Did you know...

PlayStation Vita
PlayStation Vita

Selected anniversaries Picture

I thought it was now pretty much standard to only have the top item in the lists of SA's, DYK's, and ITN's have an accompanying image? While this would not make sense with the SA's (since the chornologically earliest would always get a picture) shouldn't there be some indication as to which item the image goes with? While I figured it out eventually, I really wondered if the Yorkist troops at the Battle of Towton used semi-automatic handguns.  ;) Should a "(pictured above)" be inserted in there? I seem to recall something like that with an entry yesterday, I think in ITN. Cigarette 14:24, 29 Mar 2005 (UTC)

A "(pictured above)" or "(pictured right)" should never be used when you can read the ALT text. Please move your mouse and land your cursor on the image. ;) Better yet, click the bolded links and read the articles to find out for sure.

I disagree. This is mystery meat navigation; it should be clear at a glance what is being illustrated. —Korath (Talk) 21:06, Mar 29, 2005 (UTC)
Bad navigation ? Click on the image and what do you get ?
Well, that is something, last I heard, that is being fixed. Right now, it's that the software doesn't support images linking to anything but their image page. Cigarette 03:35, 31 Mar 2005 (UTC)
Somehow, this doesn't apply to the WP logo. Puzzling .....
Exactly. Clarity should be a top priority in the Main Page. When three of the four images on the Main Page are directly related to the top item of the list, that fourth one will cause slight confusion, but more importantly will project an unprofessional image, due to lack of consistency. Cigarette 16:23, 30 Mar 2005 (UTC)
No. FA has only 1 item. ITN tries, but don't always have the top item with a picture. DYK is the only one that has the top item going with the picture on any consistent basis.
FA generally has one item, but many links. The first link is ALWAYS the featured article and the image is ALWAYS (or always tries to be) relevant to the bulk of that article. The fact that DYK, ITN, and SA tend to have the their image and first item be relevant to each other creates an expectation in the user, and if that expectation of consistency is ignored, it creates an unprofessional image for the site. I think that either they should always have a "(pitctured right)" type deal or always have the image paired with the first item. Cigarette 14:57, 31 Mar 2005 (UTC)
FA features one article at a time, shows one image, that's easy. DYK is the only section that has the image going with the first item -- that's in the rules (Wikipedia:Did you know#Images), and DYK never uses "Pictured right" because of this rule. ITN used to have the image with the first item; but today, someone is being bold. :-) And I have no problem with that 'coz the item with the map is getting 'stale'. (Update: This has since been changed. The map is now long gone.) "Pictured right" is used here. ... SA ? It's just too difficult to keep the chronological order and have an image to go with the first and oldest item. Let's check the archive.... I have to stop myself here. I am not going to "score points" like those people above discussing the Military of the Soviet Union. Never mind what has been done for the past four hundred or so days. Now, a question: with only one section on MP, ITN, using "Pictured right" on a consistent basis, why would any reader have the expectation that the other sections on MP do the same ? I do not understand where the "unprofessional image" comes from. Here's my POV: Adding the "Pictured right" is too much 'clarification'. Things are clear and simple as is. I, as a WP reader, finds that extra two words somewhat like 'insulting my intelligence', as if I don't know how to click on the links and find out more if I want to. ALT texts are more than enough. Sometimes, it's better not to show too much. The intrigue gets me to click on the links and read the articles. The links are selected and placed on MP for the purpose of getting readers like me to read the linked pages, right ? .... Feel free to disagree. .... If we want consistency on MP, ITN should follow DYK, stop using "Pictured right" and keep the item with the image at the top. SA cannot follow if the chronological order is preferred.

DYK Picture

Speaking of DYK, the ALT text for the DYK Picture today needs to be re-written to go with the text. SYNE1 is not mentioned on the Main Page ... Why not use the same ALT text / thumb text on Enaptin ?

zimbabwe under dictatorship

I like to comment on the issues concerning zimbabwe or better rather to request some form of advise as to how to remove the Bob from power.I believe the ballot box has failed the people and we can't continue to live under these repressive conditions form of government we need to take fight to mugabe and use the same means he used .He has brought only hardship to the people don't be mislead by what we see on the news the people want him out even if its through armed resists it well have to be done .

See wikipedia:Reference desk

The Main Page has nothing about zimbabwe or Mugabe right now. Do we allow people to leave such irrelevant messages here ? It's probably political propaganda

When the Zimbabwe parliamentary elections, 2005 shows up "in the news" tomorrow, this will be on the Main Page.

DYK movie title missing italics

In Template:Did you know, The Pompatus of Love could use italicization. 14:30, 30 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Good stuff, thanks. -- user:zanimum
Thank you. 14:52, 30 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Main Page URL name

I just found out about wikipedia, and bookmarked the main page. The default URL name (if that's the correct term) was ~"Main Page - wikipedia - the free encyclopedia". Because "Main Page" won't mean much to me when I'm looking for wikipedia, I changed the name (for me) to "Wikipedia - the free encyclopedia - main page" I suggest changing the default name to that, or at least inserting 'Wikipedia' in front of the current name as per other pages.

That's a good idea. I will suggest it to the Developers, who are responsible for creating the MediaWiki software on which this site is run. - Mark 06:09, 31 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Proposal to change text on the front page.

The line on the front page, "the free-content encyclopedia that Italic anyone can edit", is dishonest. Yes, anyone can edit most pages. And chances are your edit will be reverted or otherwise removed within 10 minutes.

This makes no mention of policies with regard to the editing of articles. There should at least be a link if you guys are going to wander from article to article changing things you think aren't "objective" enough, which really ends up meaning a rewrite in the passive voice.

"If you do not want your writing to be edited mercilessly and redistributed at will, do not submit it." Wandering from article to article changing things is how Wikipedia works. -- Cyrius| 02:23, 31 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Feature error?

Should the last line of the feature article really be there? Am I reading this wrong?

You're Right

You are right about that italic sentance. I read it and got excited that my new ideas or opinions or facts would be shared with others. It would be helpful if this could be changed to something else with a link attached to it about the policies. Another thing is that the statement isn't true. I found an incorrect fact on a site at school and clicked "edit this page." Some of the computers at the school could edit and some couldn't. It was the same at my house. Some worked and some didn't. So, all people can't edit.

Sounds like there are WikiVandals at your school ! ..... or your ISP has many WikiVandals as customers. Get your own account and you'll be alright. :-)


Can someone with sysop power change "after her feeding tube is removed" to "after her feeding tube was removed" or "after the removal of her feeding tube", please ? And the death toll of the Marburg virus in Angola is 126 in the article, not 122 on the MP right now. Please update. Thanks a lot.

SA: César Arturo Chávez Day

The following was posted here at 17:16, 31 Mar 2005 (UTC):

Today is an important to recognize not only the farm workers here in the United States but also all working people of the world. So I want to invite you all to learn more about the legacy left behind by César Chávez and take the time to learn more about the migrant workers in the US. (sic)

This was promptly removed as if it were some vandalism. Yes, it seems to have nothing to do with MP, so I would have reverted it, too. However, I suppose the message could be : Please add '''[[César Chávez|César Chávez Day]]''' to today's Selected Anniversaries section on MP. How's this ?

It's Cesar Chavez Day!

At least a mention of that under anniversaries would be nice. Plus, Cesar Chavez's page could definitely benefit from some more information. The man's social impact warrants more than the abrupt one page summary he has now.

Be Bold and expand that page ! :-)


look at the "edit this page" button. it currently says "vandalise this page." was it hacked? Veritos 02:32, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)

It was an April Fool's joke by Silsor. —Korath (Talk) 03:13, Apr 1, 2005 (UTC)
ok :) Veritos 03:33, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Prank article

What happened to the front page? Under the news, it says that Terri Schiavo died of a freak autofellatio accident. Is anyone keeping an eye on it?

It's gone now; you're probably viewing a cached version. Try hitting the reload button. — Dan | Talk 03:43, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)
God I love Wikipedia. The Encyclopædia Britannica announces an immediate takeover of the Wikimedia Foundation and all associated projects. --Bash 04:15, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)

What the hell is going on? Instead of saying "Article" it says "trash", instead of "discussion" it's "groupthink", instead of "history" it's time travel, instead of "move" it's "teleport", and instead of "watch" it's "stalk." Is this the work of a hacker, or is it just an April Fool's Day prank by a developer? JarlaxleArtemis 05:09, Apr 1, 2005 (UTC)

Haha, I'm guessing at the moment that it's an April Fools Day joke. bob rulz 05:11, Apr 1, 2005 (UTC)
Changing the text on the navigation tabs seems to be a bit much for an April Fool's joke, especially for newcomers. This doesn't seem to be a good way to build Wikipedia membership. — Jeff Q (talk) 05:13, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)
I got an innapropriate message from wikipedia about "f***ing april, and also, it says wikipædia now... hmm. cascade 05:11, Apr 1, 2005 (UTC)
Hmm...I guess you're right that it probably isn't an April Fool's joke, but I still like this "Encyclopedia Britannica" takeover thing. Haha. bob rulz 05:44, Apr 1, 2005 (UTC)
Some of it is pranks; some is vandalism (the business with the tabs and interface things should be over now) - but please maintain a sense of humor. A bit of fun won't damage Wikipedia in the least. — Dan | Talk 05:48, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)
The Ents are going to war.... The last march... of the Ents. Doo doo dooooo doo doo doo dooooo doo doo doo doo... doo... doo... doo... dooooooooo....

The Ents are going to war.... The last march... of the Ents. Doo doo dooooo doo doo doo dooooo doo doo doo doo... doo... doo... doo... dooooooooo....

Some very minor language versions are moved to 50.000 articles+ - someone should correct that. Ulflarsen 05:58, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)

It's completely gone overboard. It's time to stop now. Too many users are becoming confused. Especially since it isn't even April Fool's Day in much of the world. RickK 05:59, Apr 1, 2005 (UTC)

Whoa, whoa...messing with the featured article...come on. That's going too far. bob rulz 06:02, Apr 1, 2005 (UTC)

I'm not sure how to change it back, but really, let's just keep it to the silly Britannica story.--Pharos 06:08, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)

  • I like the main page. This'll start a lot of conversations among my friends at college tomorrow, and probably get a lot of publicity and positive mindshare. Good job. -- Creidieki 06:17, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)
But what about the people who decide to first come to Wikipedia today? They'll have no idea what the hell is going on and may be turned away. It's bad for the reputation. bob rulz 06:21, Apr 1, 2005 (UTC)
If they have no sense of humour they won't last long at any rate. - 07:33, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Consider it bad timing? -- Riffsyphon1024 07:38, Apr 1, 2005 (UTC)
As of right now, the news box is confusing. Prank Britannica story followed by (apparently) true environmental story followed by prank (I presume) Seinfeld story followed by real news. Either switch the Seinfeld and environmental stories (to keep prank and real news segregated) or delete the Seinfeld one altogether. (Maybe one prank news event is enough.) Doops 08:20, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)

S23 Wiki

s23 Wiki is waging war on Wikipedia! we must strike back. JarlaxleArtemis 05:58, Apr 1, 2005 (UTC)

Good thing they failed to protect the main page. :-) Nelson Ricardo 06:12, Apr 1, 2005 (UTC)'s a bad thing. bob rulz 06:29, Apr 1, 2005 (UTC)
Okay, now perhaps I can live with it. bob rulz 06:40, Apr 1, 2005 (UTC)

Toilet paper holders

Glad to see that insanity won out in the end. Brilliant article. --Tony Sidaway|Talk 07:28, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Wikipedia wishes all a happy and safe Veneralia!

So much for NPOV. --Exigentsky 07:34, Apr 1, 2005 (UTC)

So much for not disrupting Wikipedia to make a point of celebrating April Smarts' Day. :-)
So much for not recognizing a patent imitation of "but not everyone celebrates blah" whiners. --Exigentsky 07:40, Apr 1, 2005 (UTC)

OK, could the Wikipedia admins be a little quicker in handling vandalism. The main page story about hostile takeover is amusing, but has remained unfixed for at least the past 2 hours when I came on to the site. Please fix!!!

Please fix this, already!!!

OK, could the Wikipedia admins be a little quicker in handling vandalism. The main page story about hostile takeover is amusing, but has remained unfixed for at least the past 2 hours when I came on to the site. Please fix!!!

There's no point in writing "Wikimædia" it just looks stupid. "media" does not come from "maedia"

no, no I can assure you, this is what happened. I am writing this note at gunpoint, they have just taken over my office, too. dab () 08:51, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)

April 1st

OK guys, we've got the idea. Now can the main page be back to normal? It's just not funny anymore, and not appropriate for an encyclopedia.

Exactly. One featured article was all we needed. This isn't pranksterism, it's vandalism. Slac speak up! 09:16, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)


Um...sorry to be a Latin pedant; but technically speaking Veneralia is plural — so we can't wish everybody "a safe and happy Veneralia." Could we remove the article? (The indefinite article a, I mean.) Doops 09:08, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)

I agree, but how will we phrase it? Maybe the number should be fixed on Veneralia itself, first. Still, Veneralia is a festival, it's not "festivals". dab () 09:36, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Pope's "coma"

The Vatican denies that the Pope is in a coma. See: Please update the front page news on his health!

I concur; at this moment the fact (or not) that the Pope is in a coma is mere conjecture. He suffered heart failure and received the last rites, and most Vatican officials are expressing the opinion that his time rapidly draws near. That is all that is known. Wally 09:44, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)


It appears the main page has been vandalized with hoax garbage. Was there consensus to do this? May I revert it? Everyking 09:27, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)

sure, I think so. Let's not get into edit wars over this though. You remove some, others will be added, just take it easy, ok? It doesn't do any harm. But it's certainly nicer to have a stilish hoax stashed away somewhere, than to have the entire page riddled with surrealism. dab () 09:32, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)
I think it does quite a bit of harm. I don't want to get involved in this whole mess, but it is very disappointing to me to see that we have knowingly put false information on our main page. Everyking 09:34, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)
This willinness to throw standards away at a whim is the reason Wikipedia will never be taken seriously by researchers. DAVODD 09:41, Apr 1, 2005 (UTC)
Oh please! Those who point out the April fool's day page as an example of Wikipedia's unreliability will be just laughed at by those who get the joke. Sheesh! - Ta bu shi da yu 00:01, 4 Apr 2005 (UTC)
wait a minute, the Pope and Schiavo news are entirely factual. If you mean the Wikimaedia business, I agree it's silly (but "throwing away standards"?), by all means feel free to revert it. dab () 09:43, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)
This is gettign a *bit* overhead, we already have 3 times as many April Fool stuff then the last year (see WP:BJAODN). I say leave the toilet paper, Britannica reference and remove anything else. Too much of the good stuff is not good. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus Talk 09:50, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Please remove the toilet paper story, this is a hoax too. I know a lot of work has gone into it. But I really don't think it is appropriate. Jooler 09:56, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)
American culture is impossible to understand, with its Presidents' Day, Thanksgiving, Halloween, July 4 and April Fool's Day. Great American intentions no doubt, but some may take offence at "Terri Schiavo dies of dehydration" and "Pope John Paul II ... slipping into a coma" placed alongside "Toilet paper holders have been an important facet of European bathroom design"; others still may use it to prove Wikipedia unreliable and inaccurate. 10:02, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)
for your information, April Fool is not "American", but a custom known all over Europe, too. The "in the news" sections unavoidably results in tragic events appearing along more lighthearted stuff on any day (Exploding whale and Japanese toilet are FAs, and may appear alongside reports of genocide and catastrophe any day). The toilet paper holder is not a hoax at all, it is clearly labelled as a Nihilartikel. dab () 10:06, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)

IT'S A JOKE. It's April Fool's Day, even the most reputable of media outlets are letting people have the odd laugh. Don't take everything so seriously. Tjwood 10:08, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)

What he said. Lighten up. The takeover joke was clearly delineated from the real news. I'd put it back, but I don't want a revert war. --Slowking Man 10:10, Apr 1, 2005 (UTC)

Not wanting to spoil anyone's fun but this is a bit of a half-baked April Fools' Day main page if we're playing jokes side by side with serious news. There will no doubt be lots of people for whom the distinction is unclear. On the left we have our joke featured article (which is excellent by the way), and right next to it we have very real and grave warnings about the state of the planet, news of the Pope's impending death, news of Prince Ranier III's impending death, and news of Terri Schiavo's already-happened death (the last two strike me as pretty parochial stories, incidentally). If this had been done properly we could have blanked the main page and replaced it with news of our takeover by the EB, then directed readers to our "last ever featured article", about the European toilet paper holder. The current situation on the main page is really an incoherent mess. — Trilobite (Talk) 10:14, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)

jokes alongside serious news? distinction unclear? If only this would be the exception of a day each year. Welcome to planet Earth, Trilobite. dab () 10:18, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)
There's no need to get abusive. I see nothing wrong with a having a joke main page for today, I just think that what we have right now is a mess. Replace the whole main page with a joke or don't bother at all. If you'd bothered to read my comments properly you'd see that I'm fully aware of the distinction. — Trilobite (Talk) 10:26, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)
no abuse intended. I just happen to disagree that "replace the whole page with a joke" is the way to go. It's not about not reading what you say, it's about respectfully disagreeing with it. dab () 10:39, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Well, respectfully disagreeing is fine, but "welcome to planet earth" didn't come across that way. Anyway, that aside, while we may mock those who fail to appreciate that it's April 1 and that means jokes, the point is that these people exist. Have a look at the village pump as well as this very page and you'll see a flood of comments trying to helpfully point out that the main page has been vandalised etc. My view on this is probably fairly similar to Davodd's below: jokes are fine but the main page as it stands is a jumble of attempts at humour with mixed results. — Trilobite (Talk) 10:49, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)
imho, that's the whole point of April 1st. but note that personally, I have not added anything silly to the Main Page (I have, rather, removed some excessive silliness). It's a dynamic process, it will oscillate around something people tend to find appropriate. dab () 10:57, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)

To be sucessful as a hoax, a hoax must be subtle and plausible. Both the ETRH and the Britannica takeover are blatant and implausible; they are therefore failures as hoaxes. As such, however, they are also inoccuous. A subtle bit of misinformation could be dangerous to our reputation; a blatant one is only a joke — and anybody who thinks that joking automatically damages his or her reputation is taking her- or himself too seriously. Our reputation is based on credibility, not on pomposity. Doops 10:24, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Exactly, Doops. Filiocht | Talk 10:27, Apr 1, 2005 (UTC).
If this is a toilet paper holder thing is valid article , a "Nihilartikel", why is this article not in normal namespace but actually in a user's namespace ? Jooler 10:30, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)
The toilet paper story and the Monty Pyhton head are subtle and hilarious. The rest is a "me too" jumble that is encouraging rampant vandalism throughout the site. Check out: Special:Log/delete. The innocent fun is not so innocent afterall. DAVODD 10:34, Apr 1, 2005 (UTC)
because a nihilartikel is not a 'valid article', in the usual sense. It's a valid nihilartikel. dab () 10:39, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)

WP Hoax

Fellow Wikipedians, this is just too funny ! I am very amused. However, can we have the normalcy restored by noon UTC, please ? Thanks. -- PFHLai 10:56, 2005 Apr 1 (UTC)

thanks for giving us 64 minutes' notice, but - why noon, exactly? dab ()
See April Fool's Day. "Traditionally, pranks are supposed to end by noon..." Tjwood 11:02, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)
I see. Now that particular tradition may be dependent of geography, but I support removing all silliness by noon UTC. I see no problem with the ETPH remaining for the rest of the day, since it is more a tribute to the concept of hoaxes, than trying to fool anyone. dab () 11:18, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)
in fact, the only silliness left at this point seem to be the Monty Python eyes, and the "Wikipaedia" logo (which seems rather pointless without the Britannica story). Both are not hoaxes per se. We can remove the eyes, but I think we need a developer to change the logo back. dab () 11:22, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)
I believe the pranks began around midnight U.S. Eastern time. Removing them by noon UTC will mean than many in the U.S. will not see them. Nelson Ricardo 13:10, Apr 1, 2005 (UTC)
Indeed. I suggest noontime UTC-11. That would be unbiased.

The artistic glory years of these bathroom fittings began.... Hahhhah. This is great!:)) Cmapm 11:27, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Leave the pranks up

put the pranks back up, my time zone isnt even awake yet and people have already taken the hilarity down. i know you east-ish people are probably sick of it, but let us west-ish people enjoy it as well. this is completely unfair!Matholomew 2:59 am, 1 Apr 2005 (Alaska time)

Yeah, come on! At least put the ae thing and the Britannica takeover back up! bob rulz 13:39, Apr 1, 2005 (UTC)

April Fool's Day is over--not

Since April Fool's Day is over, can we please get back to normal now? Ben Arnold 12:19, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Can we also get the Æ-free logo back, in that case? dab () 13:01, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Something hilarious about someone saying April Fool's Day is over with the date of "1 Apr" printed after their name. --The Cunctator 13:23, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Dude, the servers are in the U.S. The folks in California are still in bed this fine April 1 morn. Nelson Ricardo 8:04 a.m., Apr 1, 2005 (U.S. EST)

No its not

NO! over here in the far west April is less than four hours old! that is THOUSANDS of people who will be deprived! the only reason I know about it is because im supposed to be writing a paper. Matholomew 3:22 am, 1 Apr 2005 (Alaska time)

He has a point. It's not April 1st somewhere, at all times. We could at least keep ETPH, which is not a hoax, i.e. it doesn't try to fool people, it's simply a hilarious parody. dab () 12:32, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)

The name should permanently be Wikipædia

Far more prestigious.


The comment part is not so easy

I Agree - you gotta love those æ's --Neo 17:10, Apr 1, 2005 (UTC)

This is a silly change, not to mention irritating to look at for any length of time. Wikipedia will always be Wikipedia as it started that way. Revmachine21 17:14, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Okay, I am a moron... granted it is 2:20 am in Tokyo but I was April Fooled. I'd be completely pissed if this happened for real. I would immeidately cease and desist adding content. I am not going to help those Brity wankers out so they can earn money from my labor. Revmachine21 17:20, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)
  • It's not LABOUR, it's LABOR. British pansies are so strange. They spell words that end in "or" as "our." And whenever there's a war, they come up with some lame excuse to end it, like "Oh! It's tea time! Haha, jolly good, chaps, jolly good." And instead of saying "merry Christmas," they say "happy Christmas." How gay is that?
I have an idea... now it may be crazy, but how about we NOT be childish?
  • Oh us english are gay are we? We don't even say 'jolly good' or stuff like that. I bet you haven't even met an english person. We do say Merry Christmas and we invented your language anyway so why are you critisising your own language. Idiot.
You didn't invent English. No one did. It evolved from the Indo-European language family. When the Angles, Jutes, and Saxons conquered England, they blended their Germanic languages with the Celtic peoples who already lived there. Furthermore, when the Normans conquered England around A.D. 1000, the French language was intermingled with the English language of that time; thus, nearly half the words of the English language are derived from French. Idiot. JarlaxleArtemis 03:19, Apr 5, 2005 (UTC)
Americans >>>>>>>> English Can we discuss Wikipædia >>>>>>>>>>>> Wikipedia now? Lotsofissues 19:08, 2 Apr 2005 (UTC)
I think thats a good idea. (Erebus555 11:55, 3 Apr 2005 (UTC))

Sillys, all such sillys...

If you close your eyes you can picture it

Do you know what would be real funny? If the line at the top of the page said "...we are currently working on 514357 articles. Only 226004 to go!" Yeah. That would be funny. Doops 17:45, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)

The pope isn't dead

Why do we have the emberassing headline here? --Pjacobi 18:39, 2005 Apr 1 (UTC)

Well, yes, he is, according to the Italian News agencies that are reporting this, and Reuters picked it up quickly. Unfortunately, with all the nonsense going on today, people tend to think it's a hoax. →Raul654 18:42, Apr 1, 2005 (UTC)
Yes, having a sense of humor is nonsensical. One must always exist with his thumb up his butt. -- BRIAN0918  18:45, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)
I don't think so. Why can't we wait until its is for sure? It is very unprofessional to announce a death in advance. --Pjacobi 18:47, 2005 Apr 1 (UTC)
Media are going to jump the gun, that is what Media does. Perhaps we should wait until an official announcement is given by the Vatican?--Txredcoat 18:45, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Italy's Apcom news agency, without citing sources, reported the pope was unconscious. Vatican spokesmen were not available to comment on the report, and had denied an earlier report by the same agency that he had slipped into a coma. ABC news 33 min ago --Pjacobi 18:49, 2005 Apr 1 (UTC)

According to all the online Italian newspapers, he isn't. They may well be a little behind, but but they all say 'Il pappa sta morendo' - 'The pope is dying', which could easily be misunderstood, I think.

BovineBeast 18:51, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Now Italian media is contradicting those reports--Txredcoat 18:54, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)
The main page now correctly states the current condition - kudos to the Admins for the change.--Txredcoat 18:57, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)

This is no fun...

Just as I checked Wikipedia here, I noticed it had reloaded and had several funny things. However, I reloaded again and-- poof, it had gone. I'm sad that I didn't get to fully explore what you so specially prepared for us :( Cctoide 19:48, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Encyclopedias are not supposed to be fun, you idiot. -- BRIAN0918  19:50, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Could the entire Main Page be placed in Deleted Nonsence? Beta m (talk)
See User:Hedley/April Fool's Day, 2005 -- BRIAN0918  20:14, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)
See →Raul654 20:08, Apr 1, 2005 (UTC)

I think congratulations/condolances are in order

I think sysops edit warring over April Fool's jokes on the Main Page definitely qualifies as one of the lamest edit wars ever. I'm some three hours early, but it's already lame enough to warrant mention.

Regardless of what we do or don't do next year, I certainly hope we can be less lame about it. JRM 21:17, 2005 Apr 1 (UTC)

Brilliant commentary as always. -- BRIAN0918  23:28, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Next year, do something that's funny or clever. The fake articles reminded me of the geek parties I used to go to when I was a student. A whole lot of people haw-haw-ing having memorised the Weird Al lyrics to American Pie. I like the humour but I don't think it presents well to non-geeks. Besides, my understanding of April Fool's Day is that you're supposed to trick people. Toilet paper holders don't amount to much of a trick. A better idea would be a fake country, element on the periodic table, Prime Minister of France, etc. Something that will make people go "shit, I've never heard of that..." and then it's only half way through the article when they realise that they've been tricked.
I'd also say it's worth leaving the news section alone. Real stuff is going on and people want to find out about it. I thought it was really bad taste having a fake story about a Wikipedia take-over next to two stories about world leaders dying. One good joke is enough and better than a bunch of lame jokes.
Just my 10 cents. (And in my own defence, the irony in my comment above about time zones was entirely deliberate.) Ben Arnold 23:27, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)
You do realize that the whole toilet paper holder article was fake, right? -- BRIAN0918  23:29, 1 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Yes. Ben Arnold 00:33, 2 Apr 2005 (UTC)
I am fairly new to Wikipedia, but I watched the whole AF debacle. It was lame. And funny. What seemed to break down was the decision making process. There was an attempt at democracy, but that wasn't trusted. So anarchy reigned. You who are the trustees of this wonderful experiment need to look at how decisions are made on Wikipedia, if and when democratic methods are appropriate, and how to abide by their decisions. Shoaler 13:53, 4 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Yes, Shoaler, this hits the nail squarely on the head. But this is really nothing new, it's just that the April Fools Day mess became so high profile. Filiocht | Blarneyman 14:04, Apr 4, 2005 (UTC)
I enjoyed the day. Sure, nobody got fooled, that's because all the decision-making is there for everyone to see. But then, our system is not supposed to be streamlined towards fooling people, so the fact that we cannot fool anyone even when we're trying to should tell you how big a success the wiki is. The toiled paper holder article, btw, is almost entirely factual. dab () 14:23, 4 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Still some bad tabs

I noticed that the admins haven't completely fixed all of the tabs that ended up being renamed. When I go to my talk page, the "user page" tab still says "suspect profile." bob rulz 23:34, Apr 1, 2005 (UTC)

  • Are you sure you aren't watching a cached version? Mgm|(talk) 13:51, Apr 2, 2005 (UTC)
  • what really cracked me up was the "crush by elephant" instead of "block". thanks for a couple of good laughs, everybody. dab () 15:45, 2 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Lord of the Rings

The Ents are going to war.... The last march... of the Ents. Doo doo dooooo doo doo doo dooooo doo doo doo doo... doo... doo... doo... dooooooooo....

daniel maldonado fight 2/11/05 against jesus perez

Fight is getting apealed trying to get fight turned to no contest if you watched the fight you would see that it was a obvious push not a knock down. There wasn't 3 knock down rule. I wasn't able to get to show my true warrior abilty and once I get a chance to display that a promise you that you will not be displeased. Thank You Your Friend Daniel Maldonado.

WP code

Most probably this is a wrong place to ask, so I'm sorry, I don't know whom to ask. I'm just curious, is there a ported VB/ASP or ASP.NET version of the Wikipedia engine code? Thnx. --rydel 01:00, 2 Apr 2005 (UTC)

The technical section of the village pump is probably your best bet. I copied your question there. Gkhan 01:34, Apr 2, 2005 (UTC)
Since Wikimedia is PHP/MySQL/Linux, the answer is likely to be "you are welcome to make this your personal project.", as no one on the current platform is likely to make an ASP version right now, due to lack of time.
The developers hang out on IRC. :Firefox has a nice plug-in if you need to get on IRC. I know that my old version of IE did not have IRC. You will likely get an answer more quickly there.

Hans Christian Andersen

Today, on April 2, it is 200 years since a famous writer Hans Christian Andersen was born. Beside of Brothers Grimm, he was probably the greatest world fairy tale writer. I guess, it is such an important person and anniversary that it should be on the Main Page today. Miraceti 07:49, 2 Apr 2005 (UTC)

I added him. He should probably be removed tomorrow, so that he won't resurface in 2006 (not that I'd mind). dab () 15:52, 2 Apr 2005 (UTC)


When giving definitions you should also provide an example of the word being used in a sentence. For grammar definitions like simile or analogy provide an example of an analogy or simile.

Hi, My name is chris and I live in Toronto, Canada. This is my first time posting anything here probably because nothing has caught my attention until I saw the argument about who was more responsible for defeating Hitler. You can't measure who did more by lives lost. The Soviet Union also killed many of there own soldiers who tried retreating. The Soviet Union only got invovled when they were threatened just as the Amercians did after Pearl Harbour which is selfish on both parts.

The Soviets would not have been able to defeat the Germans if the Americans did not get involved, Hitler had to commit to many troops to the western front defending it from the states, england, canada and many other allies. If the Soviets had not kept fighting the germans then it would have been the other way around and The Americans would not be able to defeat the germans.

England practically destroyed the entire luftwaffe at the battle of britain leaving Germany without an airforce and The Soviets destroyed the majority of Hitlers tanks and artillery.

While this is going on the Americans are basically the only ones fighting Japan along side China. The result was the use of Nuclear weapons, which was a horrible tragedy but to say that the Americans killed innocent people is unfair. Japan new they were in a war, every citizen who allowed their government to fight this war was a soldier whether they fought in trench or worked in a office building. Also, thank god that nuclear weapons were only used at that time because it displayed to the world the awesome power of these bombs and I'm glad it happend when they were not as powerful as they are today. The nuclear weapons dropped killed roughly 250 000 people. If the trench warfare and ground combat had continued in Asia it was more than likely that more than 250 000 lives would have been lost anyway. Winning world war II was no one countries doing, in fact we all ASSISTED in completeing one goal.

The Pope didn't die at 21:37 CET

It isn't CET in Italy right now; it is summer, which means they are using CEST right now. That is UTC+2. Evertype 21:36, 2005 Apr 2 (UTC)

I watch Bloomberg which has a clock running 24 hours a day and when Europe moved into summertime, the abbreviation CET (Central European Time) was still used. The S makes no impact at all
It's still incorrect. Evertype
Yeah, and most people probably assume the UK and Ireland are in Greenwich Mean Time (GMT) right now, whereas actually we're in British Summer Time (BST). zoney talk 23:54, 2 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Ahem. We are in Irish Summer Time (IST) and there is an Oireachtas order specifying that. Evertype 08:47, 2005 Apr 3 (UTC)
Looking out the window at sheets of rain: clearly Irish Summer Time. Filiocht | King of Regulars 14:22, Apr 7, 2005 (UTC)

i think this needs to be developed further

WIKIPEDIA has a large base but we need to extend it ... by making it not also Online but also available offline.What more its from the concept of encyclopedia but an open one.We can extend it reach it up to every user based on Microsoft's Encarta. which provides everything in a comprehensive manner, and obviously it should me made free and platform independent . Able to automatically update itself for any correction or whatsoever is made on a later date .. we could also include interactive videos since we have all the world around us..

This project is called Wikipedia 1.0. You might look there. Mediawiki 1.5 is a necessary step on the way to 1.0. We are currently using 1.4. You might also meet some of the principals in August. Here is a link.

if anybodys interested plz contact me at and surely it isn't possible without the help of creators of wikipedia hope anybody's interested

2 Errors on Main Page

"Cardinal Richelieu was a French clergyman, noble, and statesman."

"Cardinal Richelieu" should be "The Cardinal de Richelieu". "de Richelieu" was his name, "Cardinal" was his title. Maybe the "the" can be skipped, the "de" shouldn't.

But there's worse: "Jules Cardinal Mazarin" should either be "the Cardinal Mazarin", or "Cardinal Mazarin", or even "Jules Mazarin" (but nobody calls a cardinal Jules :-) ). Other valid options are "Cardinal Jules Mazarin", "the Cardinal Jules Mazarin" - but *NOT* "Jules Cardinal Mazarin" : that's like "George President Bush".

--Hillel 18:34, Apr 3, 2005 (UTC)

  • I don't think that you should use "the Cardinal Jules Mazarin". You generally don't use "the" infront of titles. You don't wirte "the President Bush". You either write "President Bush" or just " the president". Otherwise you are correct, "Jules Cardinal Mazarin" is pretty bad. Jeltz talk 19:42, 3 Apr 2005 (UTC)
  • Unless it originated as an adjective, such as "the Reverend".  ;) Cigarette 02:10, 4 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Wikipedia policy is to use the version of a name most known by potential readers. Most potential readers would look for Cardinal Richelieu, not Cardinal de Richelieu. RickK 04:53, Apr 7, 2005 (UTC)


Shouldn't this be "Main page"??? - Omegatron 20:02, Apr 3, 2005 (UTC)

Historical reasons, and not worth enough to change it. -- Cyrius| 21:39, 3 Apr 2005 (UTC)
It's been Main Page since the beginning of 2002. Before that it was called HomePage. So many people link directly to the Main Page in their web favourites/bookmarks that the number of redirects and redirect messages shown would be more of an annoyance than anything. - Mark 12:41, 4 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Yes, it should. The quicker it gets changed, the less painful it will be. Fredrik | talk 14:11, 4 Apr 2005 (UTC)
This discussion came up at Talk:Main Page/Archive 23#Hmm... a long time ago. However, I'm not convinced that "Main page" is correct either, I mean it's not an article about the encyclopedic topic of what a "Main page" is. If it is just the title of the page, then "Main Page" is correct, although if we're going to get a real proper name, it should be in the Wikipedia namespace. What exactly is the difference between the Main page and the Wikipedia:Community Portal? Just my 2 cents. --DropDeadGorgias (talk) 19:07, Apr 4, 2005 (UTC)
The difference is that the Main Page is for readers, but the Community protal is for editors. That's why for instance the main page is much more readable, and it contains no red links. It is also ALOT less cluttered and with better design. The community portal is great for getting out information, but it is hard to get good information if you do not know what you're looking for. The main page is more "Hey look at our cool site, we have the Internets best information on Elephant crushing", if you know what I mean. The main page is what we show to the world and the community portal is the machinery that makes it work. Gkhan 20:30, Apr 4, 2005 (UTC)

Correction on Articles

I think it would be a good idea to do something like google, and when one types an article in, but they make a typo, for instance "Eurotpean Union", wikipedia could correct them instead of saying it doesn't exist.

  • That's why we've got the search button next to the go-button. :) Mgm|(talk) 12:39, Apr 4, 2005 (UTC)
    • The user has a good point though, Mgm. Once the servers get ahead of the demand (if that ever happens), and we can reactivate deprecated functions, then I think it would be a good idea to look at doing this somehow. - Mark 12:45, 4 Apr 2005 (UTC)
      • or just pipe searches for non-existent articles to google with a option. It really shouldn't be our business to correct people's spelling for them (disclaimer, I am also opposed to redirects from misspellings). dab () 14:18, 4 Apr 2005 (UTC)
  • Until the servers can handle it, it's best to use Google for this. If the servers catch up, it may be a good idea, but I'm not holding my breath just yet. Mgm|(talk) 18:56, Apr 4, 2005 (UTC)

Long ago, we used to have this feature. When somebody searched for something and didn't find it, one of the Logs was a list of unfound searches. RickK 04:51, Apr 7, 2005 (UTC)

Time of Pope's Funeral

"The Vatican announces that the state funeral of Pope John Paul II will take place on Friday, April 8, at 10:00am CEST (1200 UTC),"

Er, 10 am CEST is 0800 UTC, not 1200.

  • Thanks! Changed it. Mgm|(talk) 18:50, Apr 4, 2005 (UTC)

Ralph Steadman and Hunter S Thompson

Ralph Steadman is certainly not best known for his illustrations of Hunter S Thompson. At least, not ouside the US- where most of us live - and where Hunter S Thompson (if he is known at all) is at best considered a rather marginal figure of an ephemeral literary genre. Steadman on the other hand is an extremely famous caricaturist and political satirist. Can we have a less USA centric view of things, please?

Why are you telling us this here? -- Cyrius| 21:54, 4 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Cyrius — [1]. The version of Template:Did you know before the current version had the item "...that Flying Dog Brewery employs the unusual artwork of Ralph Steadman on its labels, best known for his work as the illustrator of the works of Hunter S. Thompson?" BLANKFAZE | (что??) 22:03, 4 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Java based Wiki

Why not to turn to J2EE based application server? There will be better proformance and reliability than PHP ones for so many users.

Free knowledge requires free software.

April 5 Selected Anniversaries

The sentence "A F5 tornado hit Tupelo, Mississippi, killing 233." should be "An F5 tornado...". I would also propose making "F5" a link to Fujita scale. Spike 12:02, 5 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Clout and Wikipedia

I thought that we lived in a country that the rights, freedoms and beliefs of others were protected, but I was wrong. Recently, some of the people I know have tried to express their freedom of religion. They felt that they could enlighten others by posting an entry about it. They have tried several times and are disheartened by the fact that is being deleted and called "Patent Nonsense". I beg you to reconsider what you are doing to these people who are just looking for some acceptance.

If an entry were deleted and the reason that was given was "Patent Nonsense" it means that, to the casual (or indeed any) reader the content was unintelligable, you can't make heads or tails out of it. It is not a reflection on their beliefs or values. Why don't you provide some information on what was deleted, and we'll see if it can't fit somewhere in the encyclopedia. Gkhan 21:22, Apr 5, 2005 (UTC)

Frankly this anonymous comment is patent nonsense from the get go. First, Wikipedia is not an exercise is democratic ideals. Second, the writer implies that the freedom of expression of the US applies ... not so as this is an international effort and only happens to be physically hosted (primarily) in the U.S. ... the mental capital is global. Third, Wikipedia is not a forum for influencing content through begging; it is a place to enrich the sharing of information through action. As you can readily see, I'm none too happy to see someeone try and wrap the 'pedia in the Flag (being a US citizen myself) and decry it as 'undemocratic' just becaue someone is frustrated. Non-anonymously yours, Courtland 23:09, 2005 Apr 5 (UTC)

this hasn't even anything to do with the US. Surely your freedoms of speech, religion, etc. do not imply that everybody is allowed to post on everybody else's servers, using everybody else's resources. You cannot be persecuted for what you have to say, but you have to say it by using your own PR budget. Wikimedia is on privately owned servers, and nobody has any right to post here without the consent of the owners. The only thing that makes it "free" is that you can take whatever is posted here and use it in certain ways. It is not even free of copyright. Wikipedia has no legal obligation to include patent nonsense, or to be infallible when deciding what is or isn't patent nonsense. dab () 08:00, 6 Apr 2005 (UTC)

I've check the the history for Clout and found it was deleted by 3 different admins. This is the complete content so non-admins can comment on it as well.

Clout is a new relgion based around an article called the Book of Clout. The book is the lifes thoughts of the Immortal Messiah Jessiah Devine. Clout is an acronym for Crazy Laughter of Unremaining Time. the religion headed by a hierarchy, the structure is as follows, the Messiah, The Answer, The Prophet, The High priest, and then various other priests and followers. Mgm|(talk) 20:56, Apr 6, 2005 (UTC)
Thank you for posting this. Although it appears not to be patent nonsense, as I understand this Wikipedia phrase, it does appear to be completely fabricated out of the air. I searched a variety of ways on Google and Yahoo and found absolutely nothing. Given that, is this really patent nonsense, or rather original research or some other valid reason to delete? JimCollaborator «talk» 23:07, Apr 6, 2005 (UTC)
of course it's nonsense, patently so. It's a kid who said "let's make up our own religion", I used to do that all the time (but in those days there was no Wikipedia to use for unleashing it upon an unsuspecting world:) dab () 23:12, 6 Apr 2005 (UTC)

I realize that this is self-promotion but there has been alot of controversy on the subject of Clout. Clout will be holding a special gathering to honour the life of the Messiah. If any doubt the validity of Clout just post a request for photos and we would be more than happy to show you the wonder of Clout. Most of the Cells will be at this gathering.


Please redirect or delete Viktor Moritz Goldschmidt as this is the wrong spelling and there is already a page, Victor Goldschmidt, with more information and, most importantly, the correct spelling.

I have merged it. dab () 16:21, 6 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Someone has hacked on Safari browsers

This is reproducable:

1) Invoke a Safari Browser running on OSX Jaguar. 2) go to 3) click on English 4) you should now be at 5) in the search box, type "abortion" 6) click on "go" 7) you will get a single page that says "don't kill your baby killer!" 8) close the Safari Browser 9) Invoke an IE Browser runnin on OSX Jaguar 10) go to 11) click on English 12) you should now be at 13) in the search box, type "abortion" 14) click on "go" 15) You will get the originally intended wikipedia entry on abortion, including

Contents [showhide] 1 Methods of abortion 2 Possible side effects

2.1 Postabortion psychological issues 2.2 Postabortion physical issues 3 Abortion law 4 Abortion as a political issue 5 Debate on abortion

5.1 Legislative effectiveness debates 6 Related topics 7 External links

7.1 Politically neutral links 7.2 Pro-choice links 7.3 Pro-life links

Can someone fix this?

It is fixed. The article was vandalised saying "don't kill your baby killer!" for 4 minutes, after which it was reverted by another user back to its previous state. You must have loaded the article in Safari during those 4 minutes, and by the time you'd loaded Internet Explorer, it was fixed. In Safari, try refreshing/reloading the page; it should appear as fixed now. One of the downsides of being editable by everyone means we have a hell of a lot of vandalism to fix. - Mark 07:12, 7 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Death of Pope

Please advise origin and significance of tapping the Pope's head three (3 ) times with a silver hammer and then saying his name three (3) times.

Please respond to:

Thank you!

It is claimed that the Pope's death is officially determined by the Cardinal Chamberlain by gently tapping the late Pope's head thrice with a silver hammer and calling his birth name three times, though this is disputed and has never been confirmed by the Vatican. A doctor may or may not have already determined that the Pope had passed away. The Cardinal Chamberlain then retrieves the Fisherman's Ring. Usually the ring is on the Pope's right hand. But with Paul VI, he had stopped wearing the ring during the last years of his reign, and left it in his desk. In other cases the ring might have been removed for medical reasons. The Chamberlain cuts the ring in two in the presence of the Cardinals. The deceased Pope's seals are defaced, to keep the Pope's seal from ever being used again, and his personal apartment is sealed.

MG Rover

There should be an article in the news section on the front page of Wikipedia aboutt he end of MG Rover. This is a serious thing for British car manufacturing as 6000 jobs will be lost in Longbridge and the knock on affect will be devastating. Rover is Britains last volume car maker, more like was. It is completely bankrupt and nobody seems to want to buy them up. - Erebus555TALK

As someone who knows the area and knows people involved I am well aware of what a serious matter this is, however, this is not "Wikipedia, the parochial encyclopedia". We are an international site and there are things going on in the world of much greater relevance to the human race. Have you by any chance been paying attention to recent developments in the Congo, none of which have been featured in the news section. Unfortunate though the loss of several thousand manufacturing jobs in a prosperous nation is, there are much more important things happening. This is a massive local story, with major national consequences, and very little international significance. Also, for a story to be featured on the main page, there actually needs to be an article to link to. I look forward to reading your long and detailed articles on MG Rover, the history of the Longbridge plant, and the issues surrounding the recent troubles. However, even then, they don't deserve a place in the news section. Sorry if I come across as harsh, but I think you have misunderstood the nature of this feature of the main page. — Trilobite (Talk) 17:01, 8 Apr 2005 (UTC)
If you're sorry about coming across as harsh, why not just not communicate harshly? Cigarette
Well, because I didn't intend my critical response as a put down and I wanted to make that clear, that's all. In my opinion the suggestion was a bad one but I have no doubt it was made in good faith. — Trilobite (Talk) 03:03, 9 Apr 2005 (UTC)


When were the colors of the main page tables lightened? I can't find anything about it in the history of the page. I just noticed, because it also changed on the table of Template talk:Did you know, but IIRC it didn't look like that yesterday.. Mgm|(talk) 10:12, Apr 8, 2005 (UTC)

  • Funny... looks totally different now I'm on my home machine. Mgm|(talk) 16:42, Apr 8, 2005 (UTC)

Handel's _Messiah_

The title of the oratorio is Handel's 'Messiah' not 'The Messiah'

This was a problem with the selected anniversaries, not the article itself. I've fixed it. →Raul654 10:46, Apr 8, 2005 (UTC)

South Vietnam Article

the National motto is Danh Du, To Quoc Trach Nghiem PLEASE FIX UP

Estonian page/ saku suurhall

I read today about Estonian biggest arena, but the same time I find some of mistakes- i do bokkepeing myself, but since 1993 is in estonia more taxes important is to look shortly 1.VAT 18 %Passed 10 December 2003 people can EU wide have VAT returns via Bruxelles or claim via Custom & exercise normal rate 18 %, lower 5%.


Estonian page/ saku suurhall

Dear Wikipedia! Concern Estonian tax policy- which is introduced mainly in 1994, but the latest changes naturally are from 2003 and 2004 show the next

Summary of the tax system For foreigners in interestin Bilateral Convention for avoidance of Double taxation- European countries and another are part of this but allways is good to look.

    Personal income tax since 01.january 2005 24 %

basic exemption for resident 20 400 EEK and for self employd 45 000EEK 1£= 22EEK 1€= 15EEK 1$= 12 EEK

look better exchange rates

    Corporate - income tax  24 % and 25 % read from 

in english

    Value-added tax (VAT)18 % , 5% and 0 %

    Social tax 33 %

    Land tax 0,1-2,5% from land value

    Heavy goods vehicle tax over 12 tonne

    Gambling tax since 2002 for one machine and gambling table, betting 5%, totalisator 5%, lottery 18 %, 10 % number lottery

    Tobacco duty
Cigaret Cigar ja sigarillo Smoking tobacco

Estonia 240,00(15,34€) 25 % 2500,00(159,78€) 240,00(15,34€)

    Fuel duty is from 2005/01/01 smaller look good, estonia have step- by step overcoming time

TABEL - mootorfuel


Product The excise rates in Estonia (from 1st of January 2005) The current community minimum rate 

Petrol (unleaded) 1000 L 4500 EEK (287 EUR)

5620 EEK 

(359 EUR)

Leaded petrol 1000 L 6600 EEK (421 EUR)

6590 EEK 

(421 EUR)

Aviation petrol 1000 L 1120 EEK


Gas oil used as propellant 1000 L 3840 EEK (245 EUR)

4730 EEK (302 EUR)/

(from 01.01.2010 330 EUR)

Gas oil for specific purposes 1000 L 690 EEK(44 EUR) 1000 l.960 EEK from 01.01.2006

330 EEK 

(21 EUR)

LPG 1000 kg 1570 EEK/(100 EUR)

1960 EEK (125 EUR)

Kerosene 1000 L 4730 EEK (302 EUR)

4730 EEK (302 EUR)

    Energy taxation 

Table 2. The excise rates on heating fuels in Estonia from 1st of May 2005 and the EU minimum levels of taxation applicable to heating fuels and electricity Product The excise rates in Estonia (from 1st of January 2005)

The current community minimum rate  

business use non-business use

Light Fuel Oil 690 EEK(44 EUR) 1000 l.960 EEK from 01.01.2006

21 EUR/1000 l.

= 330 EEK

21 EUR/1000 l.

= 330 EEK

Heavy Fuel Oil 15 EUR/1000 kg = 235 EEK

15 EUR/1000 kg

= 235 EEK

15 EUR/1000 kg

= 235 EEK

Kerosene 4730 EEK (302 EUR)1000 l.


Methane -

0.15 EUR/ gigajoule gross 

calorific value = 2.35 EEK

0.3 EUR/ gigajoule gross 

calorific value = 4.7 EEK

Coal and coke from 01.05.2005 0.3 EUR/ gigajoule gross calorific value = 4.7 EEK

0.15 EUR/ gigajoule 

gross calorific value = 2.35 EEK

0.3 EUR/ gigajoule 

gross calorific value = 4.7 EEK

Electricity -

0.5 EUR/ MWh= 7.8 EEK
1 EUR/ MWh= 15.65 EEK

    Alcohol duty  2003

Wine * Alcohol drink* beer intermediate production Another alcohol

Estonia 1040,0 (66,47€) 1040,00(66,47€) 58,00(3,71€) 1680,00(107,37€) 15200,00 (971,46€)

    Packaging tax since 1997 10- 40 EEk/kg depend on packaging

    Customs tariffs outside EU

look better

cecilia 09/04/05

Cad Programs / Erase Hard drive

1. The cad program for Mac and Windows is "Vector Works" they are located at <> a great program that I use. I have a 23" screen at home and use a new 17" PowerBook. Screen size makes a big difference in drawing plans. 2. A lady wanted to erase her Mac hard drive on a lap top with bad screen. Start it up in FireWire mode (hold the t key) then she can erase it from her new computer running OSX. 3. One of many programs that can transfer music from the iPod to the computer is "Tunes Transfer" it runs on both Mac and Windows.

Great show Leo. Having Screen Saver withdrawals. (TV's loss). Greg Norman WPB

Can someone with sysop powers fix up today's Selected Anniversaries, please ?

Things should be in past tense. Thanks. -- 18:50, 9 Apr 2005 (UTC)


How come clicking the link next to the above section shows me to the edit screen of a complete different section? Mgm|(talk) 22:15, Apr 9, 2005 (UTC)

It's a bug in MediaWiki, see Bugzilla:966. Goplat 22:55, 9 Apr 2005 (UTC)