Talk:Means of grace

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As per the June 28 edits: good enough, but needlessly detailed. --Rekleov 29 June 2005 03:01 (UTC)

What do you mean, specifically? KHM03 29 June 2005 12:05 (UTC)

Means of Grace / Lutheran edit 07/10/05[edit]

That's what I was aiming for. The removal of the language of promise, however, leaves it rather ex opere operato, does it not? And that is surely to be avoided. --Rekleov 20:11, 10 July 2005 (UTC)


There are several problems here. First, John Wesley is popularly known as the "founder of Methodism", but he is not, actually; George Whitefield and others preceeded him with Calvinistic Methodism (I know those words sound strange if you're in America and know what I'm talking about--but it's still in England and Wales). Wesley fractured Methodism and morphed parts of it, while planting the seeds of it in other places, of Arminian, or Wesleyan, Methodism.

As for the article, it doesn't cite sources, doesn't present the material very well, and is not very in-depth. I would love to help...but honestly I was trying to research "Means of Grace" further, however I do know this article is very wanting. Thus far thanks for the efforts, though; perhaps I could help a bit once I've learned a bit more.


22:04, 25 July 2008 (UTC)