the part deleted by pro-Salafi zora
In Sahih Muslim Zirr reported that 'Ali observed: By Him Who split up the seed and created something living, the Apostle (Mohammed) pbuh gave me a promise that no one but a believer would love me, and none but a hypocrite would nurse grudge against me
- Anon, I don't see how I can be a Salafi when I'm a Buddhist. As for the use of the term Rafidi in the Ummayad and early Abbasid period, see this document from the Ahlul Bayt Digital Islamic Library Project . This is a Shi'a document using the words rafd and rafidi. The Salafis and Wahhabis just took an old word and revived it, with an edge of venom. But you don't have to feel offended -- there's nothing wrong with being a Refuser, after all, if you are, as you believe you are, refusing something bad.
- You are making Shi'a Islam look bad when you engage in hatred and persecution based on your ignorance of your own sectarian history. Zora 06:51, 1 March 2006 (UTC)
- u r Salafi becuase u carry there believe , please read that article to know that what i said was right the term rafidi came longer after the death of imam Ali by anti-shia , the term shia came from the prophet himself , so u must use the same term the prophet of islam used to address Ali followers not the anti-shia term so if u r ignorant non-muslim lern something about islam and arabic and come back !!--188.8.131.52 12:23, 1 March 2006 (UTC)
- see this from the link u gave "Some extreme Sunnis (salafi's he mean) are even of the view that such a preference of the Imam over `Uthman is rafd( refuse ) so it is political term for who do not accept sunni calipha to justify the killing of shia and there imams in the time the term shia was given by the prophet of islam himself--184.108.40.206 12:35, 1 March 2006 (UTC)
Citations for use of the term
We've had both a Salafi and a Shi'a at work on this article recently. The Salafi said that Salafi use the term against Shi'a, and the Shi'a said that all Muslims use it against those who hate Ali.
Seems to me that the problem is lack of citations. We need quotes, from people identifiable as Shi'a or Sunni or Salafi or whatever, using the word against another group of people. I'm willing to believe that the article is wrong, but we need evidence.
Evidence from other languages is OK if the cite is referenced, so that it can be confirmed, and if the cite is given both in the original language and in an English translation. Zora 19:41, 1 May 2006 (UTC)
zora u are a liar salafi u r so ignorant about islam why u write about it since u do not know are u idiot or what ?? --220.127.116.11 09:22, 12 May 2006 (UTC)
Archive the section deleted
Nasibi (from the Arabic word ناصبي ) is a derogatory Islamic term among Shia and Sunni Muslims for someone who hates Ali and his followers. Today the term is used by most Shia to refer to the Salafi sect.
Salafis and Wahhabis regard Shi'a as heretics and have massacred or persecuted Shi'a (Wahhabi sack of Karbala in 1801, Taliban massacre of Shi'a , numerous guerrilla attacks in contemporary Pakistan and Iraq).
In Sahih Muslim Zirr reported that 'Ali observed: By Him Who split up the seed and created something living, the Apostle (Mohammed) PBUH gave me a promise that no one but a believer would love me, and none but a hypocrite would nurse a grudge against me.
Salafi's use the word rafida (and also the Arabic non-collective singular form rafidi رافضي) as a derogatory term for Shi'a Muslims and refuse to accept Shi`a Islam as being a valid form of Islam. It would seem to be used primarily by Salafis, but it is possible that it is used by other groups.
It is a term to denote religious opponents, which refers in a derogatory way to those who (in the opinion of the person using the term) reject the authority of their leaders.
In past times "Rafidi" used by some Sunni historians to refer to some Shi'a who refused to follow Zayd ibn Ali. It is thought that the usage of the term came from Zayd ibn Ali himself who exclaimed "You have abandoned me (rafadhtumuni)" to some of his followers who retracted their oath of allegience then they asked him to refuse to acknowledge Abu Bakr and Umar but Zayd ibn Ali said no,so they left and rejected him. . It was also used by Salafi Muslims as a term of abuse for Shi'a Muslims. They were considered "Refusers" because they refused to give allegiance to Sunni Caliph Abu Bakr, and refused to recognize the authority of the others Sunni caliphs.
- Tareekh at-Tabari, Vol. II, p. 1700
- Takfiri —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 18.104.22.168 (talk • contribs) 03:27, 4 December 2006 (UTC).
Zaid ibn Ali
"they asked him to refuse to acknowledge Abu Bakr and Umar but Zayd ibn Ali said no,so they left and rejected him." Quoting from at-Tabari on a Shiite leader regarding Abu Bark and Umar is trivial. Thus a point of scholarly debate.
- The point you're trying to make is not clear. That stuff was out of place in this article, so I removed it. It's still in the Rafida article. Are you trying to say that al-Tabari was wrong and that Shi'a sources would give a different version?
- I have been slowly building up my collection of al-Tabari in the SUNY English translation. We should be citing that instead of anonymous versions in Arabic (whoever put these in didn't know how to do references properly). Unfortunately, I don't have the volume that we need here. If you have access to the full run, it would be nice if you could check that quote. Zora 19:40, 20 December 2006 (UTC)
Well it is a biased outlook on Zaid ibn Ali's position on Abu Bakr and Umar. According to the Jafaris and the Zaidis (the first Zaidis were of the Jaruddiyya sub-sect, it manifested after the death of Zaid ibn Ali ibn in the 8th century) Zaid bin Ali never recognised Abu Bakr and Umar. It is only according to the Sunnis (at-Tabari) that Zaid ibn Ali recognised Abu Bakr and Umar.
Edited three things
1- There is a clear generlization against salafis and wahhabis
2- Details about the term rafida occupy 4 of the 7 paragraphs
3- add other views about the term Dy yol 15:55, 28 May 2007 (UTC)
I really don't understand why the whole 'Rifada' terminology is here. This article is about Nasibi, not about Rifada. Why is there a relation here from Ali? Most of this article is irrelevant to the Nasibi article. I don't feel particularly qualified to clean this up, but if no one fixes it for a while, I will be forced to take action. --Paradoxicalengineer 04:03, 11 September 2007 (UTC)
Also, please stop insulting other Wikipedians; remain civil!