Talk:Ned Kelly

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Jump to: navigation, search

Kelly murdering Lonigan in "Cold blood"[edit]

After an entire page of glowing statements about how Kelly was nice to hostages etc, there seems to be consternation that his murder of Lonigan be labeled "cold blooded". Virtually of the references state this was the case. is there a reason it should not be described this way? Michael Ronson (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 06:19, 8 June 2016 (UTC)

It's a value judgment. Give an objective account based on the best available evidence and the reader can make up his/her own mind. - HappyWaldo (talk) 06:34, 8 June 2016 (UTC)

Patrick Kelly[edit]

I have included referenced material regarding Patrick Kelly however it was reverted. Is the history of his grandfather not relevant to this article? Michael Ronson (talk) 20:09, 8 June 2016 (UTC)

The text was reference from | this article which was already part of the reference list Michael Ronson (talk) 20:10, 8 June 2016 (UTC)

"Is the history of his grandfather not relevant to this article?" Sure, but not Patrick, because he didn't exist. Ned's grandfather was Thomas Kelly. If you're going to include information on Ned's grandparents, or on anything else for that matter, make sure it's from a reliable source. - HappyWaldo (talk) 20:24, 8 June 2016 (UTC)

The reliable source has been in this article for years and other references using the "West Australian" newspaper are in abundance on Wikipedia. If you can find a source that states Ned's grandfathers name was Thomas I'm all for changing it to that. Until then WP:RS dictates that we use the sources that the we have, and the sources that we have clearly state that Neds grandfather was named Patrick Michael Ronson (talk) 21:50, 8 June 2016 (UTC)

It astounds me that someone who doesn't know Ned's grandfather's name, or the reason for Ned's father's transportation to Australia, or about the financial difficulties he faced as a selector, would feel qualified to write on these matters. It's difficult to assume good faith when you have made your negative bias towards the subject abundantly clear through your edits. You seem to calibrate many of your edits in a way that paints the subject in the worst light and from the worst angle using a dubious interpretation of the evidence—even unreliable evidence. The West Australian article is riddled with falsehoods. This is the problem with relying on Trove. Referencing old newspapers, it would very easy to construct a complete biography of Kelly that gets literally everything very wrong. Kelly is a highly mythologised historical figure, and it is only in the last couple of decades that many of these myths have been conclusively debunked through the dedicated research of historians. Why not cross check the West Australian article before referencing it? Does "Patrick Kelly" turn up in other Trove articles? (I checked, he does not). What about on Google Books? What do trained historians and scholars have to say? What is the consensus on certain events in Kelly's life? If there is no general consensus, then what are the different ways these events have been understood, interpreted and reconstructed using the best available evidence? I am going to remove the references to Patrick Kelly, and I would ask that before you make anymore edits to this page, you to read at least one recently published, well-reviewed Kelly biography and familiarise yourself with the story. - HappyWaldo (talk) 03:24, 10 June 2016 (UTC)

The Kelly Outbreak[edit]

While I was reading the section in this article about the murder of Aaron Sherritt , by Dan Kelly and Joe Byrne, it became patently obvious that this biographical article should be split up into the sections. The murder of Sherritt has little to do with Ned and should be in the Joe Byrne (Bushranger) article and the Dan Kelly (Bushranger) article. There should be an article called The Kelly Gang where most of this biographical article should be. I'd like to hear peoples input on this idea. Michael Ronson (talk) 22:21, 9 June 2016 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 28 June 2016[edit]

it says his name is ned its intact edward but his nickname was ned 122.106.173.193 (talk) 09:05, 28 June 2016 (UTC)

The first three words of the article are "Edward "Ned" Kelly". Jenks24 (talk) 09:44, 28 June 2016 (UTC)