Talk:Nocturne (Talia Wagner)

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Former good article nominee Nocturne (Talia Wagner) was a Language and literature good articles nominee, but did not meet the good article criteria at the time. There are suggestions below for improving the article. Once these issues have been addressed, the article can be renominated. Editors may also seek a reassessment of the decision if they believe there was a mistake.
June 14, 2007 Good article nominee Not listed
WikiProject Comics / Marvel (Rated B-class, Mid-importance)
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B-Class article B  This article has been rated as B-Class on the project's quality scale.
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 Mid  This article has been rated as Mid-importance on the project's importance scale.
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WikiProject Fictional characters (Rated C-class)
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C-Class article C  This article has been rated as C-Class on the project's quality scale.

Find sources: "Nocturne" Talia Wagner – news · newspapers · books · scholar · HighBeam · JSTOR · free images · free news sources · The Wikipedia Library · NYT · WP reference


Well, its been awhile since reviewing my last good article candidate. I think this article is good (its B-class). I also like the referencing. I like how the article is set up as most Marvel articles first. However, this article needs more pictures of the comic book. It is right to have the article in present tense as she is in different states depending on what comic. The article needs a navigation box to help introduce the article. The external link is fine especially if that's all you could/can find. Also I would change this sentence When she is twenty years old, Nocturne is taken by the Timebroker and told she had become "unhinged from time" to At twenty years old. Nice that the article goes in order of the biography box. Alright thats all.

Showmanship is the key 00:46, 7 June 2007 (UTC)

GA Nomination Result[edit]

The above review was not thorough and neither was the article removed from the good article candidates list. I'm doing a more detailed review here and I'm afraid the result is that the article has failed the good article criteria. The good article standard can only be as accurate as the most lenient reviewer.

Here is how the article compares to the good article criteria:

GA review (see here for criteria)
  1. It is reasonably well written.
    a (prose): b (MoS):
  2. It is factually accurate and verifiable.
    a (references): b (citations to reliable sources): c (OR):
  3. It is broad in its coverage.
    a (major aspects): b (focused):
  4. It follows the neutral point of view policy.
    a (fair representation): b (all significant views):
  5. It is stable.
  6. It contains images, where possible, to illustrate the topic.
    a (tagged and captioned): b (lack of images does not in itself exclude GA): c (non-free images have fair use rationales):
  7. Overall:
    a Pass/Fail:

More specifically:

  • The article uses comic books as primary sources of reference. This is better than other comic book related articles that fail to even cite the comics but the references cannot all just come from comic books. This qualifies it to fail under wikipedia's policy of original research. This basically means that the article is just repeating the information obtained from reading the comic books, which tantamounts to original research. The article should provide more information than what the comic books provide and should give a reader the information about the character that he would not be able to obtain from the comic books.
  • The article needs to be more focused. Batman has a significantly long fictional biography but not all the information is included in the character's article.
  • Article needs to be copyedited. It is fairly well-written but for a GA status, it needs to be much better. Request help from Wikipedia:Cleanup taskforce or from other editors.

Keep up the good work. Please review Silver Surfer on the GA candidates page. The article for that character failed about four GA nominations so far and this is the fifth. Zuracech lordum 11:15, 14 June 2007 (UTC)

External link suggestion[edit] has spotlights on characters and I've noticed that a link to these spotlights is added to the external links of all other characters. Talia has a spotlight on this site as of yesterday, I'd add the link myself but i don't know how. 00:07, 14 September 2007 (UTC)asief

Thanks for the suggestion! It has been added. Freak104 02:13, 14 September 2007 (UTC)

Days of Future Present?[edit]

Should that even be included in this article? Blue is a daughter of Nightcrawler from an alternate reality, but not Nocturne. Should that section stay, or should it go? 21:47, 4 October 2007 (UTC)

Its a tricky one - if I understand things correctly Blue is a (future) daughter of the Earth-616 Nightcrawler? If they are from another Earth then she'd still count as being an alternate version. It is a close call but it is a reasonable enough connection. It'd be worth including in the Nightcrawler entry but as far as I can tell seems OK to be here. The only way to really exclude it is if there was a statement saying Blue isn't an alternate version or if it turns out they are sisters. (Emperor 22:00, 4 October 2007 (UTC))
So Blue is a potential daughter of 616-Nightcrawler, and Nocturne is an actual daughter of an alternate-Nightcrawler. I think that is enough to consider them alternate versions of each other. Or at least alternate-reality sisters. 14:35, 5 October 2007 (UTC)

Comics Project Improvement Drive[edit]

OK let's get the final polish on this and take it up to GA. So what is needed?

Looking through the immediate problem (and instant fail) is that the second image needs a FUR.

What I'd also like to see is something from the creators on this - interviews possibly when they joined Excalibur? Something that would flesh things out beyond primary sources.

Anything else? (Emperor 13:15, 4 October 2007 (UTC))

Additional images[edit]

Suggestions above recommend more images and that Exiles one is good and I think a group shot of the New Excalibur team would be a good idea too. That should cover the main image needs. (Emperor 13:15, 4 October 2007 (UTC))

I also think some images of her during the Brotherhood/X-Men time would be good. Maybe the cover from Uncanny X-Men that she is on, her as an X-Baby, or the scene where she gets sucked into Xorn's head. 17:40, 5 October 2007 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:XMEN 05252005 0024.jpg[edit]

Nuvola apps important.svg

Image:XMEN 05252005 0024.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images lacking such an explanation can be deleted one week after being tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot (talk) 07:40, 15 January 2008 (UTC)

Fair use rationale has now been provided by -Freak104 (talk) 15:05, 17 January 2008 (UTC)

WikiProject Comics B-Class Assesment required[edit]

This article needs the B-Class checklist filled in to remain a B-Class article for the Comics WikiProject. If the checklist is not filled in by 7th August this article will be re-assessed as C-Class. The checklist should be filled out referencing the guidance given at Wikipedia:Version 1.0 Editorial Team/Assessment/B-Class criteria. For further details please contact the Comics WikiProject. Comics-awb (talk) 17:11, 31 July 2008 (UTC)

C-Class rated for Comics Project[edit]

As this B-Class article has yet to receive a review, it has been rated as C-Class. If you disagree and would like to request an assesment, please visit Wikipedia:WikiProject_Comics/Assessment#Requesting_an_assessment and list the article. Hiding T 16:37, 23 February 2009 (UTC)