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- 1 IP/OSI confusion in layer box
- 2 Examples wrong
- 3 Semi-protected edit request on 31 July 2014
- 4 Inception
- 5 Defining a standard
- 6 IPoE redirects here. WHY?
- 7 Image formats and styling languages in layer 6?
- 8 Layer 5 (Session) examples incorrect?
- 9 Layer 1 (Physical) examples incorrect?
- 10 Layer 6: Presentation Layer
IP/OSI confusion in layer box
The box of networking layers here makes the mistake of conflating TCP/IP network protocols with the OSI layers. This is wrong; the two are not connected, not even remotely.
I realize that many educational institutions like to use the OSI model because it's such a neat network model and it's so nice to explain things, but it's 'wrong' to assume that the IP network protocol is situated in layer 4 of the OSI model, or that the SIP protocol is situated in layer 7 of the OSI model. They are not. The IP protocol is found in the network layer of the TCP/IP "model", and the SIP protocol is found in the applicatoin layer of the TCP/IP "model".
- The OSI model does not only apply to the OSI protocols as the networking literature attests. --EnOreg (talk) 15:26, 21 April 2013 (UTC)
- There are no "OSI protocols." The OSI model doesn't define any protocols. By definition, protocols such as TCP/IP fall within the scope of the OSI model. The official documentation says:
- "The purpose of this Reference Model of Open Systems Interconnection is to provide a common basis for the coordination of standards development for the purpose of systems interconnection, while allowing existing standards to be placed into perspective within the overall Reference Model."
- The tasks generally performed in the Internet layer of the TCP/IP model fall within the general description of the Network layer of the OSI model. Rsduhamel (talk) 23:44, 26 January 2015 (UTC)
the table in Examples gives an entry for "Layer 2" X "TCP/IP protocols". This is wrong. Layer 2 protocols, like PPP, is at a level where IP doesn't exist (IP is on top of L2).
Also things like HTTP and HTML are backwards. HTML is transferred over HTTP, so HTML should be layer 7, not layer 6, and HTTP should be layer 6 not layer 7. The same goes for the other 6/7 layer examples.
Semi-protected edit request on 31 July 2014
|This edit request has been answered. Set the
- No, DHCP messages are ultimately sent with IP, so that can't be right. Anon126 (notify me of responses! / talk / contribs) 21:07, 9 August 2014 (UTC)
Defining a standard
- But ISO 7498 says right on its front cover that it's a standard. Please explain. --Wtshymanski (talk) 22:07, 26 January 2015 (UTC)
- The cover page of the ISO version and page 1 of both versions are titled "International Standard" (from page 1 on, both the ISO and ITU versions are identical). However, the body of the document is clear that the document does not set a standard. Specifically, it says:
- "It is not the intent of this Reference Model either to serve as an implementation specification, or to be a basis for appraising the conformance of actual implementations, or to provide a sufficient level of detail to define precisely the services and protocols of the interconnection architecture. Rather, this Reference Model provides a conceptual and functional framework which allows international teams of experts to work productively and independently on the development of standards for each layer of the Reference Model for OSI."
- Although it does not say "this is not a standard" it is described as a reference model and framework to allow the development of standards. Perhaps I am being imprecise but I have seen a lot written on the Internet and in textbooks describing the OSI model as a standard that must be complied with. I've also seen it described as an attempt by bubble-headed European bureaucrats to shove a restrictive, complicated and unworkable standard down the throats of developers. It is no such thing. It is just framework describing what tasks may or may not be done by networking applications. Developers don't necessarily follow the OSI model. The OSI model follows what developers generally do. Rsduhamel (talk) 23:29, 26 January 2015 (UTC)
- This is really moot, because the OSI model is really used nowhere as a development model, at least not above Layer 2. The lack of usable protocols in the late 80s, early 90s, made it obsolete quickly and TCP/IP has reigned, despite its shortcomings. I don't see a strict contraction in a reference model being a standard. It certainly is a standard way of teaching network application architecture. Developers use the Internet Protocol Suite (TCP/IP) as their model. Anything the standards organizations deal with is codified eventually as a standard, seems that's the only way to document their work. Kbrose (talk) 14:04, 27 January 2015 (UTC)
IPoE redirects here. WHY?
I was looking for info on I(ternet)P(rotocol)o(ver)E(thernet), and got this page. But this page says absolutely NOTHING about IPoE. So where should a seeker after knowledge go? 220.127.116.11 (talk) 03:35, 10 August 2015 (UTC)
- Perhaps somebody could restart the IPoE page with this http://www.dslreports.com/r0/download/1468367~39a604b7c30141db72e55620ebf95879/Understanding%20PPPoE%20and%20DHCP_200187.pdf info from Mark Bernstein of Juniper Networks. 18.104.22.168 (talk) 03:57, 10 August 2015 (UTC)
Image formats and styling languages in layer 6?
In the table in section "Description of OSI layers" there are some interesting examples for layer 6: HTML, CSS, GIF.
How so? Can somebody explain? What does an image format have to do with the presentation layer of the OSI model? And HTML/CSS? This looks like it was mistaken for "visual presentation of a web page".
Similarly SQL is a weird choice for layer 5 because that's a programming language, not a protocol. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Niko IstDerNameImmerNochZuÄhnlich (talk • contribs) 01:35, 5 October 2015 (UTC)
It seems to me that the examples in the upper layers are all completely mixed up. HTML should be a higher layer than HTTP since HTML is transferred using the HTTP protocol over a TCP socket using IP. The 6/7 layer examples are all backwards.
Layer 5 (Session) examples incorrect?
Numerous text-books and online sources use HTTP; FTP; RDP; SSH; Telnet as examples for Layer 7 (Application).
Layer 1 (Physical) examples incorrect?
Bluetooth is given under physical layer examples in the sidebar and not in any other layers. Bluetooth goes across a lot of layers so it is inaccurate to say it's only the physical layer. Should we remove bluetooth from the examples? Alastor Moody 20:47, 7 May 2016 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Prashantverma999 (talk • contribs)
- The sentence is
The physical layer of Parallel SCSI operates in this layer, as do the physical layers of Ethernet and other local-area networks, such as Token Ring, FDDI, ITU-T G.hn, and IEEE 802.11 (Wi-Fi), as well as personal area networks such as Bluetooth and IEEE 802.15.4.
- If it's parsed as
The physical layer of Parallel SCSI operates in this layer, as do the physical layers of <Ethernet and other local-area networks, such as Token Ring, FDDI, ITU-T G.hn, and IEEE 802.11 (Wi-Fi), as well as personal area networks such as Bluetooth and IEEE 802.15.4>.
- i.e., with "the physical layers" referring not only to the LAN technologies but the PAN technologies, rather than as
The physical layer of Parallel SCSI operates in this layer, as do <the physical layers of Ethernet and other local-area networks, such as Token Ring, FDDI, ITU-T G.hn, and IEEE 802.11 (Wi-Fi)>, as well as personal area networks such as Bluetooth and IEEE 802.15.4.
- with "the physical layers" referring only to the LAN technologies, then it's correct.
- However, the sentence is complicated enough that the second parsing is plausible, and it should perhaps be rewritten to make it clear that it's referring not to Bluetooth or 802.15.4 in their entireties, but only to their physical layers, just as it's referring to the physical layers of Ethernet/Token Ring/FDDI/G.hn/802.11 rather than to those LANs in their entireties. Guy Harris (talk) 06:03, 8 May 2016 (UTC)