Talk:Panzer Dragoon

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WikiProject Video games (Rated GA-class, Mid-importance)
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Wasn't Panzer Dragoon (One) the first game in gaming industry ever to top 1 million dollar development budget? --Abdull 09:37, 24 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Not even close, Dragon's Lair 1983 was. (Untagged comment by - ThomasWinwood 11:01, 16 May 2006 (UTC))

Panzer Dragoon Saga print run[edit]

In case anyone wonders there were three runs of Panzer Dragoon Saga printed, the initial run was only 6,000 copies. The later runs were 12,000 each. Since someone wondered about this earlier I actually dug out the press release issued by Sega shortly after the first run sold out.

It also appears the original run came with black disc sleeves while the later had white disc sleeves.

REDWOOD CITY, Calif.--May 14, 1998--Enter a world of constant strife and struggle, an Empire in ruins and at the mercy of relentless rebels.

Look through the eyes of Edge, a young hunter, as he witnesses evil rebels murder his mentor and abduct Azel, a young girl. Watch as they laugh at his tears. Here begins the ultimate quest for revenge. This is the story of "Panzer Dragoon Saga(TM)," a role-playing game (RPG) with action/adventure elements, created by Sega(R) of America for Sega Saturn(R).

"Panzer Dragoon Saga" sold out in its first week at retail. Sega has processed re-orders to fulfill consumer demand.

As Edge, your only means of defense is your determination and a mythical dragon with keen fighting powers and the ability to morph to better combat enemies. This quest opens the door to more than retribution, it unlocks the secrets of the ancient Empire -- the secrets that could end years of unanswered questions.

"Panzer Dragoon Saga" takes gamers through war-torn Empires with miles of forests, secret underground caverns, ancient ruins and towns. For the first time in the series, gamers have the freedom to explore the 3D worlds with full unrestricted 360-degree movement, encountering numerous enemies. A new and innovative combat engine allows players to fight all enemies, including a savage Baldor Queen and swarms of hideous flying Nanyds, in real-time, bringing a new level of action to this RPG.

Through the new real-time combat engine, Edge and his enemies now attack simultaneously using weapons, lasers or magic spells. The dragon has numerous attack mechanisms and can rotate around the enemies, searching for hidden weak points. However, the enemies are just as adroit with their own arsenal of attacks, poisons and spells.

When the going gets really tough, the dragon has a secret weapon to further assist in battle. Through morphing, the dragon changes shape in real-time and sharpens its abilities in four areas: "Defense" adds extra armor to the dragon; "Attack" allows the dragon to grow three deadly prongs on his head to increase his laser's fire power; "Speed" lengthens the dragon for a more aerodynamic shape; "Spiritual" gives the dragon magical powers to blast hordes of enemies. It is up to the player to "size up" the enemy and decide on the best morphing strategy for the dragon before engaging in battle.

Also a first in the "Panzer Dragoon" series, gamers can guide Edge through all worlds on or off the dragon, without pre-determined paths, to uncover secrets in the unexplored areas of the Empire with a wider panoramic field and complete freedom. Edge can now enjoy complete interactivity with everything he encounters -- strolling into stores he passes in town to buy weapons or trade items, speaking with all characters he meets to gain clues or information and eavesdropping on townspeople's conversations. Players can read books Edge buys, many of which reveal clues of where to go, or hints on how to better survive the city he may be visiting and unlock mysteries behind the other Panzer games. "`Panzer Dragoon Saga' is an interactive epic adventure played out on four discs," said Andrew Stein, marketing manager, Sega of America. "All of the mystery surrounding the dragon and characters in the previous `Panzer Dragoon' games are now revealed throughout this role-playing experience."

No stone should be left unturned in this expansive adventure. The storyline branches and players decide the length and depth of the game depending on which path they take, whom they meet, the time of day they visit a world and what they uncover based on their level of experience. At certain times of day, some characters may be more willing to talk and give information than others, so players must take advantage of the massive replay value to find all clues and secrets.

To further expand the replay value and to keep gamers guessing, various hidden elements or "Easter eggs" can be uncovered, including three hidden dragons, one of which is the dragon from the original "Panzer Dragoon." Three mini games can be unlocked in which gamers can have racing or shooting competitions with the characters. Also unique to "Panzer Dragoon Saga" is a "tamogachi" feature in which players score extra points based on the level of love and care given to the dragon throughout the game.

"Panzer Dragoon Saga" is available nationwide for a suggested retail price of $49.99.

Split off separate Panzer Dragoon games?[edit]

Should the games not be given separate pages? There seems to be a web of redirects to this page; this seems misleading - Panzer Dragoon Zwei is not Panzer Dragoon. ThomasWinwood 11:02, 16 May 2006 (UTC)

Articles on a series are not unusual. Whether it's merited in this case or not is an entirely different story. Nifboy 18:22, 13 August 2006 (UTC)

Story Summary[edit]

Hi I was wondering i it would be a good idea to maybe put a summary of the games in the article. Like all the games main goals is to destroy a tower, free the world from the will of the ancients and the heresy program etc

Fair use rationale for Image:Panzer Dragoon Boxart.jpg[edit]

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Image:Panzer Dragoon Boxart.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot (talk) 16:49, 19 November 2007 (UTC)

Can we please use the Japanese cover with Moebius' artwork? (Momus (talk) 18:39, 9 March 2010 (UTC))

GA discussion[edit]

Nice work on the article. In response to a request at the VG Wikiproject's talk page, I have decided to come here. Here's how I would review this article to pass a GA nomination:

  • Lead section - needs to summarize the article, and be at least 3 to 4 paragraphs
  • Plot section - looks good.
  • Development section - looks good.
  • Gameplay section - also looks good as well.
  • Release section - may need to be included in the article.
  • Reception section - also looks good as well. However, you may need to include reviewers as well to explain unfamiliar readers and is the proper way of sourcing (i.e. "Joe blah of IGN" instead of just "IGN").
  • References - may need to include links
  • Copyedit - This article must undergo a thorough copyediting.

Other than that, I think the article looks good. Any other suggestions or ideas would be very much appreciated. Thanks, Lord Sjones23 (talk - contributions) 22:14, 14 August 2012 (UTC)

The references in the reception section need some work, such as volume, issue, page number, and author if possible. In their current state, there's no way to know where the information is. —Torchiest talkedits 22:17, 14 August 2012 (UTC)
For most of the 1995 reviews I used the Mobygames page for the game ([1]) so it may take time to find some of these details. I've seen a scan of the gamepro review, I added the page number but no reviewer name was mentionned.Folken de Fanel (talk) 22:33, 14 August 2012 (UTC)
Take a look at Template:Video game reviews. I added it and a couple scores from the sources you've got, but try to put them all in it. There are lots of common review sources that have their own parameters already set up. —Torchiest talkedits 12:33, 15 August 2012 (UTC)
Thanks for that, I'll work on this section a bit more ;) Folken de Fanel (talk) 15:37, 15 August 2012 (UTC)
Something else that would be good to do is separate out all the various reviews into their own paragraphs or sentences. Right now, you've got the line "There was some criticism over the game's lack of diversity in weapons, it's predetermined progression and its overall difficulty, however most publications presented it as one of the Saturn's system seller.[28][29][30][31][32]". Compressing five different complete reviews into one sentence like that is missing out on a lot of great information. It would be nice to get a more specific understanding of what each reviewer thought. —Torchiest talkedits 19:45, 15 August 2012 (UTC)

I have expanded the lead and the review section (I found the magazines and was able to include specific content from each reviews, and I improved the refs as well) Also added reviewers names, and scores. I feel the article is ready for a GAN.Folken de Fanel (talk) 21:56, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

GA Review[edit]

This review is transcluded from Talk:Panzer Dragoon/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Red Phoenix (talk · contribs) 13:58, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Representing the Sega Task Force of WikiProject Video games, I am more than honored to take up this review. I'll begin as soon as I can. Red Phoenix build the future...remember the past... 13:58, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

GA review (see here for what the criteria are, and here for what they are not)

Definitely a good read for a Sega classic. There are in my opinion, however, some adjustments that need to be made to reach GA status.

  1. It is reasonably well written.
    a (prose, no copyvios, spelling and grammar): b (MoS for lead, layout, word choice, fiction, and lists):
    This article is formatted well for a video game article, but I do see some prose issues that could be cleaned up. Make sure to capitalize proper nouns, i.e. "European", not "european". Single-sentence paragraphs are also improper, and should be combined into other paragraphs; for example, the lead of the Reception section should be combined into the next paragraph below it. Keep short paragraphs together to prevent choppiness, and make sure to vary the way sentences and paragraphs start, to improve fluency (i.e. 2 sentences in a row should not start with "In 199X...", nor should 2 paragraphs.) Overall, the article could use a copyedit to help improve fluency and clean up the prose... after the other issues are fixed, I might be willing to complete this for you.
  2. It is factually accurate and verifiable.
    a (reference section): b (citations to reliable sources): c (OR):
    Reviewing the sources, there are a couple of issues. Let me start with the use of GameSpot as a source for games related to "Panzer Dragoon": if you read WP:VG/S, the guideline notes that Gamespot is not a reliable source for database information because it is user contributed, though deceptively so. I'd suggest replacing it with IGN, as IGN does not have this issue, or with Allgame. Upon review, you should be okay with the GameSpot article by Ricardo Torres since he was a staff member and that is one of the conditional acceptable uses of GameSpot as a reliable source. GameFAQs is also not considered a reliable source per the same policy, and cannot be used in a GA (in fact, GameFAQs is prohibited entirely from any use on Wikipedia because it's entirely user-created content with no fact-checking). The last sentence of the Gameplay section has no citation, which could indicate WP:OR, but everything else looks good. Make sure, though, that your citations are consistent and use the same spelling and capitalization, as well as the proper capitalization (i.e. "GamePro" vs. "Gamepro", the first is the correct capitalization), and that any citations are as complete as possible, such as needing volume and issue numbers on the Retro Gamer source if you can find it. Lastly, don't cite a reference to "Sleeve of Japanese release". Be specific and think of the reader: some readers may not understand what you mean by that unless you're specific.
  3. It is broad in its coverage.
    a (major aspects): b (focused):
    Pretty broad and focused for a Sega Saturn game, where one would think coverage would be difficult to find. Not too much focus on Plot, which is good because it means it's not a fancrufty article. Well done.
  4. It follows the neutral point of view policy.
    Fair representation without bias:
    From reading source 27, where does the comment on the sales not being high which could be explained by the PlayStation come from? I can't find it in that source, and it might be slightly POV-ish to say that it did not sell well because of its system without something to concretely back it up. Other than that, article is neutral as I read it and covers all facets well.
  5. It is stable.
    No edit wars, etc.:
    Looks to be quite stable. No edit wars in progress.
  6. It is illustrated by images and other media, where possible and appropriate.
    a (images are tagged and non-free content have fair use rationales): b (appropriate use with suitable captions):
    Check your non-free use rationales; especially for the cover art, it reads somewhat weak and the "n.a." fields need to explain in each case why a non-free image is being used. State the obvious here even if it is obvious to us, to be sure no one can question it. For example, the screenshot could not be replaced with a free equivalent because no free equivalent exists, nor can it exist because the work being described is a copyrighted work and all screenshots of it are copyrighted.
  7. Overall:
    I'm going to place the article on hold. There's some touch-up that needs to be done here, but I don't think you're too far off.

Red Phoenix build the future...remember the past... 15:53, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Thank you for the review ! It's my first attempt at "GA-ing" an article and I expected there would be some issues. I'm going to work on it right now, I can probably get it done by tomorrow.
  • As for prose issues, I think I can deal with some like paragraphs, sentence starts, etc. However I'm not a native English speaker and I may need help to improve overall fluency. I may not be able to spot certain non-idiomatic sentences right away...
  • As for sources, I think I can easily find alternatives for Gamefaqs and the Gamespot database. Last sentence in Gamplay section shouldn't be too hard to source. I've found the Retro Gamer issue number, however I don't know if I can access the paper publication for page number and author. Also I didn't add the ref to EGM 1996 Buyer's Guide myself, and I couldn't find a page number since I can't access this particular issue. I didn't add the "Japanese sleeve" ref it necessarily at all ?
  • For the POV issue, the low but substancial enough sales are referenced in source 22, and for the parenthesized comment on the Saturn, I used source 27 (1up), right at the beginning: "YF: Panzer Dragoon wasn't accepted that much in Japan, but that's maybe because it was on Saturn." If you consider that is an issue of WP:SYNTH, or not clear enough for inclusion, I'll remove that parenthesized comment.
  • For the cover art, I wasn't the one who uploaded it and I just forgot to check its rationale ^^ I'll work on that.Folken de Fanel (talk) 17:35, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
Looks much better so far. Reference issues have been tidied up, and I removed the citation for the Japanese name because really a citation for a translation in Japan has never been required even in FA-class video game articles and since it's cited to the cover art, it's simply a little bizarre. I'm glad to see the non-free rationales have also been tightened up; this will prevent copyright questions from rising up in the future. The only thing I see left to be done is a thorough copyedit. I'll need some time to complete this, but as I do understand you're not a native English speaker and the odds of finding another copyeditor are scarce, I'll be glad to copyedit this article. Once I do, I think setting GA status shouldn't be a problem. Well done, your first GA is just within reach. Red Phoenix build the future...remember the past... 12:31, 12 August 2013 (UTC)
Thanks ! I'll try to copyedit as much as I can, but your help as an en-User will be very welcome. :) Folken de Fanel (talk) 15:56, 12 August 2013 (UTC)
No problem. I'm sorry for the delay; my job is quite abrasive and takes me out of the loop for days at a time. In any circumstance, the article could still use more copyediting, but I've given it a pretty thorough start, and I'd say we're clearly at GA status now. Well done! Red Phoenix build the future...remember the past... 15:01, 17 August 2013 (UTC)
Thanks for the the status, and the copyedit ! I'll be working on other VG articles now, including the rest of the Panzer Dragoon games and other Sega titles !Folken de Fanel (talk) 16:20, 17 August 2013 (UTC)