Talk:Simon Property Group

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Improper move[edit]

This page was moved improperly from Melvin Simon and Associates via cut-and-paste. It has been listed on Wikipedia:Cut and paste move repair holding pen so that the edit history from the old location can be added to this article. SchuminWeb (Talk) 04:18, 3 June 2006 (UTC)

Fixed. -- Kim van der Linde at venus 07:42, 3 June 2006 (UTC)

Removed list of Simon Malls[edit]

I have removed in its entirety, the list of Simon malls from this article. Wikipedia is not a directory, and so this refocuses the article on the company itself. SchuminWeb (Talk) 15:37, 2 September 2007 (UTC)


The charity referenced is Susan G. Komen for the Cure not--Susan B. Komen Breast Cancer Foundation. —Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 22:40, 8 April 2008 (UTC)

No, the foundation is named the Susan G. Komen Breast Cancer Foundation. They hold a fundraiser named the "Susan B. Komen Race for the Cure" (which I assume is what you were referencing). Hmm. Name change. Nevermind. I have fixed the article. -- JTHolla! 00:25, 9 April 2008 (UTC)

Press releases as sources[edit]

The following content should be removed until it can be sourced according to WP:RS. Quoting press releases does not meet the guidelines for WP:V and WP:N and winning an unknown, non-notable award from an non-notable industry conference is not notable unless it generates legitimate, objective, independent reporting.

"In 2007, Simon reported over $500 million was spent on the cards[4], which the company said made it the largest Visa bank-issued gift card program in the world[5]. The Mills Landmarks have newer Simon Gift Cards branded by Discover Card.

In 2007, Simon's program was given the "Industry Achievement Award" at the 2007 Prepaid Card Expo in Las Vegas, Nevada. In 2008, it was awarded "Best in Category" in the "Retail Gift Card Program" category.[6]"

This isn't worth going into an edit war over, especially when you're arguing about keeping chunks of copy that describe in great detail the colors and wavy designs of each card. Flowanda | Talk 21:50, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

There's also a difference between "published" by and "distributed" by -- the Yahoo page is clearly just distributing the contents press release, not publishing it after verifying the facts.

Proving notability (which is policy) and verifiability (which is policy) is the burden of the editor adding the content not the editor removing it. Flowanda | Talk 21:54, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

Which is why I provided a source. I must of missed in that quoted text where it talks about wavy colors and designs. The information you removed is sales information that can only be verified by Simon itself. If you have a better source, add it. If not, the source provided meets Wiki's policy, so it will stay. Thanks! -- JTHolla! 22:15, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
Also, I fail to see the point of the Advert tag in that section. I neither know too many advertisements that include negative points in them, nor how you can expect to report accurate facts that don't sound like an advertisement if they're positive. -- JTHolla! 22:18, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
A sales department is going to be understandably biased in the way it collects, presents and promotes its information...its job is to sell, not inform. So, if the only source of the information is the company itself, shouldn't that raise huge red flags that this information is POV and unreliable? It's unbelievable that you think WP:RS should only be followed whenever it doesn't get in your way. This company is making big claims about itself, and a big claims needs big sources, not press releases.
And this whole thing started when you protected unsourced, poorly written content, making other editors do the work of sourcing and removing the nonsense:
"Simon is also known for its Visa Simon Gift Cards which are sold at most malls in a newer wavy blue, turquoise, and white design. Some malls also have designs for colleges, like Purdue; NBA teams for Texas, or upscale designs for King of Prussia Mall, Stanford Shopping Center, and The Forum Shops at Caesars. Chelsea Premium Outlet Centers have an orange card. In 2006, over $560 million were spent on the cards making it the largest prepaid card in the United States. The Mills Landmarks have newer Simon Gift Cards branded by Discover Card. However, some states have sued the Gift Cards due to its confusing rules. In all Connecticut malls, Simon or not, gift cards are sold in malls only, unlike online or phone as other choices. In winter 2006, some markets were shown commercials containing people having the wrong kinds of gifts, like a man with a Speedo. Then were given the Simon Cards with happy remarks. The theme song of the gift cards is "You Can't Always Get What You Want" from the Rolling Stones. From Fall 2006-Summer 2008, Pink ribbon gift cards were sold at select Simon malls in which one dollar from every card purchased goes to Susan B. Komen for the Cure."
I suggest that if you want to keep information that can only be sourced to a company's sales figures or a non-notable industry vanity award that you begin looking for the independent verification of its facts rather than continue to shove the responsibility off on other editors. Flowanda | Talk 23:42, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
Press releases do not meet the criteria for WP:RS -- are you getting this from another policy or guideline I'm not aware of? Flowanda | Talk 23:47, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
Sales figures are very important information, and information that should be included. Sales figures aren't going to be given by anyone other than the company itself. But I guess if the fact that giving inflated sales figures on a publicly traded company is major illegal, we'll just have to agree to disagree. -- JTHolla! 01:13, 16 April 2008 (UTC)
No, it does not. It means that if you want to keep that information in the article you either need to better source the info or defend your arguments and sources using actual Wikipedia guidelines or policies in order to gain consensus. Where exactly do you find that Wikipedia articles can and are supposed to quote corporate information as fact with no other verification? Flowanda | Talk 10:47, 16 April 2008 (UTC)
Really, this is the dumbest arguement in the history of the internet. Sales figures can not be verified by anyone other than the company itself. Whether it's from the Wall Street Journal, Forbes, Fox Business, or your source of choice, every single one of those sources is going to get their information from the company. -- JTHolla! 11:09, 16 April 2008 (UTC)

Yep. Sure is. Enjoy. Flowanda | Talk 06:58, 17 April 2008 (UTC)

Pier Park[edit]

I have been considering creating a page for Pier Park, which is one of Simon's "signature" properties and a major commercial presence in its location (Panama City Beach, Florida.) However, while some individual commercial real estate developments have their own pages, I am uncertain as to whether or not Pier Park warrants this. Any suggestions would be welcomed -- the real question is whether it should have its own page, or be added to the existing page on Panama City Beach. Frank Mottley (talk) 16:01, 22 January 2011 (UTC)

Gift Card Section Removed[edit]

I removed the 5-paragraph section on gift cards. Gift cards are very, very common. I don't see how that is unique to Simon Properties. --Bruce Hall (talk) 01:39, 30 May 2011 (UTC)

Toronto Premium Outlets[edit]

Split - As of August 1, 2013, Toronto Premium Outlets is the first upscale centre of its kind in Canada. --Jax 0677 (talk) 17:13, 19 August 2013 (UTC)

Premium Outlets Montreal[edit]

Split - Premium Outlets Montreal will be the second upscale centre of its kind in Canada. --Jax 0677 (talk) 18:07, 21 October 2013 (UTC)