Talk:The Firesign Theatre

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Annalee and Oona Austin[edit]

Are "Anna-lee Austin" and Oona (Elliot) Austin the same person, or two different women? Annalee is credited on the 1970 (Dwarf), 1971 (Bozos), and 1972 (Dear Friends and Not Insane) albums, while Oona starts showing up on the credits in 1973 (How Time Flys and Roller Maidens). Austin's obituary says he married Oona in 1971, which seems to imply they're the same person. There are photos on the web labled as each, but I can't really tell if they're the same person or not. Does anyone know how to find a reliable source to verify which is the case? JustinTime55 (talk) 19:32, 6 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Actually, a careful check of the liner notes for Bozos shows both Annalee and Oona listed, implying they are two different people? (Annlee is credited as "Mickey", and keyboard stylings by "Annalee of Mixville". Oona is buried in the list of performers. This is her first appearance, and she doesn't show up again until Roller Maidens. JustinTime55 (talk) 15:26, 20 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]

B article criteria[edit]

The article is mostly complete and without major problems, but requires some further work to reach good article standards.

More detailed criteria:

  1. The article is suitably referenced, with inline citations. It has reliable sources, and any important or controversial material which is likely to be challenged is cited.
  2. The article reasonably covers the topic, and does not contain obvious omissions or inaccuracies. It contains a large proportion of the material necessary for an A-Class article, although some sections may need expansion, and some less important topics may be missing.
  3. The article has a defined structure. Content should be organized into groups of related material, including a lead section and all the sections that can reasonably be included in an article of its kind.
  4. The article is reasonably well-written. The prose contains no major grammatical errors and flows sensibly, but it does not need to be "brilliant". The Manual of Style does not need to be followed rigorously.
  5. The article contains supporting materials where appropriate. Illustrations are encouraged, though not required. Diagrams and an infobox etc. should be included where they are relevant and useful to the content.
  6. The article presents its content in an appropriately understandable way. It is written with as broad an audience in mind as possible. Although Wikipedia is more than just a general encyclopedia, the article should not assume unnecessary technical background and technical terms should be explained or avoided where possible. — Preceding unsigned comment added by JustinTime55 (talk • contribs) 15:50, 22 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Problematic addition by an IP user[edit]

Moving @24.49.204.10:'s recent addition here for discussion:

Bill McIntyre's first wife actress Barbara Reid had been at Yale Drama School with proctor and Bergman. McIntyre had trained as an actor under the teaching of former American Education Theater Director Rubin Plaskoff who spent some time working with the Moscow Art Theater. Plaskoff decided to start a theater department at LA Harbor College and McIntyre jumped aboard as an aspiring actor and performed in multiple Absurdest classic plays before making the leap to Hollywood where he immediately was drawn to producing. Though he optioned properties for films and produced shows for KCET TV the PBS Station he found the media denial about of the Vet Nam war psychotic to the point of madness. Upon hearing the test pressing of Waiting For The Electrician he told proctor it was the finest theater he’d encountered since College and wanted to work with the group. This lead to his long association with the Firesign Theater from 1967 to 2012 when the produced the Re-Dux of Radio Free Oz with Peter Bergman. Wanting to produce a syndication series with the Firesign pitched KPFK the station where it all started on the weekly series which they jumped at. ”I had to find station they wouldn’t get fired off of like they got fired off KRLA and KMET. And it worked like a charm. I got 12 wonderful masters of Dear Friends and then Let’s Eat which were syndicated to over a hundred college and commercial FM stations.” McIntyre also produced Martian Space Party, which was a political convention for the National Surrealist Light People’s Party to nominate George Papoon for President because he was NOT INSANE. McIntyre has chronicled this in his book Warrior Clowns due out in the fall of 2018. In it he also shares all the gigs he set up for the Firesign, TV shows mainly, that went south because the Firesign’s on-camera comedy was just to real and threatening to Hollywood types like Screen Gems and Lowman and Barkley who were told CBS would not allow the show to air as it was maybe too “Subversive”? “There is a classic batch of these Firesign stories in the book that show ya just how phony and really right wing all these supposedly oh so liberal stations and studios were. And all the Firesign had to do was sell-out a tad to a safer more commercial comedy style and they'd have been as big at Saturday Night Live. But there wasn't an inch of sell-out in any of them.”

Several things are wrong with this according to Wikipedia policy and guidelines:

  • The emphasis placed on Bill McIntyre is out of WP:PROPORTION to the other Firesign producers. There is also no need to single out McIntyre in the article's introduction.
  • This is entirely unverified by WP:reliable sources. Wikipedia only contains previously published information.
  • Wikipedia is not about you (or one of your friends): it sounds like you're trying to promote McIntyre, or else that you are him, trying to promote yourself.
  • I would even say you are going so far as to stretch our WP:NOTABILITY guideline in regard to McIntyre.
  • There are quotes (uncited), with absolutely no mention of who is supposed to be speaking. We do not talk in articles here.
  • The grammar and spelling are very bad.
  • McIntyre's wife is way out of scope. This is poor writing; she is being used only to establish a connection between McIntyre and Proctor and Bergman, but her mention could confuse the reader into thinking she's an "associate Firesign".
  • This does not make McIntyre an "associate Firesign". The intent is to show persons who performed with them on several occasions, which pretty much limits it to Annalee Austin, Oona Austin, and Tiny Ossman. Notice the parallel passage in Monty Python#Associate Pythons. The intent is not to include their producers or other technical support staff.

Please do not put this back in unless you can tell us what reliable published sources you have which you can cite. JustinTime55 (talk) 17:55, 22 May 2018 (UTC) JustinTime55 (talk) 18:37, 22 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Red links[edit]

According to the WP:REDLINK guideline, red links in an article are appropriate when the topics are notable. The appropriate action in this case is to write the articles, not to remove the links (or link them to external sources) unless you can dispute notability. The following Firesign Theatre works (mostly albums) are notable and should have articles:

Write the Wikipedia instead of tearing down. JustinTime55 (talk) 13:56, 15 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Ralph Spoilsport ?[edit]

"Phil led into the final raga with the best Ralph Williams take-off ever."

  • Nat Freedland Wailing Los Angeles Free Press, Nov. 3, 1967

"Phil's got the perfect Ralph Williams Mantra, you know, and he spends a good deal of time in the bathroom because of it." Ralph became Ralph Spoilsport..

I'm working on a sandbox list of their notable, recurring characters, of which Spoilsport is surely one. This should probably go there: User:JustinTime55/sandbox/List of Firesign Theatre characters. And then when this list is ready to go online, we can link it here in WP:summary style. JustinTime55 (talk) 13:59, 16 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]
BTW, what the hell is a "raga"? JustinTime55 (talk) 14:00, 16 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]
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