Talk:The Greek

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ouzo, not vodka[edit]

The clear liquor that the Greek drinks is ouzo, not vodka. I believe there is at least one scene where you can see the bottle clearly labeled. It was in the empty hotel room that the police enter just after the Greek and Vondas left for the airport.

Koutris Corrupt?[edit]

"He manages to avoid prosecution because a corrupt FBI agent named Koutris tips him off if anybody gets too close."

I'm not sure how to reword this, but my understanding was that Koutris was not corrupt, but using the Greek as an informant on national security matters in exchange for information that kept him out of prison (and therefore useful) Quadparty 21:12, 25 March 2007 (UTC)

The help the Greek gave Koutris in Stray Rounds had nothing to do with anti-terrorism. The Greek was having trouble with a columbian rival so he set up the rival for a bust, and gave the bust to his friend. Anti-terrorist specialists don't chase drug smugglers, indicating that the two were friends long before Koutris' job was national security. When Frank agreed to testify against the Greek, Koutris tiped off the Greek, knowing that it would lead to Frank's murder. Koutris knowingly made himself an accomplice to murder of a witness. No legitimate federal agent would ever do that. From what was shown, Koutris is extremely corrupt.JeffStickney 22:39, 25 March 2007 (UTC)
The news articles about the bust referred (cynically) to Columbian "narco-terrorists". "Extreme corruption" also suggests that, when, in the third season, Fitz is being extra helpful to Jimmy because of the way the FBI stuffed up that Koutris would have been dealt to by the FBI as corrupt (because they knew who he was, etc.). Homeland security people within the FBI basically turned a blind eye to the Greek's drug-running because he was useful on national security (even though the particular bust we see had nothing to do with national security - hence the reference to "narco-terrorism"). —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Quadparty (talkcontribs) 08:32, 26 March 2007 (UTC).


Who is the nimrod that keeps on deleting my label of the Greek as a "fictional murderer"? We saw him kill not one but two people in the Wire. He killed the sailor in the beginning of the season then he killed Frank Sabotka near the end of the series. If that is not enough, it is revealed that he has killed dozens of people that are a threat to his organization as seen when McNulty discovered tons of bodies with their heads and heads cut off. Read the profile. It's there.

Please refrain from personal attacks. Spiros killed Sam (the sailer who murdered the girls) and we don't see who killed Sobotka on screen. The Greek is a reprehensible criminal but on screen he is not an actual murderer so the category is not appropriate.--Opark 77 (talk) 09:51, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
Actually, under Maryland law the Greek is a murderer, as are Avon, Stringer and Prop Joe. They may not be triggermen, but in the case of murder-for-hire, if you order the hit you are a murderer, and can receive the death penalty. "Under Maryland law, except in murder-for-hire cases, only those individuals found guilty of first degree murder as a principal in the first degree may be sentenced to death." [1]"Maryland's "murder for hire" aggravating circumstance reads as follows: "The defendant engaged or employed another person to commit the murder and the murder was committed pursuant to an agreement or contract for remuneration or the promise of remuneration." [2] It may take less to be convicted of murder. The quotes are death penalty circumstances. JeffStickney (talk) 13:12, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
Thats interesting thank you Jeff. Refresh my memory - who did Proposition Joe have murdered?--Opark 77 (talk) 16:49, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
The New York drug dealers ("Wal Mart") who were trying to set up shop in Baltimore. That may be a little too indirect though, because the co-op went through Joe to hire Marlo to hire Chris and Snoop.JeffStickney (talk) 16:55, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
I wonder how easy it is to prove this in criminal organizations rather than more straightforward murder for hire cases too. Stringer organizing the murder of D'Angelo seems more like murder for hire than say The Greek ordering the death of Sam and not directly rewarding his people for carrying it out.--Opark 77 (talk) 17:28, 5 February 2008 (UTC)

If we follow your reasoning to its conclusion, it would say that Hitler is not a mass murderer. Hitler never directly ran up and shot someone. Nevertheless, he ORDERED the Holocaust. You willing to go that far, Opark? User talk:Lecreuset87

Hitler was responsible for genocide. That does not equate to the leader of a criminal organization ordering several murders and is far from a logical step. Go ahead and re-add the category; I have no objection now that Jeff has made a rational clarification. Personally while I see The Greek as morally reprehensible and deserving of severe punishment for his crimes I don't think of him as a murderer - that said I'm willing to accept that my opinion is not in line with consensus and let the edit go ahead.--Opark 77 (talk) 23:38, 6 February 2008 (UTC)

Not of Greek Origin?[edit]

"Despite his moniker, he reveals that he is not of Greek origins."

Am I alone in thinking The Greek was being facetious when he made the remark that he was not Greek? I thought is was a joking reference to his ability to mask his identity, and since he was about to leave the country with a false passport, said passport was no doubt not Greek, hence the remark. My take. . . .Astrobopper (talk) 21:31, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

It's certain that it was not meant in jest. VanTucky 21:36, 5 June 2008 (UTC)
It is possible that it was a deliberate lie, after all the man is a criminal. I think he is almost certainly from the Balkans.--MacRusgail (talk) 21:19, 22 February 2009 (UTC)
Seems obvious that his "true" nationality is a form of McGuffin. Not sure how to work this into the article without using speculative language or other weasel words. Ellsworth (talk) 22:57, 4 April 2009 (UTC)
I decided to be bold and re-do the bit in the header about "not of Greek origins". Ellsworth (talk) 23:01, 4 April 2009 (UTC)
The quote from the show is "Besides, I'm not even Greek." That's not facetious. Steven Walling (talk) 23:03, 4 April 2009 (UTC)
I'm not so sure. The line preceding that one is Spiros saying "my name is not my name." Either way, does anyone think that Pontic Greek sentence is too much original research? —Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 07:30, 11 June 2009 (UTC)
I've heard that HBO was threatened by a team of Greek lawyers of being sued for defamation over the shows portrayal of Greeks-in-America (much like Oliver Stone toned down Alexander the Greats supposed homosexuality in the film ALEXANDER after being threatened by a group of Greek lawyers). The line "Besides, I'm not even Greek" was the compromise. They are of Greek origin and "The Greek" was being facetious (deliberately to make the characters ethnicity ambiguous). Consider that Greek-American George Pelecanos (famous crime-novel writer) was a writer on The Wire's second season (the most prominent season for the Greeks story). Also, the Turk they killed was speaking Greek, not Turkish. It further does not make sense that the Greeks would act Greek when alone (calling people "malakas" etc.). Why did they ship those stolen cars to Greece? Why when they ran did they have Greek passports? (it only makes sense that if being "Greek" was their cover that they would not leave the U.S. under a Greek passport with the FBI/cops hot on their tail!). I'm sure many others could find contradictions in thinking their being Greek was a cover, anyway.--Nikoz78 (talk) 14:35, 26 October 2009 (UTC)

'It's all Greek to me,' says Wire writer

George Pelecanos , the veteran crime writer who is celebrated for his Emmy nominated collaboration with David Simon in writing and producing the brilliant HBO crime series, 'The Wire', says he reckoned the reason why the second series is entirely focused around a dockland criminal ring of Greek origin in Baltimore is because the show's creator, Simon, used it as a way of enticing Pelcanos – himself of Greek original – to work on the show. He told me: "He called me up and he said 'I need you, lots of the characters speak Greek. But in the last episode, (the main criminal kingpin called) 'the Greek' admits he's not even Greek. David wrote the last episode and it came as a surprise to me. I wouldn't say he lied to me at the start but he's a good salesman." The writer, is currently visiting England to speak about his latest of 15 books, called 'The Way Home', about a wayward teenager, at the Harrogate Crime Festival. [3]--Nikoz78 (talk) 14:52, 26 October 2009 (UTC)

The fact that he states he is not Greek, I think is is in a sence pointing out that he ain't coming from Greece. There are several things that make me think he is Pontic Greek: He is is in touch with Russians He is in touch with Turks (or Greek speaking Turks) He drinks not only Ouzo but vodka. Stelios Kazantzidis singing & Chrisanthopoulos music (both Pontics) are present in music courtains.-Periptero (talk) 19:26, 25 August 2010 (UTC)

I remember reading somewhere, TV Tropes most likely, a plausible theory that he was a Cypriot given Greek Cypriots are culturally Greek - and it seems obvious 'The Greek' is culturally Greek - but are technically 'not Greek' in so far as they are citizens of Cyprus, not of Greece the country. Though his being a Pontic Greek would equally satisfy these points as well. Given it's likely the creators didn't actually decide on an official explanation themselves, it seems more reasonable to interpret him as a Cypriot given (as far as I understand) Pontic Greek sounds recognizably different from standard Greek (less so Cypriot Greek) and the actor never played him that way (given his not being Greek was a throwaway line in one of the final episodes of the season. Also consider Gleikas calling Ziggy 'malaka' which, apparently (so Wikipedia tells me), is more commonly an insult amongst Cypriots than Greeks. —Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 19:50, 1 October 2010 (UTC)
obviously, his remark is tongue in cheek. now he may indeed be cypriot, or pontic greek but he is surely greek. he speaks greek when noone but his closest aides are around, he drinks ouzo, and iirc they text message in greek letters. the line preceeding "i am not even greek" is "my name is not my name" - both characters smirk and are about to go into hiding. if people take this statement at face value, they have not been paying attention. (talk) 02:00, 24 November 2011 (UTC)