Talk:Ukrainian language

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Former good article nominee Ukrainian language was a good articles nominee, but did not meet the good article criteria at the time. There are suggestions below for improving the article. Once these issues have been addressed, the article can be renominated. Editors may also seek a reassessment of the decision if they believe there was a mistake.
May 10, 2006 Good article nominee Not listed
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visible attempts to colonize Ukraine by the Polish nobility ?[edit]

House of Wiśniowiecki, House of Sapieha, House of Tyszkiewicz - Ruthenian, Radziwiłł - Lithuanian.
The colonization included inviting pesants (mostly from overpopulated Poland) to settle in Ukraine, so some Polish peasants had Ruthenian lords, the peasants Ukrainized and the lords Polonized. These are not exactly attempts to colonize Ukraine by the Polish nobility. Xx234 (talk) 09:32, 20 November 2014 (UTC)

repeat: this is not a sentence[edit]

Under (Linguistic development of the Ukrainian language): " Another point of view developed during the 19th and 20th centuries by linguists of Imperial Russia and the Soviet Union. " - missing a verb or something ... HammerFilmFan (talk) 20:26, 4 January 2015 (UTC)

"developed" is a verb. Bataaf van Oranje (Prinsgezinde) (talk) 23:22, 12 June 2016 (UTC)

Using "rynok" and "obitsiaty" as examples for imported Ukrainian words[edit]

I am not sure, how good these examples are. While the other words from German seem to be specific to Ukrainian, "rynok" is equally present in Russian and Belorussian. The wording still might be ok, as I'm not sure, when and how fast the word spread and might be first present in the Ukrainian area and only later in what is today's Russia. (https://uk.wiktionary.org/wiki/%D1%80%D0%B8%D0%BD%D0%BE%D0%BA, https://ru.wiktionary.org/wiki/%D1%80%D1%8B%D0%BD%D0%BE%D0%BA, https://ru.wiktionary.org/wiki/%D1%80%D1%8B%D0%BD%D0%B0%D0%BA) "Obitsiaty" on the other hand seems to be a wrong example of import from Polish. This seems to be a word common to ALL Slavic languages (https://ru.wiktionary.org/wiki/%D0%BE%D0%B1%D0%B5%D1%89%D0%B0%D1%82%D1%8C) including old Church Slavonic (https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/%D0%BE%D0%B1%D0%B5%D1%82) and having the origin in Proto-Slavic (https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/%D0%B2%D1%A3%D1%82%D1%8A#Old_Church_Slavonic, https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Appendix:Proto-Slavic/v%C4%9Bt%D1%8A) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.156.136.9 (talk) 15:08, 11 March 2015 (UTC)

    The same with word "zawżdy" that is close to czech and slovak language (Same origin?). So maybe better to remove this part or to find better examples.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 194.44.30.18 (talk) 10:33, 19 September 2015 (UTC) 
  • Vasmer said that old east slavic forms are something like this: "wisegda" and "obechati" or "obeshtati". If word is slavic origin it's not mean "non-importable".

State languages of Russia[edit]

State languages of Russia? WTF? This page about Ukraine or Russia?Salain (talk) 09:39, 11 June 2015 (UTC)

External links modified[edit]

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just added archive links to 2 external links on Ukrainian language. Please take a moment to review my edit. If necessary, add {{cbignore}} after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add {{nobots|deny=InternetArchiveBot}} to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:

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YesY Archived sources have been checked to be working

Cheers. —cyberbot IITalk to my owner:Online 06:21, 28 August 2015 (UTC)

Another theory? What's the first theory?[edit]

The "Theories concerning the development of the Ukrainian language" section begins "Another point of view developed during the 19th and 20th centuries .... Like the notable Lomonosov, they assumed .... But unlike Lomonosov's hypothesis, ...." Before this article moves on to another point of view, shouldn't it share with us at least a first point of view? Presumably this is Lomonosov's, but Wikipedia seems to have assumed that the reader already knows all about that. Largoplazo (talk) 21:58, 8 May 2016 (UTC)

It is possible it was Russocentric and was sloppily deleted by Ukra nationalists. Try looking in previous versions of article history. - üser:Altenmann >t
I found it, a single edit almost a year and a half ago, with no edit summary. Especially given that the last chunk of material was sourced, I've restored the entire cut. Largoplazo (talk) 23:09, 8 May 2016 (UTC)
Sorry? Which chunk was sourced? None of it was sourced, nor is any of it sourced now. Thanks for tagging the article for citations, Altenmann. It's really been through the edit wars from both sides. --Iryna Harpy (talk) 23:38, 8 May 2016 (UTC)
The last chunk that I restored is sourced. It's currently the final paragraph in the section. Largoplazo (talk) 23:51, 8 May 2016 (UTC)
That's interesting. Considering that you were complaining about content not making sense, you reinstated an unsourced WP:WEASEL statement here so that, in cahoots with the adjoining paragraph, it reads as:
"... and, although it is gaining a number of supporters among Ukrainian academics, it is not seriously regarded outside Ukraine.

Outside Ukraine, however, theories that distance Ukrainian from East Slavic have found few followers among international scholars and most academics continue to place Ukrainian firmly within the East Slavic group, descended from Proto-East Slavic, with close ties to Belarusian and Russian."
Do you have a POV to push, or are you just of the conviction that Ukrainians only come in one flavour: i.e., fascist nationalists. Do you actually have a reliable source suggesting that Right Sector and the rest of the majority of the lunatic right ethnic group known as 'Ukrainians' are pushing WP:FRINGE philology while thwacking non-Ukrainians over the head with swastikas? I've removed the offending 'inadvertently restored remnant' as being good faith, but suggest that it's best to keep your POV to yourself and focus on improving content over and above restoring propaganda. --Iryna Harpy (talk) 01:11, 9 May 2016 (UTC)
I don't have any kind of agenda to push. Why don't you go read WP:AGF? I mean, I don't even know what would distinguish a Russian point of view from a Ukrainian point of view in this regard. I came to look at the article because something else I was looking at led me to wonder about the development of Ukrainian. I saw immediately that something was amiss—not because of any political point of view of mine, but because you don't start a discussion with "another thing" when there hasn't been a first thing. I found where the missing piece was, I saw that it and other paragraphs had been blanked by an IP user who gave no reason for it, and, as I have done for years in many cases where someone has blanked content for no apparent reason, I restored it. It's that simple. There's nothing nefarious about it. OK? So go find somebody else to attack. Largoplazo (talk) 02:03, 9 May 2016 (UTC)
My apologies if this was AGF (I did note that I removed the weasel section based on AGF). I just find myself wondering how carefully content is restored by editors when they overlook something so glaringly amiss. Psychologically, I find it nigh on impossible to account for how one can overlook such a blatant conflict of attitudes when restoring derogatory content namely because I'm so unbelievably perfect that I've never made an error in judgement in my jaw-droppingly brilliant life...
That said, yes I've just been on a break and have come back to the usual Russophobic, anti-Ukrainian, anti-Polish, anti-anti-anti-anti and have let it get to me by drawing you into my own loopy hysteria. Whack me with a whale. My attitude was truly bad form and a do deserve a damned good squishing just to remind me that being a diva is a really, really bad thing. Cheers, Largoplazo for the dressing down. Happy editing, and do flick me on the nose should you find me jumping up and down like a mean-spirited grump again! --Iryna Harpy (talk) 06:17, 9 May 2016 (UTC)
Perhaps one already needs to be embroiled in the dispute to be aware of any association that any of the theories covered by the text I restored has with any offensive agenda. On the face of it, all I see is "Ukrainian diverged in century X from this language" versus "Ukrainian diverged in century Y from that language". Reading all this academically rather than nationalistically (I'm not even any kind of Slav), it amazes me that some people stake how wonderful they feel about themselves and their people to the answer to questions like this!
I appreciate your reply and the laugh you gave me, thank you! Largoplazo (talk) 10:49, 9 May 2016 (UTC)
It appears that I've officially turned my back on Marxism and turned into a ranting, jingoistic fruitcake. Bizarre. A day later and I have no idea of where that came from. I've only just given up smoking (as in less than 3 weeks ago), so I'm working on the hypothesis that not smoking can lead to questionable political inclinations. --Iryna Harpy (talk) 22:34, 9 May 2016 (UTC)