Talk:Mets Shen, Martakert

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Requested move 21 December 2020[edit]

The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

No consensus to move. After much-extended time for discussion, there is no consensus for a move at this time. BD2412 T 17:10, 2 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Ulu Qarabəy → Mets Shen, Martakert – Move to "Mets Shen, Martakert" per WP:AT/WP:COMMONNAME:

Results from Google: Mets Shen: 25,500 Ulu Qarabəy: 461 Ulu Garabey: 162

Results from Google Scholar: Mets Shen: 2 Ulu Qarabəy: 0 Ulu Garabey: 0

The ", Martakert" disambiguation tag is based on the Soviet-era Mardakert District (NKAO), with a correction of the transliteration to correspond to the town of "Martakert" which the district was named after.
AntonSamuel (talk) 14:44, 21 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Clarification: Utilizing search results from Google should be done with caution, but is acceptable per WP:NCGN:

Regarding multiple local names: "Simple Google tests are acceptable to settle the matter, despite their problems; one solution is to follow English usage where it can be determined, and to adopt the name used by the linguistic majority where English usage is indecisive."

As this matter concerns a larger issue that is a matter of contention - an RfC for a naming convention for Nagorno-Karabakh may be needed if consensus cannot be achieved, as has been suggested before, however I hope the admin that closes this discussion will look carefully at all the arguments that have been made and take WP:VOTE into consideration.

AntonSamuel (talk) 14:32, 25 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose. Using divisions of abolished autonomous oblast that hasn't existed since 1991 is absurd. The village is internationally recognised as being part of Tartar District of Azerbaijan, therefore its name should either be kept or renamed to Mets Shen, Tartar to fit WP:CONSISTENT, as almost every single article about villages in the former Martakert District, that are now in Tartar District. — CuriousGolden (T·C) 15:10, 21 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Taking into account that Nagorno-Karabakh is a long-disputed region, the Soviet administrative divisions that existed before the First Nagorno-Karabakh War are useful and suitable per WP:NPOV. AntonSamuel (talk) 15:23, 21 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

It being disputed does not mean that we're supposed to use divisions that haven't been used by any single organization or country since its abolishment in 1991. Not even Artsakh uses NKAO borders for districts. WP:NPOV doesn't advocate for us to use historical districts for modern villages. — CuriousGolden (T·C) 15:33, 21 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

The Administrative divisions of the Republic of Artsakh pretty much completely follow the outline of the Soviet districts. AntonSamuel (talk) 15:38, 21 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Really? Do I need to mention the fact that it splits up Agdam District between the 3 neighbouring former NKAO provinces and gives countless bits of lands from other districts to the new Artsakh provinces? Even if were aligned, then that'd be breaking WP:NPOV since we'd be using districts of an internationally unrecognised breakaway republic. — CuriousGolden (T·C) 15:41, 21 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Support - per my belief that town names should be whatever the 1988 majority ethnic group prefers. --RaffiKojian (talk) 18:13, 21 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Strongly oppose. Gross misrepresentation of the search results. "Mets Shen" turns up strikingly more frequently because it is a name born by more than one settlement in Karabakh, including being the Armenian name of Böyük Qaladərəsi, an unrelated vilage, which recently made the news. Parishan (talk) 06:59, 25 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Even with the search query Mets Shen Martakert, there still are significantly more results (4,180). Maidyouneed (talk) 06:01, 28 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose. per others; and the fact that usage of an administrative division that is no longer in effect since the 1991 is not constructive to say thr least. --► Sincerely: Sola Virum 16:54, 1 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose. Since it is officially part of Terter district, and internationally recognized as part of Azerbaijan, the official Azerbaijani name should be used. Grandmaster 22:59, 2 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose This name was given by Azerbaijani Government, and this village is located in Republic of Azerbaijan. EljanM (TALK) 17:45, 13 January 2021

Oppose As per others Carthago814 (talk) 8:11, 14 January 2021 (UTC)

Support We should be using the common name. The region still is de facto within Artsakh. Maidyouneed (talk) 06:01, 28 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.