Talk:Vicente Yáñez Pinzón
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It should be noticed that the acknowledge discoverer of Brazil is the portuguese Pedro Álvares Cabral, in 1500. IAmaro — Preceding unsigned comment added by 22.214.171.124 (talk) 18:39, 26 January 2014 (UTC)
Vicent Yáñez Pinzón DID NOT DISCOVERED BRAZIL
Please reffer to the discussion Talk:Brazil to discuss who discovered/landed on Brazil for the first time.
- Pinnecco, the article says he was the first European to land in Brazil, not the first person to discover Brazil, and now says he sighted the river, not discovered it. Does that help? Moriori 22:28, Sep 22, 2004 (UTC)
- Moriori, I am sorry but it doesn't help. The user edited the page about the History of Brazil. To talk about the first people to "sight" the Amazon River, please edit the article Amazon River -- Pinnecco 22:56, Sep 22, 2004 (CMT)
- Pinnecco, this article doesn't say he was first to sight the river. But, if you think it a little ambiguous, how about we change it to read "he became the first European to see the Amazon river, on January 26, 1500". It's repetitious of the first sentence unfortunately, but......Moriori 23:17, Sep 22, 2004 (UTC)
- Moriori, for the last time, whoever saw the river first is not the issue. Is the claim that he was the first one to LAND ON BRAZIL (see history) that is an issue, but the fact that the user edited the page about the History of Brazil and added Pinzón as the discover (along with Cabral) is the issue. "It's repetitious of my first sentence unfortunately, but......"
- Pinzón where not on Brazilian territory at the time. However, Brazillian territory expanded with time. Please read Brazil:Talk as mentioned above. Pinnecco 07:10, Sep 23, 2004 (UTC).
Judging by the timing of the above, the discussion referred to was Talk:Brazil/Archive 1#Vicent Yáñez Pinzón DID NOT DISCOVER BRAZIL.
FWIW the Britannica 11th Edition says he was "the first [European] to cross the line [the Equator] in the Atlantic", so the
The page about him at cervantesvirtual (not rock-solid, but usually good, and it has a bibliography if someone wants to follow up) says:
... partió de Palos a comienzos de diciembre de 1499, con los pilotos Juan Quintero y Juan de Umbría, que habían navegado con Colón. Desde Cabo Verde hicieron rumbo al SO.; el 20 ó 26 de enero de 1500 descubrieron tierra a 8º S., en las cercanías del cabo de San Agustín, punta extrema del Brasil hacia el E., al que llamaron de Santa María de la Consolación, tomando Pinzón posesión de este país. Costearon hacia el NO. y descubrió un inmenso río, el Marañón, más tarde llamado Amazonas aunque otros autores (Pompeu Sobrino) opinan que no podía ser más que el Orinoco. ... Pinzón, con toda seguridad, había descubierto tierra brasileña meses antes de que lo hiciera el portugués Alvares Cabral, en abril de 1500.
"con toda seguridad" is hardly hedging the matter, whatever Portuguese/Brazilian patriots may prefer to think. Unless this date is wrong, the matter seems pretty clear. - Jmabel | Talk 07:41, 16 January 2010 (UTC)
Also, I couldn't get hold of a copy, but there is apparently a Portuguese-language scholarly paper asserting the same:
- Clemens Brandenburger, "O descobrimento do Brasil por Vicente Yáñez Pinzón", Annaes de imprense periodico brazileira, v. 175 [i.e. 121], p. -167.
This is all a bunch of nonsense -- where are the sources?
So, first the article said that Vicente Pinzón disembarked on the Amazon River (driven by a storm), now the last edit article said that he was in Pernambuco (not explaining how he got there) and then he went to the Amazon River. I'm sorry but this is all unfounded. As if the distance between Pernambuco and the Amazon River was the same distance from my home and our local corner-shop.
I want to see CREDIBLE sources. This is all a bunch of nonsense probably created by some Galician man in a tapas bar back in the 16 century. But please don't take only my word for it. I will draw the attention of other native Brazilian writters to this article so then can give their input about this. --Pinnecco 11:09, 15 July 2005 (UTC)
tambem acho pouco sentido alguem que foi mapear a costa norte da reentrancia ao redor das ilhas a tierra firme o mainland tenha ido tão abaixo se tivesse ido tão abaixo teria se interessado em mapear algo da costa leste mais abaixo um pouco o que não foi o caso o foco sempre foi o norte — Preceding unsigned comment added by 126.96.36.199 (talk) 06:40, 14 February 2016 (UTC)
According the wikipedia em língua portuguesa
Vicente Yanéz Pinzón, navegador espanhol, partiu de Palos de la Frontera, Espanha em 19 de novembro de 1499. Em Janeiro de 1500 desembarcou no Brasil no local atualmente chamado Praia do Paraíso, Cabo de Santo Agostinho, Pernambuco. O local foi batizado por Pinzon como Cabo de Santa Maria de la Consolación. Pinzón seguiu sua viagem e em fevereiro de 1500 chegou à foz do Rio Amazonas, que batizou como Mar Dulce. A Viagem de Pinzón e sua chegada ao Brasil não constam da maior parte dos registros oficiais de história do Brasil pois pelo tratado de Tordesilhas as terras descobertas por Pinzón pertenciam, de fato, a Portugal.
Mas existe grande probabilidade de que mesmo a esquadra de Pinzón não seria a primeira expedição européia a desembarcar em terras brasileiras. Já em 1325 circulavam em Portugal lendas e mapas sobre uma terra rica em pau-brasil situada além mar. Na disputa com a Espanha por novas terras, os portugueses realizam expedições sigilosas chamadas "de arcano". Assim há relatos de que João Coelho da Porta da Cruz e Duarte Pacheco Pereira teriam estado no Brasil respectivamente em 1493 e 1498.
Diogo de Lepe, navegador espanhol, teria atingido a costa brasileira em março de 1500.
Diego de Lepe(Sicilian I think and Spanish service)
--Gimferrer 14:46, 15 September 2005 (UTC)
- And since WHEN this is a credible source? =/
Duarte Pacheco Pereira - 1498
And before Vicente Yañez Pinzón and Diego de Lepe, Duarte Pacheco Pereira wrote in this Book "ESMERALDO SITU ORBIS" his own Discovery of many lands in "Grande Terra firme" in west(Great land in west) in the "West"(New World) in 1498, in a Mission of the King Manuel. So, is no any speculation - He spoke and wrote about that and about longitude and latitude data in American shores that he had explored. Before this Voyage, He (Duarte Pacheco Pereira) had Negociate in Tordesillas in 1494 the Line in west. Duarte Pacheco wrote about the Continent and Islands in west in his voyage of 1498. He wrote about "Brazilian" wood there. He was one of the Principal Man in Tordesillas.
And also the words of João Coelho da Porta da Cruz in 1493 on South American mailand shores according to Estevao Frois`s relate on Antillas in 1516.
nessa epoca tinha muito segredo e propaganda se os tugas tivessem chegado antes não teriam forjado porto seguro pinzon é o mais bem documentado e portanto credível — Preceding unsigned comment added by 188.8.131.52 (talk) 06:42, 14 February 2016 (UTC)
tens razão nossa vontade por espanha anacronica e nosso anti lusitanismo as vezes nos cega claramente os conhecimentos nauticos portugueses do xv no atlantico foram roubados pelos espanhois se até ilhas do meio do atlantico foram descritas é sinal de que o brasil foi descoberto pelos tugas antes dos espanhois chegarem nas ilhas — Preceding unsigned comment added by 184.108.40.206 (talk) 07:03, 14 February 2016 (UTC)
tugas descobriram a America e foi no brasil wow não só java grande pela latitude foi na costa central a leste por isso queriam alcançar aquela latitude especifica mapearam a trindade na latitude do espirito santo a descoberta do mainland pode ter se dado entre ba e es — Preceding unsigned comment added by 220.127.116.11 (talk) 07:08, 14 February 2016 (UTC)
falso ele não necessariamente fez toda viagem de modo pioneiro sintetizou outros mas nas descrições fala latitude equatorial antes noronha etc uns espanhois dizem que foi florida e que ele não comandou mas ele descreve o golfo do mexico e dois mainlands recibos de espionagem espanhola não duvido que antes dele os tugas que estavam no xv na costa inversa tenham ido pro oeste e antes dos espanhois descoberto algo mas até mapas e coisas do livro dele sumiram dirá os documentos secretos dos anteriores que os espanhois se apossaram com espiões — Preceding unsigned comment added by 18.104.22.168 (talk) 07:36, 14 February 2016 (UTC)
There is an extensive article in es-wiki, but it is woefully lacking in citations. If that ever gets better cited, someone can feel free to "ping" my talk page and I'll gladly translated it. In its current state, I don't see a lot of point to that, since it is likely to mean doing it twice. The few citations I come across while researching related topics I'll add both here & in es-wiki. - Jmabel | Talk 00:54, 17 January 2010 (UTC)
On top there is further evidence about Pinzon's life. Please incorporate this article:
Francese Albardaner i Llorens, "Columbus, Corsair, and the Pinzon brothers, Pirates, in the Mediterranean before 1492", in: The Northern Mariner/Le marin du nord, 2011, Vol. 21, No. 3 (July), p. 263-278. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2003:DD:93C8:9E00:5975:4A0B:6750:1CF5 (talk) 08:29, 8 September 2017 (UTC)
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