Talk:Viracocha

Image Used

I have removed the image attached to this article. The image is a drawing of the "Staff God" from "The Gateway of the Sun" at the Bolivian site of Tiwanaku. This image is not the Inca god Viracocha and predates the Inca by several hundred years. It is not related to the Inca at all, although the general concept of this god may have inspired later gods like Viracocha. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.107.43.167 (talk) 14:52, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

Could you address this in the article? That image is used on the Spanish page and is the main result for an image search of Viracocha. If it is indeed an error, it is widespread and needs to be addressed. Thanks. Ando228 (talk) 22:16, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

An additional discrepancy regarding Wiracocha is the existence of a representation. I visited the Wiracocha temples spread all over the Cusco region in company of Peruvian graduate students in Archeology/Anthropology and other disciplines; there were no representations of Wiracocha in these temples. The only common element was an open, unframed, window facing east. All of them had such an opening at the central location and all facing the same direction. Other temples that "seemed" to be dedicated to the Sun or the Moon do exist but with no specific knowledge passed down as to the real meanings of the symbols. To make speculation without basis is a serious bias in may articles related to ancient cultures and civilizations.

Renaming this page

Thank you very much for this article, from a peruvian, however, please do not include information that has never been proved, viracocha has absolutely no connection with any aztec god, or, much less with any polynesian god, please, viracocha is a south american god. Also, it would be interesting for you to know that Viracocha has been a diety for ancient Peruvians for around 5000 years, and images of earlier versions (the staff god) can be found on even pre-chavin ruins and artifacts, although it has not been determined whether these images are in any way related to the norte chico civilization, thanks and good luck. - for references check out andean archaeology edited by Helaine Silverman.

I've reverted this page back to Viracocha for a few reasons. (1) The move to Virakocha was not discussed here before being executed. (2) Viracocha seems to be the more common spelling, at almost 10 times the number of Google hits than Virakocha, and Viracocha is also the common spelling among most of the other language Wikipedias. Please, please discuss name changes before just jumping in and moving a page, and please refer to Wikipedia naming conventions. Thanks. Gsd97jks 18:19, 17 August 2005 (UTC)

I have removed the references to the aztec etc in this article as they are entirely not related and the sources cited are notorious. There is absolutely no archaeological or ethnological link outside of new age or pseudoscientific circles. References to new discoveries of the staff god are also tangential unless some sort of longer iconographic discussion is included. radiotik

I have also removed "*Gukumatz K'iche'-Maya equivalent of Kukulkan of the Yucatec-Maya tradition, both having resemblance with Quetzalcoatl and Viracocha. Link mentioning the Aymara indians makes a short comparison of the three last mentioned gods." as it is horribly tangential. There is no link. Also calling the Aymara indians is considered a racial slur. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Radiotik (talk • contribs) 15:04, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

Hello I am grateful for this article becous my father gave me a middle name Virakocha that I didn't know for a long time wath actualy means. So thank you :)

Ziga Virakocha Mihajlovic

Legends

Why is the believed history of Viracocha repeatedly described as legend? In contrast, the word is not mentioned once on Jesus. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.61.21.198 (talk) 11:49, 31 December 2008 (UTC)

Spanish Accounts

It's Only in the spanish accounts that fair skinned gods(everybody knows why though) are portrayed among the indigenous people. Maybe that should be mentioned?(like the Bochica)(There should also be mention of the version gold of him(supposedly hence the gold cities, gold statues/sculptures, gold offerings, etc.) There should also be mention of him maybe as serpent god(perhaps). And lets say even if he was a supposed 'white'(the real color) god, there are also black gods among slavs and the navajo(to mention a couple), but nobody makes a big deal about them. They are just misinterpretations(obviously to fit them(conquistadores)(justify,superiority,incorporate the beliefs of their own religion(like they've done to many others)etc,etc,etc..)..this is basic/common knowledge). Not to mention, they all claim to be descendants to these creator gods(and in their image).Anonni (talk) 16:54, 26 June 2009 (UTC)

I can not see the relevance in the last section "Spanish Accounts and Authenticity". To me it seems to have nothing to do here and can be removed without any disadvantage. Xauxa (talk) 21:00, 14 December 2009 (UTC)

Added Translation

I have added a section that has been translated from the Spanish version of this article, it focuses on ways that the Spanish used Viracocha as a method of spreading Christianity among the Incas. Sources and hyperlinks have been included, and I have done my best to preserve the voice and integrity of the information in my translation.

Jameserikson3 (talk) 07:16, 4 March 2017 (UTC)

External links modified (January 2018)

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Image

Is the image drawn by Herge appropriate for this article? It's not the official image but rather one created in popular culture. Firestar464 (talk) 10:42, 1 April 2021 (UTC)

I'm calling bs.

As a historian,I promise you that this article doesn't represent the academic understanding of the conquistadors. I find it incredibly unrealistic that devote catholics would claim themselves gods in an Era of heretical executions. Nor would Spaniards have had a sense of "whiteness" considering these terms were not in wide usage in the European world. The conquistadors themselves wouldn't have been entirely white in comparison to the rest of Europe(reconquista much) particularly after spending months at sea.

Dates?

Dates? Misty MH (talk) 05:36, 20 February 2023 (UTC)

Alleged Viracocha Imgage

There is NO reason to assume the religion of the Inka and the Tiwanaku was the same. The link between the front-facing figure of Gateway of the Sun and Viracocha is one created by popular culture:

• why do proponents of this link always take the image of a "staff god" from the Gateway of the Sun? Because they don't anything about Tiwanaku (SAIS Iconography); they don't know that they are dozens of depictions which are similar to this image, e. g. on the Ponce monolith, Bennett monolith, lineares lintel, conchopata ceramic fragments, El Idolo del Sol, El Bloque de Llojeta, El Lito de Taquiri, El Receptáculo Lítico de Ofrendas. Why don't paranormalists claim these represents Viraocha too? Because they even don't know these depictions of staff gods; if they would know them they would notice that all representations are extremely different and that there is no unified "god" representation.

“It is possible that this standardized figure could have represented a variety of individual identities that depended upon the context in which they were created." Steele and Allen (2004: 243); "This suggests a type of individual—much like the Sacrificer observed in Middle Horizon art - instead of a specific supernatural entity." (Mathieu Viau-Courville 2013, p. 18)

• "However, it could also be argued that representations of weaponry also point to individuals of a non-supernatural nature." (Mathieu Viau-Courville 2013, p. 16)
• "Staff Gods, as argued here, are probably one of the most enduring factoids in Andean studies. The idea the figures may all be representations of gods or that the central personage of the Gateway of the Sun may be a high ruling god are both “factoids.”" (Mathieu Viau-Courville 2013, p. 24)
• "However, as previously discussed, there is little direct evidence to support the idea that the personages are gods. Their attributes and spatial organization rather points to their status as ritual practitioners, or at least divinity impersonators, following Janusek’s (2006) suggestion." (Mathieu Viau-Courville 2013, p. 22)

Its simply dumb to claim that one (the on of the Gateway of the Sun) of those dozens representations who paranormalists don't know represents Viracocha. JonskiC (talk) 10:08, 30 July 2023 (UTC)