Talk:Wintersun

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Well, I guess he really DID say that[edit]

I included this phrase: "Mäenpää would later describe the music as "Extreme Majestic Technical Epic Melodic Metal" from this interview; I don't know if he was being tongue-in-cheek or not, but could including this sentence be a violation of WP:PRIMARY? Someone can remove it if they desire. I thought it was "cute." – Kerαunoςcopiagalaxies 11:54, 28 January 2010 (UTC)

In this case he is most likely just being humorous to the interviewer. He is probably trying to debunk genre barriers by placing several adjectives (whom would be ridiculous to be a genre, i.e. "Majestic metal" (I just laugh at the thought) at the start of "metal" to make a mockery of band categorization (though this is what I believe). I don't think it's really a violation of WP:PRIMARY but just that he outright "describes" his band's music while the interviewer does not. I'm not sure about removing it but it seems kind of out of place. I'm aware this may pass an other stuff exists policy (though this is applied to deletion) but other band articles have been called a genre that would never become an article here at Wikipedia - this being mostly in the lead of the article. FireCrystal (talk) 01:25, 29 January 2010 (UTC)
You're right, it's very out of place and is probably better suited to the album article, if at all. I've removed it. –Kerαunoςcopiagalaxies 07:07, 29 January 2010 (UTC)


On sourcing[edit]

I haven't come across this article before to the best of my knowledge, but there appears to be some confusion over what constitutes a reliable source. Anything the band says about their own genre is immediately disregarded, or we'd b calling Leng Tch'e "razorgrind" and Cradle of Filth "heavy funk". You can't use webzines, as anyone can create a website; that rules out Tartaran Desire, Metal Storm, Metal Archives etc. unless they've had their content independently published elsewhere by a third-party commercial source. I'm not going to mess with the genres fo the time being (I'm only vaguely familiar with the band), but if you want sources for every genre I suggest you find some decent ones. Blackmetalbaz (talk) 11:25, 1 May 2010 (UTC)

I'm fine with that. Mostly, genres were kept as-is when I started working on the article because removing someone's "favorite" genre usually leads to warring or whatever. I didn't think there were enough people watching this article to provide backbone for keeping a consensus as to which genres are reliably sourced... I hope I make sense. In other words, I think I just left well-enough alone at the time. I'm also an advocate for the WP:LDR referencing system, so I may just change this article to that. That would allow you to remove whatever sources (and genres) you want, easily. – Kerαunoςcopiagalaxies 18:39, 1 May 2010 (UTC)
I moved all the references (WP:LDR). – Kerαunoςcopiagalaxies 21:28, 1 May 2010 (UTC)


Extreme metal vs. melodic death metal[edit]

Most accurate description of genre is melodic death metal, not the more broad "extreme metal". Whether Jari himself has described the band as extreme metal or not is irrelevant to what the genre actually is and citing a source for basic information like this is unnecessary. It should be described as melodic death metal in the introduction. RCFrank (User talk:RCFrank) 01:25, 27 August 2012 (UTC)

Um, please read WP:RS. Your personal opinion is irrelevant. Blackmetalbaz (talk) 19:56, 27 August 2012 (UTC)
Please read Wikipedia:Citing Sources. Go to "When to cite sources" and read all of that. Note in particular lines like "Citations are also often discouraged in the lead section of an article, insofar as it summarizes information for which sources are given later in the article, although such things as quotations and particularly controversial statements should be supported by citations even in the lead." This isn't a quotation or controversial statement, it's a basic piece of information about the band. I don't think it's likely to be challanged that Wintersun is a melodic death metal band, which is a much more precise description than the ridiculously broad "extreme metal". RCFrank (User talk:RCFrank) 23:28, 27 August 2012 (UTC)
No offense, but your quotations are irrelevant. Blackmetalbaz is correct. – Kerαunoςcopiagalaxies 04:49, 28 August 2012 (UTC)
That post was pointless. At least explain yourself or you're wasting time. How is it irrelevant, you're not supposed to cite sources in the intro for basic pieces of information like that. Also, extreme metal is stupidly broad, they are melodic death metal primarily, even if they share some aspects of other genres, that's the main genre. Even look at all the other languages this article is in, they all describe it as melodic death metal with influences from other genres.RCFrank (User talk:RCFrank) 27 August 2012 (UTC)
It is far from obvious that "melodic death metal" is the most commonly sourced genre going by what is contained within the rest of the article. The reason "extreme metal" was originally introduced into the lede was for precisely that reason. I have no objection to you removing the citation from the lede, but would have a huge objection to you changing the genre (see WP:GENRE WARRIOR) unless there was a very clear journalistic consensus - which doesn't exist. Blackmetalbaz (talk) 11:00, 28 August 2012 (UTC)
Melodic death metal is more precise though. Extreme metal is so broad it could mean practically anything. Yeah, they share small aspects of power metal and maybe some other genres, but the main style is melodic death, death vocals with melodic guitar lines, fast riffing, and blast beats.RCFrank (User talk:RCFrank) 28 August 2012
In your opinion, possibly. You'd have to find a journalistic consensus. Blackmetalbaz (talk) 10:44, 29 August 2012 (UTC)
Shouldn't symphonic metal at least be considered now? Time I certainly has symphonic metal elements. 100loves (talk) 15:15, 21 July 2013 (UTC)
Elements? With all those tinkling keyboards, it sounds like Oceanborn. That's not to knock it, quite the opposite, and it's an awesome album anyway, but come on, it's just silly snobism that prevents metalheads from acknowledging that Wintersun has always been more like power metal – or now symphonic power metal – with extreme metal elements (and vocals) rather than the other way round ... Well, or you could also call it progressive metal, but really, there are few metal genres that Wintersun isn't influenced by. Just sayin'. --Florian Blaschke (talk) 20:15, 23 June 2014 (UTC)

Skimpe[edit]

Skimpe keeps changing the genres to Pop Punk and Emo. Clearly vandalizing this page.

You clearly know nothing about music. Please stop reverting my edits before you are banned. Skimpe (talk) 18:44, 13 November 2013 (UTC)

@Skimpe Is that why you're the one who has been banned? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.202.7.197 (talk) 23:41, 13 November 2013 (UTC)

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